Story Discussion: August 15, 2007 "Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot!" by jomar

[jomar]

Hi Everyone,

Chase Cooder was written as a cliffhanger. It's a seven chapter story, though three are under one Lit page and four are a little over one page. I got some good feedback on chapter one in the Story Feedback forum before submitting it here, so feel free to skip that one if you want. If time won't permit you to read and comment on all the chapters, which I can certainly understand, feel free to pick one or two.

 

[jomar]

Links

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 01 Disaster averted!

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 02 Welcome home, flyboy.

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 03 Magnifique mystere!

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 04 Shootout! Special Features-deleted scene.

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 05 Blackmailed!

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 06 Held captive!

Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot! Ch. 07 Finally!

 

[jomar]

Questions

My goal for Lit was to have a fun read with sex in every chapter, but you know characters - I had to "force" it a bit in a couple of chapters and simply used a gimmick in chapter 4 to get the sex in. Since it's Lit I also had some fun with the names. So I figure I'd change those things. I called Anna Maureen by mistake in chapter 6.

My larger goal is to expand this to novel length and see if I can get it published. So I'd like to know what works and doesn't work (and why), is it coherent, does if flow well, drama and impact, etc. I have ideas on where it can be expanded, but am interested in hearing your thoughts. Whatever you wish to comment on is fine with me.

Thanks in advance for taking the time on this.

 

[starrkers]

I've only read Ch1 so far. But something is bugging me greatly. The plane stalls in midflight for no apparent reason. It drops altitude alarmingly. Yet the pilot has time to admire the sensuality of a female passenger, who seems quite unperturbed by the lack of engine power.
After landing, the pilot makes no attempt to find out why the plane ceased functioning as it should. Never mentions the problem to anyone. The passengers never mention it.
He waits till the next day, when he's planning to leave, to check it out.

Sorry, I don't buy it.

 

[jomar]

I've only read Ch1 so far. But something is bugging me greatly. The plane stalls in midflight for no apparent reason. It drops altitude alarmingly. Yet the pilot has time to admire the sensuality of a female passenger, who seems quite unperturbed by the lack of engine power.
After landing, the pilot makes no attempt to find out why the plane ceased functioning as it should. Never mentions the problem to anyone. The passengers never mention it.
He waits till the next day, when he's planning to leave, to check it out.

Sorry, I don't buy it.

Good points. I need to work on that. Chase is uber capable so can take time to admire, and she's a bit of a thrill seeker, but I need to work on it to make it more believable, especially Dill's reaction once he calms down on land. He'd be bitching about it and maybe trying get his money back.

Thanks starrkers, hope you have time for other chapters

 

[Varian P]

Hi Jomar,

Since I commented previously on chapter one, I'm diving in, now, with chapter two. First, I'll just comment on the little line-by-line stuff as I read, and I'll give you my overarching impressions at the end.

Chase felt the floats break free from the grip of Snapper Lake and the ride smoothed out as the Beaver climbed through the crisp Canadian air.

The opening line is beautiful, right up to those last four words. This is massively nitpicky, but the “crisp air” sounds like the observation of a skier, or someone out for a stroll. Since this is Chase's POV, it seems like it should be a pilot's observation: is he flying into a buoying headwind? Is it so still it's hard to take off? Is it smooth or turbulent?

Music piped through the high quality, custom headset. The iPod was set on shuffle play and the songs and artists brought back memories, many of them about the women in his life...

You're giving me a lot of details I just don't care about; I don't think you're adding anything to the story or Chase's character when you tell us the headset is “high quality” and “custom,” or that the iPod is set on shuffle play.

On the other hand, the specific songs are fun little details about Chase, as is the way in which particular pieces of music evoke memories of particular women who've been in his life (or at least his bed). Aside from any song-recognition, this passage strikes a chord, because I think that's a common, true way that people relate to “their” music and their memories.

Once we're to the second paragraph of that, though, IMO, the accounting of women and their related songs has gone on for a bit too long. I think you can give us the sense of him as a ladies man with a history without giving us quite such a laundry list.

When you get to the Seals and Croft bit, I'm with you again, and I think it's because there, you're not just rattling off a list, but letting us tap into the character's feelings, and you do it beautifully.

I got a little lost in the transition from the white-hot anger to college to dinner in the intimate bistro. Did he enter college at age thirty-three? Or is it years after college he runs into Ruane? I think that passage just needs to be made a tad more clear.

This is a bit unclear, as well:

She reached across the table and squeezed his hand.

Chase felt a lump in his throat and took a sip of beer to give him time to recover. "Thanks," he softly replied and squeezed her back.

That last phrase--”squeezed her back” is a little murky.

Nitpicky again:

Chase shut down the aircraft, grabbed his flight bag and deplaned. He kicked a chock against the front and back of a wheel for safety and as he turned Ruane was leaping toward him.

Do you really need to say “for safety”? Over-explaining just waters down your prose.

You've got some redundant phrasing (x3) here:

Bob James's "Restless" CD was playing and Ruane swayed from side to side in graceful rhythm to the music. Her body moved sensuously in rhythm to the music. She raised her arms, her breasts pressed against her overalls. Chase adored that beautiful pear shape.

She swayed sensuously to the music and took off her cap.

Even after that, you say “swayed” and “sensuous” a number of times in short succession. Then we get this:

Looking Chase in the eye, Ruane lowered her head to him, mouthing his cock. She nibbled and nipped at him through his pants.

Ruane unbuckled his belt and slowly pulled down his zipper. Looking Chase in the eye, she removed his pants and freed him.

At this point, it feels as though you wrote the sex scene in a hurry and never looked back.

He pulled her forward and probed her back hole with his tongue, knowing she'd be clean.

I don't know...and I wasn't thinking anything icky until you give us “knowing she'd be clean.” When I read that, suddenly I'm getting gross images in my head.

He kissed, tongued, chewed, and rubbed her lips and worked her clit until he heard a familiar cry.

You're clearly going for graphic in this scene. When she orgasms, I think it would be more exciting to get to “feel” more of her climax than the sounds she makes. How does it feel against his mouth? Do her thighs flex? Quiver?

