Unconditional love

[im_a_voyeur]

I tried to do a search on this topic to see if this was done before but I didn't turn up any results. (Could be that the search engine just sucks as usual but I did my best to at least look and see.)

So here's my question: Is there such a thing as unconditional love? The reason I'm thinking about this is because of my dealings with my ex. (Some of you may know him. )

Breaking up was for the best. We definitely had different needs that were not being met by the other party. I in no shape or form want to be involved with him in a relationship again. We have been trying to maintain a friendship since our break up. For reasons that I will not get into, I felt it would be best for us to take a break from our friendship for the time being.

The past few days, I had been thinking about how no matter the ups and downs that we have been through (and a lot of the downs were REALLY bad), I've never stopped having a very strong love for him. It makes me wonder, will I always feel this way about him? Is this just because he was my first love? Will I ever stop caring about him?

I've had plenty reason to hate him and curse his name but yet I never can get myself to that place. In fact it would really make things much easier. I wonder, what would it take for me to stop loving him, short of him killing someone that I loved. (Damn, what if I still loved him after that??? Oh God, please never let me have to find out!)

I realize that unconditional love can exist between parents and children and maybe even siblings but can it happen between people you're not tied to by blood?

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

I tried to do a search on this topic to see if this was done before but I didn't turn up any results. (Could be that the search engine just sucks as usual but I did my best to at least look and see.)

So here's my question: Is there such a thing as unconditional love? The reason I'm thinking about this is because of my dealings with my ex. (Some of you may know him. )

Breaking up was for the best. We definitely had different needs that were not being met by the other party. I in no shape or form want to be involved with him in a relationship again. We have been trying to maintain a friendship since our break up. For reasons that I will not get into, I felt it would be best for us to take a break from our friendship for the time being.

The past few days, I had been thinking about how no matter the ups and downs that we have been through (and a lot of the downs were REALLY bad), I've never stopped having a very strong love for him. It makes me wonder, will I always feel this way about him? Is this just because he was my first love? Will I ever stop caring about him?

I've had plenty reason to hate him and curse his name but yet I never can get myself to that place. In fact it would really make things much easier. I wonder, what would it take for me to stop loving him, short of him killing someone that I loved. (Damn, what if I still loved him after that??? Oh God, please never let me have to find out!)

I realize that unconditional love can exist between parents and children and maybe even siblings but can it happen between people you're not tied to by blood?

I think it's okay and healthy enough to continue to love someone as long as you keep a perspective that you are able to embrace others into your life and are not doing so as a anchor to a past you have no intention of revisiting.

I have have several dominants in my history spanning over 20 years that I will always love. It won't change, because at one time we shared a unique connection and the essence of the person you loved is more palatable when the things that challenged you both negatively are no longer being dealt with on a day in day out basis. I see absolutely no harm in the premise, providing you move forward. I will go as far as to say I savour the feelings of affection I still hold for these exceptional men.

I'll convey part of a recent conversation in fact. Reason being you are very on topic to the reminiscing that fringed only days ago. I 'informed' an X partner of something along these lines .......'You know something, one day I will hear that you have collared another woman and I don't care if she is Miss International Submissive of the Year and I don't care if she gives birth to 12 perfect baby boys all whom grow up to be ideal dominant replicas of yourself. I will always think , pfffffffffft big deal, you will always be mine' and then we both laughed. More my sense of humor then any potential to stalking , he also knows me well enough to be fully aware, that with mutual respect, I simply would never go there . Just another way of expressing a deep residual affection that remains. I see no harm in it when balanced with a positive attitude by all parties involved, including due consideration of boundaries.

Still can't believe I referred to him as mine : chuckles :

My personal conclusion is that I think it's entirely possible im_a_voyeur. Some very deep bonds are formed in love and submission and I have to wonder if both parties don't to some degree own a little of each other indefinitely. Even if the case was to be that they would never cross paths again.

Best of luck with finding what works for you

 

[Netzach]

I tried to do a search on this topic to see if this was done before but I didn't turn up any results. (Could be that the search engine just sucks as usual but I did my best to at least look and see.)

So here's my question: Is there such a thing as unconditional love? The reason I'm thinking about this is because of my dealings with my ex. (Some of you may know him. )

Breaking up was for the best. We definitely had different needs that were not being met by the other party. I in no shape or form want to be involved with him in a relationship again. We have been trying to maintain a friendship since our break up. For reasons that I will not get into, I felt it would be best for us to take a break from our friendship for the time being.

