Telepathic conversation

[EmotionalStorm]

I have found no set standard for differentiating mental communication.

I am getting into chapters that have mental communication. I am using the following standards; fantasy so mental communication with a person vs an object are slightly different.

~~~Eldar...Say What?
~~~Annette...The sky is falling can you not feel it?

With an item

~~~Eldar...Can you fly around the room on your own?
~~~[No. I do not have that power.]

The discussion I am having with an editor on this is the use of '...' After the name. They want me to switch it to colons because '...' represents an incomplete thought. My thinking is '...' Is perfect because it shows the transition from subconscious thought to conscious thought. The mental activity the reader cannot see vs what is being sent.

I am using [comment] for items as it is like talking to a computer, they just spit out the answer with no real underlying thought once the item has accepted the owner. This issue has not been brought up by the editor.

The change the editor is proposing is changing the '...' to ':::' and I prefer the '...'

 

[sr71plt]

As a reader, I wouldn't know what the hell you were trying to convey unless you included a code key. For starters, that's just not a known use for the ellipsis.

 

[rjordan]

~~~Eldar...Say What?
~~~Annette...The sky is falling can you not feel it?

With an item

~~~Eldar...Can you fly around the room on your own?
~~~[No. I do not have that power.]

What's the point? No reader is going to have any idea or any interest in your punctuation choice here. It's confusing and would take them right out of the story.

Drop the tildes and change the ellipse to a colon. Done.
Also drop the brackets around responses by objects. Eldar appears to be speaking to a particular object so the response would be coming from that object, so why bother with brackets? Just name the object and use a colon like any other response.

The more you stick to standard punctuation, the clearer it's going to be. That's kind of the point of standard punctuation, isn't it.

rj

 

[RejectReality]

I just use italics + quotation marks. The italics denotes it as something to take notice of, and the quotation marks differentiate it from simple thoughts, which I also use italic for.

I've used this for communication with other people, familiars with limited ability to form human words, and intelligent objects. It's all a matter of using appropriate tags.

Once you have this convention established via appropriate tagging and narrative, your readers will know what's going on from that point forward. If it's multi-chapter, you might want to give at least a little "refresher" the first time it's used in each chapter.

It's also a convention that's used frequently in Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels, so many are going to get it straight out of the box. The readership for such stories here are dominated by genre first, sex second readers, so they've likely seen it before in mainstream novels.

 

[oggbashan]

The easiest way is just to say, in an author's note or an aside that some dialogue is telepathic.

I do that when the story calls for conversations in a foreign language. Instead of writing extended dialogue say in French, I just put a note before the story starts that the conversations should be in French.

Some published authors of the 1930s used to use foreign dialogue to show that they, and their readers, were educated. Dorothy L Sayers was noted for it, and she didn't provide translations.

But many readers coming to Literotica have enough trouble because English isn't their native language...

So - keep it simple and forget fancy punctuation.

 

[hylas_]

I kinda like the "~~~". It reminds of telepathic thought balloons in superhero comics.
Not sure about the way you follow it up with character names, though.
And I was confused by the "[ ]" brackets.

I wonder if wouldn't be easier to just use italics. They're often used to indicate thoughts, and the context should make it clear that they are communicating telepathically.

Eldar tried to think of a way out of this mess. Perhaps he could make the service drone smash the door open from the outside? He sent out a psychic ping and managed to make contact with a nearby unit.

"Can you fly around the room on your own?"

"No. I do not have that power," answered the drone.

 

[EmotionalStorm]

As a reader, I wouldn't know what the hell you were trying to convey unless you included a code key. For starters, that's just not a known use for the ellipsis.

A known use of the ellipsis is the transition of thought. In this case it is the transition on subconscious thought to telepathic thought.

The dialog before hand deals with informing the reader that they are moving into a telepathic conversation. Anyone who is following the story line will see when this occurring and who can actually do it. It is not done in every chapter but it does help in a few combat situations...fantasy elves, dwarves, and dragons oh my.

ITALICS are not an option. I use them for notes and journal entries and I have had a hell of a time getting the site to publish one chapter because of italics. So no Italics.

I use the ~~~ as a brain wave signal

I brought this into play in chapter 9 of my story which is already published. I had no editor for the first 9 chapters. I have someone who is working on chapter 10.

This is an excerpt of how I introduced mental communication.

She smirks at me, "I've never tried to connect multiple minds but I have sent messages before a long time ago."

I smile, "Send me a message that you are ready and I will send some ideas back OK." she nods.

~~~Annette...Can you hear this?

~~~Eldar...Yes, I do.

~~~Annette...What did you want to ask?

~~~Eldar...Can you find talents in others?

~~~Annette...I have but they are unpredictable. You never know what talent you will get.