This is a strong line—it has good rhythm and gives us a solid image to connect with:

Chase held her, kissed her, rocked into her as she rubbed against him.

Overall, the sex scene just doesn't have the flow, the strong sensory imagery that the rest of the chapter has.

As for the chapter as a whole...it felt kind of disjointed. It's hard to seamlessly weave multiple flashbacks in, and I think that's largely where the trouble is. The mourning of the dead girlfriend, the dinner with Ruane jarred, and felt a little jerked out of and shoved back into the main storyline.

I wonder if it would flow better if you worked those two memories in, in connection with the iPod songs, like the other women. I mean, you kind of do, but if I understand, the Seals and Crofts song relates to the girl who died, but you use it as a segue to his memory of getting involved with Ruane. And then, in the middle of the Ruane flashback, you're talking about the dead girl again. I don't feel the story developing, there, the character gradually coming to terms. It might work better if you let the Ruane history unfold, first, then reveal the deeper back-story.

Criticisms of structure aside, I enjoyed the substance of Chase's dark history and his driven and angsty response.

Your prose is a bit uneven—delightfully crafted in some places, with a lovely cadence and crisp imagery, and somewhat plodding and strangely repetitive in others. Which, I think, means that you have the skill to write well, but need to take your time with every sentence, every paragraph, to make sure you've got it right (Pot? Kettle? What?).

The substance of the larger story seems promising; you've got characters with personality and depth of emotion, and as I recall from chapter one, lots of hints of intrigue in the works. And you left us with a tempting cliffhanger at the end of chapter two.

Hopefully that's helpful. I'll try to take a look at another chapter or two over the next few days.

-Varian

 

[dr_mabeuse]

I just read Chapter 1 now, and maybe I'll come back and read more later, but I'd like to give some impressions so far.

At first I thought we were dealing with a bit of retro parody, a kind of takeoff on the Men's Adventure Tales of the 50's that you used in see in magazines like Argosy and RealMan, Sgt. Preston of the Yukon and Biff Baker, Forest Ranger, and obviously, Chase Cooder is descended from this line of he-man adventurers. He is, in fact, a perfect example of the kind of genre fiction we've been talking about. He's got all the props—the plucky female business partner (we didn't get to see Ruane yet, but I have a strong feeling she's going to be a redhead and I'll bet you anything she's going to be plucky as hell), the lovable airplane with personality that he gets teased about but that never lets him down, the yutzy army-buddy sidekick who's true-blue loyal—it’s all there, and if someone somewhere doesn't call someone "a big lug" before all this is over, I'll be very surprised.

The writing too has that pipe-in-teeth seriousness associated with that genre, from the seat-of the-pants opening to the masculine fascination with machinery and cult of the Buddy (Box the sidekick, Dill the clock, Ruane, the kid-sister-symbol), the loving description of scenery and aircraft maneuvering and treatment of women as "dames". It’s all there, and it’s perfect. Overall I think the writing does a pretty good job of creating the macho MarkTrail-like world of Chase Cooder.

But this is either extremely dry parody or no parody at all, and as far as I can tell, it's the latter; perhaps a tribute to the genre. This is played straight and we're intended to take these characters seriously, or as seriously as we ever take characters in a porn story, and that brings up some problems for me—namely, that people just don't act this way in this day and age as far as I know These people are from the 40's. They wear Manolo Blahniks (does he make shoes for men? I thought he just made women's shoes) and have iPods, but they still tease each other about eating their vegetables and bring bottles and glasses with ice to each other's rooms in lingerie for bedtime seductions. I mean, it's all charming. It's just kind of unexpected.

It is, in fact, very much like some of the early proto-porn I grew up reading as a pre-teen Red-Blooded He-Man Adventure Stories where there was a lot of manhood thrusting and mound grabbing.

But, to each his own. Every writer's entitled to his or her universe. So lets look at this in its own terms and see how well it works in serving its purpose of telling Chase Cooder's tale.

Over all, I think the writing does a pretty good job of doing what it's supposed to do. I don’t have a really good feel for who all these people are (especially Maureen. Who is she and what;s she doing there?) I mean, we know who they are, and I realize it's only chapter one, but I'm already getting a troubling feeling of flatness. That's a problem in adventure stories, of course, we've not much interesting in what people are, but in what they're doing, so maybe I shouldn't complain, but I don’t think you're going to get any heat out of that sex scene unless you can generate some sort of character friction between Chase and Maureen. Derriere staring just isn't going to do it. These are people who don’t want anything, so I don’t know where the passion's going to come from. But they do have neat sex.

Let's look at the beginning. The beginning bothered me because it's an action beginning, and you broke some key rules in an action beginning. When you drop the reader into the middle of a crisis, the last thing you want to do is make him wait while you explain some background information about Chase's business arrangements. The plain is crashing and you're telling us about Chase's business partner. That's aggravating. I think then you switched to a flashback of what happened earlier in the garage that day. Don't do that either, You've got us in the cockpit and we're crashing, keep us there. There's plenty of time for Chase to think about Ruane and all that once he gets the engine started.

At the start of a story with an In-Crisis beginning, you're really got to prioritize your information delivery. Well, not really. You've got to be stingy with it. Dying is sexy. It would be a good time to show us Maureen's tits or something. You laugh, but it would. You'd be amazed at how beautiful a woman looks when you think you're going to die and how it sticks with you. She noticed how handsome he was.

There's also a part following where you go into a big POV switch into Maureen's head where she wants to touch him and run her fingers through his hair that is almost creepy. Very disorienting. Keep your hands to yourself, Maureen.

That's really all about I have to say. It’s a well-done piece of fiction for what it is. It’s done in a style that surprises me because it was popular about 50 years ago, yet iot doesn't seem t parodize that style of fiction. If there are any more specific questions I can answer I'd be happy to address them.

 

[DeeZire]

I liked the writing style. It reminded me of Raiders of the Lost Ark. Very sunny and bright.

The POV change from Chase to Maureen in the plane was jarring to me too, and I'm just an average reader, with no PHD to remind me of such things. It seemed like a movie where the camera zooms in on one person, and then the other actors walk off the set to take a break - or jump out of the plane, in that particular scene. (Perhaps if my memory wasn't turning to swiss cheese, the POV change wouldn't have been a problem.)

