The Paradox of the Day

poppy1963

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RJMasters spoke of "accepting submission with confidence" in one of his posts. This seems one of the paradoxes of BDSM to me. Is such a mindset really possible? Something in it rings of a freeing up of spirit to me...odd.

And is there a flip side? Could there be insecurity in Dominance in a BDSM framework? I wonder.

Submissives, can you speak to this? How does that concept strike you? Dominants, how does the concept of a "confident submissive" strike you?
 
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I'm on my way out to the Post Awful and to run errands, but I'll be back. :)

I don't see submitting with confidence to be contradictory at all... I just have to figure out how to explain it. *laughing*
 
For me it is simple in explanation in that I think of it as submitting by choice, not out of a need to have someone take care of business for you, and from a position where you know what you want and need and do not feel a need to apologise or dress it up as anything else. I also think it can be confidence in knowing you can cope on your own, having gained that knowledge through actually doing just that, but you choose to submit to someone, though not everybody or anybody.

Catalina :rose:
 
Submitting with confidence pretty well sums up me. I know who and what I am. I'm true to myself and being true and honest and accepting of yourself is what confidence is all about.

I'm sure there are Dom/mes who find that intimidating.

The Dom/mes who don't are the only ones I'm interested in.
 
poppy1963 said:
RJMasters spoke of "accepting submission with confidence" in one of his posts. This seems one of the paradoxes of BDSM to me. Is such a mindset really possible? Something in it rings of a freeing up of spirit to me...odd.

And is there a flip side? Could there be insecurity in Dominance in a BDSM framework? I wonder.

Submissives, can you speak to this? How does that concept strike you? Dominants, how does the concept of a "confident submissive" strike you?

Since the men who submit to me ARE confident, I would say it strikes me just fine. Submission does not always equal self-doubt. I think there may be areas in in one's life that render more confidence than others.

Eb
 
Ebonyfire said:
Since the men who submit to me ARE confident, I would say it strikes me just fine. Submission does not always equal self-doubt. I think there may be areas in in one's life that render more confidence than others.

Eb

Well said, all of you. Just because you're confident doesn't mean you're not submissive. I think most Dominants don't want a doormat, unless they are really really sadistic lol. But really, I think most dominants enjoy someone with a brain. :)
 
malcah_ms said:
Well said, all of you. Just because you're confident doesn't mean you're not submissive. I think most Dominants don't want a doormat, unless they are really really sadistic lol. But really, I think most dominants enjoy someone with a brain. :)

I don't think doormats make particularly good submissives, and I would bet they make even poorer masochists!
 
Ebonyfire said:
I don't think doormats make particularly good submissives, and I would bet they make even poorer masochists!

When you beat a doormat that call it abuse!
 
Confidence is what is required. Courage, bravery, intelligence. To do something out of fear isn't as powerful as doing it to overcome your fears.
 
i enjoy submission (does this make me any less of a submissive? i dont think so), and dont doubt my submission to my Sir. if this is "submitting with confidence", then i would haave to say i do it all the time. doubtful/forced submission makes for uncertain and possibly dangerouse relationships.
 
Another suggested his experience with sexual submissives was often that they were quite the opposite in other areas of their lives...perhaps over-achieving in many ways. They seek submission in a way to bring balance. That sounded very interesting to me.

Comments?
 
Ebonyfire said:
I don't think doormats make particularly good submissives, and I would bet they make even poorer masochists!

Indeed! Very poor.
 
poppy1963 said:
Another suggested his experience with sexual submissives was often that they were quite the opposite in other areas of their lives...perhaps over-achieving in many ways. They seek submission in a way to bring balance. That sounded very interesting to me.

Comments?

Sometimes this is true. I run my own company in my vanilla life -- in charge and everything. :) But when the work day is done, I'm all His :) Master lets me run my biz, but he does everything else. :) I can't bear making a decision after 5 :) And for those that know me, it is like finding balance. It helps me to be who I am. I don't view myself as a dominant in my work self, more just myself creating something that is mine.
 
poppy1963 said:
Another suggested his experience with sexual submissives was often that they were quite the opposite in other areas of their lives...perhaps over-achieving in many ways. They seek submission in a way to bring balance. That sounded very interesting to me.

Comments?

There's no way to explain the circumstances why someone enjoys submission, any more than you can understand why someone likes one topping on their pizza and someone likes another. It's a matter of taste and experience. Some don't seek balance, but imbalance.
 
BloodFluke said:
There's no way to explain the circumstances why someone enjoys submission, any more than you can understand why someone likes one topping on their pizza and someone likes another. It's a matter of taste and experience. Some don't seek balance, but imbalance.

I disagree a bit. Read my post before yours, balance is necessary in all aspects of life.
 
malcah_ms said:
I disagree a bit. Read my post before yours, balance is necessary in all aspects of life.

Disagreement with me is unnecessary, if it is true in your case, then it's true. I'm leaving room for other truths.
 
poppy1963 said:
... They seek submission in a way to bring balance. That sounded very interesting to me.

