The N-word

[Chimney Sweep]

I'm looking for advice on a story. I'm not sure if I should even start down this road so I'm trying to feel out the community for guidance.

BBC, interracial, maybe MMF, maybe a train/gangbang, maybe pregnant, but the part that makes me pause is this: the white girl on the receiving end of all this black dick wants to use the n-word to her black lover(s). I blame Spring Thomas for this idea registering as sexy in my stupid head. My thought was to make this issue part of the story, part of the discussion with the participants, and maybe explore the issue a little bit.

Should I back the fuck up, check my white privilege and just run away from this idea? Is this one of those third rail deals? I'm not looking to be intentionally offensive or shocking, and I am willing to accept that this is a kink I need to take out back and drown in the creek, right?

What do you fine people think? There's no point in putting finger to keyboard on this idea if it will get me panned and banned.

Thx,
CS

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Dawning Nomex and Kevlar... Well, just me, but context is everything. Two black guys dropping that in conversation between them probably floats. A hateful cracker cursing them before he gets nailed would, too.

The word is a reality. It’s not a polite word. It’s a charged word. It’s an ugly and often hateful word. If used to refer to somebody in the wrong way, then it’s definitely wrong. But I myself have nothing but scorn for those who want to pretend that the word doesn’t exist, that it never existed, for those too delicate to face the ugliness of reality.

Mark Twain, for instance, used it in his writing, because that’s how people in mid-1800s Missouri talked. (Incidentally, Twain also wrote one of the most scathing denunciations of racism ever done - Pudd’nhead Wilson. He used the word in there, too.) To bowdlerize Huckleberry Finn because it uses a word we now find unpleasant would be both silly and a disservice to literature.

Edit. WRT your own colour, I’m not overly impressed with the claim that, for instance, only a black person can write about blacks, because the inevitable follow-up to that is that - by precisely the same logic and argument - only whites can legitimately write about whites, that gay writers can only write about gays and women have no place writing about men - all of which is a total crock. It condemns us to only writing introspective pablum.

Do your research, don’t use it unnecessarily, treat it with the caution it requires and carry on.

 

[DMBFFF]

I'm wondering if I should enjoy this song these days:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_N_Roll_Nigger

Patti Smith--Rock 'N' Roll Nigger (with Babelogue intro) ~ Easter (1978)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8SoVfTVLrk
5:32
song starts in 0:32

3:57 she refers to as one!

A slightly different version that was the first I heard:
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1o68h4Usqs



TarnishedPenny says wise stuff, though Mark Twain might get a moral pass that other white writers might not get as he was progressive for the times.


My advice, FWIW:

1. Write it out—get it out of your system, maybe explore.
2. Let it sit there a while before uploading.
3. Maybe solicit blacks or at least POC editors and beta readers.
4. Maybe upload but be prepared to defend it against charges of racism, privilege—perhaps as one might to 2nd—or are they 3rd—wave feminists charging us with sexism/misogyny for writing porn—the personal is political—what's in the mind/heart is ...,—type of talk.
5. Warning on top of the story might be good too.

 

[astuffedshirt_perv]

...the white girl on the receiving end of all this black dick wants to use the n-word to her black lover(s)... There's no point in putting finger to keyboard on this idea if it will get me panned and banned

Ah, snowflakes today. No, you won't get banned, but you will get panned if you post it in Loving Wives. The way to get banned is to make her under age.

But seriously, go to https://search.literotica.com and search that word. Lots and lots of stories use it. Some faired better than others. Read around and see how other handled it. Stormbringer has a bunch of stories in a similar vein you might want to check out.

 

[JaxRhapsody]

I'm looking for advice on a story. I'm not sure if I should even start down this road so I'm trying to feel out the community for guidance.

BBC, interracial, maybe MMF, maybe a train/gangbang, maybe pregnant, but the part that makes me pause is this: the white girl on the receiving end of all this black dick wants to use the n-word to her black lover(s). I blame Spring Thomas for this idea registering as sexy in my stupid head. My thought was to make this issue part of the story, part of the discussion with the participants, and maybe explore the issue a little bit.

