"Taboo" clip on unique treatment of alcoholism

[Recidiva]

Here it is:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xrlzus_taboo-alcoholics-shelter_shortfilms

I have to admit my head exploded upon seeing this. My social math won't add up. I had to pause and announce..."THIS...is why we need Republicans. If Republicans didn't exist, these people would rule the world."

The premise and stated goal of this shelter in Seattle is to get alcoholics off the streets, reducing emergency room trips and drunk tank attendance. According to the clip, providing homeless alcoholics with a place to live and a...daily...alcohol...allowance...(cringe, groan) on taxpayer funds, saves the city millions of dollars a year in emergency care.

I might accept that this is a viable treatment method if you consider alcoholism terminal and this is a compassionate hospice. But I don't, really. I can see that it works occasionally, but working occasionally isn't good enough to adopt this mindset or treatment program more widely.

I can't, however, deal with the basic premise that you can provide public assistance with no goal of eventually improving someone's life and getting them off public assistance.

It's the taxpayer part of this that makes me rebel. If this were only a charity I'd be less queasy. If it were voluntary and charitable, sure. However, it's the government's go-to solution. Eeewwww...

This, however, seems like government-subsidized acceptance of alcoholism as an incurable disease, thus allowing them to divert public funds to save money while using that premise to let people stay in a holding pattern until they die from it.

Mind...boggling...

Your thoughts?

 

[blobfish]

Here it is:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xrlzus_taboo-alcoholics-shelter_shortfilms

I have to admit my head exploded upon seeing this. My social math won't add up. I had to pause and announce..."THIS...is why we need Republicans. If Republicans didn't exist, these people would rule the world."

The premise and stated goal of this shelter in Seattle is to get alcoholics off the streets, reducing emergency room trips and drunk tank attendance. According to the clip, providing homeless alcoholics with a place to live and a...daily...alcohol...allowance...(cringe, groan) on taxpayer funds, saves the city millions of dollars a year in emergency care.

I might accept that this is a viable treatment method if you consider alcoholism terminal and this is a compassionate hospice. But I don't, really. I can see that it works occasionally, but working occasionally isn't good enough to adopt this mindset or treatment program more widely.

I can't, however, deal with the basic premise that you can provide public assistance with no goal of eventually improving someone's life and getting them off public assistance.

It's the taxpayer part of this that makes me rebel. If this were only a charity I'd be less queasy. If it were voluntary and charitable, sure. However, it's the government's go-to solution. Eeewwww...

This, however, seems like government-subsidized acceptance of alcoholism as an incurable disease, thus allowing them to divert public funds to save money while using that premise to let people stay in a holding pattern until they die from it.

Mind...boggling...

Your thoughts?

It's not really mindboggling. It's stupid to the point of being obscene, but I've come to expect this sort of politically correct boondoggling.

 

[Recidiva]

It's not really mindboggling. It's stupid to the point of being obscene, but I've come to expect this sort of politically correct boondoggling.

I consider the successes to come under the heading of a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Yes, obscene is an excellent word.

I can't fit my mind around all of the theories and results and intentions that result in something so inherently...wrong.

 

[Bert Notorius]

Makes 'just say no' all that more brilliant.

 

[blobfish]

I consider the successes to come under the heading of a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Yes, obscene is an excellent word.

I can't fit my mind around all of the theories and results and intentions that result in something so inherently...wrong.

This is actually a great metaphor for government in general. Instead of trying to wean you off, they just want you to be more dependent on them.

 

[Recidiva]

Makes 'just say no' all that more brilliant.

Well, that's why this is mind boggling. I think rehab is a scam. I think "just say no" is part of the right idea but impossible after someone said yes.

I come from a family of alcoholics, all who actually functioned fairly well, had jobs and could have finished a crossword hooked up to an IV of Jack Daniels. I remember my cousin at the gravesite of her father, who died of lung cancer and liver cirrhosis from smoking and drinking hard for a lifetime. He was a wonderful man, kind and fun, we all adored him. She said "I hope my dad's in heaven, but if there's no Budweiser there, there's no way he is."

This is structured surrender.

