Story Discussion: Munachi, Main Queue 01-16-06

[Munachi]

This is still the first draft of the story, so it is still quite basic, but I feel I do need some help to be able to continue. As I am not quite done with translating it yet, I post one half now, and the rest when I have it translated.

I want it to have quite a coincidental atmosphere, nothing too deep, something that reflects the way things go while you are traveling, you just happen to meet people and things happen to happen with them. This is a bit difficult for me, as usually I hide behind a lot more story, in this case it is supposed to be really just about the things they do, not about why or what their background is.

Do you think it works this way? Or do I need more background? One of the things that is important to me, is the part where they are still playing in the water (as this is kind of going back to a real event) - does one get any idea by reading how exciting the situation was, or do you have any suggestions how I can get this across better?

Ah, and of course any corrections of language are welcome too...



A Swim in the Pool

The last evening before travelling on. As so often there was a taste of the end of the world in the air, a finality I felt after having spent several weeks in the country. Now I would move on, would again go somewhere completely different.

I had found a nice little hostel to spend my last few days in: It had just thirty beds, of which only about half were occupied, and a cute patio and a swimming pool. Due to the tropical climate the latter was the main attraction for me. Every morning I swam a few rounds, and in the evenings I cooled down in the pool a bit before going to sleep with wet hair. It was so warm that they dried quite quickly anyway.

The hostel was small enough for there to be a very familiar atmosphere. From the first evening I knew the other guests. Half of them where here for an extended period – to relax a bit and catch new breath during a longer journey, or because they wanted to stay in town and were on the hunt for an apartment. Several times per week they organized parties or barbeques. I was invited to one of them as well: It was scheduled right for my last evening in the country.

I shared a dorm with two guys: One was Australian, the other from Scotland. Their names have been forgotten along with so many new names and acquaintances I made during my journey. In the evening, while people from the other dorms took care of the barbeque, I sat at a table near the swimming pool, and played cards with the boys from my dorm and a Spaniard. I hardly remember the Spaniard, but the Australian had the most beautiful eyes, they were dark and almost almond shaped, more like I would have expected eyes in Spain to be like, and I am sure some of his ancestors were from southern Europe, probably Italian. The Scot on the other hand spoke with an Accent that made it hard for me to understand him. But at the same time the harshness and melody with which he spoke caused a tickling feeling in my stomach.

In front of me there stood a bottle of wine, and the more I drank of it, the more I liked both eyes and accent. I just couldn’t decide whom of both I liked better. Apart from the abovementioned neither of them looked bad, the Scot was somewhat slimmer than the Australian, with dark blond hair and blue eyes. The Australian had black hair and tanned skin, he looked like he spent a lot of time in the sun. Another couple of glasses of wine, and suddenly I realized that I was trying to flirt with both of them at the same time. Shouldn’t I rather concentrate on our game of cards? And stop drinking, I told myself while I poured new wine into my glass.

Shortly after the Australian suggested, that the loser of the next card game should be thrown into the pool as a punishment – and soon after he lost. But he didn’t seem to care, he jumped voluntarily into the water. Then he returned to the table, wet and refreshed, and we continued playing. This time I lost.

“Well, you don’t have to jump into the pool if you don’t want to,” he said graciously, thinking I would surely not want to be in the water.

“I see, so you are scared to throw me in there?”

The others grinned.

“Is that a dare?” the Australian asked, his eyes sparkling.

He stood up, as did I. When he made a step towards me, I started to run. On the backside of the pool he had caught up with me. I felt him putting his arms around me from behind to stop my running, felt for a moment his breath near my ear, and then felt him pulling me towards the pool, jumping into it with me.

Only when we were dipping into the water he let go of me. I felt the water surround me, couldn’t orientate well for a few moments. But the fresh coolness cleared my head. I got my head over water and looked around. The Australian was a few metres from me – he seemed to be looking for me and was relieved to see me. Then he turned towards the little latter that lead out of the pool.

But I didn’t want to leave the pool yet. It was dark here, but I could still recognize a little bit away from us a ball that someone had left in the water.

“Let’s see who gets it first,” I said to the Australian.

The advantage was mine, I was closer to the ball, and reached it first. A second later however he was there and to my surprise took the ball out of my hands.

“I won!” he cheered.

“No you didn’t!” I protested, and tried to grab the ball. But he held it high above his head, and I had to kick the water strongly with my legs and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

Finally I had conquered the ball again. I suddenly let go of the Australian, and swam away, pressing my prey protectively against my chest. He however followed me rapidly, and caught my legs, held them so I couldn’t reach the end of the swimming pool anymore.

Since I wouldn’t let go of the ball, the Australian drew me under the water, and there we struggled for a few moments. Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake.

Finally the Australian had won back the ball, and both of us emerged from the water, panting. For a few moments we floated without moving too much, just trying to catch back our breath. Then he turned around and swam away, taking the ball with him. I followed.

This way, we kept fighting for the ball for a while, getting more and more daring: We hid it between our legs, behind our back, used it as an excuse to touch each other again and again, becoming more daring in this as well. Several times His hand or arm brushed my breasts, my nipples becoming erect in reaction.

At some point I was leaning with my back against the edge of the pool, holding the ball between my feet under water. The Australian dived, I could feel his hands searching for the ball. But he did not find it; whenever he reached my knee, he gave up and appeared back above the water.

“Ha! You can’t find it! Now it’s mine,” I said.

He however smiled, and answered with a coarse voice, almost whispering: “Who cares about the ball.”

I noticed how close his face was to mine. He seemed to approach me yet more, and his lips at some point touched mine. I forgot to hold on to the ball, and it appeared above the water somewhere next to us, but we did not give it any attention. Our mouths opened a little bit, we kissed carefully, tenderly at first, then more hungrily.

