The Skyline Tutorials: Rope Selection and Finishing

[Krinaia]

So, I'm going to be shopping Thursday night for rope for the purpose of bondage. And thought I would go ahead and introduce the topic in a series of possible documentary tutorials I'll do in the same vein as my ice-do thread.


First: a warning label:

I am no expert and this will be the first rope I have ever personally own. In all my play experiences, the rope has been owned and finished by the dominant I played with. No one should take my advice or example as final word and you should do your own research so that you can make decisions which fit your needs.

That said, are you guys ready?

<you guys may want to keep your eyes out for some breast bondage pictures of the finished product and if my play partner is willing to humor me>

 

[gingermango]

Sure, why not? I've been playing with rope for over 15 years; some of the lessons I've learned have had annoying/irritating/possibly dangerous consequences, so it'd probably be a real service for someone to talk others through it in a concise and informative way. I'm looking forward to your thread.

*sits back munching popcorn waiting for documentary to begin . . . *

 

[Krinaia]

Sure, why not? I've been playing with rope for over 15 years; some of the lessons I've learned have had annoying/irritating/possibly dangerous consequences, so it'd probably be a real service for someone to talk others through it in a concise and informative way. I'm looking forward to your thread.

*sits back munching popcorn waiting for documentary to begin . . . *

Well understand this is not what to do with the rope... this is just selecting and finishing the ends of the rope so that it will not unravel. I do not plan on instructing anyone what to do with it once it's finished and ready for use. I don't have that sort of knowledge... yet.

 

[Krinaia]

I also decided to start this thread so that more knowledgable persons such as yourself might stop me before I do anything silly or offer their own sage advice... so please, do keep your eyes on my activites

 

[gingermango]

Well understand this is not what to do with the rope... this is just selecting and finishing the ends of the rope so that it will not unravel. I do not plan on instructing anyone what to do with it once it's finished and ready for use. I don't have that sort of knowledge... yet.

Okay, that's very important to know - different materials (cotton, nylon, etc.) need different treatments.

And you'll figure out the how-to stuff as you go. Just remember basic safety principles and you'll be okay for most purposes.(*)


*Footnote: Unusual stuff like suspension, however, calls for pretty specialized knowledge so if you're going to play that way, it's best to learn first-hand with some really experience people.

 

[Krinaia]

Okay, that's very important to know - different materials (cotton, nylon, etc.) need different treatments.

And you'll figure out the how-to stuff as you go. Just remember basic safety principles and you'll be okay for most purposes.(*)


*Footnote: Unusual stuff like suspension, however, calls for pretty specialized knowledge so if you're going to play that way, it's best to learn first-hand with some really experience people.

I would not suggest suspension play for someone of my weight - unless I could get down to a more toned, and stronger body, I would not endanger myself that way. My bondage interests for this rope's purpose will likely be for being tied spread eagle to the bed and light breast bondage, maybe a crotch rope.

 

[gingermango]

It sounds like you have enough of the how-to's down for now then anyway. I'm looking forward to your selection/finishing tips.

 

[Krinaia]

This is a tutorial so here is some information I have/will be taking into consideration (besides cost) when I make my purchase:



SISAL ROPE:

Shock Loads: Doesn't handle shock loads well which means it should not be used for BEARING weight that will be moving (ie whipped or spanked).

Wear and Tear: Wears easily and is susceptible to mildew.

Texture: A little scratchy.



NYLON ]

Shock Loads: can take a shock load - should consult packaging or manufactor for exact capablitiles before using in this manner.

Wear and Tear: Is very durable and can get wet and will not mildew as it is inorganic.

Texture (I'm guessing here) but variable depending on quality of purchase (?)




POLYESTER

Shock Loads: Decent, not as good as nylon, but decent, consult manufactorer for concise capabilities.

Wear and Tear: Durable but susceptilbe to sunlight - and will not mildew as it is inorganic.

Texture: Unsure <to be added later>



MANILA

Shock Loads: Better than Sisal but not as good as Polyester, as always, consult manufactorer for particulars.

Wear and Tear: Is organic so it will mildew but will not weaken due to overexporsure to sunlight. It also isn't as durable as the manmade rope products.

Texture: Unsure <to be added later>

 

[Krinaia]

Any personal recommendations for when I go shopping will be greatly appreciated, you see this is a tutorial to which you have the opportunity to contribute

 

[Netzach]

If I were doing static non-suspension bondage that is NOT supposed to be scrtchy and drive the recipient nuts, I would use either cotton clothesline, being very careful to go slowly as it has a low burn speed and can give nasty rope burn, OR multifilament polypropyline braided rope. This sounds schmancy, but basically it's at every home despot/lowes type place, what you are looking for is silky-feeling nylon WITHOUT the nasty core in it.

