the image of desire; the rarity of the erotic

[Pure]

the mass market of porn serves to suppress certain images. it is rare to see the image of desire, the 'hot couple', kissing, embracing or fucking, is one. this thread is to share such images. i've attached two, below, not necessarily spectacular, but they show what i have in mind.

Find a good example, and give a link or make an attachment. If you had any trouble finding it, let me know why you think this is. here are the specs in detail. Read below if you want some rationale or my thoughts.


I'm inviting readers to have a look for the following. (i'm not saying it's better than others, or 'more tasteful.')

1) it's a picture of a couple, man and woman, hot for each other.
2) there should NOT be primary focus on her pussy, if indeed any details are shown at all.

3) they do not look at the viewer; they might, for example, look to each other, or their eyes might be closed, lost in desire.

let's 4) limit ourselves to free sites, and
5) exclude stills from movies and 'amateur porn' sites .

==================
why is an image of desire, hard to find on the 'net?" general comments for discussion are welcome.

an erotic picture invites the readers to witness desire, the approach is 'aesthetic'. that is, the standards of beauty in fine photography and art apply: composition etc. some common features: its subjects, lost in desire, generally do not look at you. they are wrapped in each other. details of cock and pussy may not be present. such pictures are VERY hard to find on the net.

porn--we are talking mostly of pictures, here--operates to stifle the erotic. it aims at quick release. the model is available quickly; she seems to be saying, 'take me,' or more subtly, 'jerk off.' to achieve that, it's posed so that she ' looks at you' (camera). she either smiles (most common) or looks sultry.(i'm not objecting to a quick solution, any more than i object to another quick fix, the cup of coffee.)

the above specifications are descriptive. no type of picture, in an of itself is morally superior by its very nature. the general point is to look at how the market has dealt with images of desire.

 

[xssve]

http://men.style.com/slideshows/mens/standalone/gq/fashion/0309/dancy/00004f.jpg
Suit, $1,512, and pocket square by Neil Barrett. Shirt, $215, by Z Zegna. Tie, $160, by Dolce & Gabbana. Shoes, $650, by Salvatore Ferragamo.

http://men.style.com/gq/features/landing?id=content_8237

 

[DeeZire]

The best erotica I've found on the net is at nerve dot com. The reading material is free, but the photo features require premium membership, which is - I think - $35 per year.

I know you didn't mention writing, but I wish more LITizens would check out some of the personal essays and fiction over there. They set a high bar, something we could all do well to consider in our literary efforts.

There is a lot of art photography over there, or a melding of art and erotica. In trying to come up with a description, "sex for slackers" seems appropriate. One can imagine a slacker couple with nothing but time to enjoy each other, (much like the back seat photo in the first post) where in the nine-to-five world, it's all wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am.

I think the honesty of desire is what's missing in commercial porn. This is what I find in the offerings at Nerve, both in the writing and the photography. I can also find it here, but it seems to be a rare commodity.

Please understand I'm not knocking this place, just trying to expand horizons, and ruminate on the topic at hand. BTW, the fashion photo above looks like it could have come from Nerve. Thanks for that.

 

[Pure]

nerve

having seen the old hardcopy versions of nerve and their book i can attest to the excellence of their erotica in story and picture.

since their photos are presently for pay, that makes them unable to this thread, either by url (unless subcribed) or by attachment.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

The reason there's not much desire on the web is that you can't sell it.

No one wants to pay to be hungry.

 

[Stella_Omega]

The reason there's not much desire on the web is that you can't sell it.

No one wants to pay to be hungry.

Sometimes you utterly impress me, you do.

 

[wafflemtl]

Since you specify "no amateur" I yahoo-ed "professional erotic photograph"
and found plenty of single (mostly girl) erotic (toward porn) pictures.

So I added "couple" and here are two results that could satisfy your criteria :

Erotic by nature - photographer David Steinberg
Photographer keith Banham gallery

And a bit out of topic (F/F), a link that one of the girl here post a long time ago about photographer Judy Francesconi

Waffle

PS : I found the two guys here
PPS : and Doc, since those photographers sell their pictures one the net I suppose you can (sell desire I mean ...)

 

[Salvor-Hardon]

I'll throw out Jack Vettriano, which should shock and surprise everyone

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

I'm not saying this just to push sales (honest), but I've always thought that when it comes to hot steamy images of carnal desire, the folks at Eternal Press did all right by me with the one they picked for the cover of my story.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/909970/Clipboard03.jpg


This black and white beach shot is fairly well known.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9IY2B99RZIo/Rxec1vmPw6I/AAAAAAAAA_o/beMEkW_t-p8/s400/from%2Bhere%2Bto%2Beternity.JPG


And one more "beach kiss" this one by Merrill Robinson http://www.itsablackthang.com/images/Art-Romance/merrill-robinson-paradise.jpg

http://www.itsablackthang.com/images/Art-Romance/merrill-robinson-paradise.jpg

Rumple Foreskin

 

[Pure]

thanks

xssve, waffle, and rumple, and all others, for the links.

rumple, the first is quite impressive. the second is rightly famous, but as it's a movie still, doesn't qualify.

to doc //The reason there's not much desire on the web is that you can't sell it.

