US spending billions on your disease

[Guest]

 

[glamorilla]

na~na.

 

[redwulftx]

The neo-Nazi loser has spoken

Hans, if you were half so intelligent as your uzi, I'd bother with a longer reply. Instead, let me try this: Go spank one of your Aryan brotherhood buddies in your jackboots, Hitler!

 

[Etoile]

This thread was reported to me as a problem thread. While I thank you for the notification, I am not removing the thread at this time. My reasons are my own.

 

[mellian]

We could be spending it on homeland security.

last time i check, HIV can effect everyone, including you. i also rather see the US government spend the money to try and keep the populace healthy than on security and military which is good enough as is.

heck, maybe if USA stops invading and occupying other countries, they would have more money for homeland security.

-mellian

 

[Mary Hall]

maybe if USA stops invading and occupying other countries, they would have more money for homeland security.

Lol! Well said

 

[Guest]

 

[Adrenaline]

Now us hetro's are the victims.

We are?

Goodness gracious, what did they do? Did some big gay baddie jump into my hetero brethren's bedroom and shoot him with his AIDS gun?

I see videogame possibilities.

 

[Cigan]

Let's be honest, the gay community spread the AIDS virus from its origin.

The casual way in which gay guys have unprotected sex with strangers in public toilets, is what brought this disease to us all.

Now us hetro's are the victims.


But if gay folk weren't so outrageously promiscuous, the disease would have been contained.

The $10billion Bush has pledged for Africa's fight against AIDS...and all the rest that is being spent on a cure/drugs globally ...could have been spent elsewhere.

Actually Hans lets be honest, HIV wasn't spread because of people who have sex in public spaces. HIV was originally spread so much among the gay community because we didn't have the motivation to use protection when we had sex because we don't so the spontaneous parenthood thing. And for the vast majority of the 90's HIV was spreading most quickly among straight females. It is only recently because of the activities of the new generation of sexual active young men that HIV is spreading most quickly among gay men again. So for the majority of the period in which people have understood HIV it has not spread most quickly among the gay community. It was the gestation period when we didn't even know it existed that it ravaged us, and embeded itself. So do some research before you throw accusations around.

 

[ExistentialLuv]

Let's be honest, the gay community spread the AIDS virus from its origin.

The casual way in which gay guys have unprotected sex with strangers in public toilets, is what brought this disease to us all.

Now us hetro's are the victims.


But if gay folk weren't so outrageously promiscuous, the disease would have been contained.

The $10billion Bush has pledged for Africa's fight against AIDS...and all the rest that is being spent on a cure/drugs globally ...could have been spent elsewhere.

If the Human Race was less primative and not hunted the Chimpanzee in Africa we would not have it at all.

The spread of AIDS falls not just on one group Hanns but many. If you want the truth these 3 factors spread the disiese faster than anyone in the Homosexual community. The first being a hetrosexual flight attendant.

There are a number of factors that may have contributed to the sudden spread including international travel, the blood industry, and widespread drug use.

International Travel

The role of international travel in the spread of HIV was highlighted by the case of 'Patient Zero'. Patient Zero was a Canadian flight attendant called Gaetan Dugas who travelled extensively worldwide. Analysis of several of the early cases of AIDS showed that the infected individuals were either direct or indirect sexual contacts of the flight attendant. These cases could be traced to several different American cities demonstrating the role of international travel in spreading the virus. It also suggested that the disease was probably the consequence of a single transmissible agent.

The Blood Industry

As blood transfusions became a routine part of medical practice, this led to a growth of an industry around meeting this increased demand for blood. In some countries such as the USA paid donors were used, including intravenous drug users. This blood was then sent worldwide. Also, in the late 1960's haemophiliacs began to benefit from the blood clotting properties of a product called Factor VIII. However, to produce the coagulant, blood from thousands of individual donors had to be pooled. Factor VIII was then distributed worldwide making it likely that haemophiliacs could become exposed to new infections.

Drug Use

The 1970s saw an increase in the availability of heroin following the Vietnam War and other conflicts in the Middle East, which helped stimulate a growth in intravenous drug use. This increased availability together with the development of disposable plastic syringes and the establishment of 'shooting galleries' where people could buy drugs and rent equipment provided another route through which the virus could be passed on.



Stop making us the Scapegoat for all of Americas problems and get you facts straight.

 

[Hairgrip]

not to mention prostitution, men who used prostitutes then went home to their wife and gave her the clap, a slap and hiv, what about the child sex tourists, the lack of contraception in catholic countries, the reduced awareness in the younger generations, the arrogance of the elderly that it was a young persons issue, the inability of ignorant people to understand that we all have to accept that because we, as a society, saw aids and hiv as a 'gay' disease, a religious curse on an 'unnatural' way of life, we ignored it... we continued to believe that we, 'normal' hetrosexual people, were immune.

so would you mind, ELuv, if I added 'Religion' and 'The Sex Trade' to that list?

