Troops respond to Kerry.

[Wildcard Ky]

You knew it wouldn't take long. A group of troops has sent a response to Kerry for his remarks.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

You knew it wouldn't take long. A group of troops has sent a response to Kerry for his remarks.

*snerk* Roxelby posted this in the other thread, too... cracked me up...

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

We should all email that pic to GW. Hope it would piss his dumb ass off

 

[3113]

We should all email that pic to GW. Hope it would piss his dumb ass off

He wouldn't get the joke

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

He wouldn't get the joke

The problem I have with GW's response to Kerry is this -

He claims the soldiers "Volunteered" to serve in Iraq. That is typically twisted. Our troops volunteered to serve in the military, not Iraq. 60% of the troops there are National Guard and Researves. I'm quite sure they didn't volunteer to fight in Iraq.

These people didn't have a choice. They volunteered to serve in the military, National Guard, Researve or Regular, but that's a different thing than fighting in Iraq - THEY WERE SENT THERE by GW and his cronies.

 

[3113]

These people didn't have a choice. They volunteered to serve in the military, National Guard, Researve or Regular, but that's a different thing than fighting in Iraq - THEY WERE SENT THERE by GW and his cronies.

You're right about the National Guard and the Reserves, certainly. When you volunteer for those, you pretty much are saying that you want to help at home, not abroad--I'm not sure what the actual contract says, of course, so I could be wrong. However, there is that implication that you won't be shipped overseas. And there certainly isn't anything in the contract about serving far longer than you signed up for.

Technically, however, if you join the military you are volunteering to fight where ever it is you are sent to fight. This does not mean, of course, that a poor 18 year old with few options is going to fully understand what it is he is volunteering for, especially if the military recruiter plays up the benefits (we'll train you for a job and pay for your education!) and downgrade the rest as "Hey, you'll get to see the world, visit new and interesting places!"

At this point, however, I kinda think you have to be pretty blind not to know that you might end up in Iraq or Afghanistan if you join any branch of the military.

 

[sophia jane]

At this point, however, I kinda think you have to be pretty blind not to know that you might end up in Iraq or Afghanistan if you join any branch of the military.

This is true- now. But, obviously, people who joined a few years ago, during peace time and with the idea of money for education, are certainly getting a surprise. You're right that when you join the military, you ought to be aware of the implications- hell, you're trained to kill people.

Here's a lesser known scenario. My brother in law joined the reserves years ago (like six or seven years ago, if I remember right). What happened after that isn't totally clear to me (tho I suspect he just bailed and they let him), but the gist of it is that he didn't even finish his basic training, never did his weekend training(s), and never heard a word from the military till about a year or so ago, when he was called up to active duty, sent to training for several months and is now in Iraq. That's how desperate they are for troops now.

(speaking of the brother in law, I got to talk to him today for a few minutes. He's about to start 24 hour guard duty shifts, guarding what I don't know. He says it's boring so far, and I told him I was glad to hear it cuz boring meant safe)

 

[JamesSD]

Man, I wish the Liberal Media would stop harping on this. They have such an act to grind.

 

[672]

LOLOCAUST!

 

[Lee Chambers]

You're right about the National Guard and the Reserves, certainly. When you volunteer for those, you pretty much are saying that you want to help at home, not abroad--I'm not sure what the actual contract says, of course, so I could be wrong. However, there is that implication that you won't be shipped overseas. And there certainly isn't anything in the contract about serving far longer than you signed up for.

Technically, however, if you join the military you are volunteering to fight where ever it is you are sent to fight. This does not mean, of course, that a poor 18 year old with few options is going to fully understand what it is he is volunteering for, especially if the military recruiter plays up the benefits (we'll train you for a job and pay for your education!) and downgrade the rest as "Hey, you'll get to see the world, visit new and interesting places!"

At this point, however, I kinda think you have to be pretty blind not to know that you might end up in Iraq or Afghanistan if you join any branch of the military.

