Story rejected

[Blue Dolphin]

I have just had a story rejected, basically because the central character, who seduces his Mother`s best friend, is 2 weeks short of his 18th birthday.

The story is set in England, where the age of consent for sexual relations is 16, not 18.
While I appreciate your rules may apply to the US, it is sad, that they are also applied universally, without exception it would seem.

 

[pinkstarfish]

So change the age.

I did.

 

[Blue Dolphin]

So change the age.

I did.

No, it is an integral part of the story.
I see nothing wrong, morally or legally with this happening, and in the place where it happened.
It is NOT child pornography, nor anything remotely connected with it.

The story is feasible, and I see nothing at all in it to bar it from an adult discussion and readers forum.

Are lit saying that people under 18 do not have sex worldwide, and even if they do, we cannot write about it?
Yes, I understand that they need parameters, but here in the UK, this story would raise no eyebrows, nor break any rules.

As I said, 16 is the age of consent here, and some want to lower it to 14, which I disagree with by the way.

I have seen threads on this site, about the age when people lost their virginity, that is an eye opener, trust me, far worse than anything that I have written or submitted.

OK, getting off my soap box now.

 

[pinkstarfish]

Well, those are the rules. You either submit to them, or bitch about it.

 

[Stella_Omega]

hi Blue Dolphin- The problem is that the website- and its owners- resides in the U.S. and must conform to U.S. law.
That's really all there is to it, sadly. There's no arguing with the laws here at this time!

 

[Blue Dolphin]

hi Blue Dolphin- The problem is that the website- and its owners- resides in the U.S. and must conform to U.S. law.
That's really all there is to it, sadly. There's no arguing with the laws here at this time!

OK
I said my piece, but I still refuse to change the story, as a matter of principle.
So I guess no one will read it, apart from the 7 who read it while it was pending, and then banned it that is.
Thank you for your comments
Blue

 

[Stella_Omega]

OK
I said my piece, but I still refuse to change the story, as a matter of principle.
So I guess no one will read it, apart from the 7 who read it while it was pending, and then banned it that is.
Thank you for your comments
Blue

Bummer!
Is there a UK-based site? There must be!

 

[Blue Dolphin]

Bummer!
Is there a UK-based site? There must be!

English Lady has a site that I am aware of, but, unbelievably, I have one or two fans here, LOL
It is they who will now miss out
ah well
c`est la vie ma cherie, c`est la vie.

 

[H Dean]

Site guidlines

Site guidlines are clearly and concisely mapped out. Complaining about the story being rejected when it was clear that it would be before submission is like putting your hand in a moving blender and complaining that your hand is now missing.

 

[Blue Dolphin]

Site guidlines are clearly and concisely mapped out. Complaining about the story being rejected when it was clear that it would be before submission is like putting your hand in a moving blender and complaining that your hand is now missing.

So then, it is all right for people to post that they lost their virginity, at 15, 14 even 13?
And it is fine for a lady to post that she let her dog lick her genitalia?
And it is fine for Incest to be extolled in both threads and stories?
but not for a boy 2 weeks from his 18th birthday to lose his virginity?

Lit may be a United States site, but it has contributors world wide now, and I mean a lot of people, who now are sadly bound by the archaic rules, of one of the most sexually open nations in the world, that is also, sadly, one of the most sexually bigotted at times.
A quandry indeed one might say.

 

[wishfulthinking]

Site guidlines are clearly and concisely mapped out. Complaining about the story being rejected when it was clear that it would be before submission is like putting your hand in a moving blender and complaining that your hand is now missing.

lol

 

[H Dean]

Blue Dolphin

So then, it is all right for people to post that they lost their virginity, at 15, 14 even 13?
And it is fine for a lady to post that she let her dog lick her genitalia?
And it is fine for Incest to be extolled in both threads and stories?
but not for a boy 2 weeks from his 18th birthday to lose his virginity?

Lit may be a United States site, but it has contributors world wide now, and I mean a lot of people, who now are sadly bound by the archaic rules, of one of the most sexually open nations in the world, that is also, sadly, one of the most sexually bigotted at times.
A quandry indeed one might say.

Your argument fails the test of logic. Regardless of whether anything posted on this site is a "wrong" or a "right" it changes nothing. The rules were posted at the door before you came into the establishment. If you did not like the rules you should have chosen a different one. Complaining about pre-existing and well-known rules is not reasonable or logical.Consequently, the ground on which you stand is shaking mightily and your complaint is unwarranted.

 

[Stella_Omega]

So then, it is all right for people to post that they lost their virginity, at 15, 14 even 13?
And it is fine for a lady to post that she let her dog lick her genitalia?
And it is fine for Incest to be extolled in both threads and stories?
but not for a boy 2 weeks from his 18th birthday to lose his virginity?