Loved the exclamation point in the title. That, to me, is an indication to the reader that it's going to be a fun read. Plus, I think it gives the writer room to play with language in a way you wouldn't see in a 'serious' piece of literature.

 

[jomar]

Varian P

Hi Jomar,

Since I commented previously on chapter one, I'm diving in, now, with chapter two. First, I'll just comment on the little line-by-line stuff as I read, and I'll give you my overarching impressions at the end.

Thanks, I appreciate it.

Chase felt the floats break free from the grip of Snapper Lake and the ride smoothed out as the Beaver climbed through the crisp Canadian air.

The opening line is beautiful, right up to those last four words. This is massively nitpicky, but the “crisp air” sounds like the observation of a skier, or someone out for a stroll. Since this is Chase's POV, it seems like it should be a pilot's observation: is he flying into a buoying headwind? Is it so still it's hard to take off? Is it smooth or turbulent?

Good point.

Music piped through the high quality, custom headset. The iPod was set on shuffle play and the songs and artists brought back memories, many of them about the women in his life...

You're giving me a lot of details I just don't care about; I don't think you're adding anything to the story or Chase's character when you tell us the headset is “high quality” and “custom,” or that the iPod is set on shuffle play.

On the other hand, the specific songs are fun little details about Chase, as is the way in which particular pieces of music evoke memories of particular women who've been in his life (or at least his bed). Aside from any song-recognition, this passage strikes a chord, because I think that's a common, true way that people relate to “their” music and their memories.

Once we're to the second paragraph of that, though, IMO, the accounting of women and their related songs has gone on for a bit too long. I think you can give us the sense of him as a ladies man with a history without giving us quite such a laundry list.

I wondered if it was overkill.

When you get to the Seals and Croft bit, I'm with you again, and I think it's because there, you're not just rattling off a list, but letting us tap into the character's feelings, and you do it beautifully.

Thanks.

I got a little lost in the transition from the white-hot anger to college to dinner in the intimate bistro. Did he enter college at age thirty-three? Or is it years after college he runs into Ruane? I think that passage just needs to be made a tad more clear.

He runs into her years after college. I'll clear it up.

This is a bit unclear, as well:

She reached across the table and squeezed his hand.

Chase felt a lump in his throat and took a sip of beer to give him time to recover. "Thanks," he softly replied and squeezed her back.

That last phrase--”squeezed her back” is a little murky.

No, I think I see what you mean - as opposed to squeezing her chest.

Chase shut down the aircraft, grabbed his flight bag and deplaned. He kicked a chock against the front and back of a wheel for safety and as he turned Ruane was leaping toward him.

Do you really need to say “for safety”? Over-explaining just waters down your prose.

I probably don't. People would likely know what they're for.

You've got some redundant phrasing (x3) here:

...you say “swayed” and “sensuous” a number of times in short succession. Then we get this:

Looking Chase in the eye, Ruane lowered her head to him, mouthing his cock. She nibbled and nipped at him through his pants.

Ruane unbuckled his belt and slowly pulled down his zipper. Looking Chase in the eye, she removed his pants and freed him.

At this point, it feels as though you wrote the sex scene in a hurry and never looked back.

I might have. I think you're saying I didn't keep up with the slow, seductive sensuality I started out with.

He pulled her forward and probed her back hole with his tongue, knowing she'd be clean.

I don't know...and I wasn't thinking anything icky until you give us “knowing she'd be clean.” When I read that, suddenly I'm getting gross images in my head.

Oops. Didn't mean to insert images. The only reason I put that in is because on some thread I read that the anal loving readers want to know for sure people are squeaky clean.

He kissed, tongued, chewed, and rubbed her lips and worked her clit until he heard a familiar cry.

You're clearly going for graphic in this scene. When she orgasms, I think it would be more exciting to get to “feel” more of her climax than the sounds she makes. How does it feel against his mouth? Do her thighs flex? Quiver?

I like that idea. Though I'll probably tone down the sex unless I try to publish in erotica.

As for the chapter as a whole...it felt kind of disjointed. It's hard to seamlessly weave multiple flashbacks in, and I think that's largely where the trouble is. The mourning of the dead girlfriend, the dinner with Ruane jarred, and felt a little jerked out of and shoved back into the main storyline.

I wonder if it would flow better if you worked those two memories in, in connection with the iPod songs, like the other women. I mean, you kind of do, but if I understand, the Seals and Crofts song relates to the girl who died, but you use it as a segue to his memory of getting involved with Ruane. And then, in the middle of the Ruane flashback, you're talking about the dead girl again. I don't feel the story developing, there, the character gradually coming to terms. It might work better if you let the Ruane history unfold, first, then reveal the deeper back-story.

I'll look hard at that.

Criticisms of structure aside, I enjoyed the substance of Chase's dark history and his driven and angsty response.

Your prose is a bit uneven—delightfully crafted in some places, with a lovely cadence and crisp imagery, and somewhat plodding and strangely repetitive in others. Which, I think, means that you have the skill to write well, but need to take your time with every sentence, every paragraph, to make sure you've got it right (Pot? Kettle? What?).

Thanks. I'm new at creative writing and figuring it out as i go along, so I'm not surprised at the uneven parts. It would be helpful if you pointed out other examples of both if you get the time.

Hopefully that's helpful. I'll try to take a look at another chapter or two over the next few days.

Extremely. Thanks Varian!

 

[jomar]

dr mabeuse

I just read Chapter 1 now, and maybe I'll come back and read more later, but I'd like to give some impressions so far.

Thank you.

At first I thought we were dealing with a bit of retro parody, a kind of takeoff on the Men's Adventure Tales of the 50's that you used in see in magazines like Argosy and RealMan, Sgt. Preston of the Yukon and Biff Baker, Forest Ranger, and obviously, Chase Cooder is descended from this line of he-man adventurers. He is, in fact, a perfect example of the kind of genre fiction we've been talking about. He's got all the props—the plucky female business partner (we didn't get to see Ruane yet, but I have a strong feeling she's going to be a redhead and I'll bet you anything she's going to be plucky as hell), the lovable airplane with personality that he gets teased about but that never lets him down, the yutzy army-buddy sidekick who's true-blue loyal—it’s all there, and if someone somewhere doesn't call someone "a big lug" before all this is over, I'll be very surprised.

