The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

[KID ROCK1]

Saturday November 22nd, 2003...

The most outrageous abuse of power took place while alot of you were sleeping last nite as the republican party broke every rule in the book to pass their version of the medicare reform/prescription drug bill...

The vote started at around 3:00am EST. and was scheduled for a 15 minute vote w/ an additional extra 2 minutes added on to the end of the vote for a total of 17 minutes of voting time...

After 17 minutes the DEMOCRATS had managed to sway enough republican voters that the bill would have not passed...It was like 217 - 215...The democrats were victorius by 2 votes and the bill should have been recommitted to conference...

BUT NO!!!

In the most despicable act of manipulating a vote the republican leadership decided to keep the vote open as Dennis Hastert and Tom Delay went all over the chamber trying to get republicans who voted NO to change their vote to YES so the bill would pass...

Almost 3 HOURS after the vote should have ended. Hastert and Delay managed to put enough peer pressure on some of the rookie republicans who voted their conscience by saying NO and got them to change their vote to YES...Even president Bush was awaken in the middle of the nite and he personaly spoke to several of the republicans on the telephone who had voted NO and Bush managed to change their vote...

Three hours after the vote should have ended, the final vote ended up 220 - 215 in favor of passage...

So much for a democracy when republicans had lost the vote and then kept the vote open until they could finaly get their desired result and win...Republicans cheated to win...Sounds alot like Florida in 2000...

This my friends will be the day that the american people will open their eyes and realize just how corrupt the republican party is...This will be the day that the republicans will remember next november when they lose control of the whitehouse and the congress...

~i~

 

[estevie]

Do you have a link, KR?

 

[Le Jacquelope]

The sad part is the GOP will live to see a Democrat President roll this bad boy back to the exuberant cheers of most American citizens. Or, more insultingly, another GOP President will have to do it to save their ass.

 

[KID ROCK1]

Do you have a link, KR?

Here's the jist of the story, but you can goto washingtonpost.com if you wanna read everything about this BS the republicans pulled off while america was sleeping...

House Passes Medicare Bill

A divided House, in a dramatic vote before dawn, approved the most fundamental transformation of Medicare in the program's history, adopting legislation that would add a prescription drug benefit and create a large new role for private health plans in caring for the nation's elderly.

The measure had appeared destined for defeat, but passed on a vote of 220 to 215 after the House's GOP leaders kept the roll call open for nearly three hours until shortly before 6 a.m. as they scoured for extra votes. Knots of senior House Republicans and Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy G. Thompson huddled repeatedly around several of the two dozen skeptical members who had initially voted against the bill -- with little apparent effect -- while their colleagues milled the floor and a few napped.

Through most of that time, the red lights on the voting board in the House chamber showed the tally at 216 for the measure and 218 against it. Finally, moments before 6 a.m., two Republican members, Rep. C.L. "Butch" Otter (Idaho) and Rep.Trent Franks (Ariz.) changed their minds, then another few colleagues followed suit.

Several longtime lawmakers said the roll call was the longest in their memory. The cliff-hanger vote, and the arduous efforts to pry a victory from an apparent defeat, reflected the enormous political significance of the Medicare issue and the philosophical differences -- between the political parties and among factions of Republicans who hold the majority in both houses of Congress -- over the changes the legislation would bring to the program.

The bill's passage, rocky as it was, vastly increases the chances that, after years of legislative struggle, the federal government will begin to offer the help in paying for medicine that has been a rallying cry among older Americans.It handed a substantial victory to the White House, which has sought to champion Medicare changes as a major domestic accomplishment for President Bush in his reelection campaign next year.

Congressional Republicans and Democrats, however, were deeply divided over whether the legislation would prove helpful to the 40 million older and disabled Americans who get health insurance through the program.

The slender margin resembled another cliff-hanger vote when the House passed a more conservative version of the Medicare legislation by a one-vote margin in June, following similar pressure by GOP leaders to win over skeptics. In that earlier vote, the GOP leadership extended the roll call by more than an hour to secure the final "yes" vote. Throughout Friday and until voting began at 3 a.m., Republicans leaders scurried to overcome resistance from Democrats and some GOP conservatives who objected to elements of the biggest proposed change to the program since it began in 1965.