Unfortunately with military enlistment contracts it all comes down to legality. On another one of my favorite message boards at usmilitary.about.com people come on all the time asking how they can get out of their contracts after they enlisted because they didn't get the job they wanted or they're having to go somewhere they didn't want to go. The problem is that you're recruiter can tell you all sorts of things but if you don't get something from them signed and in writing saying "You will get this job and you will go to this place and you will NEVER have to go to Iraq" then nothing can be promised.

Also, if you ever look at the military enlistment contract, you'll find that they actually can keep you in there for longer than you originally agreed. The standard four year contract that most people are offered is actually an eight year contract. Four years active duty and four years inactive reserve. That means that if they reall really really need people in the field that you worked in, two years after you get out they can force you back into active duty. And they'll have the law on their side since you signed the contract. There's also a thing called "stop loss" which means that if you're a few months from completing the first four years of your contract and the military really needs people in your field then they can put your discharge on hold for up to two years (I'm not sure how long for certain but I seem to recall it was two years). They actually did this during the Iraq war because a lot of soldiers who had signed up in 2001 because of 9/11 were about to get out. They activated the stop loss program and kept them in for a few more years.

 

[JamesSD]

Unfortunately with military enlistment contracts it all comes down to legality. On another one of my favorite message boards at usmilitary.about.com people come on all the time asking how they can get out of their contracts after they enlisted because they didn't get the job they wanted or they're having to go somewhere they didn't want to go. The problem is that you're recruiter can tell you all sorts of things but if you don't get something from them signed and in writing saying "You will get this job and you will go to this place and you will NEVER have to go to Iraq" then nothing can be promised.

Also, if you ever look at the military enlistment contract, you'll find that they actually can keep you in there for longer than you originally agreed. The standard four year contract that most people are offered is actually an eight year contract. Four years active duty and four years inactive reserve. That means that if they reall really really need people in the field that you worked in, two years after you get out they can force you back into active duty. And they'll have the law on their side since you signed the contract. There's also a thing called "stop loss" which means that if you're a few months from completing the first four years of your contract and the military really needs people in your field then they can put your discharge on hold for up to two years (I'm not sure how long for certain but I seem to recall it was two years). They actually did this during the Iraq war because a lot of soldiers who had signed up in 2001 because of 9/11 were about to get out. They activated the stop loss program and kept them in for a few more years.

I wonder, can you negotiate your own military contract?

Seriously, how fun would it be to have a legally binding rider on your contract?

Of course, it would be tough to enforce, thus ruining the practicality.

 

[Oblimo]

I wonder, can you negotiate your own military contract?

Yes, you can, although the military was much more responsive to such things when the draft was in place.

 

[JamesSD]

Yes, you can, although the military was much more responsive to such things when the draft was in place.

The website I found says you can't negotiate enlistment incentives.

The kind of riders I had in mind would be impractical or ridiculous. Stuff like a box of fruit roll-ups every week. Free New Release DVDs. Mostly it appeals to my sense of humor to actually try to get a recruiter to agree to this, AND bring a document that would make it legally binding.

 

[Oblimo]

The website I found says you can't negotiate enlistment incentives.

Oops, that's true. I wasn't thinking of incentives, sorry.

The kind of riders I had in mind would be impractical or ridiculous. Stuff like a box of fruit roll-ups every week. Free New Release DVDs. Mostly it appeals to my sense of humor to actually try to get a recruiter to agree to this, AND bring a document that would make it legally binding.

Private Oblimo: "Why does JamesSD get a fruit roll-up with his MRE?"

"Why is this 5x5 hole in the ground full of dirt? Private Oblimo, remove all the dirt from this hole!"

 

[Tuomas]

Almost 300 million people, and the best America could do in 2004 was Bush and Kerry? *sniggers*

Anyway, I just popped in to remark on how people are whining that they signed up for the military for benefits -free school, money, etc.- but it turns out they actually have to like.. fight, and stuff. I mean, that so sucks! The military can't do that! They can't get into wars, or have you shoot people!! Soldiers sign up for the freebies, not for war! It's so unfair!

And it's all Dubyah's fault!