~~~Eldar...I want to try at some point. I would rather have something in the arsenal if it is hidden.

~~~Annette...OK, I can understand that.

~~~Eldar...Can you imbue psionic items?

~~~Annette... Some why?

~~~Eldar...You can read about it in my journal. I faced someone who every time an offensive spell was cast at them it would charge a crystal or gem on a pendant giving the owner the power to reuse the talent they had. She had one that slowed time for just a second or two but enough to anticipate her opponents attack. She is a blade singer and had it done when she was in her 7th year of training.

~~~Annette...I have made something like that but it requires a special item, usually expensive.

~~~Eldar...Like the pendant I wear with the sapphire?

~~~Annette...Yes that might actually work for an item like that. Where did you get it?

~~~Eldar...From a 400lb grizzly that crushed me.

~~~Annette...Oh the first night...

I cut her off.

~~~Eldar...Yes, the first night Charlemagne made love to my broken and bruised body.

~~~Eldar...Can you feel emotions or there sense of touch through this connection?

~~~Annette...I have never tried.

~~~Eldar...Let's start with how I am feeling now.

~~~Annette...You are in awe of what I can do.

I reach out and brush her face.

~~~Annette...oh by the gods that feels good I can feel how that makes you feel excited aroused soft and electric as I feel it from both sides.

I reach out and cradle Charlemagne face with my hands.

~~~Annette...oh by the gods the love and warmth the softness of her face and I feel her pressing back against your hands.

 

[sr71plt]

That doesn't change what I posted. If you are bothering to publish, you are trying to make a connection with the reader. If you do fancy stuff that either the reader doesn't understand or is intrusive (as what you show here is) in the read to the point of throwing the reader out of the read, you might as well have just kept it to yourself.

 

[oggbashan]

Why did you ask for advice?

It seems you don't want our input.

 

[EmotionalStorm]

That doesn't change what I posted. If you are bothering to publish, you are trying to make a connection with the reader. If you do fancy stuff that either the reader doesn't understand or is intrusive (as what you show here is) in the read to the point of throwing the reader out of the read, you might as well have just kept it to yourself.

I thought the point of this board was to give ideas show what you are doing and get feedback. Keeping it to myself does not help me as I am new to being an author. I have a lot of stories over the years the method for dealing with telepathic communication was different in every one of them.

I read through some of your how to's after your last post. I came here for ideas for future books. The concept if you do something keep it consistent falls into play with this first story line. I searched for an editor and I did not not find one until after I started to publish what I had going.

You write as a way to make a living, enjoyment, and hobby from I have seen. We write for different Areas as I am Sci-fi& Fantasy driven.

I write these stories because I can no longer play the games behind them, my imagination still works and I can build a story-line but I cannot handle complex interactions with multiple REAL people. I write so I can get these out there for others to hopefully enjoy reading. Most important I write because it is a form of therapy for me as I have a traumatic Brain Injury so my life went from buzzing with actives to having a hard time focusing on more than one task at a time.

 

[ElectricBlue]

My suggestion would be to keep it simpler, and the first time you introduce the concept, provide an explanation (in the context of the story) e.g.:

I smile, "Send me a message that you are ready and I will send some ideas back, OK?" she nods.

~ Annette ~ Can you hear this?

~ Eldar ~ Yes, I do.

~ Annette ~ What did you want to ask?

~ Eldar ~ Can you find talents in others?

ie: keep the typography simple and consistent - I'd suggest no differentiation between people and objects, once you have established objects can communicate also.

Readers of your genre will quickly understand your concepts, and will quickly see your conventions. The fact that others might not be so familiar with the tropes, or its contrary to mainstream publishing norms is neither here nor there, you're working in a genre where you have to push convention a little. After all, the Guttenberg Bible probably only used one font, because people were pretty damned excited about the idea of print, and the notion of, "hey, I need emphasis, let's invent italics" hadn't come along yet.

For me, the repeated symbology and the [ ] seem to be unnecessary - you're not writing computer code, you are still writing English, and you want to give readers a smooth read - don't ask them to cope with too many visual hieroglyphics.

It's outside publishing conventions, yes, all the more reason to keep it simple.

 

[sr71plt]

I thought the point of this board was to give ideas show what you are doing and get feedback. Keeping it to myself does not help me as I am new to being an author. I have a lot of stories over the years the method for dealing with telepathic communication was different in every one of them.

I read through some of your how to's after your last post. I came here for ideas for future books. The concept if you do something keep it consistent falls into play with this first story line. I searched for an editor and I did not not find one until after I started to publish what I had going.

You write as a way to make a living, enjoyment, and hobby from I have seen. We write for different Areas as I am Sci-fi& Fantasy driven.