The House took up the legislation one day after congressional negotiators completed work on a hard-fought compromise, produced largely by Republicans, that would inject heavy new market competition into the government health insurance program for the elderly and disabled. The compromise emerged from four months of negotiations over separate Medicare bills that the two chambers had passed.

Many Republicans called the bill an unprecedented opportunity to help older Americans with drug costs. "This is one of those times for great change," said House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.)
Most Democrats condemned it as a handout to pharmaceutical and insurance companies and a threat to the program's existence. House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said the bill would offer too little help with drug costs and lead to "the end of Medicare as we know it."
In the end, just 16 Democrats joined with the Republican majority to pass the bill. Twenty-five Republicans and one Independent voted with the rest of the Democrats against the measure.

The conservative Republicans who switched their votes at the end said they did so because they were told that if this bill failed, Democrats planned to bring up an earlier, more liberal Senate version.
Otter said he and Franks were among a group of seven conservatives who met with party leaders off the House floor. About an hour before the switch they were told the House Democrats were planning to introduce the Senate version of the Medicare prescription drug bill and bring it to the floor through a seldom used discharge petition that requires the signature of a majority of the members. The Senate bill was far more expensive and contained fewer reform elements, so Otter said he and Franks decided to change their votes.

Otter said he received a call from Bush earlier urging him to vote for the bill but he told the president "I can't help you" because the bill would increase the national debt.


~i~

 

[KID ROCK1]

The sad part is the GOP will live to see a Democrat President roll this bad boy back to the exuberant cheers of most American citizens. Or, more insultingly, another GOP President will have to do it to save their ass.

Well its still gotta pass the senate before it goes to Bush's desk and based upon the absolute outrage being voiced on C-Span's "Washington Journal" i'm betting that the senate democrats are gonna kill this bill by filibustering it...

~i~

 

[Le Jacquelope]

Well its still gotta pass the senate before it goes to Bush's desk and based upon the absolute outrage being voiced on C-Span's "Washington Journal" i'm betting that the senate democrats are gonna kill this bill by filibustering it...

~i~

And wait'll the American public wakes up and finds out what happened.

Too bad I don't know Shockwave flash. I'd write the ultimate GOP/Libertarian quiz game.

Put an effigy of Bush on a screen and have it change with respect to his mood.
"Propose more welfare for big farms" - he smiles
"Give an extra $87 billion to Iraq" - he smiles more
"Spend that $87 billion on the American people" - his smile turns to a frown
"Americans pay through the nose for health care" - his smile comes back and he gets some major wood.
"Defame Canada's prescription drug industry" - wood PLUS wet spot in his trousers
"Exempt all workers from overtime pay" - thar she blows!

"Eliminate the USAPATRIOT Act" - he loses his wood.
"Middle class tax cut" - he frowns.
"Shut down Guantanamo" - he starts to turn red with anger.
"National single payer health plan" - he falls over dead. Instant coronary.

 

[ruminator]

Well its still gotta pass the senate before it goes to Bush's desk and based upon the absolute outrage being voiced on C-Span's "Washington Journal" i'm betting that the senate democrats are gonna kill this bill by filibustering it...

~i~

I was wondering how many others here watch C-Span. Even if it is boring at times, the live coverage gives a great view of what the members actually say. Several callers remarked that they watched the 17 minute vote for all 3 hours.

"Washington Journal" works to be impartial in their presentation and call in shows and provides a good service for citizens to be heard.

There was a startling amount of older Republicans denouncing the bill, their AARP memebership and even swore to switch to the Democratic Party. A few said they wouldn't switch their registration but would absolutely vote against any Republican whenever they could.

Again, politicians from both parties listed to the wrong influence.

 

[SpiritKitty]

Originally posted by KID ROCK1
This my friends will be the day that the american people will open their eyes and realize just how corrupt the republican party is...This will be the day that the republicans will remember next november when they lose control of the whitehouse and the congress...

~i~

do you all honestly believe this? on a saturday when college football is the most important thing on television?

 

[Le Jacquelope]

Re: Re: The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

do you all honestly believe this? on a saturday when college football is the most important thing on television?

Bread and circuses, the modern opiate of the masses.

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

What is source of your dislike on this bill? The democrats wanted a medicare drug benefit, they just wanted it bigger than what was proposed. No doubt they'll be able to expand it further in the future.

