Thought on Gender

[Never]

We live in a society that defines its members in a binary manner: old/young, male/female, white/colored, straight/queer. These are abstractions, however, made to simplify the business of identifying others.

I believe that no one is 100% any of those, even when it comes to gender. First off, there's a great deal of a person that has nothing to do with what sex they are. Moreover, when it comes to gender-specific difference, consider this, when a person starts hormone therapy to change their gender, they experience a number of changes in their body and mind but at no point is this caused by *new* hormones.

These hormones are already floating around their blood stream but the quantity is going to be increased.

Imagine if you were playing music on your computer and decided to mess around with parts of it: slip the base down, increase the treble down, and give it a bit more speed. In many ways, what you've done is no different than the changes that turn a person from male to female.

Because of this, while I do believe there are differences between men and women, I don't believe that a person can be 100% male or female.

so, eh, that's my brilliant thought for the day.

 

[sexy-girl]

i don't think many people would dispute that masculine or feminine character traits are limited to men or women

and in most cases i think femininity or masculinity is down to personality

but if some of our femininity/masculinity traits come from are physiology then perhaps people are born part female and part male

although i still do believe it's accurate to describe a man as a man and a woman as a woman

 

[Tymeless]

see the phycological problem starts in us while we are still in the womb for most transgenders. Our mothers hormonal balance was screwed up and we get a dose of the wrong hormones at just the right time which changes how our brain developes all our lives. estrogen in boys leads to mtf's and testosterone in girls leads to ftm's. this is just a theroy but they have found in transexuals that brains are developed more like the opposite sex then there born gender.

 

[kbate]

When our differences come down to 1 chromosome - and one which mutates at that, I think it is likely that nobody is 100% anything.

 

[amBIguous]

When our differences come down to 1 chromosome - and one which mutates at that, I think it is likely that nobody is 100% anything.

Wonderfully said kbate. Bravo.

 

[Nimbikarana]

I think of it through the terms of Body and Soul. The gender of your Soul is not connected to *anything* to do with your chromosomes, chemicals, or anything else. It is the gender that your Soul was crafted to be. If changing your Body makes you feel more comfortable in it, go for it, but always understand that you are already your Soul gender, and were from the moment you were made.

There is another aspect to gender studies which is almost never mentioned. That is the case of Multiples, people who have more than one Soul living inside their Body. Personally my (male) Body contains eight Souls, six females and two males. As a group We haven't decided whether to change the gender of the Body or not, but in any case it's far too expensive to consider it now.

 

[Tymeless]

I think of it through the terms of Body and Soul. The gender of your Soul is not connected to *anything* to do with your chromosomes, chemicals, or anything else. It is the gender that your Soul was crafted to be. If changing your Body makes you feel more comfortable in it, go for it, but always understand that you are already your Soul gender, and were from the moment you were made.

There is another aspect to gender studies which is almost never mentioned. That is the case of Multiples, people who have more than one Soul living inside their Body. Personally my (male) Body contains eight Souls, six females and two males. As a group We haven't decided whether to change the gender of the Body or not, but in any case it's far too expensive to consider it now.

very intersting stuff there Nimbi i'd like to see some more information on your theories and yes its expensive but if your sure its right for you its just something you gotta do!

 

[MsNouriche]

Grays Anatomy

Hello everyone,
I heard it said that gender is in the mind and one's sex is in the body.
This is such an engaging topic...because we all have the structure of society and our upbringings etc that help us meander from who we truly are, oftentimes this can suffocate a person.
Thus far I go with connection I feel. For me, if there is a psychological intercourse between us, then I don't really care what's on underneath! Chemistry is the dance of lovers.
Noticing gender is something we are conditioned to do, the binary concept is quite vivid. Thank you, will think more on this.

 

[Nimbikarana]

very intersting stuff there Nimbi i'd like to see some more information on your theories and yes its expensive but if your sure its right for you its just something you gotta do!

I would be VERY happy to elaborate, in fact some people say i have a fetish for answering questions, but please, can you be a little more specific...what would you like to hear about?

 

[Etoile]

There is another aspect to gender studies which is almost never mentioned. That is the case of Multiples, people who have more than one Soul living inside their Body. Personally my (male) Body contains eight Souls, six females and two males. As a group We haven't decided whether to change the gender of the Body or not, but in any case it's far too expensive to consider it now.

Interesting. Most of the people I know who are part of mixed-gender systems don't feel gender dysphoria, although I don't think we've talked explicitly about it. I'll have to consider bringing that up.

 

[amBIguous]

I have found myself thinking about this subject lately, largely because of this and other similar threads posted here on LIT. For what its worth, here are my ponderings.

Physically, I am male. 6 ft tall, 220 pounds and rather well built. I enjoy physical labor, being strong and all those “manly” attributes that such a body provides. I wear work boots and jeans and drive a pickup truck. For all intents and purposes, I’m your typical male specimen, at least physically.

Mentally and emotionally, I find myself bouncing across a rather broad spectrum. I dote over my kids as much as any mother hen, I cry at sad films, I love soft and silky things. In our household, I do most of the housework while my wife does the cooking. If you add in the fact that I’m bisexual, it raises some serious questions as to my gender identification.