Ruane is absolutely a plucky redhead! I didn't use "big lug" yet, but now...

The writing too has that pipe-in-teeth seriousness associated with that genre, from the seat-of the-pants opening to the masculine fascination with machinery and cult of the Buddy (Box the sidekick, Dill the clock, Ruane, the kid-sister-symbol), the loving description of scenery and aircraft maneuvering and treatment of women as "dames". It’s all there, and it’s perfect. Overall I think the writing does a pretty good job of creating the macho MarkTrail-like world of Chase Cooder.

But this is either extremely dry parody or no parody at all, and as far as I can tell, it's the latter; perhaps a tribute to the genre. This is played straight and we're intended to take these characters seriously, or as seriously as we ever take characters in a porn story, and that brings up some problems for me—namely, that people just don't act this way in this day and age as far as I know These people are from the 40's. They wear Manolo Blahniks (does he make shoes for men? I thought he just made women's shoes) and have iPods, but they still tease each other about eating their vegetables and bring bottles and glasses with ice to each other's rooms in lingerie for bedtime seductions. I mean, it's all charming. It's just kind of unexpected.

Actually, you're on the mark. Chase Cooder was inspired by Clive Cussler's Dirk Pitt, who is certainly a descendant of the stories and characters you referenced. Cussler's characters are larger than life, and have a lot of old world gallantry and charm. (I didn't check beforehand and just did - turns out that Manolo Blahnik started out designing shoes for men before turning to womens shoes because he could be more creative.)

Over all, I think the writing does a pretty good job of doing what it's supposed to do. I don’t have a really good feel for who all these people are (especially Maureen. Who is she and what;s she doing there?) I mean, we know who they are, and I realize it's only chapter one, but I'm already getting a troubling feeling of flatness. That's a problem in adventure stories, of course, we've not much interesting in what people are, but in what they're doing, so maybe I shouldn't complain, but I don’t think you're going to get any heat out of that sex scene unless you can generate some sort of character friction between Chase and Maureen. Derriere staring just isn't going to do it. These are people who don’t want anything, so I don’t know where the passion's going to come from. But they do have neat sex.

No, they don't want anything from each other, just attracted to each other. I need to do a better job of setting it up.

Let's look at the beginning. The beginning bothered me because it's an action beginning, and you broke some key rules in an action beginning. When you drop the reader into the middle of a crisis, the last thing you want to do is make him wait while you explain some background information about Chase's business arrangements. The plain is crashing and you're telling us about Chase's business partner. That's aggravating. I think then you switched to a flashback of what happened earlier in the garage that day. Don't do that either, You've got us in the cockpit and we're crashing, keep us there. There's plenty of time for Chase to think about Ruane and all that once he gets the engine started.

At the start of a story with an In-Crisis beginning, you're really got to prioritize your information delivery. Well, not really. You've got to be stingy with it. Dying is sexy. It would be a good time to show us Maureen's tits or something. You laugh, but it would. You'd be amazed at how beautiful a woman looks when you think you're going to die and how it sticks with you. She noticed how handsome he was.

I did laugh at "...show us Maureen's tits or something." A couple of my rules for a really good bad movie is someone must die and tits must be bared within the first five minutes.

But you make some good points about staying with the crisis. I'll rework it. And then learn the rules!

There's also a part following where you go into a big POV switch into Maureen's head where she wants to touch him and run her fingers through his hair that is almost creepy. Very disorienting. Keep your hands to yourself, Maureen.

Hmm. I wonder if it struck others that way. I'm certainly open to changing it.

That's really all about I have to say. It’s a well-done piece of fiction for what it is. It’s done in a style that surprises me because it was popular about 50 years ago, yet iot doesn't seem t parodize that style of fiction. If there are any more specific questions I can answer I'd be happy to address them.

Thank you very much Dr. M. I'm glad it didn't hit parody. I was trying for the icons, but wanted to play it straight. I hope you get some time to check out some more. If you do, please comment on continuity of style, and whatever else, of course.

 

[jomar]

I liked the writing style. It reminded me of Raiders of the Lost Ark. Very sunny and bright.

Hi DeeZire, thanks for joining.

The POV change from Chase to Maureen in the plane was jarring to me too, and I'm just an average reader, with no PHD to remind me of such things. It seemed like a movie where the camera zooms in on one person, and then the other actors walk off the set to take a break - or jump out of the plane, in that particular scene. (Perhaps if my memory wasn't turning to swiss cheese, the POV change wouldn't have been a problem.)

This seems like something I'm going to have to rework.

Loved the exclamation point in the title. That, to me, is an indication to the reader that it's going to be a fun read. Plus, I think it gives the writer room to play with language in a way you wouldn't see in a 'serious' piece of literature.

I liked the exclamation point too! There is a lot of silliness with the names. Thanks very much for taking the time read and comment.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

One thing I should have emphasized is that you really do write this style well. I take it you're a flier. Am I also safe in assuming you''ve got like a 6' X 6' wall of these kinds of books at home? Maybe Ace Doubles or... Who was the other one> The publisher who did all the Edgar Rice Burroughs and Doc Savages? Pyramid?

Yeah, I'll be back, I'm stuck in the Italian renaissance for a few days now, but I'll be back.

 

[jomar]

One thing I should have emphasized is that you really do write this style well. I take it you're a flier. Am I also safe in assuming you''ve got like a 6' X 6' wall of these kinds of books at home? Maybe Ace Doubles or... Who was the other one> The publisher who did all the Edgar Rice Burroughs and Doc Savages? Pyramid?

Yeah, I'll be back, I'm stuck in the Italian renaissance for a few days now, but I'll be back.

Ha! Yes and no. I'm not a flier and was "winging" it with the restart. I've probably read about an in-flight restart along the way, but made up the scalloping higher on a headwind. And drkside caught a technical error - a turbine engine wouldn't restart that way so I'll have to switch it to a radial engine.