He held on to the edge of the pool, pressing himself to me, that way keeping me from sinking down. Despite this I wrapped my legs somewhat around him, as if I was scared to drown if I didn’t do this. I could clearly feel his arousal.

One of his hands let go of the pool’s edge, and he let it explore my body, but softer and more precisely now than before, when he had pretended to search for the ball. I did not wear a bra, so his hand only had to slip under my small, wet shirt to reach my breasts. He fondled them tenderly, then stronger, started playing with my nipples and finally pinched them slightly.

During this we kept kissing, breathless due to the afford to keep above water. His tongue explored my mouth, dared me, retreated a bit to leave room for my tongue. I could taste a bit of the taste of water, of the beer he had been drinking, but also of the taste of his mouth itself.

The others were still occupied with their barbeque, I could hear voices and music. When I opened my eyes a bit I could see them stand by the grill or sit at the tables. We however were in the darkest corner of the pool, and it was improbable, that anyone who was in the lighted part of the patio could see us. Still, somewhere in the back of my head, I feared and hoped that someone might look in our direction.

His hand let go of my breasts, slowly wandered down my stomach and my hips. Then he pushed it under my skirt, which due to swimming had already moved upwards, and barely covered my hips.

 

[Varian P]

Hi Munachi,

To answer your questions, I can only tell you that personally, I like a little emotional tension in my stories, so the casual encounter by the swimming pool isn't the sort of story I usually seek out. However, there are lots of people who enjoy the quick romp sort of story, and the travel fling--the brief acquaintances with exotic strangers in a foreign place--makes excellent fodder for that.

I do think you can keep a casual feel to the story, but offer us a bit more insight into the narrator as a person--is this the way things often go as she travels from place to place? Is he her fifth conquest this week? Or is she doing something a little racy, a bit unusual for her? Has she been dying to get laid for the last week/month? Or is she just going with the flow?

There are times when the playful chase, dunk in the pool, and wrestling nicely capture that kind of might-be-about-to-get-some frolicking, but I think it needs a little work to convey the excitement you want.

The language often feels a little formal, and therefore distant and detached. I put some comments in-text, suggesting words/phrases I though would work a little better. I also think you could just slow it down a tad, and really show us a few moments where something little happens--her hand accidentally brushing against his groin, his hand pressed against the underside of her breast as he holds her from behind trying to get at the ball, etc. I'd also like to see more of what she's feeling, physically, as she gets increasingly aroused by the play.

And now, here are my detailed comments, in-text:

The last evening before travelling on. As so often [happens] there was a taste of the end of the world in the air [I quite like that phrase], a finality I felt after having spent several weeks in the country. Now I would move on, would again go somewhere completely different [hmmm, as you haven't given any indication of where you are now, "somewhere completely different" is a bit meaningless. Perhaps you mean to get across that you'll be going somewhere completely new to you, that you'll be a stranger in a strange land—there's something evocative in that idea—I'd think about working out a more compelling phrase for it].

I had found a nice little hostel to spend my last few days in: It had just thirty beds, of which only about half were occupied, and a cute patio and a swimming pool [I feel like I either want you to paint a clearer picture—help me see this little spot you've found, or leave these details out altogether. Also, should I know by now what city/country you're in?]. Due to the tropical climate the latter was the main attraction for me. Every morning I swam a few rounds [laps], and in the evenings I cooled down in the pool a bit before going to sleep with wet hair. It was so warm that they [it] dried quite quickly anyway.

The hostel was small enough for there to be a very familiar atmosphere [this might be a better place to mention how many occupants/beds there are]. From the first evening I knew the other guests. Half of them where here for an extended period – to relax a bit and catch new [their] breath during a longer journey, or because they wanted to stay in town and were on the hunt for an apartment. Several times per week they organized parties or barbeques. I was invited to one of them as well: It was scheduled right for my last evening in the country.

I shared a dorm with two guys: O[o]ne was Australian, the other from Scotland. Their names have been forgotten along with so many new names and acquaintances I made during my journey [I like this—having important characters in your story have forgotten names]. In the evening, while people from the other dorms took care of the barbeque, I sat at a table near the swimming pool, and played cards with the boys from my dorm and a Spaniard. I hardly remember the Spaniard, but the Australian had the most beautiful eyes,[;] they were dark and almost almond shaped, more like I would have expected eyes in Spain to be like [delete], and I am sure some of his ancestors were from southern Europe, probably Italian [Italy]. The Scot on the other hand spoke with an A[a]ccent that made it hard for me to understand him. But at the same time the harshness and melody with which he spoke caused a tickling feeling in my stomach.

In front of me there stood a bottle of wine, and the more I drank of it [delete], the more I liked both eyes and accent. I just couldn’t decide whom of both [the two] I liked better. Apart from the abovementioned neither of them looked bad ["Apart from the abovementioned" is a pretty formal-soudnign phrase for the tone/type of story. Also, overall the phrase suggests that you'd been listing their faults earlier.,[;] the Scot was somewhat slimmer than the Australian, with dark blond hair and blue eyes. The Australian had black hair and tanned skin, he [and] looked like he spent a lot of time in the sun. Another couple of glasses of wine, and suddenly I realized that I was trying to flirt with both of them at the same time. Shouldn’t I rather concentrate on our game of cards? And stop drinking, I told myself while I poured new [more] wine into my glass.

Shortly after the Australian suggested, [delete] that the loser of the next card game should be thrown into the pool as a punishment – and soon after he lost. But he didn’t seem to care, he jumped voluntarily into the water. Then he returned to the table, wet and refreshed, and we continued playing. This time I lost.

“Well, you don’t have to jump into the pool if you don’t want to,” he said graciously, thinking I would surely not want to be in the water.

“I see, so you are scared to throw me in there?”

The others grinned.

“Is that a dare?” the Australian asked, his eyes sparkling.

