Ukraine War the most censorsed war of all time?

[renard_ruse]

The level of information and opinion control in the "west" (and probably to some extent in Russia as well) has reached levels unimaginable in the recent past and maybe ever. The near entirity of mainstream media and major social media has made it almost literally impossible to disagree with the US government approved narrative on the conflict. The rules are so far reaching and also extremely specific. They are difficult to even keep track of. Basically if you don't agree with the US and NATO narrative you will be banned and nobody allowed to listen to you.

http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=63019

 

[pecksniff]

The level of information and opinion control in the "west" (and probably to some extent in Russia as well)

Yes, probably in Russia. To some extent.

 

[renard_ruse]

If you hate the one sided censorship, I suggest news from the first "western" journalist on the ground behind Russian lines in Eastern Ukraine...

https://www.banned.video/watch?id=62561104c08d37744dcb3521

Also here's a good discussion with Robert Barnes a couple days ago...

https://rumble.com/v10il9l-ep.-108-russia-jan.-6-whitmer-trump-scotus-and-more.html

 

[renard_ruse]

I know some of the jack asses on here will claim its "only demonitizing not banning." First off this is for now. These social media companies always tighten the vise gradually. Also they have already outright banned a crap load of content creators outright from YT over the war. Twitter and Facebook have gone even farther with the censorship already. Yours truly lost yet another Facebook account weeks ago simply for calling for US neutrality.

 

[PaxNurgle]

^Your pro-Kremlin propaganda campaign does not excuse the well-documented atrocities committed against civilians in your neighboring country. Even if you feel that your government's invasion of Ukraine was justified for geopolitical strategic reasons, the methods of your country's army against the population is not excusable.

 

[pecksniff]

Yours truly lost yet another Facebook account weeks ago simply for calling for US neutrality.

Neutrality? I've seen you pray for Russian victory in this war.

 

[pecksniff]

Look, renard, you can't make out a case that you're like the America First isolationists of the pre-WWII period. They (except for the German Bundists and the anti-semites among them) had no particular reason to support the Axis, and they're "it's not our business" position seemed a kind of common sense. But you're avowedly and consistently pro-Russian, for some reason. If events arose in which America were tempted to enter a war on Russia's side (not inconceivable, we have been allies in the past, and when they had a government even more odious than they have now), you'd be all for that intervention.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Wait why is nobody just shutting down the narrative? Ever since journalism has been invented wars have been censored. It got worse when photography was invented. We know things like the famous Iwo Jima photo was flat out staged. Or does flat out propaganda go so far it doesn't count as "censorship" anymore because nobody would be stupid enough to believe that there was a photographer RIGHT there when these men were raising the flag? Or much of what we saw out of every major war in between?

Hell until/unless you get to college we still do a damn good job of pretending it was 'The Trail of (happy) Tears' where we escorted the Natives to various campsites where they set up Casinos. And in World War II they were SOOOOOO grateful they let us use their language as code! Vietnam and Korea was about saving the world from Communism. A system SO bad it could never have succeeded. Really we just wanted to go stomping around Asia like Godzilla. Eventually, like Godzilla, we returned to the sea and anything that happened after that was because Russians are evil!!!!!!!!

Some stuff happened that we weren't pleased with over the last few decades, blood feuds were sworn and we're really hoping that . . .shit it's been twenty years since the start. G-willikers if I knew who blew up my Uncle and his family's wedding ceremony I would totally turn the other cheek. Cus I'm good Christian! And Islam is basically just sand Christian's right? They would treat us the same as we would them!

Speaking as a Millennial why the fuck did nobody take away you guys' fucking shovels?!

 

[ll74]

Russia invaded Ukraine and s killing Ukranians in very high numbers indiscriminately. Ukraine is defending itself and attempting to expel foreign invaders.

You can ignore any propaganda you want ...this is what's happening.

 

[mayfly13]

Wait why is nobody just shutting down the narrative? Ever since journalism has been invented wars have been censored. It got worse when photography was invented. We know things like the famous Iwo Jima photo was flat out staged. Or does flat out propaganda go so far it doesn't count as "censorship" anymore because nobody would be stupid enough to believe that there was a photographer RIGHT there when these men were raising the flag? Or much of what we saw out of every major war in between?

Hell until/unless you get to college we still do a damn good job of pretending it was 'The Trail of (happy) Tears' where we escorted the Natives to various campsites where they set up Casinos. And in World War II they were SOOOOOO grateful they let us use their language as code! Vietnam and Korea was about saving the world from Communism. A system SO bad it could never have succeeded. Really we just wanted to go stomping around Asia like Godzilla. Eventually, like Godzilla, we returned to the sea and anything that happened after that was because Russians are evil!!!!!!!!

Good points.
could you just clarify if you were criticizing mainly Russian or American mai stream propaganda,


In a related line.

Personally, I feel EXHAUSTED
--- BEECAUSE while one strain is crystal clear (Russian imperialism & barbarism created this shit)
-- The other parallel strain (the US-China-Russia economy interests or proxy wars thing)
is harder for me to grasp,
we have all this clusterfuck of Russian and American propaganda willfully misdirecting us or obfuscating.

 

[coati]

Yup. sounds like Renard got kicked off Facebook again, so he's retreated to the porn board to spout off his authoritarian crap and get equivocating wimps like Mayfly to resonate.

What else is new?

 

[LupusDei]

I would like to make an counter argument that this is most directly observable and openly documented war in history so far. The transparency is unprecedented, and scandalous at times.