Should I back the fuck up, check my white privilege and just run away from this idea? Is this one of those third rail deals? I'm not looking to be intentionally offensive or shocking, and I am willing to accept that this is a kink I need to take out back and drown in the creek, right?

What do you fine people think? There's no point in putting finger to keyboard on this idea if it will get me panned and banned.

Thx,
CS

I'll give you my black two cents. If you use it, use it properly and depending on what kinda white girl she is depends on if she would use it or not. The higher on the class scale, the least likely she would use it. Or at least use it in the "nice" way. Honestly I rarely use the word in stories or real life nor do I see a difference in Nigger and Nigga and see Nigga as improper pronunciation, anyway. Just like how Mopar started out as More Power and well... the more country the person was, the more it became one word and blam; it's Mopar now.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I'll give you my black two cents. If you use it, use it properly and depending on what kinda white girl she is depends on if she would use it or not. The higher on the class scale, the least likely she would use it. Or at least use it in the "nice" way. Honestly I rarely use the word in stories or real life nor do I see a difference in Nigger and Nigga and see Nigga as improper pronunciation, anyway. Just like how Mopar started out as More Power and well... the more country the person was, the more it became one word and blam; it's Mopar now.

Now that’s interesting. I would not have thought of that.

But class usage must shift. The word was once common in all classes.

Need to think on that.

 

[gordo12]

I've been writing a lot of period Westerns lately and agonized over the N problem. It's totally period appropriate but... the modern me doesn't feel good about it. It is/was derogatory.

So I try to limit the usage, write out a black character unless it's necessary and I would put a warning up front. But if it is totally appropriate, in it goes.

 

[yukonnights]

Let's face it; it's a high octane word in regard to kink and sexual stimulation in some circumstances. It's entwined with a taboo of inter-racial couplings and is especially potent in some kinks/story genres.

It seems a shame to deprive those who find such play their go to fantasy. It also stings to feel constrained in the story telling craft — it's real and it happens. So how to include it w/o getting things too stirred up?

One way might be (emphasis on might) to have the person in a power position be the black alpha...an educated black alpha CEO for example. That's pretty straight forward and common in this trope. If it were he who demanded the use of such a term in the sexual play, it might soften the impact of negative racial overtones to some degree. ("I told you Leroy, you use the word your grand-pappy called my people — only you'll be saying it while you beg me to mount your wife! You like this big black snake, your wife likes it — so just say it Leroy. Surrender and let your shame tickle you and get you all worked up. Your wife's waiting for you to speak up Leroy.")

Another ploy might be a short introduction to the story where the author educates the reader about the history of the word. Acknowledges it's negative connotations — but also explains that in some cultures for many men/women of all races the word implies power, virility, and dominance, etc. (I think a well researched intro on the history/origins/evolution of the word would actually be good reading on it's own merits.)

Anyway, just some random thoughts Good luck, and be sure to wear the asbestos firefighting suit

 

[Deleted member 3041612]

As an American Black woman, this is only my opinion. It is a hurtful, hate filled word that most in my culture have come to use as a term of endearment or derogatory means. It has been used in literature. It has been used in history to describe my culture as "less than human". It has been used numerous different ways.

Coming directly from me? It's a hurtful word that is meant to demean and lower my self worth. I choose not to use it. It conjures up feelings of hate from the white race that influenced other races and cultures. They picked up this train of thought. Based on media stereotypes, those without the melanin in their skins forget that we as a race, to some extent, had no choice in what we were born to look like. Other countries look at that word and build their own variation of it. To have been called n-word by different races closer to or darker than my complexion (after spending time in the sun or tanning), it is not kind. It doesn't make it any more accepted or acceptable being in literature, songs or history. I tolerate the word because of history.

If you choose to use it, and it's uncomfortable for you, it's something you will have to stand by. If 10 to 20 years down the road, you see history repeating itself, are you prepared to deal with the way and how it was used and the fact that it was used at all? How are you at explaining the use of that word to an elementary school child? I was smart for that age. I wasn't shy about asking questions. Are you prepared for explaining your answer to a child that stumbles upon your works and is bold enough to email you about it? Yes, I found out early about things and was bold enough to investigate the use of that word (This was back when the internet was equivalent to the Dewey Decimal System).

