Story Discussion: January 26, 2010. "(S)aint Jack's Eve" by Auden James

[Auden James]

Story Discussion: January 26, 2010. My failed English-language story attempt

Hi, everyone!

I know I failed disastrously and I thank everyone who helped me figure it out!


Greets
AJ

 

[Auden James]

The fortunately gone excerpt

==== Thank You All Very Much For Your Advice, But I Think It's Better Not To Torment You Anyfurther With My Clumsy Wording Like Paco Pointed Out ====

 

[Auden James]

My obsolete questions and concerns

OK, I got it: drop it to attempt to write a story in a language that's not your mother tongue. I'm sorry for anyone who's been afflicted with my pointless ramblings...

—AJ

 

[PacoFear]

What you ask is a tall order, Auden

...but I've got some time on my hands and this'll be more entertaining than daytime American television. For starters, my thoughts on your piece are only mine and safely ignored. I'm sure what I perceived as weaknesses others would call strengths.

Before I get to my comments, I have a suggestion about a possible vehicle for introducing your "Old Jack" backstory. When Amy, Adam, and Cathy unite with Nick, I would remove the Monster Mash feature from your background and replace it with a narration of the story of Old Jack. Frankly, Monster Mash is a cliched, campy song whose use at Halloween parties is on parallel with the Macarena or, worse, the dreaded Chicken Dance at a wedding. Monster Mash is lame and silly. Everyone knows it. We do it for the kids, really. Using it in your story is not doing you any favors in terms of building your creative credibility and I think it's messing with your piece's tone.

Better, I think, to have Nick's entrance begin with having him tell "The Story of Old Jack," partly from the shadows. If you can manage it, it might improve the haunting aspect of The Story of Old Jack, by having it told in verse.

Gather, ye children, 'round the fire
For a blood slicked story, dark and dire
Of the wickedest man to die on a wrack,
The scourge of London, dear Old Jack.

[Nick, dressed as a dire clown, steps into the thin light and continues the story...] The ending twist or connection for the four of them to Old Jack? I'd go with this tried and true one: Cathy turns out to be Old Jack's great, great, great, granddaughter. I'd foreshadow this a little in the beginning with something like, "Cathy's whole family hates this holiday for very old and very good reasons." Just a thought.

Okay, on to what I liked and disliked about your piece.

LIKED: It's quite descriptive. You've invested time into setting the scene and the tone for your tale. At points, it gets quite immersive. I feel like I'm in the place you're describing. I also liked that the characters seem to have a pre-existing relationship. How they know each other piqued some interest.

DISLIKED: -- Buckle in, this is me being completely candid --

You didn't have to tell us. You're clearly not a native English speaker. Blatant word misuse abounds: it's a 'corset' not a 'corsage.' Awkward phrasing ensues from the very beginning. The statement, 'A nameless evil pervades each and everyone' is nonsensical. In common usage, the verb 'pervades' applies to inanimate objects like rooms or ideas. It does not apply to people. Better to say simply that 'A nameless evil pervades' or that 'A nameless evil has infected the city.' But even stated more naturally, the sentence has little value contextually to me either way or, worse still, points to a misunderstanding of the culture. Is Halloween really all that evil? Not really.

To make this story read naturally would require an editor to effectively re-write it from the ground up. Why bother? I'll shorten my usual soapbox speech on the subject of second-language writing by saying that you should really, I mean really, consider writing in your first language instead. The only logical reason I've heard for writing in English as a second language is to reach a broader audience than your first language. But if the English audience does not enjoy your work then, in my book, you've lost ground by switching languages, not gained.

Next problem, you have no discernable plot nor a hint at one. The only reason to continue reading was the implicit promise of sex (because it's on Lit.) and my mild curiousity in seeing what adjectives you were going to string together next. If you're only getting to the actual plot after 2,000 words, you're way too late. So, in answer to your question about pacing: yes, you have a pacing issue. Really long, descriptive passages from an amateur author (and, hey, I'm an amateur writer too, don't get me wrong) are just self-indulgent. Cut it down. A lot. And sprinkle in either some plot teasers or, at the very least, some sensual content to titillate. Either work to maintain a reader's interest.

Next problem, if I'm interpreting one of the questions from your post correctly, you have sensed that you have no plot and now you're asking us to supply you with one. Frankly, that's a bit nuts. Basically, with your 2,000+ word passage you've laid out a misshapen chessboard and you're asking if someone would like to play a nice game for you.