My dislike is that it's transfering billions of more dollars to the elderly, the richest segment of our society. If we've got lots and lots of extra money (we don't) we should be putting the money into kids programs. Kids are the poorest segment of society they need the money more than the elderly. Education needs more money, early start programs, inner city programs, etc. would benefit society much more than giving away more money to the elderly.

I have nothing against elderly people, I'll be one myself in 30 or 40 years, but they've had their whole lives to save, they often have offspring who are willing to help and they are resourceful. If an elderly person and his/her whole family destitute, I can see providing some sort of last-chance welfare, but this program is a wholesale $ transfer.

What is your grip with it?

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

The Republicans are novices at this arm-twisting style of politics. The democrats are the masters. The democrats frequently vote in large blocs, do you think that happens because Daschle is saying "Vote your conscious and I don't care if you buck the party?".

LOL.

 

[SpiritKitty]

you know, i just went through most of the lower non-digital channels on my tv. there is already nothing about this. c-span was talking about mtbe, headline news was doing something on a molestation in the citadel, cnn is all over the country, oh wait they're talking about the jfk assassination from a new witness discovered in, no, in texas.

so there you have it, your outraged public lasted how long? pathetic. *disgusted*

 

[Le Jacquelope]

What is source of your dislike on this bill? The democrats wanted a medicare drug benefit, they just wanted it bigger than what was proposed. No doubt they'll be able to expand it further in the future.

My dislike is that it's transfering billions of more dollars to the elderly, the richest segment of our society. If we've got lots and lots of extra money (we don't) we should be putting the money into kids programs. Kids are the poorest segment of society they need the money more than the elderly. Education needs more money, early start programs, inner city programs, etc. would benefit society much more than giving away more money to the elderly.

I have nothing against elderly people, I'll be one myself in 30 or 40 years, but they've had their whole lives to save, they often have offspring who are willing to help and they are resourceful. If an elderly person and his/her whole family destitute, I can see providing some sort of last-chance welfare, but this program is a wholesale $ transfer.

What is your grip with it?

Hmmm... the elderly vs the kids... I can certainly feel ya on the need to prioritize children. Just as long as this doesn't turn into a game of lifeboat ethics.

And I know both rich and poor elderly people alike. And Medicare also cares for the disabled.

What I want to see addressed, is the fact that seniors retiring today are said to face an average of $100,000 in out of pocket medical expenses over the rest of their lives. That ought to render plenty of well to do seniors destitute.

 

[KID ROCK1]

I was wondering how many others here watch C-Span. Even if it is boring at times, the live coverage gives a great view of what the members actually say. Several callers remarked that they watched the 17 minute vote for all 3 hours.

"Washington Journal" works to be impartial in their presentation and call in shows and provides a good service for citizens to be heard.

There was a startling amount of older Republicans denouncing the bill, their AARP memebership and even swore to switch to the Democratic Party. A few said they wouldn't switch their registration but would absolutely vote against any Republican whenever they could.

Again, politicians from both parties listed to the wrong influence.

I love C-Span, C-Span2, and C-Span3...

It was kinda funny this morning that the handfull of republican callers on "Washington Journal" who actualy supported the bill weren't even old enough to be eligible for the prescription drug benefit...I too heard countless numbers of people calling in saying they tore up their AARP card and would never vote republican again...

I hope the people in this country are outraged, not so much cuz the bill sux, but about how the republicans manipulated the democratic process...A vote is a vote and win or lose its unfathomable to hold the ballot box hostage until you can force people to change their votes in order to get a desired result...

The fact that Bush called members and pressured them to change their vote is the most disturbing thing...

Mr./Ms. America, this is your wake-up call...

~i~

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

I love C-Span, C-Span2, and C-Span3...

It was kinda funny this morning that the handfull of republican callers on "Washington Journal" who actualy supported the bill weren't even old enough to be eligible for the prescription drug benefit...I too heard countless numbers of people calling in saying they tore up their AARP card and would never vote republican again...

I hope the people in this country are outraged, not so much cuz the bill sux, but about how the republicans manipulated the democratic process...A vote is a vote and win or lose its unfathomable to hold the ballot box hostage until you can force people to change their votes in order to get a desired result...

The fact that Bush called members and pressured them to change their vote is the most disturbing thing...

Mr./Ms. America, this is your wake-up call...

~i~

Pssst...not that many of them voted Republican in the first place...the elderly are one of the democrats core constituancies.