By using it, it doesn't matter if you were ingrained in Black culture or not, it will never feel right to some. Sometimes it opens up a can of worms that many don't want to talk about, explore and even acknowledge. The issue is the harsh realities of race, how people don't feel comfortable with someone who's melanin is much different and issues revolving around the n-word.

 

[SimonDoom]

My personal view is that it cannot be wrong for an artist or author, of whatever color, to create art or stories that mimic or depict the real world accurately, however ugly it is. The result may be unpleasant, and it may offend somehow, but being unpleasant or offensive does not make something wrong.

But the fact of the matter is that the world has changed in the last 20 years and many people do not agree with my opinion, especially younger people. As an old school "liberal" (sort of) who remains firmly committed to the idea that people shouldn't be judged by their race, the notion that your race or skin color should determine what you can say, what words can come out of your mouth, what hairstyle you can wear, what parts you can play in a movie, what costumes and makeup you can wear seems very, very wrong to me. But my young adult daughter doesn't quite agree with me, and many younger people don't agree with me. You can expect that if you use this word, in almost any context, you may get blow-back, and perhaps even accusations, and you have to decide if you want to deal with that.

 

[Bramblethorn]

My personal view is that it cannot be wrong for an artist or author, of whatever color, to create art or stories that mimic or depict the real world accurately, however ugly it is. The result may be unpleasant, and it may offend somehow, but being unpleasant or offensive does not make something wrong.

But the fact of the matter is that the world has changed in the last 20 years and many people do not agree with my opinion, especially younger people. As an old school "liberal" (sort of) who remains firmly committed to the idea that people shouldn't be judged by their race, the notion that your race or skin color should determine what you can say, what words can come out of your mouth, what hairstyle you can wear, what parts you can play in a movie, what costumes and makeup you can wear seems very, very wrong to me.

Context matters. My partner gets to call me names that would be completely inappropriate for my co-workers to use, because of the relationship that we have. For the same kind of reason, Black people get to call one another by names that I, as a White person, don't get to use - though, as BlackCaramelCreme's answer suggests, it's not straightforward even between Black people.

When a White person uses the N-word to a Black person, that can be a very threatening act, because of the history of that word and how it's been used. For a lot of Black people it was the last word they ever heard. I don't deal much in absolutes, but I'd need to have an amazingly good reason to use that in a story, knowing the associations it will have for some readers.

Re. the other stuff you mention: by my understanding, what tends to raise hackles isn't so much "White people adopt Black fashion/culture/etc." as "White people lauded for adopting Black fashion/culture/etc. while Black people are denied it or penalised for it."

Hair, for example - styles like dreadlocks and cornrows are popular with Black people because they help keep curly hair manageable, but because of their associations with Black people, they've been stigmatised as "ghetto". Just the other day I saw a Black woman talking about a customer who'd told her "you'd look more professional if you got your hair straightened". Only a few years ago, the US military was banning those hairstyles.

So when somebody complains about white dudes wearing dreadlocks as a fashion statement, that's where it's coming from: it hurts to be denied or punished for something that's a part of your own culture while somebody else gets to be trendy in it.

 

[Deleted member 3041612]

My personal view is that it cannot be wrong for an artist or author, of whatever color, to create art or stories that mimic or depict the real world accurately, however ugly it is. The result may be unpleasant, and it may offend somehow, but being unpleasant or offensive does not make something wrong.

But the fact of the matter is that the world has changed in the last 20 years and many people do not agree with my opinion, especially younger people. As an old school "liberal" (sort of) who remains firmly committed to the idea that people shouldn't be judged by their race, the notion that your race or skin color should determine what you can say, what words can come out of your mouth, what hairstyle you can wear, what parts you can play in a movie, what costumes and makeup you can wear seems very, very wrong to me. But my young adult daughter doesn't quite agree with me, and many younger people don't agree with me. You can expect that if you use this word, in almost any context, you may get blow-back, and perhaps even accusations, and you have to decide if you want to deal with that.