 

[Recidiva]

This is actually a great metaphor for government in general. Instead of trying to wean you off, they just want you to be more dependent on them.

I know I am biased. I very likely would have qualified for lots of subsidies, disability and welfare. I've worked my ass off to avoid thinking that way. I didn't ask for alimony or child support after two divorces.

I don't think it's up to the government, I think it's up to Darwin. I wouldn't want to be subsidized, waiting until I died and was no longer a potential problem. I think you have to fight.

Even factoring in my bias, this just results in looking into the heads of people put in charge and wanting to scream.

 

[Bert Notorius]

Where would hemmingway be without the booze?
Clapton without the coke?
Chong without the smoke?

It's the legal system that is out of balance.
Everybody dies of something.

 

[Recidiva]

Where would hemmingway be without the booze?
Clapton without the coke?
Chong without the smoke?

It's the legal system that is out of balance.
Everybody dies of something.

I came from a family where everybody handled their booze and their drugs. I think they should all be legal.

I just don't think that the government should pay me to do them and nothing else.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Here it is:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xrlzus_taboo-alcoholics-shelter_shortfilms

I have to admit my head exploded upon seeing this. My social math won't add up. I had to pause and announce..."THIS...is why we need Republicans. If Republicans didn't exist, these people would rule the world."

The premise and stated goal of this shelter in Seattle is to get alcoholics off the streets, reducing emergency room trips and drunk tank attendance. According to the clip, providing homeless alcoholics with a place to live and a...daily...alcohol...allowance...(cringe, groan) on taxpayer funds, saves the city millions of dollars a year in emergency care.

I might accept that this is a viable treatment method if you consider alcoholism terminal and this is a compassionate hospice. But I don't, really. I can see that it works occasionally, but working occasionally isn't good enough to adopt this mindset or treatment program more widely.

I can't, however, deal with the basic premise that you can provide public assistance with no goal of eventually improving someone's life and getting them off public assistance.

It's the taxpayer part of this that makes me rebel. If this were only a charity I'd be less queasy. If it were voluntary and charitable, sure. However, it's the government's go-to solution. Eeewwww...

This, however, seems like government-subsidized acceptance of alcoholism as an incurable disease, thus allowing them to divert public funds to save money while using that premise to let people stay in a holding pattern until they die from it.

Mind...boggling...

Your thoughts?

The program meets the criteria for a social game: Victim, rescuer, and persecutor. At the very least its lawsuit bait, cuz the doe-eyed psychologist ordained the treatment plan that prescribes alcohol as 'medication.' So its a matter of time before a drunk kills several people. In my professional opinion the program is psychotic enabling.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Makes 'just say no' all that more brilliant.

HAHAHAHA...it worked so well.

I came from a family where everybody handled their booze and their drugs. I think they should all be legal.

I just don't think that the government should pay me to do them and nothing else.

Weeeerd

 

[Recidiva]

The program meets the criteria for a social game: Victim, rescuer, and persecutor. At the very least its lawsuit bait, cuz the doe-eyed psychologist ordained the treatment plan that prescribes alcohol as 'medication.' So its a matter of time before a drunk kills several people. In my professional opinion the program is psychotic enabling.

It's a Bad. Idea.

Unfortunately I don't have a better idea, but I do think being homeless and struggling with something means you're still in the game somehow and still have a chance at becoming someone under your own free will and choice.

This is like...a people zoo.

 

[Licia]

I stopped reading at 'daily alcohol allowance ... for the alcoholic'. I call Political Manifesto horse shit. Before these people begin thier bloody ballet, they need to experience the exact futility of a savior complex. ... Makes me wonder just how many alcoholics and enablers have lived those lives.

Who understands alcoholics the best? Other alcoholics. The same interchangeable understanding holds a hand with addicts. Anyone who does not understand the life dynamic has no business in the help business. They do more harm than good.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I came from a family where everybody handled their booze and their drugs. I think they should all be legal.

I just don't think that the government should pay me to do them and nothing else.

I came from a family where the drug and alcohol abuse was a crazee nightmare for everyone.

 

[blobfish]

There's a rehab place in Thailand where they make you work and vomit every day. It's a lot more successful than our cushy, vacation-style rehab.