I write these stories because I can no longer play the games behind them, my imagination still works and I can build a story-line but I cannot handle complex interactions with multiple REAL people. I write so I can get these out there for others to hopefully enjoy reading. Most important I write because it is a form of therapy for me as I have a traumatic Brain Injury so my life went from buzzing with actives to having a hard time focusing on more than one task at a time.

You posted for advice on content submission--presumably for submitting to Literotica. I gave you advice. I don't see where I misinterpreted what you were asking for. Do what you want with it. You're the one who asked for help.

 

[EmotionalStorm]

My suggestion would be to keep it simpler, and the first time you introduce the concept, provide an explanation (in the context of the story) e.g.:



ie: keep the typography simple and consistent - I'd suggest no differentiation between people and objects, once you have established objects can communicate also.

Readers of your genre will quickly understand your concepts, and will quickly see your conventions. The fact that others might not be so familiar with the tropes, or its contrary to mainstream publishing norms is neither here nor there, you're working in a genre where you have to push convention a little. After all, the Guttenberg Bible probably only used one font, because people were pretty damned excited about the idea of print, and the notion of, "hey, I need emphasis, let's invent italics" hadn't come along yet.

For me, the repeated symbology and the [ ] seem to be unnecessary - you're not writing computer code, you are still writing English, and you want to give readers a smooth read - don't ask them to cope with too many visual hieroglyphics.

It's outside publishing conventions, yes, all the more reason to keep it simple.

I have not published the section with objects yet, I can make that change easily enough. I like your idea of ~name~ Instead; I will look at that for future books as I have this book written; in draft anyway up into chapter 30 or 40. Still finding the best places to break in the chapter as I was on an inspirations spree and just trying to get it down on paper while it was still in my mind. I have 10-16 with the editor and 17+ that I am going over again and trying to apply changes the editor is making to chapter 10 into the other chapters. (I have been working on 11-16 as he makes changes in chapter 10 at the moment. We have it on a shared doc via google) I accept almost all of his changes; this one change bothered be for a couple of reasons including keeping it consistent with what is already published.

Note: I worked computer System Administration and Computer System Security in the design and implementation so your comment on code I found humorous but accurate.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Most important I write because it is a form of therapy for me as I have a traumatic Brain Injury so my life went from buzzing with actives to having a hard time focusing on more than one task at a time.

Storm,

I was still writing my suggestion when you posted this, so we crossed in the mail.

Writing as therapy has to be a positive thing, so good for you for doing what you're doing.

Hopefully you will go away from here with some helpful suggestions (as well as a good understanding of mainstream publishing conventions).

Don't sweat the attitudes though, we all have one or two of our own

If you stick around, you'll soon figure us all out (it's not hard, we're all as predictable as the sun rising).

 

[Zeb_Carter]

In a telepathic universe isn't telepathy just another form of communication which would be just like talking only you think the words to pass on?

To make it special do like RR said...italics with quotation marks and all the call outs you would normally do. Why clutter up the screen with tildes and colons and such.

If I saw all the shit in a story, I chalk it up to some young writer trying to be hip and failing. I then toss the thing in the delete bin.

ETA: and now that I know you wrote computer code...stop! writing! computer! code! Write English! I wrote computer code for 45 years. Towards the end there were some script languages that came close to English, but got no cigar.

Stop trying to invent something new and just use what English gives you.

 

[sr71plt]

Don't sweat the attitudes though, we all have one or two of our own

I don't think that responding that a series of tildas and ellipses scrolling down the page is too disconcerting for a reader to handle is showing attitude. I thought that it was providing experienced advice on best practices in connecting with the readers.

 

[rjordan]

~~~Annette...Can you hear this?

~~~Eldar...Yes, I do.

~~~Annette...What did you want to ask?

~~~Eldar...Can you find talents in others?

~~~Annette...I have but they are unpredictable. You never know what talent you will get.

~~~Eldar...I want to try at some point. I would rather have something in the arsenal if it is hidden.

~~~Annette...OK, I can understand that.

