Stories site shut down by the FBI

[mack_the_knife]

Worrisome -

Story site shut down.

The admin folks at ASSTR think there may be more to it than the rose site admin is admitting to, but still alarming.

I've never been to that particular site, and know nothing of their policies or practices, but...

Edited to add -
I received this letter from ASSTR, who hosts copies of my stories, as well as Lit...

Dear Authors and other ASSTR account holders,

Many of you have written in regard to the recent news surrounding the
closure of the Red Rose Stories web site (http://www.red-rose-stories.com/)

While initally alarmed by this turn of events ourselves, given some time to
reflect on the situation and discuss it with other operators of large story
sites, there seems to be a consensus that there may be more to the story than
is posted in the Red Rose stories announcement.

In any case, the ASSTR administration firmly believes in our authors'
rights to create/pen erotic literature and our right to distribute it in
exercise of our First Amendment rights and the confirmation of those rights
as established over the years by the U.S. Supreme Court.

Currently the U.S. Supreme court uses the "Miller test" to determine if
material is legally "obscene" and therefore NOT subject to First Amendment
protection. Interesting and insightful information on this test is available
at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller_test

In short:

"The Miller test was developed in the 1973 case Miller v. California. It has
three parts:

* Whether the average person, applying contemporary community standards,
would find that the work, taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest,
* Whether the work depicts/describes, in a patently offensive way, sexual
conduct specifically defined by applicable state law,
* Whether the work, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic,
political, or scientific value.

The third condition is also known as the SLAPS test. The work is considered
obscene only if all three conditions are satisfied."

Of critical relevance is the final condition and the requirement that
*all* three conditions must be met for the material to be considered obscene.

We firmly believe that the literary work hosted at ASSTR meets the SLAPS
test and is therefore entitled to full Constitutional protection.

We are committed to defending this position in court, if necessary, as our
time and funding allow. The ACLU has shown a willingness to assist in the
defense of such cases, and we would not hesistate to contact them if the need
should arise.

- Rey del Sexo

 

[rgraham666]

Don't panic.

Remember when the Secret Service took down Steve Jackson Games because they 'encouraged and taught hackers'?

Did they end up looking stupid.

 

[mack_the_knife]

Don't panic.

Remember when the Secret Service took down Steve Jackson Games because they 'encouraged and taught hackers'?

Did they end up looking stupid.

True dat, Evil Stevie tore them up for almost a cool million. However, I really don't feel like having my computers seized for so long they become obsolete before I get them back (like they're not already). Just wanted folk to know the FBI is on the warpath...

Unless, again, something else was going on with that site or its computers or admin...

 

[rgraham666]

True dat, Evil Stevie tore them up for almost a cool million. However, I really don't feel like having my computers seized for so long they become obsolete before I get them back (like they're not already). Just wanted folk to know the FBI is on the warpath...

Unless, again, something else was going on with that site or its computers or admin...

We'll find out.

If there's a site shut down every day for the next month, then we should worry.

 

[Just-Legal]

The ONLY legal sex stories are those that involve a man and a woman, consenting
to MISSIONARY POSITION SEX, in a dark room.

You CAN NOT write beastiality, water sports, scat, b&d, s&m, slavery, threesomes, orgies,
or sex with children.

I'm sorry, but if s/he was posting about the last item on the list, then I can understand WHY s/he got shut down.

 

[Alex756]

I'm sorry, but if s/he was posting about the last item on the list, then I can understand WHY s/he got shut down.

Agreed. Who the heck would include that on a list unless it was something they did ... sex with kids is a far cry from m/f dark room missionary possition.

I would never put my work on a site that had that shit on it.

~Alex

 

[rgraham666]

Agreed. That's one of the reasons I'm not worried.

If there was pedophiliac material on the site, I won't bitch.

 

[amicus]

Just heard on the news tonight that the alleged perpetrator in the murder of a first year college girl in Virgina had photo's posted on D/A Deviant Art.com which is a site I use from time to time for 'straight' artwork, as do many of my artist friends.

amicus...

 

[Guest]

Just heard on the news tonight that the alleged perpetrator in the murder of a first year college girl in Virgina had photo's posted on D/A Deviant Art.com which is a site I use from time to time for 'straight' artwork, as do many of my artist friends.

amicus...

My niece posts her artwork on that site as well.

I was saddened to hear that it was indeed Taylor Behl's remains that were discovered. Horrible people live in this world.

