The scary world of antidepressants...

[carsonshepherd]

This is some journalling I did today and decided to repost it here, where we discuss all kinds of matters both private and universal. Perhaps someone will have some insight.

Not me, my boyfriend. He's suffered from depression and anxiety most of his life. He's gone to many different psychologists, counselors and psychiatrists. He's taken lots of different medications, which either made him worse, turned him into a zombie or had side effects he couldn't deal with. So he quit taking them and has been unmedicated for the last ten years, struggling with his migraines and his anxiety, losing job after job and having to withdraw from classes four different semesters.

Through his work with the counseling center at his school, he feels like he's had a breakthrough. They figured out that his anxiety is the central issue. In the past, all his other mental health people have been treating it like a symptom of depression, when it was really depression that was the symptom. The doses of medication were always for depression, when a dose for anxiety is much lower; basically he was being way overmedicated. He saw the school psychiatrist today and after talking with her and going over all his records, she wrote him a prescription for Effexor.

My boyfriend is very, very smart. He went to Texas A&M on a full scholarship for marine biology - but left after a year because of his anxiety problems. That was back in 1993. He still doesn't have a degree, but he knows now that he wants one and it frustrates the hell out of him that his anxiety and migraines have prevented it. He is suspicious of ADs but he wants to get better, he wants to succeed at life. It kills me to watch him too because I know how smart he is and what he could do. People love him, he's such a kind, generous and reassuring person, he would give you the shirt off his back, and he deserves to be happy. It kills me that he's so unhappy. I don't suffer from depression so I don't know what it's like to be that sad and sometimes, even want to die - I could be just as happy as can be and I think everything's going along fine and to him, life isn't worth living. He says those thoughts don't come nearly as much as they used to, but it tears me up to think he could be that unhappy, and I wouldn't know it.

So, we come to the Effexor. He explained to me that it's a low dose, and that he'll continue taking his migraine preventatives too (Elavil). I looked it up online after he went to work. I read one of those "patient review" sites and saw things that ranged from "It saved my life" to "Don't EVER take this medicine!!" Side effects everywhere. I want him to get better, but I worry about him getting hooked on it (a very common warning) and about the weight gain (he already needs to lose weight) and the sexual side effects, which are not only impotence and loss of desire, but anorgasmia too. I don't want him to suffer uncomfortable physical symptoms. I don't want him to get hooked on this drug and I also don't want to lose our sex life - what's left of it after the migraine drugs anyway - and I know he doesn't either.

I know each person has a different reaction to a medication. Typically, he hasn't done well with these drugs, though it could be because the dose was so high. Maybe he'll do fine with this one. Maybe he'll decide he doesn't even want to take it at all. The choice is his. He knows I'll hang in there with him, and I'll try not to let him see how I worry, but I'm pretty scared about what's going to happen.

 

[CharleyH]

This is some journalling I did today and decided to repost it here, where we discuss all kinds of matters both private and universal. Perhaps someone will have some insight.

Not me, my boyfriend. He's suffered from depression and anxiety most of his life. He's gone to many different psychologists, counselors and psychiatrists. He's taken lots of different medications, which either made him worse, turned him into a zombie or had side effects he couldn't deal with. So he quit taking them and has been unmedicated for the last ten years, struggling with his migraines and his anxiety, losing job after job and having to withdraw from classes four different semesters.

Through his work with the counseling center at his school, he feels like he's had a breakthrough. They figured out that his anxiety is the central issue. In the past, all his other mental health people have been treating it like a symptom of depression, when it was really depression that was the symptom. The doses of medication were always for depression, when a dose for anxiety is much lower; basically he was being way overmedicated. He saw the school psychiatrist today and after talking with her and going over all his records, she wrote him a prescription for Effexor.