If you touch it and it feels stiff and icky I'd pass, who wants to be tied up in that?

 

[gingermango]

Good tips from Netzach. One other tip about any kind of rope - unless you're going to make elaborate multi-wrap art projects out of the sub(s), thicker rope is oftern better for actual bondage play. The thicker bindings spread out any stress over the skin, bone and musculature which helps reduce the risk of injury and abrasion. Also, thicker rope is easier to untie for later re-use.

Another point, if you're using cotton rope and are cutting lengths of it, you can get parafin (candle "wax") and melt it to dip the ends of your rope in. Think "giant shoe laces" and you get the idea. It'll help keep the ends from fraying. It's fragile and will chip off but it's cheap and easy to re-do. Alternately, you can just tie simple knots at each end of the pieces you cut to limit fraying that way. Nylon rope, of course, can be melted with a flame and sealed at the ends to prevent fraying. Don't hold the flame too close to the rope or it will scorch and burn. Simply rotat the end of the rope over the flame to melt the strands together.

 

[Krinaia]

Good tips from Netzach. One other tip about any kind of rope - unless you're going to make elaborate multi-wrap art projects out of the sub(s), thicker rope is oftern better for actual bondage play. The thicker bindings spread out any stress over the skin, bone and musculature which helps reduce the risk of injury and abrasion. Also, thicker rope is easier to untie for later re-use.

Another point, if you're using cotton rope and are cutting lengths of it, you can get parafin (candle "wax") and melt it to dip the ends of your rope in. Think "giant shoe laces" and you get the idea. It'll help keep the ends from fraying. It's fragile and will chip off but it's cheap and easy to re-do. Alternately, you can just tie simple knots at each end of the pieces you cut to limit fraying that way. Nylon rope, of course, can be melted with a flame and sealed at the ends to prevent fraying. Don't hold the flame too close to the rope or it will scorch and burn. Simply rotat the end of the rope over the flame to melt the strands together.

Actually, I have decided I will buy this kind of rope (nylon) for the shorter lengthed rope I want... and try several different finishing techniques and see which hold up the best. The burning technique you mention here I have seen first hand THOUSANDS of times as my father owns a sailboat and usually does this project in the kithcen. My ex, dipped the ends of his rope in tool dip, this worked rather nicely. There is an nail polish method I've heard of that I think I will also try.

So, I will do at least 4 6'-0" or 12'-0" sections of nylon rope and finish them with tool dip if I can afford that and the rope, nail polish (which I have), the melting of the tips, and the dipping it in wax.

 

[marieR19]

wow, I love this tutorial already! Doing tutorials is a great idea, I'm very glad someone has decided to do this. Thanks Skyline! Oh, and your avatar is really cool.


Heather

 

[gingermango]

I'm interested in reading your results and what you end up preferring. As I alluded to earlier, using rope for actual intense bondage play as opposed to bondage art or photography sometimes leads you down different paths. For pretty pictures, we like nylon rope. It's shiny, looks really pretty coiled around body parts and it's easy to finish the ends. For actually playing and restraint, we tend toward thicker cotton rope. It's harder to finish the ends (we usually just knot them), but it doesn't tangle as easily, is usually very soft and is very easy to tie and untie as needed. The knotted ends mean its not as aesthetically pleasing to look at, but is very functional. We don't find it to be any more or less likely to leave rope burns that nylon, but that may be because we tend toward thicker rope which provides less pressure anyway for a given manner of restraint.

 

[Guest]

Rope?

Okee.... Rope eh?

Being an avid fan of rope bondage...Both artistic and practical...I will now bore the hell out of you.

Step one: go to a couple of the large chain DIY stores...most towns of any size have at least two..
(this is my standard safety thing) Snag your local undergrad/high school senior that is doomed to work there, and tell him you want a set of utility shears.
What you want are what they used to call EMT scissors... A good set will be handy for cutting your rope to length (more in a moment), but more important, they have the plastic clad lower end which will (admittedly with difficulty) enable you to work the tip between rope and beloved (or at least lusted after) flesh.
Trying to remove someone from bondage with a knife, in an emegency, is a good way to make the aquaintance of both your local EMT's and the Police.
Lessee...
You want to just go and look at the rope yourself. Like chain it will have the stats for the product printed on the spool. Which is about the only thing the store employees are actually good for...Getting you the spool down.
Most decent rope is available in bulk, off the spool. Most of the precut isn't worth bringing home. Unless you really need a new clothesline.
Also, buying the rope in bulk lets you get it at a better price (so you can own more rope see?), and (if you care) is a tad less obvious.