Lit may be a United States site, but it has contributors world wide now, and I mean a lot of people, who now are sadly bound by the archaic rules, of one of the most sexually open nations in the world, that is also, sadly, one of the most sexually bigotted at times.
A quandry indeed one might say.

Child abuse is the cardinal sin, at this time in this country, sorry. Yes, it's weird, and you are welcome to rail against it all you want. The thing is- the actual computer server that holds the electronic files that make up the lit board, are actually IN the USA. And the owners who are legally responsible for the content, they, too, actually reside physically in the USA. That means the FBI can knock on a real door and take real people away.
Although the owners have created something that looks like a public forum, it's till private property. They can't change their policies to just accommodate you. You're not the one that runs the risk of getting arrested.

 

[PBI298]

I have to admire BD's decision not to change the age of her character. Sure, it means her story won't be posted on Lit, but, oh well. Interesting how this raises issues of legality and what laws apply where on the Net and to whom.

 

[Pure]

Decision

While I am tempted to close this thread as the topic has been covered in hundreds of threads and the rules of literotica are publically posted, I have decided merely to move it.

As H. Dean said, Blue has no logical argument and--as a nonresident of the US-- assumes the owners of literotica, who operate in the US, should ignore US law in favor of his/her ideas of morality.

In any case, the debate has nothing to do with the Story Discussion Forum, and it's moved, but anyone is welcome to carry on!

pure
moderator,
story disc forum

 

[Boxlicker101]

First, I want to say that it would be very unusual for a 17 year old boy to actually seduce his mother's best friend. More likely, it would be the other way around. Second, I had a story in which a 16 year old was deflowered by HER HUSBAND. The deflowering was the least erotic sex act I have ever written about and it would not have been illegal anywhere in the world but I still had to change it. I didn't like the idea because a major point of the story was how she had gotten married so young, and what her husband was like, but I still had to change it.

 

[cantdog]

The laws on age-of-consent are not 18, even here in the US, which I admit is a priest-ridden backwater. It just happens to be the oldest of many ages of consent, in many different states. Ed Meese did this to us, among others. So Lit isn't actually constrained by US law, just being prudent because of US weirdness.

Haven't you heard there's a war on? Our Attorney General is only one of myriads in the War on Porn.

But all that is mere background. The policy they have hit on, here, and it is only a policy, not a law, is to eschew postings which feature sex under 18, or the witnessing of sex when one is under 18. The site hopes thereby to avoid confrontation with the troops in the War on Porn. They do not hide it, and so you will have known of it. If not, well, now you do.

You have chosen to post elsewhere. So have I, for some of my stories, but I have also changed the ages of some characters in some of my other stories. Really, you have no moral argument, no logical argument. Any market for your writing will reserve the right to accept or reject as they see fit. This is not a public park, where you are free to speak, it's a writer's market. The editorial policy is plainly posted.

If you really do care about the climate in the US which makes policies like this a good idea, you should address the censorship issue sensibly. I do; I joined ACLU and give them hundreds a year. I write letters and make telephone calls. But not to people like Lit. To people like Gonzales.

 

[Blue Dolphin]

Firstly let me say this will be my last post on this matter.
I do appreciate all the comments, good or otherwise.
Some I disagree with, but that is of no matter now, once again, I thank you
regards
Blue

(PB1298, I am a man BTW)

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I'm late to this thread, but, if your character being under the age of majority is so important you can't make him/her older, why would you even attempt to post it here? Why should your work be allowed to ignore the rules when everyone else must conform to them.

Dirtman has written several interracial stories here, but he also writes works for the pet lover's club. If old sparky scores with the main deb, it won't fly here and he dosen't presume he will get a pass.

Without belaboring the point, this country is currently controled by a right that is beholding to a christian fundamentalist fringe. It's also beholding to a corporate overlord who pays for all the fancy dinners and campaign ads. While the owners made a personal choice not to allow anything underage on thier site, it's just prudent of them to do so. The current crop of corrupt congressment can crack down on mom & pop type internet porn and throw a sop to thier religious fanatical backers as well as their big buissness backers and it's no sweat off their noses to do so.

The age of conscent in this state is 16. In my home state it was 14 until recently. Romeo & Juliet laws have decriminalized excperimentation between youngsters of roughly the same age in many states. So the age of conscent varries across this country, but 18 is the age of majority. Should I get a pass because 14 is legal in mississippi? What about countries with no legal limits? You are arguing for the site owners to have to have a working knowledge of the law in every nation where they have readers/contributors. That's insane.

The rules are there for everyone and are clearly outlined. Expecting the owners to let you get by without conforming to them is, IMHO, pretty arrogant.

 

[English Lady]

*hugs* Blue Dolphin -I've not seen you in ages!