~~~Eldar...Can you imbue psionic items?

~~~Annette... Some why?

This post clearly shows what all the criticism is about. Your post fills my screen with all this strange punctuation. As a reader, I look at all this and say to myself, "Geez, that's more effort than I want to expend on a story." It just looks so complicated and tiring.

Thanks for sharing your reasons for writing. It doesn't change any of the advice you've received here, but I'm sure everyone who responded wishes you the best in recovering.

rj

 

[HandsInTheDark]

Readers into the concept will figure out your notation, however strange, and go with it. Readers who aren't will leave immediately, but maybe they were going to anyway. Do what you want; ratings will tell you if it worked and next time you might do it differently. Note that if everyone's telepathic, speech died long ago and you don't need special notation. They are just "talking".

If a device can communicate intelligently, it's a character for all intents and purposes and you don't need special notation when it communicates. The square brackets seem like needless burden.

I have a total of two stories where something like telepathy operates, I used italics for it in both, and they rated well. Your mileage will vary.

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

In a telepathic universe isn't telepathy just another form of communication which would be just like talking only you think the words to pass on?

To make it special do like RR said...italics with quotation marks and all the call outs you would normally do. Why clutter up the screen with tildes and colons and such.

If I saw all the shit in a story, I chalk it up to some young writer trying to be hip and failing. I then toss the thing in the delete bin.

ETA: and now that I know you wrote computer code...stop! writing! computer! code! Write English! I wrote computer code for 45 years. Towards the end there were some script languages that came close to English, but got no cigar.

Stop trying to invent something new and just use what English gives you.

Could not agree more with this.

 

[Bramblethorn]

side point: "Eldar" may be distracting to many readers in SF/F, since it's the name for the space elves of Games Workshop's Warhammer 40K franchise, which pinched the name from Tolkien.

GW are known for being litigious regarding their IP; the risk of being sued for an erotica story is probably still low, but it might be prudent to pick something else.

 

[Darkniciad]

I'm fairly certain that "Eldar" has joined the ranks of orcs, ogres, etc. as a "generic" term that nobody is going to be able to claim. It's the name of a race of elves in Feist's Riftwar, for example.

Can't name any other specific examples, but I have read it in other works as well.

I doubt it's going to be a confusion or irritation point for many people either. That's not been my experience with the readership for S&F here.

side point: "Eldar" may be distracting to many readers in SF/F, since it's the name for the space elves of Games Workshop's Warhammer 40K franchise, which pinched the name from Tolkien.

GW are known for being litigious regarding their IP; the risk of being sued for an erotica story is probably still low, but it might be prudent to pick something else.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I'm fairly certain that "Eldar" has joined the ranks of orcs, ogres, etc. as a "generic" term that nobody is going to be able to claim. It's the name of a race of elves in Feist's Riftwar, for example.

It's a generic term that no reasonable person would attempt to claim, but Games Workshop's lawyers are not reasonable people. They have laid claim to "Eldar" by registering it as a trademark.

They have previously shown themselves willing to issue takedowns over this kind of bullshit. IMHO laying claim to "Space Marine" is even stupider than "Eldar", and terrible publicity, but they tried it on nevertheless, seriously inconveniencing the author of "Spots the Space Marine".

They eventually backed down from that one. I very much doubt such claims would hold up in a court battle if it came to that, and if somebody wants to volunteer to take them on I'd be cheering all the way. But many authors aren't looking for that kind of distraction.

(GW also claim a trademark on "ork"... though I see they've now renamed their "ogres" to "ogors", probably to strengthen trademark protection there.)

 

[Wifetheif]

Telepathic communication

Check out my new (and Hot) story "Out of the Fog https://www.literotica.com/s/out-of-the-fog
I give a science fictional explanation for Faries and leprechauns and all of the little people of folklore. Our hero, a human and the pixie communicate via telepathy. I have the little person touch my hero, who is a
bit of a schlub, on the temple and he hears her inside his head, "Telepathy, just like Mr. Spock!"
I then explain that so long as they are in skin-to-skin contact they can communicate fine. Once I establish the "rules" of telepathy, in this case, I use nothing fancier than standard punctuation. Once the reader understands what is going on, they will accept whatever you write, so long as you abide by your own rules. I make sure to mention that they are in physical contact with each "conversation" and that they are incomprehensible to each other apart from the telepathy. At points, for completely logical reasons, the characters are apart physically and our hero is reduced to trying to comprehend his little alien visitor by reading her emotions and body language, just like humans do when physical communication is impossible,

Keeping it simple is also the easiest way to write it. Be trustful of your reader's imaginations!

 

[PervOtaku]

IMHO a telepathic conversation should not be in screenplay/chat room format. That's fine if the entire story is done that way but going back and forth between that and traditional prose conversations is too jarring.

A while back I did a Batgirl fanfic story in a weird prose/comic style hybrid, by which I mean in comic books there is a lot of internal monologue in those puffy cloud balloons that is mostly used to convey information that a regular prose story would simple describe in the narration, but for this story I put in all of that internal monologue. And I did it with normal quotation marks and just put "she thought" instead of "she said".

Using italics is a fairly common convention for telepathy, although bucking convention by using tildes as the open and close quotes sounds like it would be neat. But the traditional prose method of identifying who is "speaking" would still be preferred, I think.