I do like mysteries and action/adventures, but don't have the ones you're referring to. I just finished a Nelson DeMille book and just picked up one of Lee Child's. I also pick up random ones at the library. Really, the only even remotely recent book of this type I've read has been Clive Cussler, so I'm not sure where all this is coming from. ETA: Now that I think about it there have been a couple, but not of the old school type. I can't think of the author's name, but he writes very fast paced, way over the top action, mostly with a military setting.

And Thank you for the compliment. Much appreciated coming from a writer of your caliber. I'll look forward to hearing more from you.

 

[drksideofthemoon]

I've only read chapter one, I'll get to the others here in a bit.

Other than the error with the PT-6 vs Radial engine, my only quibble is with Cooder's demeanor during the the flame out. I don't think he would be thinking about his partner/mechanic playing practical jokes with the aircraft. Nor, would he be admiring the physical attributes of his passenger. His priorities would be first to initiate a restart, and secondly look for a spot to set the aircraft down.

I did a bit of reading, and it seems the restart would be a fairly simple procedure. Since the turbine is still spinning, all he might need to do is engage the igniter. Once lit, a jet turbine doesn't need an ignition source, it's a bit like a Bic lighter in that, once lit, it will stay lit as long as there is fuel and oxygen.

I don't know if I mentioned this before or not, one doesn't feather the flaps, flaps are set. Propellers are feathered.

I agree with Starrkers, I think he would have shown a bit more concern for the aircraft upon landing, it's not something he would have left for the next day.

Pilot joke. The propeller is only there to keep the pilot cool, once it stops spinning, watch him sweat.

Overall, the first chapter was an enjoyable read, I'll let you know what I think of the following chapters in a bit.

 

[DeeZire]

my only quibble is with Cooder's demeanor during the the flame out.

Just to be contrary, would Superman be concerned? Since this style of fiction features the unflappable hero, I think it would be in character for him to be relying on machismo, rather than commom sense, to triumph over the impending peril.
But realistically speaking, any guy, hero or not, would have a brown stain on his pants after going through an expereince like that. But that's probably not the type of thing you'd want to open a story with. Too much detail.

 

[jomar]

I've only read chapter one, I'll get to the others here in a bit.

Thanks.

Other than the error with the PT-6 vs Radial engine, my only quibble is with Cooder's demeanor during the the flame out. I don't think he would be thinking about his partner/mechanic playing practical jokes with the aircraft. Nor, would he be admiring the physical attributes of his passenger. His priorities would be first to initiate a restart, and secondly look for a spot to set the aircraft down.

But he's Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot!

His thoughts on Ruane were supposed to flash in and out in a split second. And the idea was to show his cool competence and unflappability - he could multi-task while still saving the day. But it looks like I'll be changing it.

I did a bit of reading, and it seems the restart would be a fairly simple procedure. Since the turbine is still spinning, all he might need to do is engage the igniter. Once lit, a jet turbine doesn't need an ignition source, it's a bit like a Bic lighter in that, once lit, it will stay lit as long as there is fuel and oxygen.

Actually, I like the looks of the radial engine better so will probably adjust.

I don't know if I mentioned this before or not, one doesn't feather the flaps, flaps are set. Propellers are feathered.

I agree with Starrkers, I think he would have shown a bit more concern for the aircraft upon landing, it's not something he would have left for the next day.

You did, thanks. I remembered it when I reread today. Yeah, I'm not sure why I let them get all settled in the lodge without Chase checking out the plane.

Pilot joke. The propeller is only there to keep the pilot cool, once it stops spinning, watch him sweat.

Overall, the first chapter was an enjoyable read, I'll let you know what I think of the following chapters in a bit.

Ha! Thanks. I'll look forward to your comments.

 

[Penelope Street]

Hi Jomar,

I only had time to read the first chapter and I might not find time to read any more for several days.

I enjoyed the opening, except the places where the action pauses to tell me little things I didn't need to know at that moment. For an example of how ineffective this manner of conveying information can be, at least when I'm the reader, I later encountered Ruane's name and thought, Ruane? Who's Ruane?, and had to look back to find out.

The POV shift to Maureen may not have been the best choice. If this is her chapter, why not just start with her perspective? Is there a reason the backstory isn't in past perfect?

And then she's thinking of running her fingers through his hair while the engine is out?! Ok, so my panties might be wet then too, but that's not why! This is one case where just being told that she appeared unconcerned wasn't enough. I think it might have helped if she'd had a little something sassy to say when Parker asked what was wrong. Or maybe start the story with her thinking about running her fingers through his hair and then the engine turns off?

Suppressing a laugh, she thought back to Chase's quick reactions, athletic agility, and graciousness as he helped the sputtering Parker off the plane. By the time I got to this section, my interest had waned. Being told how each appreciatively eyed the other was getting a little old. The suspense regarding the flight was over and I was ready for the story to move along.

She briefly locked stares with the pale-eyed, hawk-nosed man, the one with an air of authority, but he made her uneasy and she turned away. Oh- that's a nice little moment at the start of a novel!

The first erotic scene didn't interest me and I skimmed ahead to the next morning. Why does Chase wait until then to inspect the plane's engine? Was it too dark before?

He squinted slightly and looked at her with malevolence. I'd really like to see this look instead of just being told it's malevolent. Otherwise, I think it's a good way to end the chapter.

Take Care,
Penny

 

[Penelope Street]

This is massively nitpicky, but the “crisp air” sounds like the observation of a skier, or someone out for a stroll. Since this is Chase's POV, it seems like it should be a pilot's observation: is he flying into a buoying headwind?

Wow. That is massively nitpicky, but massively right too!

Dying is sexy. It would be a good time to show us Maureen's tits or something. You laugh, but it would. You'd be amazed at how beautiful woman looks when you think you're going to die and how it sticks with you. She noticed how handsome he was.

I didn't laugh, but I am surprised. Maybe I need to almost die to understand this?

Since this style of fiction features the unflappable hero, I think it would be in character for him to be relying on machismo, rather than common sense, to triumph over the impending peril.

I didn't have any real problem with Chase remaining calm while during the crisis.

And the idea was to show his cool competence and unflappability - he could multi-task...

Puleeeease! There are many things about which I am willing to suspend my disbelief, but not about a man being able to multi-task.