Rope Types:

Cotton:
Has aproximately the same tensile strength and shock resistance of your old yo-yo string...Which was probably cotton BTW... Remember how hard it was to get off your finger sometimes????
Cotton will compress.. It will cut into skin.. And it will leave horrendous rope burns.
The compression means that at some point the knots WILL tighten up. Remember those shears??
Oh, and to add insult to injury, cotton will absorb EVERYTHING.. And when it's wet is bloody impossible to handle.
If you have to use it (for some unknown reason) just tape the ends... It won't last long enough for any more effort.

Sisal/Manilla/etc:
Getting harder to come by in useable diameters.. A must for traditional/serious Shibari, but like twisted style ropes, tends to leave really obvious and (sometimes) long lasting marks. Those marks can get you some REALLY unwanted attention if your pyl goes to the Doc. or some other places and they are seen .

Sorry I'm being long winded here..

Nylon: *grin* Nylon is the easy one.. For what we do I guess nylon is the Dom of ropes.. It has the best shock and weight loadings.. Really the only chpoice for safest suspension. AND it is available in a wide variety of colors. (Check out the climbing and outdoor gear cat.'s) It can be washed (which I recommend doing before use). It IS however the most expensive of the readily available ropes. Keep in mind that the larger diameters are easier to work with. And easier on the skin of the pyl.
It IS subject to UV and chemical degradation, don't leave it in the sun, and don't store it with batteries.
Cut it and fuse the ends with heat. Or you can cut it with a hotknife. Either way make sure and round the ends with a cool surface. It will tend to want to form sharp points.
Oh be careful, molten nylon, as well as the other polymers, will stick to skin. And it HURTS.

Poly:
I personally use a woven surface (skin marks) 7/16ths (minimum) polypro.
It handles easily, ties well, and unties well (more important) even after loading.
It cuts easily and the ends fuse and round well.
The good stuff, off the spool, is a LOT better than the pre-cut stuff out of the silly plastic bags.
It does seem to loosen a tad faster than nylon, so I have adopted the method of taping the rope then cutting it between two bands of tape. Then I fuse the ends. WHile the plastic is still hot, I round the ends against a cool metal surface.
Also, I can use poly at this time because, for the moment, I am not doing suspension.
Just for the record.. I also like the poly because the black poly provides the best contrast with pale skin...
Personal opinion..I also think it provides a better contrast in photo's.

There yah go... Free benefit of experience. Perhaps worth just what it cost.

Food for thought though... Most of the problems I have heard of break down into two catagories. Either the rope wouldn't come untied. Tension on the knots should be avoided if possible.
The other is hardware failure. It is amazing the folks who will go out and buy rope that they can pick up their SUV with, and then buy cheesdick hardware made out of flash chromed zinc from the local 'ware vendor.
Oh, and what DO you have all that anchored into????? Do you KNOW what that ceiling is rated for???
ANd what do you have it anchored with?????

 

[nusubgurl]

Well, as luck would have it, i was sent off on a shopping spree by a Dom friend who's coming to visit tomorrow with orders to buy 100ft of 3/8 in rope. He said pick what i liked and what felt good. I chose 50 feet of black braided nylon rope from a spool at .39 a foot, cause it was a) pretty, b) held a knot well, and c) it felt silky and soft. i also purchased a 50 foot length (prebagged) of white twisted nylon which was less silky and less knottable, but only slightly...cost 22.00. There were huge 100 ft bundles of brightly colored rop made of a braided nylon cover over a stiffer poly core...cute..but sucked for tying a knot.

Will report back more tomorrow!!

(doing the happy dance)

 

[Netzach]

I am going to plug www.rainbowrope.com

I get my EMT shears there (always have 2 pairs on you) I get rope for static bondage there. It's very pretty and it comes in colors. It's more expensive than home despot, but it's nice and it's still a cheap splurge as good gear splurges go.

I also want to plug finished hemp as an investment for the serious rope nut. It has a good soft feel, a gorgeous smell, and it has a tensile strength of 1200 pounds per strand. One can use MFP nylon for suspension at 350 pounds per strand (you want 3 times the load weight, always) I find the ability of hemp to grip its own knots makes me far more comfortable for suspension.