The past few days, I had been thinking about how no matter the ups and downs that we have been through (and a lot of the downs were REALLY bad), I've never stopped having a very strong love for him. It makes me wonder, will I always feel this way about him? Is this just because he was my first love? Will I ever stop caring about him?

I've had plenty reason to hate him and curse his name but yet I never can get myself to that place. In fact it would really make things much easier. I wonder, what would it take for me to stop loving him, short of him killing someone that I loved. (Damn, what if I still loved him after that??? Oh God, please never let me have to find out!)

I realize that unconditional love can exist between parents and children and maybe even siblings but can it happen between people you're not tied to by blood?

Sure.

You can love someone forever and no matter what and still not be a good thing together. As you are clearly aware. A whole hell of a lot is forgivable and overlookable.

I still love my ex, and we're friends though not friends who are hanging out often. He's one of those friends I know I can always pick up with even if we haven't talked in a while.

I love my bull, though there are so many compelling reasons it's not a *wise* relationship it's not funny. Wise or not, it's gone on almost a decade and longer than any other I've been in. Wise or not, he's shown up when I was at my worst and other friends were not people I wanted to see me.

 

[the captians wench]

I know exactly what you mean. I felt that way for a long time with my ex hubby. He was my high school sweet heart, we dated starting my softmore year and were married a year after I graduated, we were married 3 years before we seperated. When we first split I was still absolutely totally in love with him, but I wasn't going to stay married (or at least I wasn't going to live with as nothing is legal yet) to some one who did not want to be married to me. We were good friends for a while, then things got complicated and I told him I needed a break from him. Then he got a new girlfriend who swears I'm trying to steal him from her and he's coming back to me (hunny I've got a lot better options out there you have fun), so I don't see him too much any more, a phone call once every 3 or 4 months now. Which is cool, we both have grown a lot, but that tends to happen at this age any way. I don't have those strong feelings anymore. Do I care about him? yes, but not as strong an emotion as love.

Whether this will be what results with you or not I can't say. I just say go with what happens as long as you're comfortable with it happening.

 

[JMohegan]

I've had plenty reason to hate him and curse his name but yet I never can get myself to that place. In fact it would really make things much easier. I wonder, what would it take for me to stop loving him, short of him killing someone that I loved. (Damn, what if I still loved him after that??? Oh God, please never let me have to find out!)

I realize that unconditional love can exist between parents and children and maybe even siblings but can it happen between people you're not tied to by blood?

I don't have personal experience with loving someone who has given me "reason to hate him[her] and curse his [her] name."

However, I have observed many other people who have endured abuse and yet continued to love the offending party.

Abuse, in that last sentence, should be read as covering everything from being treated unfairly, abuse of trust, etc., all the way up to abuse in its most serious and damaging form.

So my answer to your question is yes. Clearly love is possible, no matter what transpires and no matter how irrational it may seem to be.

 

[im_a_voyeur]

Thanks for your responses. Pretty insightful stuff. I can't fully respond because there are details I don't wish to go into (enough of our dirty laundry has been put out to see, lol). I do want to say that I appreciate you taking the time to respond though.

 

[LittleJade]

You'll always have a place in your heart for your first love- my first love was, and remains a jerk, but there's some tiny part of me that remembers the good times... and it was 10 years ago.

 

[Blushing Bottom]

Try Me

Here the term "love" is replaced with positive regard.

Good Luck!!

 

[Homburg]

Yes, there is. Love is an amazing thing in that it will caus eyou to overlook, and put up with, behaviours you would not even remotely tolerate in any other situation. I've seen it time and time again, and been involved in it. Am involved in it. I am amazed that "v" puts up with me some days.

 

[eastern sun]

yes. in fact, most spiritual traditions believe it is important that we love our enemies. to continue to love someone with whom you've allowed yourself to be vulnerable and open (even after you've come to believe that you need to be apart) allows you be vulnerable and open with others.

 

[graceanne]

*hugs*

First off, yes i believe in unconditional love. Second, you haven't been seperated that long, give yourself some time.

 

[FurryFury]

I think all love is conditional to be perfectly honest. Yes, even that between a parent and a child. If you really think about it, there are conditions. You may have to cut each other out of your life but that doesn't mean the love is gone, just thinned.

Your first love is special. If you can hold on to thoughts about the good things about/with that person that's good in a way. However if that means you can't ever really let go or will continue to sigh, pine and wish, that's not useful to you at all. You have to remember the bad too. I have no problem with that or hating people or making a final cut from my life.