 

[Guest]

oooooooO!!!!

it makes me so angry I want to post in.....
PINK!

 

[McKenna]

It is worrisome.

I can't wait for 2008.

Do you think a new administration will back off this kind of witch hunt?

 

[rgraham666]

It is worrisome.

I can't wait for 2008.

Do you think a new administration will back off this kind of witch hunt?

Depends. If the GOP wins, no. The Dems, maybe.

 

[Just-Legal]

It is worrisome.

I can't wait for 2008.

Do you think a new administration will back off this kind of witch hunt?

Its not just the administration - a mother who lost her daughter to a violent rapist has worked on getting anyone caught visiting sites with images of rape (real or simulated, photography or art) PUT IN PRISON.

What next? Rape stories are illegal? Yes, the real images are sick, but there's a fine line, and its being crossed, and not just by administrations...

 

[McKenna]

Depends. If the GOP wins, no. The Dems, maybe.

That's it. I'm moving to Canada.

 

[McKenna]

Its not just the administration - a mother who lost her daughter to a violent rapist has worked on getting anyone caught visiting sites with images of rape (real or simulated, photography or art) PUT IN PRISON.

What next? Rape stories are illegal? Yes, the real images are sick, but there's a fine line, and its being crossed, and not just by administrations...

It's the whole mentality that gets to me.

For instance, this guy got fired from his job for looking at porn. Granted, he shouldn't have been doing that at work, but in his words, "I couldn't do it at home because my wife is adamantly against pornography!"

WTF?!

That's just messed up. He lost his job because pornography wasn't "allowed" in his home.

I harbor the same feeling for "moral moms" who came out in droves to vote in the last election, fearing their way of life was being threatened. Damn straight it's being threatened! Let's try a little diversity and tolerance, folks.

I'm getting off topic, so I'll stop now.

I just resent someone trying to take away my right to choose what I view and/or read. I don't need someone to dictate morality to me. That's nucking futs.

 

[rgraham666]

That's it. I'm moving to Canada.

You're more than welcome Mckenna.

 

[Just-Legal]

You're more than welcome Mckenna.

Budge over, make room for me.

 

[Alex756]

I just resent someone trying to take away my right to choose what I view and/or read. I don't need someone to dictate morality to me. That's nucking futs.

The thing is the looking at child pornography and child abuse wank stories is linked strongly with people who are going to do that shit. Its a very fine line between art and fueling a depraved killer in waiting.

When it comes to child abuse and child pornography, the link is amazingly strong. Know what they pulled from that sick fuck;s residence? Yep. Child porn. Wht did he most likely do? Kill at least one kid. One of the other things they removed were 'bones'

In the case of child pornography... the case if not soo clear that restriction is the wrong thing to do for the society as a whole.

~Alex

 

[Boxlicker101]

The thing is the looking at child pornography and child abuse wank stories is linked strongly with people who are going to do that shit. Its a very fine line between art and fueling a depraved killer in waiting.

When it comes to child abuse and child pornography, the link is amazingly strong. Know what they pulled from that sick fuck;s residence? Yep. Child porn. Wht did he most likely do? Kill at least one kid. One of the other things they removed were 'bones'

In the case of child pornography... the case if not soo clear that restriction is the wrong thing to do for the society as a whole.

~Alex

Were these photographs or drawings or stories? Photos would mean that some abuse was happening somewhere, maybe in a foreign country. Drawings or a story wouldn't mean anything. A picture can be drawn of anything, legal or not, and a story can be written about it also. It wouldn't mean an actual crime had occurred.

 

[McKenna]

The thing is the looking at child pornography and child abuse wank stories is linked strongly with people who are going to do that shit. Its a very fine line between art and fueling a depraved killer in waiting.

When it comes to child abuse and child pornography, the link is amazingly strong. Know what they pulled from that sick fuck;s residence? Yep. Child porn. Wht did he most likely do? Kill at least one kid. One of the other things they removed were 'bones'

In the case of child pornography... the case if not soo clear that restriction is the wrong thing to do for the society as a whole.

~Alex

As sickening as this is, Alex, it doesn't change my opinion. I mean, where does it end? Who draws the line?

Who would you trust to make decisions for you about your life? I would trust very few, and certainly not a bureaucratic administration.

Even if child pornography were legal, I still wouldn't view/read about it. That's me making a moral decision. I'm fully capable, and I'd rather the right to make such a decision wasn't taken away.