Yeah, the 18 thing is in the rules and I know, I really know why you're pissed of with it, but Darlin' once you make them rules you've got to stick to 'em wether a character is 2 weeks under age or 5 years underage. It's the age that has been chosen, it's the age they stick to for legal reasons and thats it.

We all know it's not how it goes in the real world, but to submit here, thats what you have to agree too.

I did have a site, but it's gone now, however my husband created a new forum that accepts stories but nither of us are involved in it any more, if anyone does want the link though, please ask

Don't let it eat you up love, life is too short!

 

[amicus]

Blue Dolphin....

While most here advocate breaking the rules when it comes to issues they have an interest in, it is strange to see them cave in on control of the internet.

Since I maintain that even the 'airways' (radio frequencies) should not be regulated by government, (abolish the FCC), and that 'free speech' is guaranteed by the Constitution, then the imposition of any rules concerning that right, should be resisted.

Whatever one thinks of the age of consent, a particular viewpoint should not be imposed upon all as a matter of 'law'.

This site and any other that bows to perceived 'pressure' to limit expression, does no service to free speech or any other human liberty.

Thanks for expressing your opinion.

amicus...

 

[Boxlicker101]

Blue Dolphin....

While most here advocate breaking the rules when it comes to issues they have an interest in, it is strange to see them cave in on control of the internet.

Since I maintain that even the 'airways' (radio frequencies) should not be regulated by government, (abolish the FCC), and that 'free speech' is guaranteed by the Constitution, then the imposition of any rules concerning that right, should be resisted.

Whatever one thinks of the age of consent, a particular viewpoint should not be imposed upon all as a matter of 'law'.

This site and any other that bows to perceived 'pressure' to limit expression, does no service to free speech or any other human liberty.

Thanks for expressing your opinion.

amicus...

What does "the government" or "law" have to do with this thread? For very good reasons, Laurel and Manu have certain requirements for persons posting stories on this site, and we acknowledge this and follow their rules. Sometimes we wish they would make some changes or exceptions, but we still accept the rules.

Most of us don't so much advocate breaking the rules or the law as we do changing the laws to make them more reasonable, or keeping them reasonable against the pressure of certain extremists.

 

[Stella_Omega]

There's an obvious solution for Amicus, and it's the same one that Blue Dolphin could employ.
Open your own erotic literature website, post in any way you want on it.

 

[H Dean]

Blue Dolphin....

While most here advocate breaking the rules when it comes to issues they have an interest in, it is strange to see them cave in on control of the internet.

I find this to be an interesting assumption. I, for one, do not advocate breaking rules but moving for change if one is disatisfied with said rules. This is not an issue of "caving" but of acknowledgement of known and previously set guidlines.

Since I maintain that even the 'airways' (radio frequencies) should not be regulated by government, (abolish the FCC), and that 'free speech' is guaranteed by the Constitution, then the imposition of any rules concerning that right, should be resisted.

I would tend to agree with this notion. However, we do not have the freedom to post anything we wish to post on a privately owned website. So this is not applicable to this situation.

Whatever one thinks of the age of consent, a particular viewpoint should not be imposed upon all as a matter of 'law'.

This would tend to suggest that we should not protect minors from sexual contact by adults since it is only wrong to some people. NAMBLA would love this quote.

This site and any other that bows to perceived 'pressure' to limit expression, does no service to free speech or any other human liberty.

Are you willing to put yourself at risk? If so, I will gladly post to a site if you run it. Unless you are willing to do so you are speaking from an untennable position.

Thanks for expressing your opinion.

amicus...

Thank you for expressing your own opinion.

 

[amicus]

Not that it matters....

All across the news today the name, 'Rosa Parks' is being heralded as a benchmark in civil rights. She was arrested for refusing to give up a seat on a bus to a white man.

Gay marriages in California, while illegal, were conducted in public.

Change, right or wrong, never occurs easily or peacefully and I think those who commented realize that but just prefer not to acknowledge it.

Laws, in most cases, cannot be challenged rhetorically, they must be broken and then adjudicated, thas the way it works.

I think you do not sense the wider issue at hand, that of control, restriction, regulation, censorship.

My keyboard, hooked up to my computer reaching out via modem, phone lines or satellite to other computers, should be beyond the province of 'government'.

There are of course, the 'screaming fire in a crowded theatre, when there is no fire...' issue of limits to free speech; but to regulate and control or forbid free speech because it might somehow be injurious to someone of a given age, goes beyond the pale of 'protection of the young', and infringes on the right of free expression.

There are nude beaches in many places, but society has proclaimed that only a certain degree of nudity is permitted at the mall; but in your home, or on a 'private' computer, society has no claim.

I have no qualms with this site or any other that imposes rules such as the owners choose. However, if those rules are implemented out of fear of repercussion from government, then a 'chilling effect' settles over creative efforts and free speech.

In my opinion, that is not a good thing.

amicus...