Yes, it's incredibly messy. But first, the war is messy business. Fog of war is real thing too. Even commanders directly involved not always are sure where they are, even less where the enemy is. The goal of war is literally to make a mess too bad for your opponent to manage. And that is true from tactical level, to operational, strategic, and all the way to global communication. Because ultimately, wars are won and lost in mind space. Guns are just very rude arguments, and being rude isn't always the best way to win a dispute, especially long term.

 

[The_Trouvere]

If you hate the one sided censorship, I suggest news from the first "western" journalist on the ground behind Russian lines in Eastern Ukraine...

https://www.banned.video/watch?id=62561104c08d37744dcb3521

Also here's a good discussion with Robert Barnes a couple days ago...

https://rumble.com/v10il9l-ep.-108-russia-jan.-6-whitmer-trump-scotus-and-more.html

If Russian behavior with Ukraine can be defended, defend it yourself in your own words.

What I see is an unprovoked invasion by a large country of a small country that simply does not want to be ruled by the large country.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Good points.
could you just clarify if you were criticizing mainly Russian or American mai stream propaganda,


In a related line.

Personally, I feel EXHAUSTED
--- BEECAUSE while one strain is crystal clear (Russian imperialism & barbarism created this shit)
-- The other parallel strain (the US-China-Russia economy interests or proxy wars thing)
is harder for me to grasp,
we have all this clusterfuck of Russian and American propaganda willfully misdirecting us or obfuscating.

Neither. I was talking about media in general. I've never looked into Nazi media during WW2 but I'm sure the French Resistance was the French Terrorists or something similar. We can debate on if Ireland should or shouldn't be part of the UK or not but I'm sure the IRA got different coverage and will be remembered differently in the history books.

And yeah I'm on a 30 day Facebook jail for being honest. Though I haven't been fully withdrawing from this place for a while now.

 

[QuickWit]

If you hate the one sided censorship, I suggest news from the first "western" journalist on the ground behind Russian lines in Eastern Ukraine...

https://www.banned.video/watch?id=62561104c08d37744dcb3521

Also here's a good discussion with Robert Barnes a couple days ago...

https://rumble.com/v10il9l-ep.-108-russia-jan.-6-whitmer-trump-scotus-and-more.html

No thanks

 

[PaxNurgle]

Look, guys.... Renard Ruse is Russian. He has been outed as such on this board before, and has all but confessed to it more than once.

Of course he supports Russia in this war, for the same reason he has unconditionally backed Donald Trump and his campaign to overthrow American democracy- because having Trump in charge in the United States is good for Russia and Russian aims (same if a pacifist pro-Western/pro-liberal democrat in charge in Russia would help the United States).

Understanding this is key to understanding why he posts the things he does.

 

[ll74]

He's funny as shit and I hope he continues to post.

 

[mayfly13]

Look, guys.... Renard Ruse is Russian. He has been outed as such on this board before, and has all but confessed to it more than once.

Of course he supports Russia in this war, for the same reason he has unconditionally backed Donald Trump and his campaign to overthrow American democracy- because having Trump in charge in the United States is good for Russia and Russian aims (same if a pacifist pro-Western/pro-liberal democrat in charge in Russia would help the United States).

Understanding this is key to understanding why he posts the things he does.

like Angelina Jolie in 'Salt'?

 

[PaxNurgle]

I dunno; I never saw that film.

 

[LupusDei]

Look, guys.... Renard Ruse is Russian. He has been outed as such on this board before, and has all but confessed to it more than once.

Why, he just as well could be a Serb. Some of the most rabid cheerleaders for Russia in this war are.

 

[pecksniff]

Why, he just as well could be a Serb. Some of the most rabid cheerleaders for Russia in this war are.

Russia vs. Ukraine might outrage the world, but if Bulgaria were to conquer Serbia, the world could live with it.

 

[LupusDei]

Russia vs. Ukraine might outrage the world, but if Bulgaria were to conquer Serbia, the world could live with it.

Hmm... depends on the spin very much, but yeah, the other way around would have clearer baddies in this age.

 

[mayfly13]

IT'S BEYOND YUCKY AND GROTESQUE.

Every day we're watching vids of civilians being either caught in the gunfire, or being directly massacred.
WITH NO END IN SIGHT.

I'm fed up with any 'rational' explanation 'avoiding ww3'. ' brave Ukrainians', 'we Are winning, baby steps' or so.
Nevermind knowing that there are some who are making bucks out of the carnage.

 

[pecksniff]

IT'S BEYOND YUCKY AND GROTESQUE.

Every day we're watching vids of civilians being either caught in the gunfire, or being directly massacred.
WITH NO END IN SIGHT.

I'm fed up with any 'rational' explanation 'avoiding ww3'. ' brave Ukrainians', 'we Are winning, baby steps' or so.
Nevermind knowing that there are some who are making bucks out of the carnage.

You're always fed up with what non-Ukrainian supporters of Ukraine are doing or not doing about the war, but you never suggest any alternatives.

 

[LupusDei]

IT'S BEYOND YUCKY AND GROTESQUE.

Every day we're watching vids of civilians being either caught in the gunfire, or being directly massacred.
WITH NO END IN SIGHT.

I'm fed up with any 'rational' explanation 'avoiding ww3'. ' brave Ukrainians', 'we Are winning, baby steps' or so.
Nevermind knowing that there are some who are making bucks out of the carnage.

Then go and demand more heavy weapons for Ukraine NOW. That's the only way out of this.