Have you ever been on a situation where you heard an inflammatory word used to describe you by a person in authority of another race, in a room full of people who despised you because of the color of your skin, been stopped by police and had a gun pulled on you for no other reason other than looking suspicious, or clearly disrespected when in line and the cashier won't serve you because your skin is of a darker hue than everyone else? Walk a mile in someone else's shoes for a while and see how you feel about my race being described as ugly, lazy, good for nothing and stupid. I'm not talking about things that happened in the 1930s but are very real and present today. Sometimes it isn't just what is said, but is what is showed in actions as well. Then think about statement you made. Whether you may still think the same way or not, it does make an impact seeing yourself followed around on a store rather than someone left alone and not considered a threat.

That's a should've could've would've scenario. The real deal is that negative things happen whether we want them to or not. Are you ready accept the responsibility for calling it what it is when presented? Race should not matter but when children are taken out of earshot of parents, most think of darker skins as being ugly or more criminal. Most keep that train of thought even with teachings. Not everyone Is a racist for using that n-word but how they use it, what it is used for and why it is used period sure burns like lava to the skin to some.

Please know that I'm an individual. I don't represent the entire race. People are different. Those are my opinions.

 

[cuck72]

My girlfriend and I are a Mexican couple and we've been around black guys and they've let her say "nigga" or niggas" and they thought it was cool coming out of her mouth.

I've seen plenty of interracial video's, where the black guy will say " you like this 'N" cock. In gay video's some of the black guys will tell the white faggot " suck that " N" cock. I just think of it as just another degrading name calling word in sex, some people like myself get turned on with the name calling. Like calling her a slut or whore if she likes the name calling, maybe it's in role-playing. Like in a lot of interracial gay video's, where the black dom is telling the white guy " suck it while boy." I feel outside of sex, it would mostly be very wrong, and disrespectful.

I understand many of us don't enjoy the same kinds of sex, like forced sex. I like the theme where maybe the guy or girl may not be a hard-core racist, but just aren't into black guys.. BUT! like they say, once she or he goes black they are black cock addicts. Maybe a women uses the "N" word to the wrong couple of guys. She learns to love those BBC's. Maybe it's a white boy .

If a black guy tells a white guy " suck it white boy," is that racist? Or just a black man getting off thinking of being superior.

 

[jaF0]

Like the age thing, when in doubt, don't.

 

[jaF0]

I've been writing a lot of period Westerns lately and agonized over the N problem. It's totally period appropriate but... the modern me doesn't feel good about it. It is/was derogatory.

This ain't the 70s and ain't none of us neither Cleavon Little nor Mel Brooks:


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/films/2016/08/30/104823280blazingsaddles_trans_NvBQzQNjv4Bq3tF9VLWEm4uczfkOMJlJW-MkFIoh4ppvjaVMuW4x_eI.jpg?imwidth=480

 

[gordo12]

This ain't the 70s and ain't none of us neither Cleavon Little nor Mel Brooks:

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say. It isn't the George Jefferson or Archie Bunker era either.

When I say period Westerns I'm talking 1860's to maybe 1885. The wild west era. Then end of the Civil War and the struggle to free slaves (among other issues). The N word was pretty much THE word. As I understand history.

[Rest of what I really want to say about what sickens me with regard to colour of skin, sexual or political discrimination deleted. Too political]

 

[Deleted member 3041612]

.....

 

[srgreene]

Dawning Nomex and Kevlar... Well, just me, but context is everything. Two black guys dropping that in conversation between them probably floats. A hateful cracker cursing them before he gets nailed would, too.

The word is a reality. It’s not a polite word. It’s a charged word. It’s an ugly and often hateful word. If used to refer to somebody in the wrong way, then it’s definitely wrong. But I myself have nothing but scorn for those who want to pretend that the word doesn’t exist, that it never existed, for those too delicate to face the ugliness of reality.

One of the images that stuck in my mind was from Ken Burns' excellent series on jazz. He explored the black neighborhoods where it flourished as a sort of vaguely disreputable musical form. He showed a photo of a restaurant in Kansas City ... the name of this establishment was "N****r Chicken". I don't think the owner was trying to disparage his customers- he was just saying black folks were welcome, and probably Caucasians never ventured there.

Truly, words are what you make of them!

