Sexless marriage?

[GoodGirl1977]

I am not sure this is the right forum but I figured I would try this first.

I've posted on Lit before on other topics ... so if you know me you know I am married and in a sexless marriage.

I'd love any kind and constructive feedback because I've heard it all and I don't need to be brought down any more.
The facts:
We have been married 7 years, together for 10 (since just before 9/11.)

We have not had sex - and I am guessing here - in about 2.5 years - maybe 3. I honestly do not remember the last time. He hasn't gone down on me since before our chld was born - the kiddo turned 7 last summer. (7 years, not 7 months.)

We were never a "light the sheets on fire" couple - he's always had some reservations about sex and smoe stamina problems but I have never criticized him. I have always been supportive and frankly I don't need a guy who wants to go at it all night long. I was always satisfied with what we had, back in the day.

We get along otherwise, we're friends, we laugh, we have a home we enjoy. I work full time - busy career (VP-level). I often throw myself into work because sometimes being home is painful for me.

Confession: I have has an affair - the sex was great but I was left feeling empty inside. I guess, like many women, I truly do want the love+sex combo deal - I just can't do loveless sex. But what I have now is sexless love.

My question is this:

Should I simply be happy with what I have? After all he is a loving supportive kind husband who doesnt drink, smoke, run around, is a great dad, works full time and does all the man-stuff at home (mow the lawn, fix the sink, etc.) he's a good man. he cooks. he bought me a phone charger tonight because he noticed mine wasn't working. he's not into cards, flowers or romance, but he does other things.

I have tried therapy on my own (he won't go.) We have talked about it - but that was years ago. It's in some ways the 800 lb. gorilla in the room and in other ways it's about as much a part of our marriage as competitive polka-dancing is. (i.e. - not at all and no one seems to care.)

Is this worth leaving him? I fantasize about a relationship where love and romance and passion are all part of it. Where I feel desired and hungry with desire. But maybe that is a just that - a fantasty - and I am thinking of throwing away a perfectly good relationship for a pipe dream?

Any advice is welcome ... thank you.

 

[sofiredog]

sounds like a MUTUAL therapy session would be the way to go, sounds like there are a lot of good things to work on, and you not be more right that loveless sex is not the way to go, but do you really want to hear all of this. I have been chatting with several women that seems to be in this situation, they all handle it different ways, with some the addiction to sex is just to much to fight all the time, so what have you been doing to fill the void, i mean besides the earlier mentioned. that has been a really really long time to go without being satisfied.

 

[silverwhisper]

that was a much better first post in this type of thread than is the norm. the only thing i don't feel i understand here is what happened last time you discussed the subject with your husband and when that was?

what changed 2.5-3 years ago in your respective situations? was it that your son was old enough to burst into the bedroom?

you're presenting this as a binary situation and i'm not convinced that your current situation can't be improved--but my question from paragraph 1 becomes quite important in achieving that transformation. i guess what i'm really asking here is:

a) has your husband explicitly told you that sexually he is the way he is and there's no changing him? or
b) are you inferring that's what he said?

there's a big difference between a & b. as a husband, i'm (acutely!) aware that i regularly appear to be communicating things to my own wife that i don't actually mean to communicate.

ed

 

[Ozfetishguy]

I've been in a situation that was a little bit similar to your situation. I had a long term girlfriend who didn't enjoy sex. We only had sex very, very occasionally, and I didn't enjoy it, because I knew she wasn't enjoying herself.

Sorry if this isn't that helpful, but I guess whether or not you should leave him depends on whether or not the issue is a "deal breaker". If you feel that being in a relationship with romance and passion is essential for you to be truly happy, then I think you have your answer.

The lack of sex wasn't the only reason I broke up with my ex, but it was certainly a factor. I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life with someone who wasn't physically affectionate and who didn't enjoy sex.

 

[RAddams]

There is always a way to solve problems and find mutual happiness. If he loves you than he will be willing to do whatever it takes for both of you to be happy.

 

[bronzeage]

<snip>

Is this worth leaving him? I fantasize about a relationship where love and romance and passion are all part of it. Where I feel desired and hungry with desire. But maybe that is a just that - a fantasty - and I am thinking of throwing away a perfectly good relationship for a pipe dream?

Any advice is welcome ... thank you.

It's as good a reason to leave as any, but when someone wants out of a relationship, they will take whatever is handy.