He stood up, as did I. When he made a step towards me, I started to run. On the backside of the pool he had caught up with me. I felt him putting his arms around me from behind to stop my running, felt for a moment his breath near my ear, and then felt him pulling me towards the pool, jumping into it with me.

Only when we were dipping ["plunging" or "dropping" would be better—"dipping" suggests gradual immersion] into the water [did (only when…did… is the common phrase)] he let go of me. I felt the water surround me, couldn’t orientate well for a few moments. But the fresh coolness cleared my head. I got my head over [above] water and looked around. The Australian was a few metres from me – he seemed to be looking for me and was relieved to see me. Then he turned towards the little latter [ladder] that lead out of the pool.

But I didn’t want to leave the pool yet. It was dark here, but I could still recognize a little bit away from us [but a few feet away I spotted/noticed] a ball [what size/kind of ball? A large beach ball? A tennis ball? Later when you're hiding it from each other I was confused, because I'd been picturing a ball too large for that to be believable] that someone had left in the water.

“Let’s see who gets it first,” I said to the Australian.

The advantage was mine, I was closer to the ball, and reached it first. A second later however he was there and to my surprise took the ball out of my hands.

“I won!” he cheered.

“No you didn’t!” I protested, and tried to grab the ball. But he held it high above his head, and I had to kick the water strongly with my legs [delete--since you're kicking, it's obvious you're using your legs] and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

Finally I had conquered the ball again. I suddenly let go of the Australian, and swam away, pressing my prey protectively against my chest. He however followed me rapidly, and caught my legs, held them so I couldn’t reach the end of the swimming pool anymore.

Since I wouldn’t let go of the ball, the Australian drew me under the water, and there we struggled for a few moments. Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake [a great way to start building a bit of sexual tension here would be to give more attention to describing just what's happening—does his hand brush against your breast?].

Finally the Australian had won back the ball, and both of us emerged from the water, panting. For a few moments we floated without moving too much, just trying to catch back [delete] our breath. Then he turned around and swam away, taking the ball with him. I followed.

This way, we kept fighting for the ball for a while, getting more and more daring: We hid it between our legs, behind our back, used it as an excuse to touch each other again and again, becoming more daring in this as well. Several times His [his] hand or arm brushed my breasts, my nipples becoming erect in reaction.

At some point I was leaning with my back against the edge of the pool, holding the ball between my feet under water. The Australian [I kind of want you to at least give the guy a nickname—like "my Aussie" or something, because "the Australian" sounds a bit detached as you get to wrestling around together] dived, I could feel his hands searching for the ball. But he did not find it; whenever he reached my knee, he gave up and appeared back above the water.

“Ha! You can’t find it! Now it’s mine,” I said.

He however smiled, and answered with a coarse voice, almost whispering: “Who cares about the ball.”

I noticed how close his face was to mine. He seemed to approach me yet more [came even nearer], and his lips at some point [delete] touched mine. I forgot to hold on to the ball, and it appeared above the water [popped/bobbed to the surface] somewhere next to us, but we did not give it any attention. Our mouths opened a little bit, we kissed carefully, tenderly at first, then more hungrily.

He held on to the edge of the pool, pressing himself to me, that way keeping me from sinking down. Despite this I wrapped my legs somewhat [delete] around him, as if I was scared to drown if I didn’t do this. I could clearly feel his arousal.

One of his hands let go of the pool’s edge, and he let it explore my body, but softer and more precisely now than before, when he had pretended to search for the ball. I did not wear a bra, so his hand only had to slip under my small, wet shirt to reach my breasts. He fondled them tenderly, then stronger, started playing with my nipples and finally pinched them slightly.

During this we kept kissing, breathless due to the afford [effort] to keep above water. His tongue explored my mouth, dared me, retreated a bit to leave room for my tongue. I could taste a bit of the taste of water, of the beer he had been drinking, but also of the taste of his mouth itself [Over the mingled flavors of pool water and beer I tasted his mouth] (personally, the thought of tasting chorine and stale beer undermines the sensuality of what's going on, but if you're going for realism…).

The others were still occupied with their barbeque, I could hear voices and music. When I opened my eyes a bit I could see them stand[ing] by the grill or sit[ting] at the tables. We however were in the darkest corner of the pool, and it was improbable, [delete] that anyone who was in the lighted part of the patio could see us. Still, somewhere in the back of my head, I feared and hoped that someone might look in our direction.

His hand let go of ["slid from" would make for a softer image—as it is now, I get the impression he's had a good grip on them] my breasts, slowly wandered down my stomach and my hips. Then he pushed it under my skirt, which due to swimming had already moved upwards [had floated up], and barely covered my hips.



***


I hope that's somewhat helpful. I certainly admire the undertaking of translating this into English--if I were to attempt to translate something into the language I know best after English, I'd probably accidentally end up portraying my MC shagging a lawnmower, or gently inserting a buffalo in someone's ass.

-V

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Hey Munachi. It's good to see one of your stories up here.

I have terrific admiration for anyone writing in a language that;s not their native tongue, and it's something I'd never be able to do, simply because I'm so bad with languages, but I won't beat around the bush: you've got English problems. Nothing irreparable or fatal, , and nothing an editor can't take care of, but they're there and they have to be corrected before you submit this piece. If you can't find an editor to help, let me know and I'll help you with it.

Aside from that, the main problem with this piece (for me at least) is your tendency to tell rather than show, and your lack of detail. The premise and the set-up of the story are charming and show a lot of promise, but so far you're telling us what happened and not showing us, not painting a picture that we can see and climb into.

As an example, take the struggle for the ball, which you;ve said you want to portray as exciting and erotic. Here's what you say:

Finally I had conquered the ball again. I suddenly let go of the Australian, and swam away, pressing my prey protectively against my chest. He however followed me rapidly, and caught my legs, held them so I couldn’t reach the end of the swimming pool anymore.