My boyfriend is very, very smart. He went to Texas A&M on a full scholarship for marine biology - but left after a year because of his anxiety problems. That was back in 1993. He still doesn't have a degree, but he knows now that he wants one and it frustrates the hell out of him that his anxiety and migraines have prevented it. He is suspicious of ADs but he wants to get better, he wants to succeed at life. It kills me to watch him too because I know how smart he is and what he could do. People love him, he's such a kind, generous and reassuring person, he would give you the shirt off his back, and he deserves to be happy. It kills me that he's so unhappy. I don't suffer from depression so I don't know what it's like to be that sad and sometimes, even want to die - I could be just as happy as can be and I think everything's going along fine and to him, life isn't worth living. He says those thoughts don't come nearly as much as they used to, but it tears me up to think he could be that unhappy, and I wouldn't know it.

So, we come to the Effexor. He explained to me that it's a low dose, and that he'll continue taking his migraine preventatives too (Elavil). I looked it up online after he went to work. I read one of those "patient review" sites and saw things that ranged from "It saved my life" to "Don't EVER take this medicine!!" Side effects everywhere. I want him to get better, but I worry about him getting hooked on it (a very common warning) and about the weight gain (he already needs to lose weight) and the sexual side effects, which are not only impotence and loss of desire, but anorgasmia too. I don't want him to suffer uncomfortable physical symptoms. I don't want him to get hooked on this drug and I also don't want to lose our sex life - what's left of it after the migraine drugs anyway - and I know he doesn't either.

I know each person has a different reaction to a medication. Typically, he hasn't done well with these drugs, though it could be because the dose was so high. Maybe he'll do fine with this one. Maybe he'll decide he doesn't even want to take it at all. The choice is his. He knows I'll hang in there with him, and I'll try not to let him see how I worry, but I'm pretty scared about what's going to happen.

Lived with worse, love. My question is where are you in all that you have said?

 

[rgraham666]

There's always hope, carson.

A decade ago I was hanging from my own belt. Despite that I'm alive and doing fine today.

Drugs, Paxil, helped. Mostly it was learning that I'm not suited for what most people call 'leading a normal life'. I'm not normal and never will be. Trying to pretend I was made me very sick.

You and your guy will get through this. Keep the faith.

 

[CharleyH]

There's always hope, carson.

A decade ago I was hanging from my own belt. Despite that I'm alive and doing fine today.

Drugs, Paxil, helped. Mostly it was learning that I'm not suited for what most people call 'leading a normal life'. I'm not normal and never will be. Trying to pretend I was made me very sick.

You and your guy will get through this. Keep the faith.

Let's think half full and not half empty here RG. It's important for Carson to look at his original post and find where he is in it.

 

[carsonshepherd]

Let's think half full and not half empty here RG. It's important for Carson to look at his original post and find where he is in it.

I'm here. At first I got overwhelmed dealing with his low points, but I've learned not to let it get to me as much, because I realized that if I concentrate too much on his life, I'll get burned out. Now I help him as much as I can, because I understand anxiety to a point, but I have my own life and my own friends, school and family. He loves me without judgement or criticism and he's grateful for how I've helped him. I feel the same way about him.

 

[carsonshepherd]

There's always hope, carson.

A decade ago I was hanging from my own belt. Despite that I'm alive and doing fine today.

Drugs, Paxil, helped. Mostly it was learning that I'm not suited for what most people call 'leading a normal life'. I'm not normal and never will be. Trying to pretend I was made me very sick.

You and your guy will get through this. Keep the faith.

You've had an amazing journey and you see so clearly. Thanks for your words or hope.

 

[rgraham666]

You're welcome. Any time.

 

[somberReality]

I'm on Effexor 150 mg a day and it's a lifesaver!! I have clinical depression, diagnosed in 2000 (I know I've had it for much longer though). I was on paxil for a while but lost its effectiveness. I hope the med helps him cause it sure does help me. *hugs* Any time you wanna talk, i'm here.

 

[Recidiva]

I've been on trials of so many things (for migraines) I can't even begin to express how badly they have worked on me. Side effects much worse than the original problem.

I've been put on antidepressants in hopes that it will somehow (?) help with my problem, but on the whole...just made me a stupid zombie.

I have my beloved Imitrex, which I use now when the pain starts. My experience with blood-level drugs or something I need to take daily is hideous because my brain just rewires itself around the thing, and all I'm left with is negative side effect.

Good luck.

 

[tickledkitty]

Carson,

A close family member of mine has been taking Effexor for some time now with no side effects. It really seems to be helping.