Comments?

That was once an 'excuse' for me. I thought I had to come home and submit after a day of being 'in charge' at work. In your words... looking to bring my life some kind of balance. I was looking for a reason for why I am who I am.

That's not true. And it wasn't then either. I just didn't know it at the time.

I no longer need a reason. As I said before, I know who and what I am and I'm fully responsible and happy with that knowledge.



Disclaimer: I speak only for and about myself in this and all posts.
 
It sounds as if there is a growing self-awareness for some and self-acceptance of the lifestyle and what motivates it. I've read comments like that from many subs in the forums here. Thinking they sought this for one reason...then finding out that it was "who they are and always were" rather than it was something "chosen" as an identity or role.

This eludes me in application but not in theory....my culture (USA) is wrought with so many negative connotations regarding "submission" in so many ways.
 
poppy1963 said:
It sounds as if there is a growing self-awareness for some and self-acceptance of the lifestyle and what motivates it. I've read comments like that from many subs in the forums here. Thinking they sought this for one reason...then finding out that it was "who they are and always were" rather than it was something "chosen" as an identity or role.

This eludes me in application but not in theory....my culture (USA) is wrought with so many negative connotations regarding "submission" in so many ways.

The negative connotations tend to reside in the minds of individuals. Authority and questioning and acceptance of authority and responsibility are difficult subjects, but Americans are taught to question all these roles, not obey them blindly. That's healthy. The conflict lies in the choosing, not in the examples given.

What do you consider to be a negative cultural connotation? Very likely it has a positive opposite if you look. The voice may be softer in representation, but minority voices exist.
 
poppy1963 said:
It sounds as if there is a growing self-awareness for some and self-acceptance of the lifestyle and what motivates it. I've read comments like that from many subs in the forums here. Thinking they sought this for one reason...then finding out that it was "who they are and always were" rather than it was something "chosen" as an identity or role.

This eludes me in application but not in theory....my culture (USA) is wrought with so many negative connotations regarding "submission" in so many ways.

I'm not sure what you are saying here. For me, this is not a chosen identity or a role. If anything, it's a personality trait.
 
BloodFluke said:
The negative connotations tend to reside in the minds of individuals. Authority and questioning and acceptance of authority and responsibility are difficult subjects, but Americans are taught to question all these roles, not obey them blindly. That's healthy. The conflict lies in the choosing, not in the examples given.

What do you consider to be a negative cultural connotation? Very likely it has a positive opposite if you look. The voice may be softer in representation, but minority voices exist.

I am going to respond to this as if it was directed to me for a response...even if it was just rhetorical.

Submission is often seen as "weakness"...less than...by many. Sometimes "temporary submission" is seen as a way to achieve Dominance later as in the claims behind the rationale for the War in Iraq. (don't want to argue this point...just an illustration)

Submission leads to revilement if it is too complete...therefore can bring about a great degree of loneliness I think.

These are just a couple ideas off the top of my head.
 
A Desert Rose said:
I'm not sure what you are saying here. For me, this is not a chosen identity or a role. If anything, it's a personality trait.

Did you recognize that right from the start of your participation or exploration?
 
BloodFluke said:
The negative connotations tend to reside in the minds of individuals. Authority and questioning and acceptance of authority and responsibility are difficult subjects, but Americans are taught to question all these roles, not obey them blindly. That's healthy. The conflict lies in the choosing, not in the examples given.

What do you consider to be a negative cultural connotation? Very likely it has a positive opposite if you look. The voice may be softer in representation, but minority voices exist.


That is a good question, cause I was wondering that myself. I live in the USA and I have yet to know a USA culture.
 
poppy1963 said:
I am going to respond to this as if it was directed to me for a response...even if it was just rhetorical.

Submission is often seen as "weakness"...less than...by many. Sometimes "temporary submission" is seen as a way to achieve Dominance later as in the claims behind the rationale for the War in Iraq. (don't want to argue this point...just an illustration)

Submission leads to revilement if it is too complete...therefore can bring about a great degree of loneliness I think.

These are just a couple ideas off the top of my head.

Submission is a fact of life. We submit to the need to breathe every few seconds and fighting it is foolish and self destructive. Anyone who doesn't recognize submission in themselves is prey to denial, or death by asphyxiation. Are you a bad person for breathing? I'm sure someone can make out how continuing to breathe is evil, but they're foolish. Just as an inability to recognize what can give you personal satisfaction is often prey to denial or death by asphyxiation of pleasure.

It depends on how judgmental of the submission you become, the way you think about it determines your ease or lack of it, when the opportunity to submit presents itself.
 
Ebonyfire said:
That is a good question, cause I was wondering that myself. I live in the USA and I have yet to know a USA culture.

There are as many cultures as there are individuals. They're not all forthcoming with their cultural beliefs casually, but get some of them drunk and you'll get an earful.
 
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