Since I wouldn’t let go of the ball, the Australian drew me under the water, and there we struggled for a few moments. Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake.

This bit is key to the story. It's where the horseplay gets physical and sexual, and so we want to know what happens here—we're watching the action very closely. We'd like to hear what you heard, see what you saw, feel what you felt. We'd probably like to see something more like this:

I got the ball away from him, clasped it to my chest and tried to swim away, but he was right behind me, splashing and laughing. I squealed as he grabbed at my legs, then his fingers closed on my ankle and he pulled me easily towards him, ignoring my frantic kicking. He grabbed for the ball but I wouldn’t let go, so he pulled me under, and there we struggled, laughing, choking, rolling around in the froth and the bubbles. I felt his hands slide inadvertently over my hips, my thighs. He slid his hands around the ball and I felt the back of his knuckles against my breasts. Even underwater, I felt myself blush with excitement. I hugged the ball even tighter, forcing my body against his hands.

It's not great prose, but you see how it gives the picture more of a sense of immediacy, of happening right there while you're telling it. There's a lot of concrete detail—the laughing and splashing and bubbles, knowing just where he touched you—and that brings it alive and gives it a sense of excitement and action.

It's a good idea, whenever you write an action scene, to avoid words like "however," "since," "obviously," anything that suggests you were analyzing what was going on. That distances us from the action and takes us out of the moment. What we want are concrete sensual details, specific sights and sounds and smells and sensations—raw sensory input.

I don't have a problem with this being a casual sexual encounter, and I'm pretty sure most Literotica readers won't mind either. The fact that you don't use the men's names kind of bothers me, and if you're not using them because you think it makes the scene seem more casual and transitroy, I don't think it's worth it. Even in a quickie grabbed in the alley, we usually know our partner's names, and if she's been playing cards with them, for sure she would know their names. Referring to his as "The Australian" just seems kind of rude. You were attracted to him, you should use his name.

We really do need a lot more detail though, in my opinion. Her jumping in the pool would have a lot more meaning if we already knew what she was wearing, so we could picture what it would look like wet. It would be nice to get a feel for the banter during the card game too, whether they were already flirting and coming onto her. The way you make things hot is through vivid detail—telling us what yu experienced. I notice when they kissed, the kiss was dealt with in four or five words, and then on to something else. That's not a memorable kiss. If you want to make it hot, you've got to show us just what it felt like and what it did to you. Concentrate on that, and the rest will take of itself.

 

[Penelope Street]

Hi Munachi,

I want it to have quite a coincidental atmosphere, nothing too deep, something that reflects the way things go while you are traveling, you just happen to meet people and things happen to happen with them. This is a bit difficult for me, as usually I hide behind a lot more story, in this case it is supposed to be really just about the things they do, not about why or what their background is.

As vignettes go, this one is pretty good. I think you've exceeded your stated objective; even though it has a casual feel, I at least understood a little about why she was attracted to him. For me, why is more important than what or how or when or where. I'm still not as involved as I might have been had there been more build-up, but this is good for its length.

Do you think it works this way? Or do I need more background? One of the things that is important to me, is the part where they are still playing in the water (as this is kind of going back to a real event) - does one get any idea by reading how exciting the situation was, or do you have any suggestions how I can get this across better?

I like the action in the pool; especially the crisp flow. Sometimes I got a little lost, but nothing major. Their actions did say a lot about what they were feeling.

Ah, and of course any corrections of language are welcome too...

This was the biggest problem for me, the subtle things that were just off enough that I had to read a sentence a few times to try and grasp the meaning. Please don't take this as any kind of slam if English is not your native tongue. I couldn't even manage a paragraph in any other language, let alone write a story. Varian does a pretty good job of pointing out a host of minor issues, so I'll not duplicate her efforts.


I liked that he is just "The Australian" and never has a name in the story. This made it more believable for me that she could be about the moment and not necessarily the man, as if any young Australian with the right eyes might have done. On the other hand, I can still tell you the name of every man, and boy for that matter, I have ever kissed, so it distances me that she has forgotten his name. Calling him "My Aussie" might be the perfect compromise.

I also like that you left it up to me whether this is her fifth conquest of the week or her first. Personally, I think it's her first, that there's a sense of being a little more free, and reckless, on the last night.

As so often there was a taste of the end of the world in the air, a finality I felt after having spent several weeks in the country.

Good job on giving me a hint of melancholy. I did, however, want to know which country.

“Well, you don’t have to jump into the pool if you don’t want to,” he said graciously, thinking I would surely not want to be in the water.

“I see, so you are scared to throw me in there?”

The others grinned.

“Is that a dare?” the Australian asked, his eyes sparkling.

He stood up, as did I. When he made a step towards me, I started to run.

This was a great point in the story for me. It's the first real action and, even with such sparse description, it still works, being such a primitive predator/prey moment. I'd like to see their expressions after they stand, just the instant before he takes that step.
I think you can trim graciously, thinking I would surely not want to be in the water from the first sentence. It's clear that he's being gracious, yet how does she know what he's thinking?

Did you consider starting the detailed narrative a little sooner, perhaps when the Australian suggests throwing someone in the pool? I'd like to have seen how everyone reacts to this. Do the men all look to her? Of course they do - but does she like it? Also, a good time to bring up what she's wearing, no? Plus, I want to be with her when she ogles him emerging from the pool with rivulets running over his form.

Finally the Australian had won back the ball, and both of us emerged from the water, panting.

Maybe it's just me, but when I read "emerged from the water" I pictured them climbing out of the pool instead of just breaking the surface. Also, I started to wonder what the other card players were doing.