No one wants to pay to be hungry. //

pure: one doesn't 'pay to be hungry,' but neither does one, when hungry, always choose mcdonalds and being fed in 5 mins, instead of going to a fine restaurant where you wait 20 mins and it's worth it.

as far as the general point, i believe desire is indeed sought. lovers since the troubadors have delighted in the arousal of desire. it feels good to be aroused by one's love, and the *postponement* of satisfaction can be savored.

on the general point, further, yes the 'market' is responsible for the wave of porn. commercial considerations do not lead to high quality products, as a rule. otoh, i wonder why the net is a LESS likely place than a good bookstore, to find a an 'image of desire' (e.g. erotic photograph).

 

[Stella_Omega]

I could link you to many images "of desire" that have been created by women for women. But I don't want to link the whole world to them-- pm me if interested.

Most of these images are not hetero, though.

One of the most often recurring motifs, I've noticed, is linked hands.

 

[slyc_willie]

I've always liked Met-Art, personally, because they engender both extremes. Their photography can be both sublimely erotic and patently pornographic, sometimes at the same time.

Some of my favorite models -- Koika, Avril, and Jezebel -- are featured with Met-Art almost exclusively.

 

[Pure]

note to stella, and a reference

stella said,

//I could link you to many images "of desire" that have been created by women for women. But I don't want to link the whole world to them-- pm me if interested.

Most of these images are not hetero, though.//

thanks for pointing this out. i did, in my searches for 'images of desire' encounter exceptions to the rule that the 'net has almost entirely generated porn pics. they were at sites advertized for women, and presumably run by them. these sites were usually paying, which to me suggests an understandable desire NOT to be accessible to the whole world.

there are of course, even apart from these sites, at some 'fine photography' sites, some striking image of desire, with two women. (and indeed, some of two men.)

i have no reason to slight such images in this thread, but a complicating factor is that woman/woman scenes of a slightly different cast are also favored by men's sites and are straight, whack-off porn.

---
to all,

there is an interesting essay by a woman photographer named china hamilton; she gives illustrative examples and tries to state what the ingredients are, for a genuinely erotic photograph. for some reason i can't get the url of the essay, "the nature of the erotic". but if you go to the site, it's near the top of the list of essays and can be clicked on.

http://www.associationoferoticartists.co.uk/code.htm

top of page, click on 'the essence of the erotic" by china hamilton

 

[ishtat]

The reason there's not much desire on the web is that you can't sell it.

No one wants to pay to be hungry.

Images of desire are often best achieved in poetry, but then poetry doesn't sell too well either.

My favourite image of desire is one depicting a desire for love rather than sex. It is of an old woman kneeling awkwardly on one knee at her husbands grave. One hand was on the headstone to support herself whilst the other reached out to place a flower. it looked like an embrace and was a metaphor of her feeling for him which to her was still alive.

I'm not going to post it though because the lady is still alive and somehow it seems very private

 

[lesbiaphrodite]

I often see examples of desire in moving pictures more than still work. The best movies have many pictures of such feelings and evoke them in the viewer. I think of the look on William Hurt's face when he wants young Kathleen Turner in "Body Heat" or the look on Susan Sarandon's face when she is yearning for Catherine Deneuve in "The Hunger."

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I think Olivia de Havilland captured the essence of desire in a scene from GONE WITH THE WIND.

Melanie is chatting with Scarlett when a bum turns onto the lane to Tara. Melanie seems pole-axed and propelled into racing toward the man...Ashley.

 

[lesbiaphrodite]

I think Olivia de Havilland captured the essence of desire in a scene from GONE WITH THE WIND.

Melanie is chatting with Scarlett when a bum turns onto the lane to Tara. Melanie seems pole-axed and propelled into racing toward the man...Ashley.

Nice one, JBJ. I remember it vividly.

 

[Pure]

question:

images of desire are NOT rare in movies, for example the still that rumple posted, i think, from 'on the beach'.

yet movies are commerce driven, as are bookstores. i wonder why the 'net is not so congenial as either?? why are some female- directed and -oriented sites an exception to the rule?

 

[Selena_Kitt]

I think Olivia de Havilland captured the essence of desire in a scene from GONE WITH THE WIND.

Melanie is chatting with Scarlett when a bum turns onto the lane to Tara. Melanie seems pole-axed and propelled into racing toward the man...Ashley.

That wasn't desire - that was co-dependence. If it wasn't Ashley, it was Scarlett... she was an equal opportunity co-dependent, I'll give her that...