Originally posted by ExistentialLuv
If the Human Race was less primative and not hunted the Chimpanzee in Africa we would not have it at all.

The spread of AIDS falls not just on one group Hanns but many. If you want the truth these 3 factors spread the disiese faster than anyone in the Homosexual community. The first being a hetrosexual flight attendant.

There are a number of factors that may have contributed to the sudden spread including international travel, the blood industry, and widespread drug use.

International Travel

The role of international travel in the spread of HIV was highlighted by the case of 'Patient Zero'. Patient Zero was a Canadian flight attendant called Gaetan Dugas who travelled extensively worldwide. Analysis of several of the early cases of AIDS showed that the infected individuals were either direct or indirect sexual contacts of the flight attendant. These cases could be traced to several different American cities demonstrating the role of international travel in spreading the virus. It also suggested that the disease was probably the consequence of a single transmissible agent.

The Blood Industry

As blood transfusions became a routine part of medical practice, this led to a growth of an industry around meeting this increased demand for blood. In some countries such as the USA paid donors were used, including intravenous drug users. This blood was then sent worldwide. Also, in the late 1960's haemophiliacs began to benefit from the blood clotting properties of a product called Factor VIII. However, to produce the coagulant, blood from thousands of individual donors had to be pooled. Factor VIII was then distributed worldwide making it likely that haemophiliacs could become exposed to new infections.

Drug Use

The 1970s saw an increase in the availability of heroin following the Vietnam War and other conflicts in the Middle East, which helped stimulate a growth in intravenous drug use. This increased availability together with the development of disposable plastic syringes and the establishment of 'shooting galleries' where people could buy drugs and rent equipment provided another route through which the virus could be passed on.



Stop making us the Scapegoat for all of Americas problems and get you facts straight.

 

[Mary Hall]

Hanns is ignorant

 

[Etoile]

The role of international travel in the spread of HIV was highlighted by the case of 'Patient Zero'. Patient Zero was a Canadian flight attendant called Gaetan Dugas who travelled extensively worldwide. Analysis of several of the early cases of AIDS showed that the infected individuals were either direct or indirect sexual contacts of the flight attendant. These cases could be traced to several different American cities demonstrating the role of international travel in spreading the virus. It also suggested that the disease was probably the consequence of a single transmissible agent.

Actually, there is some debate in HIV research circles about whether Gaetan Dugas really was Patient Zero, or whether there was a Patient Zero at all. Although his role was immortalized by Randy Shilts in his book And The Band Played On (which is also my all-time favorite movie), Dugas may not have been as promiscuous or as culpable as some would believe. (Incidentally, Dugas was gay, and visited gay bathhouses around the world.) He contracted Kaposi's Sarcoma in 1980 and died in 1984.

Here are some links refuting Gaetan Dugas's role as Patient Zero (and Randy Shilts's report of it):
http://gaytoday.badpuppy.com/garchive/health/062397he.htm
http://www.newamerica.net/index.cfm?pg=article&pubID=1214
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/4227

 

[ExistentialLuv]

Actually, there is some debate in HIV research circles about whether Gaetan Dugas really was Patient Zero, or whether there was a Patient Zero at all. Although his role was immortalized by Randy Shilts in his book And The Band Played On (which is also my all-time favorite movie), Dugas may not have been as promiscuous or as culpable as some would believe. (Incidentally, Dugas was gay, and visited gay bathhouses around the world.) He contracted Kaposi's Sarcoma in 1980 and died in 1984.

Here are some links refuting Gaetan Dugas's role as Patient Zero (and Randy Shilts's report of it):
http://gaytoday.badpuppy.com/garchive/health/062397he.htm
http://www.newamerica.net/index.cfm?pg=article&pubID=1214
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/4227

Thank you for the links doll. I will check them out.

 

[Queersetti]

Nicely handled, folks!

By the way, Hanns, you do realize that some of the money the government spends fighting AIDS comes from gay taxpayers, aren't you?

 

[Guest]

 

[glamorilla]

Actually Hans lets be honest, HIV wasn't spread because of people who have sex in public spaces. HIV was originally spread so much among the gay community because we didn't have the motivation to use protection when we had sex because we don't so the spontaneous parenthood thing. And for the vast majority of the 90's HIV was spreading most quickly among straight females. It is only recently because of the activities of the new generation of sexual active young men that HIV is spreading most quickly among gay men again. So for the majority of the period in which people have understood HIV it has not spread most quickly among the gay community. It was the gestation period when we didn't even know it existed that it ravaged us, and embeded itself. So do some research before you throw accusations around.

well said cigan.

you can't expect some people to understand common sense.