 

[Bert Notorius]

The government shoulda stuck to building roads and killing commies.
See: prohibition.

People want what they want. The harder the legal system pushes, the harder the suppliers push back.

 

[blobfish]

The government shoulda stuck to building roads and killing commies.
See: prohibition.

People want what they want. The harder the legal system pushes, the harder the suppliers push back.

This is the best and truest post you've ever posted.

 

[BotanyBoy]

There's a rehab place in Thailand where they make you work and vomit every day. It's a lot more successful than our cushy, vacation-style rehab.

They should send junkies and boozers to Sand Hill Ft.Benning... clean that ass right up.

 

[blobfish]

They should send junkies and boozers to Sand Hill Ft.Benning... clean that ass right up.

Damn right! Fuck Bill W. and his "disease".

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

It's a Bad. Idea.

Unfortunately I don't have a better idea, but I do think being homeless and struggling with something means you're still in the game somehow and still have a chance at becoming someone under your own free will and choice.

This is like...a people zoo.

The real solution, and I worked with abusers for many years, is to exile them to a place where sobriety is enforced via the isolation of the place. Fort Jefferson on the Dry Tortugas comes to mind.

 

[Recidiva]

I stopped reading at 'daily alcohol allowance ... for the alcoholic'. I call Political Manifesto horse shit. Before these people begin thier bloody ballet, they need to experience the exact futility of a savior complex. ... Makes me wonder just how many alcoholics and enablers have lived those lives.

Who understands alcoholics the best? Other alcoholics. The same interchangeable understanding holds a hand with addicts. Anyone who does not understand the life dynamic has no business in the help business. They do more harm than good.

My poor husband, as you can see, the clip's only a few minutes long, but I'm sure I paused 20 times and ranted. A lot. Now you guys are hopefully more voluntarily discussing it with me. I was appalled.

I come again, from a decently functional family of severe alcoholics.

That's my main issue...it's a choice. Yes, genetics and habituation make it a difficult choice. But my family all had jobs along with their alcoholism.

I don't accept that you simply can't function or that you need to be treated as if you have a terminal disease. My husband made the point that it saved the community money, and somehow that isn't an arguing point, that just makes it worse.

 

[renard_ruse]

I covered this subject on here maybe a year ago. Was called the usual names from the usual suspects.

However, I have a concern about this point:

I have to admit my head exploded upon seeing this. My social math won't add up. I had to pause and announce..."THIS...is why we need Republicans. If Republicans didn't exist, these people would rule the world."

I don't see how or why this would be a "partisan issue." I find it very sad that people have accepted this idea that there are no socially moderate or even socially sane Democrats. There used to be not only socially moderate but even socially conservative Democrats, and vice versa in the GOP. The principle differences between the parties should be economic as it used to be. Its unfortunate, its gotten to the point where social issues are the main division between parties, that is not good for society or for either party.

Unfortunately, despite what the lying media and some of the useful idiots on here might say, it started when the Democrats pretty much drove social conservatives out of their party and more recently have driven out social moderates as well. I know because I used to be one.

 

[Recidiva]

I came from a family where the drug and alcohol abuse was a crazee nightmare for everyone.

I don't drink, but I just don't like the taste of alcohol. I'd think I was adopted if I didn't look so much like them. It'd be impossible for me to be an alcoholic. Eventually I just want orange juice. My fridge is full of liqueurs in the attempt to have that one serving of alcohol a day, but I can't even take it up for health purposes.

We weren't crazy. It's just that family reunions involved trash cans full of beer on ice and the kids were on their own.

 

[Saint Peter]

I need a similar treatment option for my stripper addiction.

 

[Recidiva]

There's a rehab place in Thailand where they make you work and vomit every day. It's a lot more successful than our cushy, vacation-style rehab.

That was on Taboo too, I think. People who have as their rehab program, a flight to a monastery where they throw up a lot and meditate.

I think that's a scam too.

Even 12 step, I just think replaces one community of obsessive dysfunction with another. But it works because it is a community and it provides a new structure that might let some choices flourish with the support of people who understand the challenges.

There's too much theater and too little focus on choice being the mundane, boring, only effective factor.