The others were still occupied with their barbeque, I could hear voices and music. When I opened my eyes a bit I could see them stand by the grill or sit at the tables. We however were in the darkest corner of the pool, and it was improbable, that anyone who was in the lighted part of the patio could see us. Still, somewhere in the back of my head, I feared and hoped that someone might look in our direction.

This paragraph clashed with the image I had formed of the scene, that being of a pool area deserted aside from the card players. Did I see her dodging anyone as she ran about the pool with her Aussie in hot pursuit? Come to think of it, why does there have to be a party? Doesn't it work just as well if four acquaintances drink and play cards late into the night because there's nothing else to do? Well, almost nothing.

 

[Munachi]

Hi!
Thanks for your reply, and thanks for taking the effort of going through the text and correcting the language mistakes, and of course also thanks for the comments!

I do think you can keep a casual feel to the story, but offer us a bit more insight into the narrator as a person--is this the way things often go as she travels from place to place? Is he her fifth conquest this week? Or is she doing something a little racy, a bit unusual for her? Has she been dying to get laid for the last week/month? Or is she just going with the flow?

I will try that. I guess part of the problem is, I am not quite sure yet myself if I want her to be doing this all the time, or just on this occasion... I will think about it and then try to work it into the story...

She has already been traveling for months, and will still go on traveling for months, so I guess it is more likely she has done this before... I guess I have to think about how to bring that across.

The language often feels a little formal, and therefore distant and detached. I put some comments in-text, suggesting words/phrases I though would work a little better. I also think you could just slow it down a tad, and really show us a few moments where something little happens--her hand accidentally brushing against his groin, his hand pressed against the underside of her breast as he holds her from behind trying to get at the ball, etc. I'd also like to see more of what she's feeling, physically, as she gets increasingly aroused by the play.

True, I do need to slow it down, and work in more details... I am not very good with writing action I think, and need to work on that. I was just somehow stuck with it and couldn't get myself to work anything into the texts, reading your and the other's comments here already gives me some motivation and ideas what I could do with it...

[hmmm, as you haven't given any indication of where you are now, "somewhere completely different" is a bit meaningless. Perhaps you mean to get across that you'll be going somewhere completely new to you, that you'll be a stranger in a strange land—there's something evocative in that idea—I'd think about working out a more compelling phrase for it].

The idea is that she is on some kind of round the world trip where she gets to a different country every month or so. So she is in a place right now that she has traveled around in, but hadn't seen before, and will fly to a different one she hasn't seen before the next day... Seeing so many places makes it all blur a bit and in the end you often don't even remember what happened where, and when you have been in what place - because of this I decided not to actually say where she is (because it could have been anywhere really)... I guess I should probably use a few more phrases to bring across that idea...

[I feel like I either want you to paint a clearer picture—help me see this little spot you've found, or leave these details out altogether. Also, should I know by now what city/country you're in?].

Okay, hehe, I think it is just that I more or less remember the kind of hostel I mean, and thus forget to describe it for those that don't know it... As for the country, as I said, I didn't want it to be clear, maybe I will let her mention that she doesn't remember...

Apart from the abovementioned neither of them looked bad ["Apart from the abovementioned" is a pretty formal-soudnign phrase for the tone/type of story. Also, overall the phrase suggests that you'd been listing their faults earlier.

Ah, okay, thanks, good to know... I had the word from the dictionary, and I guess I got it wrong...

[a great way to start building a bit of sexual tension here would be to give more attention to describing just what's happening—does his hand brush against your breast?].

thanks, I will try to do that. I guess again I was thinking what is happening and forgetting that when someone else reads it they don't see what I think but only what I actually write down... I need to work on that, hehe...

[I kind of want you to at least give the guy a nickname—like "my Aussie" or something, because "the Australian" sounds a bit detached as you get to wrestling around together]

I was at first thinking to give him some nick name referring to the eyes as at the beginning I say that they are what gets her attention first... But then I couldn't think of any good nickname... naming him my aussie instead of the australian sounds good though, thanks for the suggestion!

I could taste a bit of the taste of water, of the beer he had been drinking, but also of the taste of his mouth itself [Over the mingled flavors of pool water and beer I tasted his mouth] (personally, the thought of tasting chorine and stale beer undermines the sensuality of what's going on, but if you're going for realism…).

Hm, I guess I either have to drop this or describe a bit better what I mean... For me it is that somehow the taste of beer, cigarettes, in this case chlorine and similar things can be erotic (of course only if it isn't too strong) - maybe because it just makes the situation feel more real, or also because it reminds me of my first kisses as a teenager, when just every guy I knew would be drinking and smoking a lot, and thus taste this way...

I hope that's somewhat helpful. I certainly admire the undertaking of translating this into English--if I were to attempt to translate something into the language I know best after English, I'd probably accidentally end up portraying my MC shagging a lawnmower, or gently inserting a buffalo in someone's ass.

-V

Thanks! That was very helpful! Thanks for taking the effort - I know it is a lot of effort especially when apart from contents and difficulties with descriptions there are also so many language mistakes - but your suggestions will help me a lot to improve it!

 

[Munachi]

Hey Munachi. It's good to see one of your stories up here.

Hi! Thanks for your reply!

I have terrific admiration for anyone writing in a language that;s not their native tongue, and it's something I'd never be able to do, simply because I'm so bad with languages, but I won't beat around the bush: you've got English problems. Nothing irreparable or fatal, , and nothing an editor can't take care of, but they're there and they have to be corrected before you submit this piece. If you can't find an editor to help, let me know and I'll help you with it.

Yes, I know there is still quite a bit to work on in my English writing, and especially when I feel not so secure yet contentswise with what I am writing I have difficulties chosing the right words... I hope that having my text discussed here will help me somewhat in that though - I do usually try to put my texts on lit in both English and German, and must say, I prefer putting them on the English lit, as I have some problems with the German lit... but okay, that's a different topic...
And thanks for the offer to help me! I am always in search of someone to help me getting rid of the many mistakes in my stories (as I am also always scared that if I ask the same person too often, they will get quite bored with my mistakes), so thanks a lot for the offer, I will happily accept it...