 

[Zergplex]

Zergplex Says

None of the points so far have taken away from the fact that through the irreponsible gay network, the disease was spread and brought into Hetro life. The Hetro's were unaware.

Hanns you make our point so clear sometimes. The hetro's were unaware? Do you think the homosexual populous miraculously knew any more about this disease then anyone else? When it first appeared they had no more of an idea then anyone else. When more was known about it, the gay populous started to take steps to protect themselves that the hetrosexuals never did for a few more years, because it was just a 'gay disease'.

This is pointless, it really doesn't matter who's fault it is that HIV is here. It's here and has infected both gay, straight, and bisexuals and the money is being used to aid everyone. That is what it should be used for, to better it's population regardless of who or what you are. That is the way things should be.

-Zergplex

 

[Guest]

Re: Zergplex Says

 

[Killswitch]

This thread was reported to me as a problem thread. While I thank you for the notification, I am not removing the thread at this time. My reasons are my own.

Remove this thread and I will keep you busy removing threads for the next five years.

How dare you even suggest that it might be removed.

I might just make this a regular stop on the Killswitch train of fair play.

 

[ExistentialLuv]

Hep C was about, and they still took the risk because gay men are promiscuous and irresponsible.

Where is your proof Hanns?

The hetros did know. After a six year silence, US President Ronald Reagan uses the word "AIDS" in public for the first time. And, Vice President George Bush is heckled when he calls for mandatory HIV testing.


No less irresponsible than straights who use dirty needles, the un-educated Africans, or the infected blood being transfused to people in China

Nothing in this article about Africa mentions homosexuals at all. Just talks about the Hetrosexual men spreading the virus through the villages

ARUSHA, 28 March (PLUSNEWS) - Elements of traditional culture and subservient female roles in Kenya, Uganda and Tanzania are pushing HIV/AIDS infection rates up to unprecedented levels, experts said this week.

In Tanzania, as is generally the case for sub-Saharan Africa, there are about 1.5 women for every male living with HIV/AIDS, Leoni Msimbe, a director from Tanzania's Ministry of Community Development, Gender and Children in Tanzania, told a workshop in Arusha, Tanzania.

While this proportion may be somewhat exaggerated by the fact that more data is available on women due to routine antenatal tests, it is widely accepted that women and young girls are increasingly vulnerable to infection.

Hilde Basstanie of UNAIDS said that girls between 15 and 19 in the region were now six times more likely to be HIV-positive than boys in the same age bracket, often as a result of rape, coercion or sex with older men.

While biology plays a significant role in the high rates of transmission (females are twice as likely as males to be infected during unprotected sex), man-made socio-political factors are adding plenty of fuel to the fire.

UNEQUAL STATUS

Patriarchal culture in the region has heavily influenced the legal systems, governance structures and value systems that uphold the unequal status of girls and women.

A number of commonly observed traditional practices are now recognised as being directly responsible for the spread of HIV/AIDS. Widow inheritance, widow "cleansing", wife sharing, wife exchanging with land or cattle, and polygamy are some of the key ones, which are stacked against women's health because the parties involved do not test for HIV.

Female and male circumcision are still practised in the traditional way, using the same knives or blades. In the case of females, circumcision can also lead to bleeding during sex.

Aside from these traditional practices are the social norms which dictate that females defer to males. "Male youth have been cultured to believe it is a sign of manhood to be able to control relationships. Females are brought up to believe that males are superior in all spheres of life and should be the masters of sexual relationships," said Ambrose Rachier of the Kenya Ethical and Legal Network.

"The rigid implementation of traditional practices such as dowry payments make women men's property," he noted.

SEXUAL SUBSERVIENCE

While men are encouraged to be promiscuous - including within marriage - women are often expected to remain "pure". Furthermore, low levels of education among girls and women, due to being pulled out of school early to perform household duties or care for sick relatives, mean they cannot access HIV information.

"Young women are kept ignorant about sex - this is viewed as a sign of innocence," said Dr Patrick Orege, Deputy Director of the National AIDS Control Council (NACC) in Kenya.

This in turn makes them totally unprepared for sexual relations, and equally unable to negotiate for safe sex.

"Women are at risk because of a lack of power to determine when, where and whether sex takes place," added Paul Bukuluki of UNESCO.

There is growing evidence that a large number of new cases of infection is due to violence in homes, schools, the workplace and other social centres, such as churches or while collecting water.

USE OF CONDOMS

Female condoms have been found to be inappropriate and inadequate in the context and culture of East Africa, and have been largely unsuccessful in providing protection for women.

The Ugandan Ministry of Health purchased 1.2 million female condoms but found that women were not familiar enough with their anatomies to use them, said Vashta Kibirige of the Ugandan Ministry of Health. "Culturally, women are brought up not to touch any of their private parts."