 

[rachlou]

Puleeeease! There are many things about which I am willing to suspend my disbelief, but not about a man being able to multi-task.

Haha! I'm so with you on that one...

Jomar, I read through Ch 1 in a rush yesterday, but will re-read it later and pass comment.

 

[starrkers]

I didn't have any real problem with Chase remaining calm while during the crisis.

My problem wasn't that he remained calm, but that he seemed almost cocky about it. He doesn't come across as the fly-by-the-seat-of-his-pants, one-wing-perpetually-on-fire type operator. I get the feeling he cares about his plane more than that.

Puleeeease! There are many things about which I am willing to suspend my disbelief, but not about a man being able to multi-task.

Hear Hear LOL!

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Chapter 2: Takeoff!

Chapter 2:

Yes! All right! A double or treble quantum level improvement over Chapter 1. In fact, you should honestly go remove Chapter 1 from the reading list right now, because the skill, control, and nuance shown in Chapter 2 are as different from Chapter 1 as to make Chapter 1 appear anamolous. As different as a takeoff is from cruising at 27,000 feet. There's no comparison. Chapter 1 read like a parody of an action hero. Vhapter 2 reads like a story. Go take down Chapter 1. It'll discourage too many people and they'll never read the rest. I mean, not that Chapter 1's bad at all, but it's certainly not representative.

This chapter certainly has its issues. Nothing happens, for example. But it "not happens" gracefully and with skill and style that it still manages to be entertaining, and that''s not easy to do, and one suspects by now that's going to be the pattern in Chase Cooder's life—he flies and fucks and looks at scenery. He's headed possibly for some great adventure, but for now we're still filling backstory, and what's even better from my own point of view, we're fleshing out characters, which I really didn't think was going to happen. Fully dimensional characters are not native to the adventure genre, and if Chase still has a bit too much of the superman all-American hero about him for my liking, at least he... Well, I'm sure he'll have some fault somewhere, Oh yeah, he likes girls. And music by sissy bands.

But really, what we have here is mainly a nice, smoothly-done flashback (rocky transition though) a big chunk of skillfully rendered dialog of two people believably unfolding to each other (never easy to do) and forming a partnership, and then a sex scene tacked on at the end.

The centerpiece, for me, is the restaurant dialog.

First, I have to cavil with the background music. Personally, I don't care for the use of named background music in a story unless it's something everyone knows. I used to do the same thing with music in my stories because it's such an easy way of establishing mood in a scene. You're basically supplying background music to your story. If I put on the MJQ's "Django", I know exactly how the room feels. But if we're in a story at a tense situation and I tell you that someone put on the MJQ's "Django", what does that make you feel? Unless you happen to know the piece and have exactly the same associations with it that I do, it probably makes you feel nothing, or excluded, or like I'm a name dropper, or like I should shut up and tell you what's going on. Which was my reaction to Chase's little iPod symphonette: why don't you just whack off already and then fly the damned plane before you get to the BeeGees?

And then of course, there was more music in the restaurant.. By now I'm really noticing the author's hand sliding into frame and changing CD's.

I was confused during the transition to the flashback. As I understand it, he hears his High School graduation song, remembers this searing pain he had, then remembers getting off a plane in Seattle after traveling the world after being a prosecuting attorney, meets Ruane, and then goes to college? SOmething needs clarification.

And now this caught my eyes as very interesting. This little minor phrase is how we get invaded and strangled by clichés. Watch:

Chase and Ruane entered college the same year and were acquaintances, but hadn't really spent any time together. Like two people with nothing better to do for the time being, they had a long dinner in an intimate bistro. Playing softly in the background as they ate and talked, audible over the clinking dishes, the hum of nearby conversation and occasional shouts from the kitchen, was Aimee…

This is what I mean:

Like two people with nothing better to do for the time being, they had a long dinner in an intimate bistro.

How many people with nothing better to do have long dinners in intimate bistros? I know, this seems like a terribly minor point but really it's not. Because "Like two people with nothing better to do" is a cliché that shows we didn't stop to think why they really had dinner together in that intimate bistro rather than in Red Lobster or Denny's, and yet there had to be some reason and that reason would probably tell us a whole paragraph's worth of information about just what kind of man Chase Cooder is and what he wants from Ruane, why he's really taking her out to dinner.

I suspect the real reason Chase Cooder takes Ruane out to dinner at that intimate bistro is because he knows they have excellent gazpacho or make a fantastic Martini or they play that music you mentioned they play or he figures it's the kind of place she'd like or maybe they have some insane flaming Albanian cheese dish that's a scream to watch them serve. But there's some reason and it has to do with who he is and what he thinks of Ruane and if I were Ruane's friend and she told me Chase Cooder took her out to dinner last night at this intimate bistro the first thing I;d want to know is why there?

So just telling us, "Chase took her to an bistro he thought she'd like because it was so dark and intimate" or "Chase took her to a bistro he wanted to share with her" or "Chase took her to a place where they could talk"-- each tells us something else about Chase Cooder, who he is and what he wants and his feelings towards Ruane at this point, and it tells it to us totally free of charge, in place of a cliché. It's an opportunity we shouldn't let slip away.

This is how richness is built into stories and depth into character. *L* It's like being in love, where the whole world of the story is a reflection of the characters being in it.

And lose the lump in the throat! God! I don’t know what people do when they choke up anymore. Let me think… For me, I think I feel a pressure in my eyes. What do you feel? Is it really a lump in your throat? I just don't trust those damned clichés.

You've got another cliche—an emotional one—when he breaks down and cries out his girlfriend's death and then he feels better. All cured.. I don't know. I know I've heard women say they've done things like that, but I never have. Usually you cry and you cry and you still feel awful. I've had tragedies and losses in mny life and that's never happened to me or anyone I know. That's a TV emotion.

But enough of that.

What you've done in their conversation way overshadows all this piddly stuff though. What really impresses me is the way you're not afraid to show their badinage—the way they play with other as they talk (the "feeble attempt" theme is played beautifully)—and let it stand for itself without explaining it to the reader. A couple of times you do. You tell us that she's intentionally using goofy grammar when we can figure it out ourselves, but for the most part you treat your readers like grown-ups and trust us to know when they're playing and when they're not, and that is terribly appealing. It makes us trust you as a story teller and respect you for respecting us, and trusting his readers' intelligence is a difficult thing for an author to do. Honestly. It is, (and especially on Lit). It's a sign of a mature and confidant author. It's impressive.