 

[SimonDoom]

Have you ever been on a situation where you heard an inflammatory word used to describe you by a person in authority of another race, in a room full of people who despised you because of the color of your skin, been stopped by police and had a gun pulled on you for no other reason other than looking suspicious, or clearly disrespected when in line and the cashier won't serve you because your skin is of a darker hue than everyone else? Walk a mile in someone else's shoes for a while and see how you feel about my race being described as ugly, lazy, good for nothing and stupid. I'm not talking about things that happened in the 1930s but are very real and present today. Sometimes it isn't just what is said, but is what is showed in actions as well. Then think about statement you made. Whether you may still think the same way or not, it does make an impact seeing yourself followed around on a store rather than someone left alone and not considered a threat.

That's a should've could've would've scenario. The real deal is that negative things happen whether we want them to or not. Are you ready accept the responsibility for calling it what it is when presented? Race should not matter but when children are taken out of earshot of parents, most think of darker skins as being ugly or more criminal. Most keep that train of thought even with teachings. Not everyone Is a racist for using that n-word but how they use it, what it is used for and why it is used period sure burns like lava to the skin to some.

Please know that I'm an individual. I don't represent the entire race. People are different. Those are my opinions.

I've never, ever been in a position like that, and I can only imagine what it's like. I don't really know.

Please understand I don't condone using that work directed at an individual, or in public discourse as a way of insulting or demeaning people. But I see that as being very different from writing a work of fiction in which characters use the word because that's the way that similar characters in the real world actually talked. If you are writing a book about people in the south in the 1950s, the reality is that people did use that word, and if you choose to excise it from the vocabulary of the people of the time then you are writing a fake book.

I personally don't use the word in my stories. I'm enough a creature of my time that I find it offensive in a way that I don't find many other words offensive. But then so far I have not written any stories in which racism is a factor.

I do not pretend to have all the answers regarding the right way to balance making progress on things like racism with freedom of expression. In literature I'm inclined to lean hard toward maximizing freedom of expression, but as I said in my first post I understand that some people, including those whose opinions I value, think differently. I think this is going to be an ongoing dialogue and I'm not sure what the result will be.

 

[SimonDoom]

So when somebody complains about white dudes wearing dreadlocks as a fashion statement, that's where it's coming from: it hurts to be denied or punished for something that's a part of your own culture while somebody else gets to be trendy in it.

It seems to me that the civilized and enlightened and moral response to this problem is to stop discriminating, rather than to say "Group A was discriminated against for a long time, so now Group B has to be denied something because of its skin color." That's regress, not progress.

The contextual example you gave regarding use of the N Word between people is valid as far as it goes but it has nothing to do with whether or not one should use the word in a story. Let me give another example that's more on point, based on a factual incident:

A black rap artist is performing on stage and invites a young white girl to get on the stage and sing along with him. The song he sings includes the N word. The girl sings the word out loud while singing along with him, and she's criticized for it, including by the artist. I think that's wrong. I do. That makes no sense to me. She's not directing the word as an insult to someone. She's singing HIS song, in appreciation of his song and to have fun. I think it's very odd that it should be perceived as wrong for a white person to let the word escape her lips under circumstances where it's obviously not meant as an insult, and where the artist himself is performing in front of and to a crowd full of white people.

Another example: A white professor is teaching a class, covering the topic of offensive words and the degree to which they should be tolerated. He utters the N word out loud in front of his class, and some black students take offense, to the degree that some believe he should be disciplined, or even fired. Has the white professor done something wrong? I don't think so. How do we talk in truly meaningful ways about things without using the words? No one would think twice if he said the F-word (although at one time in the past, a professor publicly saying that word in class probably would have been regarded as scandalous).

There are plenty of movies in which the N word is uttered. Watch any Tarantino movie. Is that wrong? Is it wrong for a student to recite a passage from a book in class and utter the N word?

I'm inclined to think we have regressed, rather than progressed, through the expansion of concepts of taboo in our society regarding the use of words. Of course, people should not try to hurt other people, and should be criticized for doing so. But the examples I've given are NOT examples of that.

I question, too, whether any of this has done any good. In some ways, at least in America, we have been going backward on racial progress in some ways for a while, and I think some of that is the result of the animosity and resentment built up by the actions of the overly zealous language and culture police.

 

[Deleted member 3041612]

I've never, ever been in a position like that, and I can only imagine what it's like. I don't really know.