It also comes in some nice colors, as you can tell from my av.

 

[Guest]

Well, as luck would have it, i was sent off on a shopping spree by a Dom friend who's coming to visit tomorrow with orders to buy 100ft of 3/8 in rope. He said pick what i liked and what felt good. I chose 50 feet of black braided nylon rope from a spool at .39 a foot, cause it was a) pretty, b) held a knot well, and c) it felt silky and soft. i also purchased a 50 foot length (prebagged) of white twisted nylon which was less silky and less knottable, but only slightly...cost 22.00. There were huge 100 ft bundles of brightly colored rop made of a braided nylon cover over a stiffer poly core...cute..but sucked for tying a knot.

Will report back more tomorrow!!

(doing the happy dance)

*shrug* Perhaps it is just a personal thing, but as a Pyl/Dom/Master, I would no more send my pyl after the rope I am going to use.....Than I would let them pick my floggers.....
Part of this is, I suppose, because I enjoy the mechanics of the bondage experience...Including choosing the materials...
Another, and more cogent reason, is that I consider the rope/materials selection part of my responsibility...That whole "significant safety issues" thing.

To each their own...

 

[Krinaia]

Netzach, Ekvitkar

thank you.... advice like yours is why I wanted to do this thread. I figured, I could read in my one sm book that I own, search online, and use my knowledge of physics from five semesters of structures to make concious and intelligent decisions. This rope will NOT be used for suspension and as I don't really own any furniture to be tied to, I won't be tied to anything either. Maybe the bed frame. But otherwise, I'll but be bound to myself. I might use the rope to practice, in fact I have a wicked ironic idea of buying some clothesline to practice different kinds of bondage and knots on a particularly large stuffed animal I have... until I find a suitable bottom willing to let me tie them up. It could make for a highly amusing thread.

Anyhow, Ekv, Netz, I have writen your advice down on my index cards, and will be refering to them when at the store. I think I will look for a good 7/16 polypro as now three sources have recommended it but I will also look at the nylon ropes.


Ekv, while I don't personally need too much help understand load stresses on a structure (remember the structures courses I mentioned, I know a lot about beams). Anyhow, your mention of hardware - especially safety features, quick releases, I know some about them but not a lot. Any advice (including where to shop, probably sporting goods where mountain climbers go?) would be good... but what exactly should I look for or buy.

And the scissors were already on my list... but good point, I'll get two sets instead of just one.

 

[Guest]

Netzach, Ekvitkar

thank you.... advice like yours is why I wanted to do this thread. I figured, I could read in my one sm book that I own, search online, and use my knowledge of physics from five semesters of structures to make concious and intelligent decisions. This rope will NOT be used for suspension and as I don't really own any furniture to be tied to, I won't be tied to anything either. Maybe the bed frame. But otherwise, I'll but be bound to myself. I might use the rope to practice, in fact I have a wicked ironic idea of buying some clothesline to practice different kinds of bondage and knots on a particularly large stuffed animal I have... until I find a suitable bottom willing to let me tie them up. It could make for a highly amusing thread.

Anyhow, Ekv, Netz, I have writen your advice down on my index cards, and will be refering to them when at the store. I think I will look for a good 7/16 polypro as now three sources have recommended it but I will also look at the nylon ropes.


Ekv, while I don't personally need too much help understand load stresses on a structure (remember the structures courses I mentioned, I know a lot about beams). Anyhow, your mention of hardware - especially safety features, quick releases, I know some about them but not a lot. Any advice (including where to shop, probably sporting goods where mountain climbers go?) would be good... but what exactly should I look for or buy.

And the scissors were already on my list... but good point, I'll get two sets instead of just one.

A good source is your local store that deals with (of all things) livestock.... There is a clip sold for use with horses that can be released while under load.. I have seen these in use on the upper tie points of several St. Andrews...
Climbing, outdoor gear, and Industrial Safety, cats. are all available online..
A wide variety of "interesting" items can be had from all three... Hmmmm In fact.. One of my "keyrings" is a very basic industrial safety carabiner (souvenier of Antarctica). It is rated for 7 KN. while in the open position.