The condoms were also beyond the reach of most women, costing up to 10 times as much as the male condom.

Aside from both men and women's reluctance to wear condoms within the context of marriage, in cultures where the value of women is dependent on their ability to reproduce, they are compelled to have unprotected sex, placing themselves and their babies at risk.

Up to 80 percent of infections among women occurred in "stable relationships" where the man had become infected elsewhere, Orege of the Kenyan National AIDS Control Council pointed out.

Indeed, one of the key findings of the Arusha workshop was that sex workers were often better able to protect themselves than housewives because they were more empowered to insist on safe sex.

POVERTY AND STIGMA

Widespread poverty and unemployment compound the status quo by forcing women and girls to engage in risky sex with all sort of people, including their partners and husbands.

Most women who are HIV positive are poor and are rejected by their husbands and families, and therefore cannot afford medicine. In some cases women are forced to take HIV tests by their husbands or families, sometimes without their knowledge, and are then rejected.

Flavia Kyomukama of Uganda's National Community of Women Living with HIV/AIDS said her husband had rejected her after 12 years of marriage, and forcibly separated her from her children.

"My case was assigned to a lady at the Human Rights Commission in Kampala. She, without my consent, closed my file because she was under pressure from my husband's friends to save my husband's dignity and job."

"My husband took all our savings and investments," she added. Inadequate and corrupt legal systems in the region, and a lack of political will to "interfere" in family matters mean that women often lose everything they own.

"HIV and poverty are mutually reinforcing - HIV pushes people into poverty," said Uganda's Minister of Gender, Labour and Social Development, Zoe Bakoko-Bakoru. Similarly, poverty places people at the mercy of HIV by forcing them to take risks.

WAY FORWARD

While Kenya, Tanzania and Uganda all have national frameworks to deal with HIV/AIDS, there is a consensus that more needs to be done to prioritise women's issues. "My gut feeling is that we haven't done enough when it comes to implementing gender balance," said Herman Lupogo of Tanzania's Commission for AIDS.

Bills that are drafted tend not to adequately address women's issues - such as the Kenya National Strategy on HIV/AIDS - which have to be added later on as an "afterthought".

Experts say more needs to be done to protect women's rights by legalising the sex industry, criminalising marital rape and wilful infection, and imposing heavier penalties on rapists. In addition, laws protecting human rights need to be harmonised to ensure basic protection.

In Kenya - in the field of family and land laws - Islamic law, Hindu law, customary and statutory laws were "all working against each other," Rachier told PlusNews.

Yet, the political will for change is lacking. Bills that might improve women's lot are not being passed or even debated because a male dominated parliament simply wouldn't accept them, Rachier said. In the areas of polygamy, FGM, wife inheritance and wife sharing, which are "widespread and deeply rooted", he said it was not possible to introduce legislation in Kenya.

"A sizeable proportion of the Kenyan population is poligamously married. We therefore did not think it prudent to declare such unions either in the present or in the future illegal," he said.

COMMUNITY INVOLVEMENT

This week, the three countries' National AIDS Councils/Commissions, UN agencies, NGOs and people living with HIV/AIDS issued a statement saying that "the centrality of culture" must be addressed more rigorously in each of the countries, recognising that culture "needs to transform" if the pandemic is to be halted. They also agreed to strengthen gender and HIV/AIDS policies and to share best practices between the three countries.

The consensus is that community-based education, which includes cultural and traditional leaders, is the only means to secure behavioural change. But with so many different communities and languages in each of the countries, initiatives needs to be tailor-made to each area.

Therein lies the challenge, which without adequate resources is impossible to achieve. Meanwhile, and for as long as the status quo remains, more and more women and girls will continue to lose their lives.

 

[Queersetti]

Remove this thread and I will keep you busy removing threads for the next five years.

How dare you even suggest that it might be removed.

I might just make this a regular stop on the Killswitch train of fair play.

"The Killswitch train of fair play"?

This is coming from someone who has threatened to chain gays to the back of a truck and drag them to death.

Don't push your luck, little pup.

 

[Bitchslapper]

Ah, more proof (like we need any) that Hanns Shit is an asshole.

BTW, the spread of AIDS to the U.S. is attributed to an Australian flight attendant...a female flight attendant (or as I like to call them, Sky Waitresses).

 

[Guest]

 

[Pookie]

The Hetro's knew long after the gay community knew.

It was a secret underground thing, they didn't want the disease to be outed.

The probs for the Hetro's at first was that because it was seen as a gay disease , they also were reluctant to tell of their illness.


Subsequent spreading of the disease obviously involved Hetro's, but the initial careless way the gays treated it, resulted in what we see today.

You seem to be hooked into the gay community pretty deep, Hanns. Is this really the only source of info you have to back up your claim?