The thing about laws and restrictions is that they very often end up punishing the law-abiding citizens while doing very little to curb the dangerous/deviant behaviour said laws were aimed at controlling.

And lest this argument be taken as anything in support of child pornography and the like, it is not; it's an argument based on principle: Someone else dictating to me what is "right" and "wrong" to view or read. Plenty of people would like to see sites like Literotica shut down because sites like this also (supposedly) support and perpetuate deviant behavior -or at least what some term "deviant behaviour.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

It is worrisome.

I can't wait for 2008.

Do you think a new administration will back off this kind of witch hunt?

A new administration is probably not going to slow down. Unless the Dems find a way to win, which I don't see as very hopeful.

The real fear though isn't abou tthe administration pushing, it's about changes on the high court that may render the arguments moot. I would say the odds are less than 50/50 the current court would bar the fed going after pornography.

Another 4 to 8 years of GOP control and it is very likely practically all of our freedoms will be subject to review by a court with a political ideology that would make anything fun, questionably legal.

 

[McKenna]

Another 4 to 8 years of GOP control and it is very likely practically all of our freedoms will be subject to review by a court with a political ideology that would make anything fun, questionably legal.

Have passport. Am willing to travel great distances for personal freedom.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Have passport. Am willing to travel great distances for personal freedom.

Too many of us don't have that option, for whatever reason. Sadly, we come from a large crossection of warring factions and thus far no one has emerged who can pull those factions together into a force to get rid of these guys. One doubts such a uniter exists.

 

[amicus]

Well, taking the usual risk of widespread umbrage, I think those anti Bush zealots are over reacting, again, as usual.

Broadcast televison is already and has been for a long time under censorship, very controlled for sexual content. However, the Hollywood Liberal onslaught of gay and lesbian themes, gay marriages in sitcoms, the blantant promiscuity and casual sex, the weak male, strong female agenda, is beginning to create a backlash among traditional, conventional viewers.

Cable television is also filled to the brim with this trash and add to it several channels like Playboy, where almost anthing buy child sex, bestiality and anal intercourse in shown on a regular basis. These are pay channels and thus far have escaped intense scrutiny and regulation. Again, the tolerance factor is being pushed as many who do not appreciate or tolerate these practices, do want those programs restricted.

As I have said before, the gay and liberal community have somewhat brought this upon themselves by demanding that their lifestyles be treated as equitable and accepted simply as alternative and not aberrant.

The fear expressed by several is unreasonable because any laws or rule changes will go through the legislature or before the people at the ballot box.

What will not happen, as has happened so many times with the Liberal Court system, is that law will not be made from the bench, thus no restrictions and limitations on first amendment rights will come from the courts anymore.

So, you can move to Canada and elsewhere if you wish, but the wiser thing would be to participate in the political process and advocate your position, whatever it may be.

Once we get the Liberals out of the court system, the rest of the system will function as it was designged, of, by and for, the people.

And most of you be peeples...(I think, a few ponies and bow wows around)

amicus...

 

[cantdog]

Just heard on the news tonight that the alleged perpetrator in the murder of a first year college girl in Virgina had photo's posted on D/A Deviant Art.com which is a site I use from time to time for 'straight' artwork, as do many of my artist friends.

amicus...

Deviant Art is a cool site. It's sad to see this kind of hysteria. You can't even slow it down, though, without a clear agenda and some candidates to pull that agenda together. Colly is quite right. The candidates have been abysmal lately. Liberals threw away all influence almost deliberately in the last election cycle. The two parties are right-slightly center (with religious extremism) and center-right (without it.) Liberal planks in the platforms didn't even exist, because Liberals had decided to throw away their influence.

(If that group is going to vote Anyone But Bush, then the not-Bush candidate doesn't have to act Liberal in any way; he is free to move his party to the right. Bush, of course, can also ignore them. If Liberals had gone into the last election looking deliberately for a way to nut any influence their numbers might have, they could have done no more thorough a job.)

The Reps ran a figurehead and the Dems a plastic cut-out.

All the newly energized political activity which we now see in the streets and on the net? It's all outside the political process. Big organizations, lots of popular support, but in the end all these organizations are NGOs and don't even field candidates for dog catcher. The ones still inside the process benefit from the old truism: "The world is run by those who show up." If you want influence, run for office and take conventional power! Making a large organization which only undertakes to put protests in the street doesn't win elections.