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Re: The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

do you all honestly believe this? on a saturday when college football is the most important thing on television?

Or the Rugby World Cup Final...



ppman

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

The fact that Bush called members and pressured them to change their vote is the most disturbing thing...


~i~

LOL...you don't think this is an every day occurance here? It's actually much less militant now than it was under the democrats.

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

Re: Re: Re: The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

Or the Rugby World Cup Final...



ppman

Good afternoon Mate. What's up?

 

[SpiritKitty]

Re: Re: Re: The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

Originally posted by p_p_man
Or the Rugby World Cup Final...



ppman

oh damn...how could i have forgotten about that

i also forgot that today is the 40th anniversary of the jfk assassination. i guess that's why the new witness...sorry for accusing texas earlier...maybe this will finally bring to light that it was a conspiracy of the telephone company.

 

[ruminator]

Pssst...not that many of them voted Republican in the first place...the elderly are one of the democrats core constituancies.

An issue here is that large numbers of Republican constituents were against this bill. The original vote had enough Republican dissention from party line to defeat it. The additional time was necessary to change the stand of a few crucial votes.

Regardless of party, once again the opinion of the public is not considered.

 

[KID ROCK1]

Re: Re: The Day The Republican Party Will Live To Regret...

do you all honestly believe this? on a saturday when college football is the most important thing on television?

Trust me, there are 40 million seniors out there who could prolly care-less about college football and they will spread the word...If you read my post then you would have seen that IMO this day will come back to haunt republicans next November, not today, not tomorrow, and prolly not next week...

Abuse of power is one of the worst violations in politics...The american people will be reminded of this day constantly as the election in 04 draws nearer...

~i~

 

[SpiritKitty]

Originally posted by ruminator
An issue here is that large numbers of Republican constituents were against this bill. The original vote had enough Republican dissention from party line to defeat it. The additional time was necessary to change the stand of a few crucial votes.

Regardless of party, once again the opinion of the public is not considered.

oh please, is it really ever? public opinion is an illusion. it's all in whoever has the most money. money=power it's the american way.

damn...i need to get some coffee in me...i can't believe that pollyanna is so cynical today.

oh wait, i just saw a few seconds devoted to the bill on cnn: there was a close vote. seniors have alternate options. there you have it. very rapidly moving on to a spam bill and michael jackson. hurrying so they can talk about events that happened 40 YEARS AGO!!!!!! damn them. and i wonder why i'm cynical.

 

[ruminator]

oh please, is it really ever? public opinion is an illusion. it's all in whoever has the most money. money=power it's the american way.

damn...i need to get some coffee in me...i can't believe that pollyanna is so cynical today.

oh wait, i just saw a few seconds devoted to the bill on cnn: there was a close vote. seniors have alternate options. there you have it. very rapidly moving on to a spam bill and michael jackson. hurrying so they can talk about events that happened 40 YEARS AGO!!!!!! damn them. and i wonder why i'm cynical.

You're right. Nothing to worry about.
Plenty of options out there for those with the opportunity to choose.
It is easier to say that's the way it's always been and that's the way it should be.

Did you happen to see the overthrow of Parliament in Georgia this morning? They had it live, but had to cut away to an MJ update.

 

[KID ROCK1]

LOL...you don't think this is an every day occurance here? It's actually much less militant now than it was under the democrats.

Arm-twisting prior to a vote is one thing, but when the votes have been cast, your side loses, and then you start arm-twisting people to change their vote and hold the ballot box hostage for three hours until you can finaly pressure enough people into going against their will, and the will of their constituents is dispicable and non-democratic...

^^^ Shit like this is abuse of power and has the smell of a dictatorship, not a democracy...

~i~

 

[ruminator]

Arm-twisting prior to a vote is one thing, but when the votes have been cast, your side loses, and then you start arm-twisting people to change their vote and hold the ballot box hostage for three hours until you can finaly pressure enough people into going against their will, and the will of their constituents is dispicable and non-democratic...

^^^ Shit like this is abuse of power and has the smell of a dictatorship, not a democracy...

~i~

This is the same thing that happened with the media ownership regulations with the FCC. The politicians couldn't hide when they went back home during holidays/recess. E-mails, letters and calls are a way to speak to our representation but there's nothing like seeing him/her in Wal-Mart for a quick audience.

Regardless of party, those who listen will and those don't, won't.