I see the medical histories of a lot of different people for my work, and Effexor is a very common drug. Lots of people are taking it, so it must be working for at least some of them.

Try not to be alarmed by the warnings and disclaimers. Even OTC drugs have them. The drug companies are just trying to cover themselves in case something does happen.

Should your bf have some minor side effects, they may lessen over time, as well. If this one doesn't work, they can try something else.

Hang in there.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

These things have such radically different effects on different people that it's really impossible to tell. Some advice-- You watch him. Other people are often a better guide to how well an AD works than the person taking it themselves. Because the AD works globally, it's very hard to tell that it's havfing any effect. You don't feel "up" or "high" like you do with a street drug.

SO much depends on your attitude towards drugs too. I used to eat them like candy, so AD's don't bother me at all. Problem is, they don't work for me. None of them. The one that comes closest is a narcotic, a mild form of methadone, It seems to ease the "pain" of being alive. No shit.

I took effexor. It made me too aggressive, like hyper caffeine. I would take offense really easily at jokes or teasing. I remember attacking Perdita here on Lit like a pit bull after she made some silly joke.

One well known caveat about Effexor: DON'T GO OFF THIS DRUG ON YOUR OWN!!! You have to be weaned under supervision. There are notorious withdrawal symptoms that can be scary, but weaned off the drug over a week or a few days and it's no problem.

 

[carsonshepherd]

I'm on Effexor 150 mg a day and it's a lifesaver!! I have clinical depression, diagnosed in 2000 (I know I've had it for much longer though). I was on paxil for a while but lost its effectiveness. I hope the med helps him cause it sure does help me. *hugs* Any time you wanna talk, i'm here.

Yes, he tried Paxil as well and it made him into a zombie - because they were giving him too much. I'm glad it works for you. Thanks

 

[carsonshepherd]

I've been on trials of so many things (for migraines) I can't even begin to express how badly they have worked on me. Side effects much worse than the original problem.

I've been put on antidepressants in hopes that it will somehow (?) help with my problem, but on the whole...just made me a stupid zombie.

I have my beloved Imitrex, which I use now when the pain starts. My experience with blood-level drugs or something I need to take daily is hideous because my brain just rewires itself around the thing, and all I'm left with is negative side effect.

Good luck.

He's having some luck with the Elavil. It's made the migraines somewhat less intense, though not really less frequent. He is a big fan of Imitrex too.

 

[carsonshepherd]

Carson,

A close family member of mine has been taking Effexor for some time now with no side effects. It really seems to be helping.

I see the medical histories of a lot of different people for my work, and Effexor is a very common drug. Lots of people are taking it, so it must be working for at least some of them.

Try not to be alarmed by the warnings and disclaimers. Even OTC drugs have them. The drug companies are just trying to cover themselves in case something does happen.

Should your bf have some minor side effects, they may lessen over time, as well. If this one doesn't work, they can try something else.

Hang in there.

I know, the warnings and side effects always seem so dire, and they're not the same for everyone. All we can do is try.

 

[Recidiva]

He's having some luck with the Elavil. It's made the migraines somewhat less intense, though not really less frequent. He is a big fan of Imitrex too.

I just ended my trial of Elavil. The weight gain and zombie effect were too much to handle.

 

[carsonshepherd]

These things have such radically different effects on different people that it's really impossible to tell. Some advice-- You watch him. Other people are often a better guide to how well an AD works than the person taking it themselves. Because the AD works globally, it's very hard to tell that it's havfing any effect. You don't feel "up" or "high" like you do with a street drug.

SO much depends on your attitude towards drugs too. I used to eat them like candy, so AD's don't bother me at all. Problem is, they don't work for me. None of them. The one that comes closest is a narcotic, a mild form of methadone, It seems to ease the "pain" of being alive. No shit.

I took effexor. It made me too aggressive, like hyper caffeine. I would take offense really easily at jokes or teasing. I remember attacking Perdita here on Lit like a pit bull after she made some silly joke.