On the "tied to" front, don't discount that some good work can be done with a few relatively inexpensive eyebolts run into the wallstuds....Not actually "suspension" since the pyl still has their feet on the ground...It always appeals to my sense of the traditional. Though I do encourage the use of cuffs and clips, for any time you are tying to an "immoveable" object.
You might find that the traditional "Dungeon" position, with a few little inexpensive touches, can be psychologicly salutory.
*grin* Also, it DOES simplify the swinging and application of the random floggy bits...
While at the DIY store, this can be facilitated by the purchase of an inexpensive "stud finder". (Yes, insert your own joke here) The holes in the sheet rock are easily covered if/when you ever decide to remove the screws.
Should you decide to put a bolt into the ceiling, there is a kit available for the hanging of a "heavy bag". *shrug* I personally don't recommend doing that without using "suspension cuffs" though. Wrist damage being nothing to laugh at..

 

[Netzach]

I'm kind of a nut about hardware. I won't do weight-bearing play unless I know that thing is drilled THROUGH not merely into a structural beam. I do all weight-bearing play in my own house with a steel ring specifically made for shibari tied around an exposed metal I beam in my basement with hemp rope. I got the ring off of Lew Rubens' site, but a lot of people sell them, I'd go with someone who's got a reputation to uphold among rope people lest someone get killed.

(this is the unfinished ghetto look, not the unfinished yuppie look down there, but who cares)

I don't know a lot about boat hooks et al. I NEVER EVER use panic snaps. They seem like a great idea but honestly I don't think they are, anything that can bring your weight down that fast while your hands might still be behind your back seems dangerous as all get-out.

Also YMMV, and I LOVE my suspension cuffs from Aslan and trust their workmanship, but I don't believe in suspending from the wrists, I just don't. Those suspended-from-wrists photos you see are basically 2 second shots, there's someone rushing in to catch the models weight after the shutter click. Either that or they don't mind courting nerve damage and losing use of the hands altogether. Not my cuppa. Weight should be borne at the chest and the hips, period, and carefully at that.


I use little clippy things, boathooks and chains for cuffs and attaching them all the time in my static bondage play! They are great. Also for lifting the arms over the head with the weight fully supported as on a St. Andrews or a whipping post, they're great. Industrial velcro with a D ring slid into it makes a great furniture friendly attachment point for cuffs and chain. I get all those goodies at Fleet Farm.

 

[Netzach]

Netzach, Ekvitkar

thank you.... advice like yours is why I wanted to do this thread. I figured, I could read in my one sm book that I own, search online, and use my knowledge of physics from five semesters of structures to make concious and intelligent decisions. This rope will NOT be used for suspension and as I don't really own any furniture to be tied to, I won't be tied to anything either. Maybe the bed frame. But otherwise, I'll but be bound to myself. I might use the rope to practice, in fact I have a wicked ironic idea of buying some clothesline to practice different kinds of bondage and knots on a particularly large stuffed animal I have... until I find a suitable bottom willing to let me tie them up. It could make for a highly amusing thread.

Hey, self bondage is a totally legitimate way to masturbate, you know.

I wish more bottoms were into it, it would be less work for me. If you get really good at it, just imagine getting all trussed up and then your top only has to come in and ravish away.

 

[Krinaia]

Hey, self bondage is a totally legitimate way to masturbate, you know.

I wish more bottoms were into it, it would be less work for me. If you get really good at it, just imagine getting all trussed up and then your top only has to come in and ravish away.

Uh I used to tie mysel fup a lot... but have gotten out of the habit since the time I discovered how much more fun it is to be tied up by someone else... a pale comparison. But I also have bondage top fantasies, another reason I want to learn how to do it instead of just be in it... and the two of you have convinced me to start taking advantage of workshops whenever one has come my way.

to lose the use of my hands would be the end of my career, my life's passion.

I wonder if perhaps one or more of you could share what signs that something might go wrong a submissive needs to know so she or he can warn the top. You know, a tingly sensation or a feeling of unbalance... what should WE look for to make it easier for you to protect us?

 

[Krinaia]

Oh and tonight I bought:

100 feet of 3/8" inch white twisted nylon rope (it was cheap). It carries a working load of 278 pounds.

this I plan on making into one 80 foot section and two nine foot sections.


I also bought 60 feet of black braided nylon rope 3/8" in diameter. I think I want a 25 foot section and then two lengths 6 feet long and then two equal lengths with the remainder.

Unless someone can suggest something better.

 

[Guest]

Oh and tonight I bought:

100 feet of 3/8" inch white twisted nylon rope (it was cheap). It carries a working load of 278 pounds.

this I plan on making into one 80 foot section and two nine foot sections.


I also bought 60 feet of black braided nylon rope 3/8" in diameter. I think I want a 25 foot section and then two lengths 6 feet long and then two equal lengths with the remainder.

Unless someone can suggest something better.

Well....How is it going????????