Does that make me cold hearted? I think not. I may be somewhat mean, in a way, but I do make myself open and vulnerable to others. I do go on with my life. Once I'm done there is no chance in hell I'm going back, ever. That's okay because life has tons to offer without that other person being by my side.

I don't know if this helps at all.

*HUG*

 

[Quint]

...........

 

[catalina_francisco]

I am a believer in unconditional love. I think it marries well in some way with ADR's thread on forgiveness. I don't think it is something you have for more than a handful of people at the most, your children being part of that handful. While a child or other person may do something you do not approve of or feel is right, it does not have to hold the power to be significant in terms of your ability to love them. IMHO it is about how you view your place in the universe...do you have the right to punish someone for perhaps not sharing your views/morals/ethics etc., by withdrawing your love or can you accept it as part of their journey and though it may not match yours, you do not have to stop loving them in response? You can have an opinion without carrying it through to punishment such as banishment, withdrawal of your love/affection. I can't imagine anything my children could do which would make me stop loving them, even the most extreme of examples...I do not have to approve or share their choice, but I cannot withdraw my love. I feel much the same for F. Does that make sense?

Catalina

 

[Homburg]

I can't imagine anything my children could do which would make me stop loving them, even the most extreme of examples...I do not have to approve or share their choice, but I cannot withdraw my love.

As a parent of four great (noisy, unruly, hooligan) children, I can totally understand and agree. I cannot imagine a situation where I would just stop being Papa.

 

[Netzach]

I love my mother. I really do.

It's not a mere accident of fate that I live 1500 miles from her. I think if you'd asked me if I was "getting away" when I picked my college at 19, I would have denied, it, I denied it over and over to myself. But I was. It's what we call "preservation instinct."

You can love someone deeply, totally, irrationally, and still have boundaries. Even really big ones.

 

[im_a_voyeur]

All of my favorite people are showing up and responding on my thread, hooray!

I'm enjoying reading your responses thus far. It's helping me to gain some clarity.



And yes Cat, it makes perfect sense.

 

[Chicklet]

not my first boyfriend, but my longest most serious relationship will always be in my heart.

we were together over five years, and had our ups and downs, and when we broke up it was for the best. but it's been three years and I still long for him, love him, want his friendship, care about him, think about him... I don't want to be in another relationship with him, and am currently giving advice on the girl he is trying to date. I believe without a doubt I will love him for the rest of my life.

I think to some extent you can't sever the bonds you create with someone. I dated him for so long for a reason, right? I *liked* him. I thought he was awesome. I still think he's awesome. Luckily he and I broke up on reasonably good terms (In my opinion... his might be different)

We took a couple of breaks from our friendship here and there, when one of us would be pining or feeling lonely and being friends just wouldn't work. But now we've got a great relationship together.

When you break up, I think it's easier to say "I HATE HIM!" and rant and rage and be angry, and it's a lot easier not to miss them that way. I'm glad for you that you aren't at that place.

Good luck, to both of you.

I don't believe there's any shame in a love that extends past your relationship.

 

[im_a_voyeur]

not my first boyfriend, but my longest most serious relationship will always be in my heart.

we were together over five years, and had our ups and downs, and when we broke up it was for the best. but it's been three years and I still long for him, love him, want his friendship, care about him, think about him... I don't want to be in another relationship with him, and am currently giving advice on the girl he is trying to date. I believe without a doubt I will love him for the rest of my life.

I think to some extent you can't sever the bonds you create with someone. I dated him for so long for a reason, right? I *liked* him. I thought he was awesome. I still think he's awesome. Luckily he and I broke up on reasonably good terms (In my opinion... his might be different)

We took a couple of breaks from our friendship here and there, when one of us would be pining or feeling lonely and being friends just wouldn't work. But now we've got a great relationship together.

When you break up, I think it's easier to say "I HATE HIM!" and rant and rage and be angry, and it's a lot easier not to miss them that way. I'm glad for you that you aren't at that place.

Good luck, to both of you.

I don't believe there's any shame in a love that extends past your relationship.

This actually makes me feel a bit hopeful.

I can't say that there hasn't been times where I haven't been angry. I tend to like to deal with anger rather then be sad. I do recognize that's what I'm doing and then I get sad which is exactly the emotion I was trying to avoid. Then I get mad all over again so it's a vicious cycle, lol. I hate making myself vulnerable to people and I do admit that I get very embarrassed when doing so. I'm trying to be better about that, though, but it's a work in progress.