One well known caveat about Effexor: DON'T GO OFF THIS DRUG ON YOUR OWN!!! You have to be weaned under supervision. There are notorious withdrawal symptoms that can be scary, but weaned off the drug over a week or a few days and it's no problem.

Yes, his psychiatrist told him it was very important that I watch his moods and how he's doing. And I've read about the withdrawal symptoms. I'll be sure to watch carefully to make sure he doesn't quit the drug on his own.

Aggression, ugh. That sounds nasty. BF asked me last night if I was going to kick him out if he lost his sex drive, and if I did, would I at least give him some warning. I told him I didn't think it would come to that, but I would tell him if it did, and that's not why I'm with him anyway. (Not that I'm looking forward to that happening.)

 

[carsonshepherd]

I just ended my trial of Elavil. The weight gain and zombie effect were too much to handle.

He has trouble with waking up in the morning and getting out of bed. He hates it. Other than that, the side effects (at first, bad headache and nausea) have pretty much gone away. We actually think it did avert a couple of migraines. He gets them when the weather changes suddenly, and a couple of times that happened and he got a "funny feeling" in his head, but no migraine. The doctor might up his dose, so we're hoping that will make it work a little better.

 

[Recidiva]

He has trouble with waking up in the morning and getting out of bed. He hates it. Other than that, the side effects (at first, bad headache and nausea) have pretty much gone away. We actually think it did avert a couple of migraines. He gets them when the weather changes suddenly, and a couple of times that happened and he got a "funny feeling" in his head, but no migraine. The doctor might up his dose, so we're hoping that will make it work a little better.

I think it helped avert a few too, but I'd rather have them back (and my life) - after about a month and a half, I just couldn't get out of bed for work any more. Husband and daughter agreed I was just zombielike.

I feel infinitely better off the stuff, and I don't feel like I have to eat all the time.

Topamax made me suicidal...

I just have bad reactions to so many things. I do try to give a fair trial, but often that fair trial disrupts everything else in place.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Yes, his psychiatrist told him it was very important that I watch his moods and how he's doing. And I've read about the withdrawal symptoms. I'll be sure to watch carefully to make sure he doesn't quit the drug on his own.

Aggression, ugh. That sounds nasty. BF asked me last night if I was going to kick him out if he lost his sex drive, and if I did, would I at least give him some warning. I told him I didn't think it would come to that, but I would tell him if it did, and that's not why I'm with him anyway. (Not that I'm looking forward to that happening.)

I'm disappointed you as a protege, Carson. I have the feeling you don't have a lot of experience with substance abuse.

You can slap these puppies around pretty vigorously before they sit up and bite. The side effects, when present are rarely like in werewolf movies or the bad trip acid-movies of the 60's where he's suddenly going to sit up in bed with the curse of the juju on him.

No, seriously, not to make fun of your concerns, but if and when side effects come on, they're usually gradual and mild, like maybe he's been drinking too much coffee, or hasn't been sleeping well. The fact that AD's have to bio-load so slowly keeps them from suddenly building up to some toxic trip point, so the effects (& therefore the side effects as well) come on very slowly.

What'll hapopen is he'll be on them for 4 weeks and one day you'll say, "You know, you've been such a butt lately! What's with you? Is it the AD's?"

And he'll say, "No, Carson. It's you!"

When they work, it's the same sad anti-climax. You'll be sitting together and you'll say, "You know, it's been three days since you broke down and cried?"

And he'll see, "Huh! Yeah. How about that." You won't be bike riding along the seaside when it happens, or playing with your grandchildren in the grass, or painting scenery for the summer stock theatre.

You'll be in your jockey shorts ironing pants and he'll be cleaning melted cheese out of the toaster.

Nothing's as good as on TV.

Now I'm depressed.

 

[carsonshepherd]

You'll be in your jockey shorts ironing pants and he'll be cleaning melted cheese out of the toaster.

Nothing's as good as on TV.

Now I'm depressed.

Wouldn't it be cool if life were exactly like a commercial for feminine hygiene products or erectile dysfunction drugs?

 

[emma72]

I suffer from depression too, have done since I was a teen.
I was put on Sertaline Hydrochloride in my late twenties. I have never attempted suicide because I am too conscious of being an only child and
I am also Catholic.