Aside from that, the main problem with this piece (for me at least) is your tendency to tell rather than show, and your lack of detail. The premise and the set-up of the story are charming and show a lot of promise, but so far you're telling us what happened and not showing us, not painting a picture that we can see and climb into.

You are right, I need to work on that... As I said, this is still mainly an outline, but the reason I put it here like that was that I somehow couldn't make it more alive. Reading your suggestions gives me some ideas though, and I hope this way I will manage to rewrite it in a better way...

It's a good idea, whenever you write an action scene, to avoid words like "however," "since," "obviously," anything that suggests you were analyzing what was going on. That distances us from the action and takes us out of the moment. What we want are concrete sensual details, specific sights and sounds and smells and sensations—raw sensory input.

Okay, thanks... I didn't really realize that these words give a very analyzing notion (or maybe I did, I am sometimes told that I tend to be over-analytical)... I will try to find better ways of saying what I was saying at these parts...

I don't have a problem with this being a casual sexual encounter, and I'm pretty sure most Literotica readers won't mind either. The fact that you don't use the men's names kind of bothers me, and if you're not using them because you think it makes the scene seem more casual and transitroy, I don't think it's worth it. Even in a quickie grabbed in the alley, we usually know our partner's names, and if she's been playing cards with them, for sure she would know their names. Referring to his as "The Australian" just seems kind of rude. You were attracted to him, you should use his name.

Hm, the reason I did chose to let her have forgotten their names was indeed to make it seem more casual and transitory, and also random... Getting back to Varian P's question about whether she did this before or not, I am realizing now more and more that she did - it is one of several encounters she has during her back packing times, and names get less memorable even than the nationality of people she met... I guess in part I also did it because I just don#t like naming characters though and try to avoid it when I can. Maybe I will try to think of some name, not sure yet... Though the truth is, that I have forgotten the names of several guys I had sex with, especially while traveling. In one case I forgot someone's name about three days after the day I met him...

We really do need a lot more detail though, in my opinion. Her jumping in the pool would have a lot more meaning if we already knew what she was wearing, so we could picture what it would look like wet. It would be nice to get a feel for the banter during the card game too, whether they were already flirting and coming onto her. The way you make things hot is through vivid detail—telling us what yu experienced. I notice when they kissed, the kiss was dealt with in four or five words, and then on to something else. That's not a memorable kiss. If you want to make it hot, you've got to show us just what it felt like and what it did to you. Concentrate on that, and the rest will take of itself.

Thanks... I will try to work on that, to make the story more vivid, and probably try to work in some dialogue and descriptions already in the beginning...

thanks a lot for your suggestions, they gave me good ideas what to work on!

 

[Munachi]

Hi Munachi

Hi! Thanks for reading the text and thanks for replying!

As vignettes go, this one is pretty good. I think you've exceeded your stated objective; even though it has a casual feel, I at least understood a little about why she was attracted to him. For me, why is more important than what or how or when or where. I'm still not as involved as I might have been had there been more build-up, but this is good for its length.

I am glad you understand why she is attracted to him and all that... As for more build up, I will definitely work on that...

I liked that he is just "The Australian" and never has a name in the story. This made it more believable for me that she could be about the moment and not necessarily the man, as if any young Australian with the right eyes might have done. On the other hand, I can still tell you the name of every man, and boy for that matter, I have ever kissed, so it distances me that she has forgotten his name. Calling him "My Aussie" might be the perfect compromise.

Yes, I think I might go for my aussie or something like that, or sometimes call him this, sometimes that - also to avoid repetitions, apart from that obviously I don't want the way she speaks about him sound rude...

I also like that you left it up to me whether this is her fifth conquest of the week or her first. Personally, I think it's her first, that there's a sense of being a little more free, and reckless, on the last night.

Good job on giving me a hint of melancholy. I did, however, want to know which country.

Hm, I was more thinking about indicating now that she has had similar conquests before, but I will see... She's been on her way quite a while... As I mentioned above I don't really want to place it in any specific country because I want it to be very random even concerning the when and where it happened... She has been traveling a long time, spending many nights in many different hostels all over the world, seeing different places and meeting different people all the time - and in a way the memories blur. It is kind of this feeling you get when you are just constantly traveling, and especially in the occasions when your life concentrates more on the hostel and the people you meet there and the parties, than at the cultural parts of the country - then everything could be just about anywhere...

This was a great point in the story for me. It's the first real action and, even with such sparse description, it still works, being such a primitive predator/prey moment. I'd like to see their expressions after they stand, just the instant before he takes that step.
I think you can trim graciously, thinking I would surely not want to be in the water from the first sentence. It's clear that he's being gracious, yet how does she know what he's thinking?

Did you consider starting the detailed narrative a little sooner, perhaps when the Australian suggests throwing someone in the pool? I'd like to have seen how everyone reacts to this. Do the men all look to her? Of course they do - but does she like it? Also, a good time to bring up what she's wearing, no? Plus, I want to be with her when she ogles him emerging from the pool with rivulets running over his form.

Okay, thanks for the tip, I will try to do that.

Maybe it's just me, but when I read "emerged from the water" I pictured them climbing out of the pool instead of just breaking the surface. Also, I started to wonder what the other card players were doing.

Actually one of them shows up in the second part that I haven't posted here yet. But I think I will work over this first part before I think about that second part - especially as I am not sure if that second part is very believable, or maybe a bit too over the top...

This paragraph clashed with the image I had formed of the scene, that being of a pool area deserted aside from the card players. Did I see her dodging anyone as she ran about the pool with her Aussie in hot pursuit? Come to think of it, why does there have to be a party? Doesn't it work just as well if four acquaintances drink and play cards late into the night because there's nothing else to do? Well, almost nothing.