Please understand I don't condone using that work directed at an individual, or in public discourse as a way of insulting or demeaning people. But I see that as being very different from writing a work of fiction in which characters use the word because that's the way that similar characters in the real world actually talked. If you are writing a book about people in the south in the 1950s, the reality is that people did use that word, and if you choose to excise it from the vocabulary of the people of the time then you are writing a fake book.

I personally don't use the word in my stories. I'm enough a creature of my time that I find it offensive in a way that I don't find many other words offensive. But then so far I have not written any stories in which racism is a factor.

I do not pretend to have all the answers regarding the right way to balance making progress on things like racism with freedom of expression. In literature I'm inclined to lean hard toward maximizing freedom of expression, but as I said in my first post I understand that some people, including those whose opinions I value, think differently. I think this is going to be an ongoing dialogue and I'm not sure what the result will be.

An interesting dialogue indeed. Even in story form, I sometimes still wince because in today's day and age, I still get called that from others who prejudge me or don't bother to get to know me as a person but is more inclined to accept me as a stereotype, of which I am totally different.

 

[Deleted member 3041612]

It seems to me that the civilized and enlightened and moral response to this problem is to stop discriminating, rather than to say "Group A was discriminated against for a long time, so now Group B has to be denied something because of its skin color." That's regress, not progress.

The contextual example you gave regarding use of the N Word between people is valid as far as it goes but it has nothing to do with whether or not one should use the word in a story. Let me give another example that's more on point, based on a factual incident:

A black rap artist is performing on stage and invites a young white girl to get on the stage and sing along with him. The song he sings includes the N word. The girl sings the word out loud while singing along with him, and she's criticized for it, including by the artist. I think that's wrong. I do. That makes no sense to me. She's not directing the word as an insult to someone. She's singing HIS song, in appreciation of his song and to have fun. I think it's very odd that it should be perceived as wrong for a white person to let the word escape her lips under circumstances where it's obviously not meant as an insult, and where the artist himself is performing in front of and to a crowd full of white people.

Another example: A white professor is teaching a class, covering the topic of offensive words and the degree to which they should be tolerated. He utters the N word out loud in front of his class, and some black students take offense, to the degree that some believe he should be disciplined, or even fired. Has the white professor done something wrong? I don't think so. How do we talk in truly meaningful ways about things without using the words? No one would think twice if he said the F-word (although at one time in the past, a professor publicly saying that word in class probably would have been regarded as scandalous).

There are plenty of movies in which the N word is uttered. Watch any Tarantino movie. Is that wrong? Is it wrong for a student to recite a passage from a book in class and utter the N word?

I'm inclined to think we have regressed, rather than progressed, through the expansion of concepts of taboo in our society regarding the use of words. Of course, people should not try to hurt other people, and should be criticized for doing so. But the examples I've given are NOT examples of that.

I question, too, whether any of this has done any good. In some ways, at least in America, we have been going backward on racial progress in some ways for a while, and I think some of that is the result of the animosity and resentment built up by the actions of the overly zealous language and culture police.

I believe the girl was innocent in the repeating of the word. If you don't want a person to say it, don't use it as common language. When using words as common language, there is somewhat of a free pass to use it.

The professor clearly was exploring the use of the word. To get mad when the intent was to explore offensive words and should have sparked conversation, not outrage. I think those comments should have been spoken up about them then, at the moment of impact rather than to wait for public backlash, where the conversation could be taken out of context.

The intent of how the n-word is used can easily be taken out of context. Even in a story, a fake story, the use of it raises emotions because of what is associated with it, (for some) who uses it, how it's used and even the reason for it to be used at all. Again, this is my individual opinion and observation. I don't represent the entire Black race.

 

[JaxRhapsody]

I believe the girl was innocent in the repeating of the word. If you don't want a person to say it, don't use it as common language. When using words as common language, there is somewhat of a free pass to use it.

The professor clearly was exploring the use of the word. To get mad when the intent was to explore offensive words and should have sparked conversation, not outrage. I think those comments should have been spoken up about them then, at the moment of impact rather than to wait for public backlash, where the conversation could be taken out of context.