But then—I have to kvetch again—just when things were going so swimmingly, you hit us with this paragraph

Chase was charmed by Ruane's passion for her dream, and by her beauty. Ruane was a bit taller than average. She had an athletic build and womanly curves. She moved gracefully and was charmingly unaware of how stunning she truly was. Her sharp wit and ready laugh drew him in. Chase imagined she'd be as comfortable in a sophisticated formal dress at the opera as she would be trading coarse insults with the guys.

A totally telly physical description.

I'm going to guess you added this after the piece was done and you suddenly realized you hadn't described her so you slipped this in. It's so out of place.

We know about her wit and her laugh from what we've just witnessed at dinner . The body's a bit more difficult to describe without doing an ogle scene or the old going-to-the-ladies' look-over bit "He watched her as she got up to go to the washroom…) (so tawdry!)

Since this paragraph comes at the transition from flashback to reality and is the culmination of their plans for their business, I had a funny inspiration for a segue scene: the two of them naked in bed in their first building on a lake in the Canadian woods with the sounds of the loons in the background, wordless. A little Zen still life. Her sitting up, bare breasted: the full moon, their first plane tethered in the lake, the pines against the water: tranquility.

Like: it's all come to this—a man, a woman, an airplane, the moon

It’s a good story, Jomar.

 

[rachlou]

Chapter 1.

I agree with most of what's been said already, so I won't repeat it.

One thing I will mention though -

Parker, oblivious to Maureen and Chase, was 15 pounds beyond graceful and clumsily lurched out of the plane. His leather-soled shoe slipped on the wet float and he squawked while scrambling to maintain his balance. His arms waved wildly, hoping to snare a strut, as his right foot plunged into the frigid water.

Chase gracefully reached down and caught Parker's sleeve, preventing him from toppling into the lake, and effortlessly helped him step up to the dock.

I do like that line, fifteen pounds beyond graceful but I would use the word 'fifteen' rather than 15.

You used the word graceful in rather close succesion. I think you could lose the second one, or change it to something like helpfully?

Chapter 2

The dialogue between Chase and Ruane was definitely the best bit of the chapter. It worked beautifully and added depth to the characters. I was slightly jarred by the jump back to the present. It seemed to happen with no warning, but maybe that's just me rushing through the story whilst waiting for the paint to dry.

Chapter 3

Shortly into this chapter, I kept waiting for Arnie Schwarzeneger to appear with guns blazing!

She looked up at chase. She found Chase extremely attractive and was increasingly aroused in his presence.

I found it difficult to believe that after four of her comrades had been murdered by masked assailents of unknown origin, this woman had sex on the brain?! Quite frankly, i'd be calling the local law in by then. The other issue I have about this scene is the mention of dead bodies under tarpaulin. Surely the whole area would be a crime scene and nothing should have been moved? Maybe I'm missing the point here completely? Maybe I've been watching too many episodes of CSI...

I also felt the sex scene was too forced at the end. Again because it seemed unlikely that Zizi would be feeling terribly horny after the bloodshed - unless she was a total nympho.

But in terms of story development, I can see that you used the chapter to further the plot. I've no idea what the 'orb' is all about, but i'll read on to find out. I think we're heading into Indiana Jones territory... which I love!

I'll go and get some popcorn and read more later.

 

[jomar]

Penny

Hi Jomar,

I only had time to read the first chapter and I might not find time to read any more for several days.

Appreciate it. Look forward to hearing from you when you can. Hopefully, the fun's just starting.

I enjoyed the opening, except the places where the action pauses to tell me little things I didn't need to know at that moment. For an example of how ineffective this manner of conveying information can be, at least when I'm the reader, I later encountered Ruane's name and thought, Ruane? Who's Ruane?, and had to look back to find out.

The POV shift to Maureen may not have been the best choice. If this is her chapter, why not just start with her perspective? Is there a reason the backstory isn't in past perfect?

A consensus is building on this part. I need to keep the action in the present until it resolves and then on with other stuff.

And then she's thinking of running her fingers through his hair while the engine is out?! Ok, so my panties might be wet then too, but that's not why! This is one case where just being told that she appeared unconcerned wasn't enough. I think it might have helped if she'd had a little something sassy to say when Parker asked what was wrong. Or maybe start the story with her thinking about running her fingers through his hair and then the engine turns off?

I don't think I did enough with the passenger reactions. She could be a thrill seeker and Parker could be blubbering stuff at Chase. Does need work.

Suppressing a laugh, she thought back to Chase's quick reactions, athletic agility, and graciousness as he helped the sputtering Parker off the plane. By the time I got to this section, my interest had waned. Being told how each appreciatively eyed the other was getting a little old. The suspense regarding the flight was over and I was ready for the story to move along.

Point taken.

She briefly locked stares with the pale-eyed, hawk-nosed man, the one with an air of authority, but he made her uneasy and she turned away. Oh- that's a nice little moment at the start of a novel!

Good. Thanks.

Why does Chase wait until then to inspect the plane's engine? Was it too dark before?

No, he definitely needs to check it immediately.

He squinted slightly and looked at her with malevolence. I'd really like to see this look instead of just being told it's malevolent. Otherwise, I think it's a good way to end the chapter.

Gotcha. Thanks, Penny.

 

[jomar]

Puleeeease! There are many things about which I am willing to suspend my disbelief, but not about a man being able to multi-task.

But...He's Chase Cooder - Bush Pilot!

Although, studies have shown...

 

[jomar]

Doc

Chapter 2:

Yes! All right! A double or treble quantum level improvement over Chapter 1. In fact, you should honestly go remove Chapter 1 from the reading list right now, because the skill, control, and nuance shown in Chapter 2 are as different from Chapter 1 as to make Chapter 1 appear anamolous. As different as a takeoff is from cruising at 27,000 feet. There's no comparison. Chapter 1 read like a parody of an action hero. Vhapter 2 reads like a story. Go take down Chapter 1. It'll discourage too many people and they'll never read the rest. I mean, not that Chapter 1's bad at all, but it's certainly not representative.