All that being said, I try not to worry about where my gender lies. In day to day life, I live as myself without thinking about what are typical “male” or “female” attributes, attitudes or traits. Granted, my body is male and I’m bound by that to use certain facilities, wear certain clothes and act certain ways under the right circumstances. Maybe I shouldn’t say “bound” since many people here are proof positive that I’m not really bound by anything other than my own desires. However, I see those boundaries as being fairly insignificant in the greater scheme of my life. In the ways that count, with my family, friends and private life, I can live as I feel comfortable and not really worry about all the other. And that does not mean just behind closed doors, but even out in the world, my wife and I act the way we normally would and just don’t worry about others. I guess that I’m just lucky in that I live in an area that everyone pretty much leaves others to themselves and don’t have to worry about reprisals or prejudices. If anything like that comes up, I simply ignore or avoid as necessary.

 

[Tymeless]

Nimbi your whole post is intriquing about the mutiple souls and just your thoughts on souls having a set gender that may not reflect the physical body!

 

[Never]

Hey amBIguous, you've got one hundred posts. What are you going to pick for your avatar?

 

[Etoile]

Mentally and emotionally, I find myself bouncing across a rather broad spectrum. I dote over my kids as much as any mother hen, I cry at sad films, I love soft and silky things. In our household, I do most of the housework while my wife does the cooking. If you add in the fact that I’m bisexual, it raises some serious questions as to my gender identification.

In a perfect world, none of the traits you describe would influence your gender identity. You'd just be a guy who cries at sad films and does the housework. Given that those traits are typically assigned to females, though, I think you're taking an excellent approach by acknowledging the potential for gender identity confusion, and then continuing to live your life as you like it best.

 

[snowy ciara]

Does anyone ever not feel any gender at all? I mean, I'm sexual, and horny and all that. But quite often, I don't feel definitively female or male. I just am. Remember in Star Trek TNG when Data made a child? (Episode 64: the Offspring) There's a scene where they're walking down the corridor of the Enterprise and she is pointing at people saying "male" or "female". She didn't have a gender at this time. She eventually becomes his daughter, named Lal. I wish they would have gone into her gender decisions further, but it wasn't something they were interested in exploring at the time. But anyway, sometimes I feel like Lal, walking down the corridor, looking at "male" and "female" and trying to decide which she is. I'm not binary, I'm somewhere along the spectrum, sliding along one way or the other from day to day.

 

[Etoile]

Remember in Star Trek TNG when Data made a child? (Episode 64: the Offspring)

Yes, I do remember, very clearly. http://www.amanita.net/images/smilies/startrek.gif

 

[snowy ciara]

<<<hijack>>>>

I have geeky girly boner for etoile and her star trek smilie now.

<<</hijack>>>>

 

[Nimbikarana]

Etoile, I have very little contact with other multis. It's good to hear of other open-minded people making contact with various systems. The level of gender dysphoria experienced in my system varies among the souls from "blah..." to "somebody kill me please".

 

[Night_Jasmine]

If you think about it, it may not be so much as gender for souls as they are how the souls are constructed. I am firm believer in the yin/yang concept. One is light and that represents the more 'masculine' portions of a soul. They provide, hunt, protect. The opposite is the darker which is the nurturer. We tend to think of that as 'feminine.'

 

[Athena_e19]

Personally, I believe that gender concept is a practiced extension of a base being. I don't believe that the base being can be solely defined on the basis of genetics, DNA, or chromosones. To do so is to practice over-simplification.

Many of us are raised to believe that the extension of our basis MUST be a specific way. Our parents, society, law makers, and even those like us try and define a specific meandering of our course.

I am who I choose to be and I choose the path that I follow. We all are capable of this action and should be allowed to perform it. Dealing with others on the sole basis of gender distinction is to discrimate agains that right.

 

[Night_Jasmine]

When I was in college, I was stuck in a class where this MASSIVE debate was going on about gender based toys. Was society forcing little girls to follow the Susie homemaker role by playing with dolls and Barbies? Were we teaching boys that they had to be the strong hetero type by having demolition derbies with hotwheels?

I can see where society has the molding influence on our thoughts about gender and personal views of ourselves. People often forget that the self view is the most important. If you are not comfortable with who you are then there is a serious problem. I learned that the hard way. Forget society and their rules. They don't live your life. Only you do.

 

[amBIguous]

In a perfect world, none of the traits you describe would influence your gender identity. You'd just be a guy who cries at sad films and does the housework. Given that those traits are typically assigned to females, though, I think you're taking an excellent approach by acknowledging the potential for gender identity confusion, and then continuing to live your life as you like it best.

I honestly would not say that I was confused, potentially or otherwise. Inside my mind, I am me, no gender specific pronouns needed beyond that. Once you can wrap your mind around that concept, it's pretty simple to let that apply itself to the world around you. Yes, you still have to pay attention to certain things in the rest of the world, but in the grand scheme of things are they really all that important? Me and mine are happy, the rest can take care of themselves.