There are a few simple rules to a relationship. They are so obvious, most people don't even see them in action.

A relationship is a set of mutual demands. You demand this and he demands that. Most of the time, it's not a problem for either of you. People get stuck on the word "demand" as if it's some kind of bitter pill that scratches on the way down.

The problem comes when a demand is not voiced. We know in our heart want we want and need. When we don't get it, we get resentful. Resentment is corrosive to a relationship. After resentment sets in, we seek compensation. Sometimes this means making the other as miserable as we are. Sometimes it means fucking someone other than the other.

The real serious problem comes from demanding something the other cannot give. This is the first step of a break up. Either one has to change something or the relationship is over.

I assume your husband is close to your age, 30-something and in good health. There is no good reason for him to lose all interest in sex. It could be a medical problem. These things can be fixed. It's not a matter of therapy, it's chemistry. His doctor has heard the story a hundred times.

If you want to know what to do next, answer this question: If you knew this was the way it would be for the rest of your life, what would you do right now? If you do nothing at all, nothing will ever change.

 

[Hhot]

There are a few simple rules to a relationship. They are so obvious, most people don't even see them in action.

A relationship is a set of mutual demands. You demand this and he demands that. Most of the time, it's not a problem for either of you. People get stuck on the word "demand" as if it's some kind of bitter pill that scratches on the way down.

The problem comes when a demand is not voiced. We know in our heart want we want and need. When we don't get it, we get resentful. Resentment is corrosive to a relationship. After resentment sets in, we seek compensation. Sometimes this means making the other as miserable as we are. Sometimes it means fucking someone other than the other.

The real serious problem comes from demanding something the other cannot give. This is the first step of a break up. Either one has to change something or the relationship is over.

Very wise advice...

 

[maximus78]

Im in a similar situation to you and i would guess that even though we may feel we are the only ones that have this problem, it's probably more common than we think. I love my life but I often get frustrated how a lack of sex can take over any of my rational thinking and I start thinking of other ways to get satisfaction, this frustrates me as I think 'come on it's only sex, its not the end of the world' but having a mis-matched sex drive can leave you feeling very frustrated, irrational and unfulfilled, particularly when you feel in your 'prime'.
I'm sorry I can't be of any help but I too wanted to say your not alone and i too could do with the answer to this question!

 

[20aBowler]

I was in a similar situation and I will try to speak negatively, but i think it is time to make some very difficult decisions. I too had a pretty good relationship with my wife, but no sex. Unfortunately we did find that it wasn't enough & we separated. I guess what I am saying is you have to decide how important sex is for you!

 

[SweetErika]

I have the same questions as Ed.

Also, have you talked with your husband recently about how each of you view the state of your marriage? Does he know how unhappy you are with the lack of physical intimacy and you're considering leaving because of it? Have you asked him for his ideas on how to resolve the issues and suggested some resolutions and compromises of your own? Has he told you why he stopped giving oral so long ago and what changed a few years ago?

It might be a long-shot, but have you considered the possibility that your husband has issues with his sexuality/sexual identity?

Once you've talked, can you ask him to go to couples therapy again with the goals of communicating more effectively, coping with the intimacy issue(s) and ultimately saving your marriage? I'm wondering if he would go this time if he knew how serious the situation was and had sufficient motivation to avoid splitting up (assuming that's what he wants).

Regardless, I think it's important for you to give therapy another shot with the goals of communicating your feelings to your husband, figuring out how you can be happy and minimizing the impact of any major changes on your son if you decide to go the separation/divorce route.

 

[Eilan]

Is it possible that he's cheating? A friend of mine is in the process of divorcing, and for the last two years of their marriage, she was ready and willing to have sex, but she couldn't get him to show any interest. Turns out he had been having an affair for most of those two years. He was interested in sex, I guess. Just not with her.

In their case, unfortunately, it seems that there was a breakdown in their relationship after they lost a child.

 

[CinT]

Oh man

Deleted...

 

[CatBrown]

I understand

My marriage started out with good sex on a fairly steady basis. Over the course of three kids, changes in employment status, depression (in both of us, including severe post-partum depression in me after two of the kids,) and health changes, we found ourselves lacking any kind of intimacy.

For about eight years, from the time the kids were old enough to understand what the noises from the bedroom were, there basically weren't any noises from the bedroom. Over that period, I could count on one hand the number of times we had sex, and every one of them was initiated by me.