Again, the fact that there are more people comes into some importance in the second part (or maybe as an excuse to move away from the pool after a while... And I guess it is also just because the event that gave me the idea (not that the story happened as I write it, but there are some parts of it) was at a barbeque and party... I guess I can consider either changing that, or else I will try to make it a bit clearer - I guess that way I can also describe the place a bit better, where the swimming pool is in relation to the rest of the hostel, etc.

Again, thanks a lot for reading the text and for your replies!

 

[oOScarletWingsOo]

Do you think it works this way? Or do I need more background? One of the things that is important to me, is the part where they are still playing in the water (as this is kind of going back to a real event) - does one get any idea by reading how exciting the situation was, or do you have any suggestions how I can get this across better?

I think what you have works. The only thing background related that I felt it could have is the sex of the narrator. I think that it too easily reads homoerotic to me (or too easily could read either way) as the narrator seems to skirt this boyhood playfulness. For me, if you gave some indication of the sex of the narrator early on (and I’m not saying you have to directly state it - but rather give some stronger indications) that would be helpful. It wasn’t a total shock to come across the line “He touched my breast.” but it did make me frown up a bit. ::laugh:: I can’t for the life of me tell you where/why I got the impression that the narrator was male. ::shrug::

As far as the water play is concerned, I’m not reading a strict erotic/sexual excitement in it. I get a flirtatious excitement from it – the thrill you get when someone is returning your advances/feelings. So maybe I would need to know what level or type of excitement you are going for to provide a suggestion.

This is a good start overall. I am very impressed that it’s being translated to something that is not your native tongue. Nice work.

 

[Pure]

Hi Munachi,

To me it reads rather well, and I see Varian has caught various word problems-- the two that caught my eye first were

Despite this I wrapped my legs *somewhat around him,

I could taste a bit of the *taste of water, of the beer he had been drinking, but also of the taste of his mouth itself.

English, unlike Chinese and some other languages does not usually have redundancy, like 'taste ... the taste' or (my examples) "I speared with my spear' 'I swam a good swim.'

----
It does read as very casual and unplanned (on the characters' part, not yours!). I like some of mab's suggestions as to making it lighter, more detailed and more active. More 'prurient detail,' as they say. If I remember correctly, younger people esp. react in the whole body to these little touches at various key places; perhaps that could be brought out a bit more.

My experience did not contain a 'gender of the narrator' problem, since there are clues early on.
----
Let's look at one para, for some details of wording and style:

“No you didn’t!” I protested, and tried to grab the ball. But he held it high above his head, and I had to kick the water strongly with my legs and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

Finally I had conquered the ball again. I suddenly let go of the Australian, and swam away, pressing my prey protectively against my chest. He however followed me rapidly, and caught my legs, held them so I couldn’t reach the end of the swimming pool anymore.

Since I wouldn’t let go of the ball, the Australian drew me under the water, and there we struggled for a few moments. Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake.
---

Mab alluded to the issue I see, above and elsewhere, mentioning words like 'however' and 'since'. IF it's to be immediate, you should not make so many detailed causal and explanatory links. (Like a scientist's description of how a chick emerges from an egg.)

...I had to kick the water strongly with my legs and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

//I kicked upwards, then grabbed his arm to get close to the ball. My body pressed against his, only my wet shirt between us.//

Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake

//He reached for the toy, and touched me in so many places; his fingers brushed my waist, my inner thighs; his arm slid past my breast. I couldn't tell if it was accidental.//

In the moment--which you are seeking to convey-- intentions ("trying") and linkages are not thought of. (Incidentally, 'different' is unnecessary.)

I think it will be a fine story! We Americans have to praise this expert proficiency in a second (or third) language!

 

[Munachi]

I think what you have works. The only thing background related that I felt it could have is the sex of the narrator. I think that it too easily reads homoerotic to me (or too easily could read either way) as the narrator seems to skirt this boyhood playfulness. For me, if you gave some indication of the sex of the narrator early on (and I’m not saying you have to directly state it - but rather give some stronger indications) that would be helpful. It wasn’t a total shock to come across the line “He touched my breast.” but it did make me frown up a bit. ::laugh:: I can’t for the life of me tell you where/why I got the impression that the narrator was male. ::shrug::

As far as the water play is concerned, I’m not reading a strict erotic/sexual excitement in it. I get a flirtatious excitement from it – the thrill you get when someone is returning your advances/feelings. So maybe I would need to know what level or type of excitement you are going for to provide a suggestion.

This is a good start overall. I am very impressed that it’s being translated to something that is not your native tongue. Nice work.

Thanks for reading it and commenting!

Ha! it never occured to me it might not be clear the narrator is a girl. I guess that is because I am one, and usually write out of the point of view of one, that I forget that someone who just reads the story doesn't know... I will see to make it a bit clearer earlier on, probably if I anyway want to put on a bit more of a description of her clothes etc. then I can do that there...

As for the fight in the water - I want it to go from more innocent flirtation/playfulness into clearer sexual excitement, so I guess I have to work on building up the tension...

 

[Munachi]

Hi Munachi,

To me it reads rather well, and I see Varian has caught various word problems-- the two that caught my eye first were

Despite this I wrapped my legs *somewhat around him,

I could taste a bit of the *taste of water, of the beer he had been drinking, but also of the taste of his mouth itself.

English, unlike Chinese and some other languages does not usually have redundancy, like 'taste ... the taste' or (my examples) "I speared with my spear' 'I swam a good swim.'

----
It does read as very casual and unplanned (on the characters' part, not yours!). I like some of mab's suggestions as to making it lighter, more detailed and more active. More 'prurient detail,' as they say. If I remember correctly, younger people esp. react in the whole body to these little touches at various key places; perhaps that could be brought out a bit more.