Not that there was one healthy relationship in that book. Which, frankly my dear, made it all the more interesting...

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Desire is denial of satisfaction. For desire to be communicated, I think you have to be willing to undergo frustration and denial yourself. These are more easily communicated in a movie or on TV. where the audience has no choice but to endure the denial that creates desire. Movies, TV, drama, and to some extent books are linear media. The audience has no input into the subject matter. They're passive observers.

You don't get that kind of control and manipulation of an audience on the internet. We wouldn't stand for it. We want to cut right to the chase, and we have the ability to do it with a single click (and maybe a credit card.)

The issue's similar to asking why more X-rated movies don't have plots and decent acting. The reason is, they don't need them and plots simply delay the gratification of the people who watch X-rated stuff.

If you write porn, chances are you'll have little desire expressed in the story. If you write romance, though, your whole book is about desire and the denial that fosters it.

The question is, can surfeit create desire too?

 

[Stella_Omega]

images of desire are NOT rare in movies, for example the still that rumple posted, i think, from 'on the beach'.

yet movies are commerce driven, as are bookstores. i wonder why the 'net is not so congenial as either?? why are some female- directed and -oriented sites an exception to the rule?

Oxytocin.

:nods:

I looked at your link, pure, and I wonder how long ago she wrote her essays. Back when I began trying to catalogue my own erotic needs, i was all alone-- inventing, as they say, the wheel. In eight years, women's aggregrate selfknowledge, if I can call it that, has increased amazingly.

 

[DeeZire]

My favourite image of desire is one depicting a desire for love rather than sex. It is of an old woman kneeling awkwardly on one knee at her husbands grave. One hand was on the headstone to support herself whilst the other reached out to place a flower. it looked like an embrace and was a metaphor of her feeling for him which to her was still alive.

Thank you for that. It's the most moving thing I've encountered in weeks.

 

[Pure]

note to doc

Desire is denial of satisfaction. For desire to be communicated, I think you have to be willing to undergo frustration and denial yourself. These are more easily communicated in a movie or on TV. where the audience has no choice but to endure the denial that creates desire. Movies, TV, drama, and to some extent books are linear media. The audience has no input into the subject matter. They're passive observers.

You don't get that kind of control and manipulation of an audience on the internet. We wouldn't stand for it. We want to cut right to the chase, and we have the ability to do it with a single click (and maybe a credit card.)

P: i'm not sure who the the 'we' is, in the last two sentences. There are mystery stories online, as well as romances.

for mysteries,

http://www.mysterynet.com/short-mystery-stories/

there's no doubt that online porn yields fast results for the seekers of such. OTOH, if you look at longer stories at Lit, some with very high ratings, it's apparent that there is some portion of 'net users--perhaps those not challenged in oxytocin-- enjoy 'buildup'; the mass porn market notwithstanding.

 

[Stella_Omega]

One of the most erotic images I know of on the web is a female fan's rendition of a certain Boy Who Lived (as a young adult, OF COURSE) sprawled over the bed, with all his bits dangling. he has a look of exhausted satiation on his face, and is splashed with his own seed, and he has softening, but not yet limp.
A certain Teacher Of Potions is in his company. The man has one arm wrapped around of one H____'s legs, and has a finger or two inserted in the nether orifice. he is looking up into his young lover's face, with an expression of fierce, possessive wonder. His other hand is rather in the foreground, fingers interlocked with the younger man's.

This image is very very graphic. It leaves not much to the imagination. It is also very erotic-- as opposed to pornographic-- and I can tell you what makes it so;

1) Our younger subject isn't looking at his older lover, but he isn't looking at us, either. He is, we feel, about to turn his head back to the man who just gave him so much pleasure.

2) the older gentleman is looking at his lover's face.

3)And there is a whole lot going on in those expressions.

4)Although everything shows, and boy does it ever, "everything" is not all that shows. Women's imagery, no matter how graphic it gets, tends to focus on a whole lot of the body, not only the genitalia. We see how his legs are drawn up, giving the Potions Teacher all the trust in the world-- and all the room to work. And we can see that the trust was well founded. that alone is pretty fucking sexy.

5)The hands. Those hands that hold each other. I don't know if it's true of all womens' imagery, but when the women I follow draw, or photograph men-- you get hands. And wrists. So often. Cocks, tits, armpits-- hands and wrists.

Guys, it's just occurred to me, but some of you ought to try wearing sleeves too short, and flaunt your wrists. Lemme know if ladies notice them.

6) the image is, you might have noticed, of two men. Many women really get off on seeing two men together, in the way that so many men love to see two women together... but not quite for the same reasons...

 

[voluptuary_manque]

You know, Stella, on the late lamented "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy", Carston was always "zhoozhing" the latest client's sleeves. I wonder . . .




Been rolling mine up for years, though I always thought it was to get the cuffs out of the way when I was working!