My husband suffered from erectile dysfunction (from blood pressure meds) and ejaculation failure. Still he claimed to enjoy sexual activity. I couldn't figure out what to do other than help him talk to the doctor, which we did.

Several times we would have blow-ups, or quiet discussions, and I always mentioned intimacy as a problem we needed to work on. Sometimes I was point-blank demanding more sex. None of it changed things.

We were about to leave on a 25th anniversary cruise when I wrote my husband a letter. It took four drafts to get it right. I told him either sex was going to be a frequent part of our vacation and beyond, or we were going to use our time alone on this trip to discuss an equitable separation. I told him to see his doctor and handle the physical issues before we left. I made it very clear I was not his roommate. I wanted a real marriage or no marriage.

We had sex more times in the first seven days of our trip than in the previous seven years. Since then, I have talked very openly about my voracious sexual appetites, my frequent masturbation (sometimes with him beside me in the bed), and the new things I want to try. He still has problems ejaculating, but daily Cialis and my honesty have brought a satisfying level of intimacy back to our marriage.

Will this work for everyone? No. It didn't work for me until I was ready to demand it or leave, and to be absolutely honest about my needs. Is my life perfect now? No, but it sure is a whole lot better.

Figure out what you need, what you cannot do without, and what you are willing to give up to get it, then state your case. He may have issues he's too shy to discuss, you just never know.

Good luck.

PS: I have a story about to post that is about a couple suffering from this problem. Look for "Trying New Things" in a day or two.

 

[razrsharp]

I totally agree with CatBrown on this one. This is something that obviously bothers you a great deal, as it should. There are a lot of variables in a relationship but if I were to characterize and summarize what a relationship with my spouse means to me, it boils down to three important issues: do we like each other (not just love, but truly like), is she the person that I believe has the right values, and do we have a good physical relationship (ergo, an adequate sex life)? Most of the other issues can be subsumed under those three. How you weigh each of those things is up to you but, as for me, all three are critical and if one is missing, I don't think the marriage would work.

I firmly believe that after all this time and after all your trying, this situation is not going to get better. I would be more optimistic if he would at least be willing to try to make it better but he hasn't and I doubt he will. We could all spend a lot of time trying to figure out why he has this problem or why he isn't willing to work on it but we can never really know that. But, people don't often change as much as we would like them to or believe that they can.

I think you have two realistic choices - one is to get out of the marriage and try to find the things you need, or work on yourself so you can have an outside relationship and simply deal with the issues that come with that. The one option that I would not entertain is simply accepting the current situation you have and try to make the best of it. I believe that continuing to live in a sexless marriage when you have sexual needs could embitter you over time and damage the other parts of your marriage that are good. And let's face it, finding something else outside the marriage, either an affair or leaving your husband, is probably going to be easier now while you are younger than it will be 10-12 years from now.

Just my thoughts....I feel for you sweetie.

 

[subwannabe]

Good advice given here. I have to agree with Ed and Erika. You gave a lot of helpful details but you also left out some important ones. There has to be a reason why he stopped. Do you actually know what it is? It also sounds like you have talked to him in the past without results so it kind of sounds like you haven't tried to reconnect at all for quite some time. Try again.

 

[Gilead]

my story is nearly identical, but from the male side of the equation. In her case, she blames anti-depressants for her lack of interest...we've tried counseling to no avail. The problem is that the more time that passes, the more I have simply stopped viewing her as an object of sexual desire. I understand that her issues may not be entirely of her own doing, but the logic of that doesn't hold up to the feeling that I'm not desirable to her. She's my kids' mom. She's the other adult in the house. But whatever spark there was is gone, and I finally realized that my choices were to either let that part of me die for the sake of keeping my house stable for the kids, leave her in pursuit of greener pastures at the detriment of my kids, OR try to sate that desire for a loving connection that included physical intimacy outside of my marriage on the sly. None were great choices, but I chose option C and have not had a single regret about it. In fact, it changed my life enormously for the better. Could I get 'found out'? Of course. But I'm as smart as I can be about it, I have never taken a foolish risk in over a year...I'm not proud that it turned out this way, but I'm not ashamed of it either.