My experience did not contain a 'gender of the narrator' problem, since there are clues early on.
----
Let's look at one para, for some details of wording and style:

“No you didn’t!” I protested, and tried to grab the ball. But he held it high above his head, and I had to kick the water strongly with my legs and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

Finally I had conquered the ball again. I suddenly let go of the Australian, and swam away, pressing my prey protectively against my chest. He however followed me rapidly, and caught my legs, held them so I couldn’t reach the end of the swimming pool anymore.

Since I wouldn’t let go of the ball, the Australian drew me under the water, and there we struggled for a few moments. Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake.
---

Mab alluded to the issue I see, above and elsewhere, mentioning words like 'however' and 'since'. IF it's to be immediate, you should not make so many detailed causal and explanatory links. (Like a scientist's description of how a chick emerges from an egg.)

...I had to kick the water strongly with my legs and hold on to his arm to even get close to the ball. Doing this, my body – covered only slightly by the small, wet shirt I was wearing - ended up pressing against his.

//I kicked upwards, then grabbed his arm to get close to the ball. My body pressed against his, only my wet shirt between us.//

Trying to get back the toy, he touched different parts of my body seemingly by mistake

//He reached for the toy, and touched me in so many places; his fingers brushed my waist, my inner thighs; his arm slid past my breast. I couldn't tell if it was accidental.//

In the moment--which you are seeking to convey-- intentions ("trying") and linkages are not thought of. (Incidentally, 'different' is unnecessary.)

I think it will be a fine story! We Americans have to praise this expert proficiency in a second (or third) language!

Thanks... I will look at all the things you pointed out.

 

[Pure]

a couple minor niggles:


I don't agree with Varian, here:
M: I just couldn’t decide whom of both I liked better.

V: I just couldn’t decide whom of the two I liked better. [[If I read his suggestion correctly]]

I prefer 'which.'

----
'orientate' is needlessly complicated:

M: I felt the water surround me, couldn’t orientate well for a few moments.

P: I felt the water surround me and was momentarily disoriented.

OR

I felt the water surround me, and it took a few moments to orient myself.
----


Overall, it is an impressive translation. Very professional, almost native-like.

 

[Penelope Street]

As far as the water play is concerned, I’m not reading a strict erotic/sexual excitement in it. I get a flirtatious excitement from it – the thrill you get when someone is returning your advances/feelings.

I think my reaction was similar; while not arousing it still made me smile.

... it never occurred to me it might not be clear the narrator is a girl.

I'm not sure if I picked up on the hints or not, but it never dawned on me that the narrator might be male. A reader of one of my stories left a detailed feedback recently about this issue and it appears I am guilty of the same sort of thing; when my narrators are masculine I establish this within a few sentences, but when they are feminine I'm not so deliberate about it. Has anyone ever tried, or read for that matter, a story where a character's gender is deliberately left to the reader's imagination?

Overall, it is an impressive translation. Very professional, almost native-like.

I agree it's impressive, although I can't say I thought it almost native-like. This is hardly a bad thing; I found a certain charm in phrases such as '... I had conquered the ball...' While I would never have said it like that, the meaning is clear. What if, during the conversation with the other card players, the narrator established that English was not her first language? I think something simple would work, like a mix-up with the Australian involving certain slang. To me, this would encourage the reader to view any unconventional aspects of the narration style as just another part of her character.

 

[Pure]

penny said, What if, during the conversation with the other card players, the narrator established that English was not her first language? I think something simple would work, like a mix-up with the Australian involving certain slang. To me, this would encourage the reader to view any unconventional aspects of the narration style as just another part of her character.

good idea, penny! this is like the problem of making a movie, say, about the Nazis. Do they speak perfect Oxford English? American English? English with a German accent? German only, with subtitles? i believe Penny is implying that IF it did read perfectly, like a native English speaker, that might be less suitable, perhaps even needing an explanation, else the only other conclusion is that the person was English, or born and schooled in an English-speaking country.

it also might be mentioned that 'native-like' prose is not necessarily error free--as many lit. postings and stories attest. and a substantial portion of munachi's errors could be those of a native speaker, for example, homonyms, word choice (diction), and grammar ("When I opened my eyes a bit I could see them stand[ing] by the grill or sit[ting] at the tables. " corrections by Varian). for me, the German flavor comes chiefly from certain sentence structures, sometimes undue precision, or overly detailed explanations.

in the long run, such prose is improved; its faults become its virtues, often, to the point of superiority to native speaker's prose, and you get the common situation in our city-- a foreign born (ESL) person teaching English to--say--native speakers in High School!

 

[Munachi]

I'm not sure if I picked up on the hints or not, but it never dawned on me that the narrator might be male. A reader of one of my stories left a detailed feedback recently about this issue and it appears I am guilty of the same sort of thing; when my narrators are masculine I establish this within a few sentences, but when they are feminine I'm not so deliberate about it. Has anyone ever tried, or read for that matter, a story where a character's gender is deliberately left to the reader's imagination?


I agree it's impressive, although I can't say I thought it almost native-like. This is hardly a bad thing; I found a certain charm in phrases such as '... I had conquered the ball...' While I would never have said it like that, the meaning is clear. What if, during the conversation with the other card players, the narrator established that English was not her first language? I think something simple would work, like a mix-up with the Australian involving certain slang. To me, this would encourage the reader to view any unconventional aspects of the narration style as just another part of her character.

Actually I once started writing a (non-erotic) story where it wasn't supposed to be clear throughout the whole story if the two main characters are male, female, one each. also their personalities were supposed to blend a lot that you wouldn't be able to tell sometimes who of them is talking now. i never finished it yet, though.

that's good idea, about having her mention that she isn't a native speaker! thanks!