Hopefully, I can raise the quality of chapter 1.

This chapter certainly has its issues. Nothing happens, for example. But it "not happens" gracefully and with skill and style that it still manages to be entertaining, and that''s not easy to do, and one suspects by now that's going to be the pattern in Chase Cooder's life—he flies and fucks and looks at scenery. He's headed possibly for some great adventure, but for now we're still filling backstory, and what's even better from my own point of view, we're fleshing out characters, which I really didn't think was going to happen. Fully dimensional characters are not native to the adventure genre, and if Chase still has a bit too much of the superman all-American hero about him for my liking, at least he... Well, I'm sure he'll have some fault somewhere, Oh yeah, he likes girls. And music by sissy bands.

Yeah, I'm not sure about his flaw. On the one hand the original idea was larger than life all-American hero type, like you said. But his losing Pam in high school and subsequent "running" may have given him some dark quality.

But really, what we have here is mainly a nice, smoothly-done flashback (rocky transition though) a big chunk of skillfully rendered dialog of two people believably unfolding to each other (never easy to do) and forming a partnership, and then a sex scene tacked on at the end.

I'll work on the transitions.

First, I have to cavil with the background music. Personally, I don't care for the use of named background music in a story unless it's something everyone knows. I used to do the same thing with music in my stories because it's such an easy way of establishing mood in a scene. You're basically supplying background music to your story. If I put on the MJQ's "Django", I know exactly how the room feels. But if we're in a story at a tense situation and I tell you that someone put on the MJQ's "Django", what does that make you feel? Unless you happen to know the piece and have exactly the same associations with it that I do, it probably makes you feel nothing, or excluded, or like I'm a name dropper, or like I should shut up and tell you what's going on. Which was my reaction to Chase's little iPod symphonette: why don't you just whack off already and then fly the damned plane before you get to the BeeGees?

And then of course, there was more music in the restaurant.. By now I'm really noticing the author's hand sliding into frame and changing CD's.

BeeGees! Never! Varian mentioned this too. I had a feeling it was too much.

I was confused during the transition to the flashback. As I understand it, he hears his High School graduation song, remembers this searing pain he had, then remembers getting off a plane in Seattle after traveling the world after being a prosecuting attorney, meets Ruane, and then goes to college? SOmething needs clarification.

Yes. Others stumbled here too. After his trip around the world he runs into Ruane in Seattle, about 10 years after they had attended college together. But the way I wrote it isn't clear.

And now this caught my eyes as very interesting. This little minor phrase is how we get invaded and strangled by clichés. Watch:

This is what I mean:

Like two people with nothing better to do for the time being, they had a long dinner in an intimate bistro.

How many people with nothing better to do have long dinners in intimate bistros? I know, this seems like a terribly minor point but really it's not.

...there's some reason and it has to do with who he is and what he thinks of Ruane and...

So just telling us, "Chase took her to an bistro he thought she'd like because it was so dark and intimate" or "Chase took her to a bistro he wanted to share with her" or "Chase took her to a place where they could talk"-- each tells us something else about Chase Cooder, who he is and what he wants and his feelings towards Ruane at this point, and it tells it to us totally free of charge, in place of a cliché. It's an opportunity we shouldn't let slip away.

Excellent point. Varian made a good suggestion about thinking more about the small details/motivations.

And lose the lump in the throat! God! I don’t know what people do when they choke up anymore. Let me think… For me, I think I feel a pressure in my eyes. What do you feel? Is it really a lump in your throat? I just don't trust those damned clichés.

You've got another cliche—an emotional one—when he breaks down and cries out his girlfriend's death and then he feels better. All cured.. I don't know. I know I've heard women say they've done things like that, but I never have. Usually you cry and you cry and you still feel awful. I've had tragedies and losses in mny life and that's never happened to me or anyone I know. That's a TV emotion.

Appreciate you pointing those out.

What you've done in their conversation way overshadows all this piddly stuff though. What really impresses me is the way you're not afraid to show their badinage—the way they play with other as they talk (the "feeble attempt" theme is played beautifully)—and let it stand for itself without explaining it to the reader. A couple of times you do. You tell us that she's intentionally using goofy grammar when we can figure it out ourselves, but for the most part you treat your readers like grown-ups and trust us to know when they're playing and when they're not, and that is terribly appealing. It makes us trust you as a story teller and respect you for respecting us, and trusting his readers' intelligence is a difficult thing for an author to do. Honestly. It is, (and especially on Lit). It's a sign of a mature and confidant author. It's impressive.

Thank you. I'll clean up the explaining.

But then—I have to kvetch again—just when things were going so swimmingly, you hit us with this paragraph

Chase was charmed by Ruane's passion for her dream, and by her beauty. Ruane was a bit taller than average. She had an athletic build and womanly curves. She moved gracefully and was charmingly unaware of how stunning she truly was. Her sharp wit and ready laugh drew him in. Chase imagined she'd be as comfortable in a sophisticated formal dress at the opera as she would be trading coarse insults with the guys.

A totally telly physical description.

I'm going to guess you added this after the piece was done and you suddenly realized you hadn't described her so you slipped this in. It's so out of place.

We know about her wit and her laugh from what we've just witnessed at dinner . The body's a bit more difficult to describe without doing an ogle scene or the old going-to-the-ladies' look-over bit "He watched her as she got up to go to the washroom…) (so tawdry!)

Not sure when I wrote that. Maybe thought it was keeping with the genre thing?

Since this paragraph comes at the transition from flashback to reality and is the culmination of their plans for their business, I had a funny inspiration for a segue scene: the two of them naked in bed in their first building on a lake in the Canadian woods with the sounds of the loons in the background, wordless. A little Zen still life. Her sitting up, bare breasted: the full moon, their first plane tethered in the lake, the pines against the water: tranquility.

Like: it's all come to this—a man, a woman, an airplane, the moon

I like that. The second to last scene in the story (chapter 7) has Chase and Ruane in bed. Maybe I'll figure a way to switch to nightime and put them in the room with a view.

It’s a good story, Jomar.

Glad you think so. Got to say, I hope time permits you to hang around. Thank you.