 

[bholderman]

I haven't plowed through all the replies. Its a uniquely individual thing. 3 words, Pam and Tommy Lee. They can't live with each other and they can't live without each other. Personally, my relationship isn't like that, so I don't understand it, but its apparent that on some level they are made for each other. Its a level they have probably even ignored or chose not to pursue.

That siad uncondition love is a tough thing to describe. Do I love my wife so much that she should be allowed to pursue sex outside of me for satisfaction? Or do I lover so much, I wont let anyone have her? This question has come up, if it was between saving her or saving our kids, which would I choose?

There isn't any easy answer. My advice, find that level ground that works and stick with it and for good or bad, accept it.

 

[FurryFury]

Right. Now think about it. There is NOTHING your child could do that would make you stop loving them?

If one of your kids killed your husband or another of your kids you would still love them?

When you are old and your child is supposed to either care for you or make sure you get care but instead abuses and neglects you holding you prisoner when you are unable to take care of yourself, will you still love them?

There are conditions for everything in my book.

*shrugs*

 

[Homburg]

Right. Now think about it. There is NOTHING your child could do that would make you stop loving them?

There are things that might cause me to do dire things, even possibly end their lives. But I don't think that I would stop loving them, no.

Admittedly, there are things that I'm not imagining, but I do that purposefully. Say Junior turns out to be the next Jeff Dahmer. How can I say what I'd feel if that came to pass? So, no, there are no conceviable situations that I can honestly put myself in that would cause me to say that I would no longer love my child. There are extreme, entirely unlikely situations that I cannot predict my response to, nor can most people. Who can say in those situations?

 

[FurryFury]

I agree that we can't know until we know. I pray we never do. I always think of the worst. It makes life mostly turn out to be a happy surprise.

*chuckles*

 

[im_a_voyeur]

Right. Now think about it. There is NOTHING your child could do that would make you stop loving them?

If one of your kids killed your husband or another of your kids you would still love them?

When you are old and your child is supposed to either care for you or make sure you get care but instead abuses and neglects you holding you prisoner when you are unable to take care of yourself, will you still love them?

There are conditions for everything in my book.

*shrugs*

I would be extremely hurt and broken up about it but I don't think I would stop loving them.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Right. Now think about it. There is NOTHING your child could do that would make you stop loving them?

If one of your kids killed your husband or another of your kids you would still love them?

When you are old and your child is supposed to either care for you or make sure you get care but instead abuses and neglects you holding you prisoner when you are unable to take care of yourself, will you still love them?

There are conditions for everything in my book.

*shrugs*

I would still love them...it doesn't mean I condone their actions, but I still love. I guess for me it is this way as I don't associate love with judgement and if I were to stop loving someone because of how they acted, or what they did/didn't do, I would be making my love conditional on the basis of their living and acting as I choose to or expect and then withdrawing my love as a judgement of them and punishment for their not living up to my expectations. I have hopes for my children in general terms, but I do not have expectations beyond them living their life authentically in a way which is of their choosing...and even then whether they do that and how is of their choosing, and in some part reliant upon conditions being positive toward that goal, not my choosing or right to demand.

As to their looking after me in my old age I am of the same mind as my mother brought us up with in that we have our lives to live and we are not bound to be her carer in latter years, especially if it impacted significantly and limited our lives. She believes so strongly in this she would be torn between feeling guilty and being angry if we did anything else. She accepts help of a small kind these days (making sure her bills are paid on time with her money, making sure if she needs anything checked up on someone will help her with it as she is finding it difficult to process cognitive processes in terms of dealing with government and health bodies), but she will not accept any of us putting our lives on hold indefinately to care for her to her death...there are other options.

I have the same agreement with my own children...I gave life to them to live, not to feel they owed it to me to nurse me until death. LOL, add to that I suspect I will be like my mother in that it would drive me nuts to have someone there looking after me, watching my every move, always there, even my children. Also even though I am on the other side of the planet, she says I am the one she can talk to most honestly without fear, I am the one who has brought something into her life which has made her last days much happier, I am also the one who has guided her to see some things in ways which bring her peace she has sought a lifetime for, and I am the one who she trusts and still she is happier for knowing I have found someone who loves and cares for me far more than if I were still there and available for her to call on at anytime she needed something as she did when I was there and which I was happy she did.

Catalina