The intent of how the n-word is used can easily be taken out of context. Even in a story, a fake story, the use of it raises emotions because of what is associated with it, (for some) who uses it, how it's used and even the reason for it to be used at all. Again, this is my individual opinion and observation. I don't represent the entire Black race.

One has to be pragmatic about it. Is it hienous, it can be, it we can drag the issue to some high levels, but when it comes to it, we're talking about basically art here and depending how period correct or real somebody wants the story, that trumps new age thinking. If wrote something and a character(ex, ghetto white girl) is of a particular group where it is known to be used... it's not goimg to be some Norman Rockwell, See Spot Run ordeal with no profanities and near perfect english. The word hurts you and I get that, it doesn't bother me, as I don't believe in the "power" it is, nor give it such. A black person calling me a nigga oit of anger is no different than if it were a white person, it irritates me in the way that I am not one and those that would be considered, or claim to be a nigga- the only thing we have in common is skin color and city geograghical area where we live.

I have one story I've written where it was used and by a character who is a straight up hood nigga. He even drives an 85 Caprice. The other black characters whom are probably more cultured/progressive don't even use it. I don't even use it. This post probably has it written more times than I have spoken the word in a few years, and more than that particular story. I'm not afraid to say or write it, though. I just choose not to. I don't typically write characters that would use it either. If somebody wanted to turn Roots in to an erotica... Massa ain't callin all the colored folks by name, even the ones they gave them 99% of the time. History is history and people are people. Even something not historically acurate has to touch base. All this wraps up in use, though. I'm just not triggered by it. Other than that; I don't t think anybody should use slurs as slurs.

I also know that if I read a story about Lil Mook Mook fucking Becky and the Crenshaw house party and she lives six houses down from him, I'll question the legitimacy of said fictional erotica, especially if La-A(LaDasha) and her cousin Mercedes ain't judging him for getting that lilly white pussy whif' all da sistahs he cod pick from.

 

[Bramblethorn]

It seems to me that the civilized and enlightened and moral response to this problem is to stop discriminating,

Sure. That's a great world and we should all work towards it. But we don't live in that world yet, and we need to deal with the world we do live in.

There are plenty of movies in which the N word is uttered. Watch any Tarantino movie. Is that wrong?

On this, I don't think I have anything to add to the answer I gave the last time you asked about this same thing.

Is it wrong for a student to recite a passage from a book in class and utter the N word?

That surely depends on context. If they're doing it Tarantino-style, for the sake of shock value, then yeah, they're being a tool. Otherwise, well...

Is a student in that class free to piss on a US flag and set it alight, if they're making a legitimate point about something or other? Are they free to desecrate a Bible? Can they speak their mind about their teacher without punishment? (For that matter, is the teacher permitted to discuss history from specific ethnic perspectives?)

If the answer to any of those is "no", as it very often is, then maybe we need to be asking about why Black people have to put up with crap that makes them uncomfortable while nice white Christian people have all their own sensitivities defended.

I question, too, whether any of this has done any good. In some ways, at least in America, we have been going backward on racial progress in some ways for a while, and I think some of that is the result of the animosity and resentment built up by the actions of the overly zealous language and culture police.

History shows us that racists are perfectly capable of being racist without any need for provocation. They may well use such things as excuses for racist behaviour, but those excuses are best taken with a hefty dose of skepticism.

 

[MotherEffer]

If you want to use the word nigger in your story, then use the word nigger. It's that easy. I suggest that when you do it, then you make it work. The word nigger is going to tell us a lot about your characters, but if you don't do it right, it may come across as a different personality trait than you expected.

There's a movie with Selma Blair, where she's a white student in a creative writing class taught by a black professor. They meet in a bar, he takes her home, and they fuck. He makes her say, "Nigger, fuck me hard," over and over again.

It got people talking, but I already knew white women who had black boyfriends and some of them told their women to call them "nigger" when they were fucking. The reason was because the men liked it. I had black friends, who were men, and some told me the same. It added a certain nastiness when they were having intense sex. Guys have to brag to each other about that, and then I had to ask my other friends just to see if it rang true.

Do what you want do, but I'm sure you can understand that some people will love it, some will hate it, some won't care, some will think you're trying to hard to be edge, etc.

Getting permission from strangers doesn't mean shit.