I have found that depression seems to run in my family two of my cousins are on the same medication I am on. A big problem I had was taking it alone side the pill as it lowered my sex drive and made it very hard to cum.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

I suffer from depression too, have done since I was a teen.
I was put on Sertaline Hydrochloride in my late twenties. I have never attempted suicide because I am too conscious of being an only child and
I am also Catholic.

I have found that depression seems to run in my family two of my cousins are on the same medication I am on. A big problem I had was taking it alone side the pill as it lowered my sex drive and made it very hard to cum.

There's so many depressives in the Author's Hangout that we have a special "Depression" thread. But I don;t go over there. Too depressing

Yeah my mom had it. My daugher has it. It's such a terrible, insidious disease. If you've never had it you can't can't imagine what it's like. To a non-sufferer it just seems like it's a matter of cheering up and looking on the bright side. They have no idea of the entire loss of hope and even capacity for hope that goes with it.

 

[rgraham666]

They have no idea of the entire loss of hope and even capacity for hope that goes with it.

That's the hardest thing to deal with. I've not gotten my faith back after it was taken away from me by the illness. Not really.

 

[shereads]

It's a tough call, Carson. Antidepressants have saved lives. Mine, for one. But prescribing them is still more an art than a science. Unlike pain-killers and cough syrup and the familiar recreational drugs, SRI's don't take effect immediately. The lag-time between the first dose and seeing the effect is sometimes weeks. And even then, a poor result can simply mean the dosage needs to be adjusted - or it could mean it's the wrong drug for this particular person. The frustration adds another layer of fear and self-blame to a growing pile of reasons not to believe in the future.

When my friend's teenaged daughter killed herself, she'd been taking Paxil. When it was first prescribed, her mother was concerned about reports of a connection between Paxil and an increased rate of suicide in children and young adults. But in the months that followed, Nina recovered her confidence, began enjoying her family and friends again, regained her interest in school and the future. Everyone, from her mother to the teacher whose class she attended just hours before she took her life, said Nina was like her old self. That afternoon, she became upset over a minor incident while in the company of friends. She jumped off the balcony at her father's apartment in the presence of three horrified teenagers and a stepmother she adored. No one will ever know why; no one can do more than speculate that Nina might have lived longer if she'd taken some other drug, or none. It's possible that Paxil gave her a few months she wouldn't have had otherwise. It's also possible that it helped kill her.

The only certainties are that Nina had been deeply depressed, responded poorly or not at all to other forms of treatment, and seemed to get better on Paxil; and that everyone who loved her believes they are to blame.

BTW, people who offer advice like "get more exercise" mean well, but they've never experienced a sustained major depression. If they had, they'd know that depression, the brain disorder, has little in common with depression, the bad mood.

At its worst, it's not just anguish and hopelessness and self-loathing. It can destroy the person's reading comprehension and ability to plan and carry out simple, familiar tasks.

There were days when I'd look at an assignment at work and see a string of words and punctuation with no context. I might as well have been trying to decipher a coded message. It was terrifying, and terribly humiliating. I hid it by calling in sick, until I could no longer see any point in making the phone call. Then I just hid.

To tell someone in such a state that they should exercise more, or look at the bright side, or develop some outside interests, is like telling someone with a bullet wound to put a cork in it.

EDITED TO ADD:

Carson, I sound here like I'm dismissing the effect this has on you. It's got to be pure hell to live with and be supportive of one of us when we're at our worst.

Give it some time.

But don't let it take you down with it. You have a right - and even a responsibility - to protect yourself from contagious despair.

 

[shereads]

A big problem I had was taking it alone side the pill as it lowered my sex drive and made it very hard to cum.

If you're capable of wanting an orgasm, you aren't in a major depression. Yet.

When my pdoc warned me that Prozac could make it difficult to achieve an orgasm, I almost laughed for the first time in three months. He might as well have said, "Prozac could make it difficult to catch wild pigs with your teeth."

Prozac did, in fact, make it difficult to climax. When that finally mattered to me, I knew the drug was working. I take Celexa now, which has a low incidence of sexual side effects...First survive. Later, you can fine-tune.