Oddly enough, I'm game today. As I said, American daytime TV is miserable, so here goes my attempt... *stretching knuckles*

1. Nick tells a version of the story of Old Jack. The gist of Nick's story is that Old Jack was executed for doing something gruesome 301 years ago. When he finishes he says he read it in the library archives of their school dealing with old London folklore.
2. Andy and Amy accuse him of making the story up.
3. Cathy confirms that Nick didn't invent the story, explaining that her grandfather used to tell it to her when she was a child on his knee in front of the fireplace and that the story had been in her family for generations. (Foreshadowing that she's Old Jack's descendant.)
4. Cathy retells a different version of the ending of the story of Old Jack, one that's more open-ended such that he may have survived his execution in some spectral form. And she corrects the date he was killed. It was actually an even 300 years ago.
5. The candles or bonfire or whatever in the room flare/s spookily when she finishes her story.
6. "What was that?" Nick, Andy, or Amy ask.
7. "Just a funny breeze," Cathy says sadly/mysteriously.
8. Insert sex scenes.
9. One by one, Cathy leads each of the others off for sex and, subsequently, to be claimed by Old Jack.
10. We learn at the end that Cathy's family is obligated, every 100 years to refuel Old Jack's lantern so that he may lead the way to hell for each of his descendants when they die because what he did was so wicked that their family is damned for all eternity. He needs one soul for every century since he passed away. It's 300 years now, so Cathy's three friends give him what he needs.

Pick and choose from the feedback and ideas at your leisure. And good luck.

-PacoFear

 

[jacks4u]

Auden,

I just read your excerpt and questions, and tend to agree with Paco, as to it's weaknesses. I wouldn't go so far as to say "Don't write in English", but rather "when you get far enough along, to consider posting, please find a good editor, .lit has many volunteer editors, surely one would help you with phrasing, etc...

As for plot, I have no real suggestions there. I will mention that there are several ways to write, plot-wise: 1) rigidly plot out your story, including characters, their personalities and flaws, then write to your stated goal. 2) create a set of characters with a loose goal, plot, or premise, and gently nudge your characters in that direction. 3) create a set of characters, complete with personality, and turn them loose, where each character acts according to his/her personality and circumstances. I did this with my last story - created 3 characters that wanted to fuck, set them in a certain setting, and watched them go to it. This type of story isn't always as strong as #1, but can offer surprises - "I wanted my character to get naked and have sex, but instead she pulled a gun!" One author told me.

I'll sleep on it some, and maybe re-read your excerpt, perhaps comment further when I have more time.

Oh, and I did like the descriptive nature of your writing, and had no problem at all picturing the setting.


Jacks

 

[Acal]

Your story has real promise, you just need to get yourself a competant editor to go over it with you and help you with your grammar and spelling.

Plot-wise I think it has quite a bit of room to grow, and since you have marked it Erotic Horror I think that would be it more creative and original then other stories.

I did get the feel of the supernatural undertones and i'm looking forward to seeing where you go with them. It may do with you going over your sexual and body descriptions three or four times. It really helps to shape your writing properly. I had a piece that I worked over three times and it had improved quite a bit from the first draft to the final print.

 

[Penelope Street]

Hi Auden,

Thanks for sharing your work with us.

English isn't my mother tongue.
I wouldn't have guessed. Native English speakers are far from perfect and spell checkers are notorious for selecting similar sounding, but incorrect, words if one isn't careful with them.

I noticed that the narration style was unusual, but I thought this was due to a deliberate attempt to make it eerie. If you're going to write in a second language, horror is a good genre since an unusual narration style can actually be a strength.

Is the pacing adequate or is it too long?
I found the tale overwritten to the point of being cloying, which definitely slowed the pace a bit. Since this isn't your native tongue, might you have been trying a bit too hard to get your points across out of concern for not making them?

Are the characters and their actions anywhere near 'believable'? What about the streams of Cathy's consciousness and their realization?
Well, they're teenagers, right? And teens do all manner of goofy things, especially alone at night in a little group- so you have more than a pinch of leeway there!

What about originality or creativity of the story?
It's definitely an unusual read.

The statement, 'A nameless evil pervades each and everyone' is nonsensical. In common usage, the verb 'pervades' applies to inanimate objects like rooms or ideas. It does not apply to people. Better to say simply that 'A nameless evil pervades' or that 'A nameless evil has infected the city.' But even stated more naturally, the sentence has little value contextually to me either way or, worse still, points to a misunderstanding of the culture. Is Halloween really all that evil? Not really.

Even if 'infected' might be more precise, I really didn't have an issue with the use of 'pervades'- but I totally agree with Paco on the larger issue of whether the sentence adds to the tale. I don't see contemporary rituals, like costumes and trick-or-treating, to be 'evil', so I assumed this sentence referred to something else- as if Cathy knows the aforementioned rituals are merely symptoms of a hidden affliction that will make itself apparent later in the tale. So is this line about something the heroine knows that most of us don't, or does it relate to the ordinary?

I wouldn't go so far as to say "Don't write in English", but rather "when you get far enough along, to consider posting, please find a good editor, .lit has many volunteer editors, surely one would help you with phrasing, etc...

Even better might be if you could form a complementary partnership with a natural English-speaking author who needs help with a story written in German?

I did get the feel of the supernatural undertones...

Yes, so did I. They might even have been overtones .

But my actual concern is about—quiet awkward for me to state it here—how to continue the plot or story itself, i.e. where to take it.

Since it's your story, why not just take it where you want to take it? It's an erotic horror story with high schoolers, so there's really no place it can't go.

I do hope our comments haven't been too much of a downer for your confidence. I really didn't guess English was not your first language. If it's not a language you speak with any regularity, then this is a truly impressive effort.

Take Care,
Penny