 

[DevilBoy79]

i feel your pain its been roughly 2yrs for some ungodly reason an we arent even married just been together for 11yrs, weve had out share of fun and interesting times, just for some reason the G/F - Wife - Mother of my child whatever you want to call her, wont let me near her and yes it pisses me off, its not like i ever gave her a reason too, i havent scanned the whole thread but i assume you havent gotten a straight answer about the situation either, im about to toss all out toys on the BBQ grill and melt them down just out of spite

 

[videxpert]

I was in a similar sexless marriage. I went for 7 years without any sex. I begged her to go with me for couple counseling, but she refused. Finally, we divorced, but for other reasons besides no sex. What I learned is this: In a marriage, BOTH partners need to put their best foot forward to make the marriage work. If either partner does not want to do so, there is no marriage, even if the marriage license is still in effect. If either partner won't go to counseling than there is not enough love to make the marriage work.
I am now in a marriage with a woman who does go the extra mile with me. She is the love of my life and we go beyond sex engage in lovemaking. It was worth all the pain and hardship of getting out of my former marriage. I wish that kind of happiness for you.

 

[bighands1962]

ask for what you need

You need sex and love,ask for it.Don't demand it.Ask and tell him,all the things that make him a grate guy.Ask him,you need love and more sex in your life

 

[SweetErika]

i feel your pain its been roughly 2yrs for some ungodly reason an we arent even married just been together for 11yrs, weve had out share of fun and interesting times, just for some reason the G/F - Wife - Mother of my child whatever you want to call her, wont let me near her and yes it pisses me off, its not like i ever gave her a reason too, i havent scanned the whole thread but i assume you havent gotten a straight answer about the situation either, im about to toss all out toys on the BBQ grill and melt them down just out of spite

Did your significant other's lack of interest coincide with her pregnancy, childbirth or breastfeeding by any chance?

Unfortunately, I'm all too aware how well all three can fuck up a woman's body and libido.

 

[amofiga]

Good Girl

You certainly are in a bit of a trap and I think most of us can feel your pain. You've said you've gone to therapy but he won't go himeself or with you. Unfortunately you can't force him. You can't force people to change their personalities and behavior issues, be it drinking, gambling, smoking, or even the other extreme you have which would be sexual addiction. People have to want to do it for whatever the reason. It has to come from within. I would NOT suggest giving your husband an ultimatum by saying either he goes to therapy or you'll leave him. One, it could cause him to react very negatively and possibly even physically if he's of that bent. As a minimum it would undermine what he hopefully still sees is your love for him. However, anything you could do to try to get him to at least speak with a therapist, clergyman, etc would be good.

I'm not a psychiatrist but I could see some classical madonna/whore things going on here. You indicated that problems seemed to get worse after you had your baby. It's not unheard of for some men to have the notion that now that their wives are mothers, they shouldn't want to be doing "dirty things" like have sex. Motherhood is somehow too noble and pure for feeling sexual needs. The other issue is whether or not he might not have actually witnessed the birth. I've heard of cases where that can be more emotionally traumatic for a man than it is physically traumatic for a woman. If he witnessed what is usually a pretty messy event, it could have turned him off to some degree to wanting any sort of contact with that part of your body. You indicated that he no longer gives you oral sex and I think many men who don't like going down on women are often turned off by the "messyness" often associated with that area of women. I remember seeing an episode of that program with the sex therapist in Chicago (Dr Laura Berman?) where this guy wouldn't give his wife oral sex and didn't even like looking at or fondling her pussy. It was just a "dirty" dirty place as far as he was concerned. They did make some level of progress, but I can't say he was completely "cured". I'm often amazed, perhaps saddened, that couples didn't recognize these sorts of hang-ups before they got married, thinking that somebody would change after marriage. Usually that's just not going to happen.

There's even another aspect of the birth process that could be an issue. If he witnessed or heard or otherwise experienced you in pain, it could be a powerful deterent for him wanting to ever risk "doing that to you again." How many times have they shown birth events in movies or on TV where women are screaming at their husbands, "You son of a bitch! You did this to me. Don't you ever touch me again. etc, etc" Could he have any of these sorts of issues?

Another thought you mitht not want to hear, but need to think about given the he's never really seemed that interested in sex. Is there any chance he could be gay and maybe hasn't even wanting to or been able to admit it even to himself? There have been many gay men who have married in order to have children and families even though their interest in sexual contact with their wives is more of an expedient than a pleasure. It's most likely not the case, but something to consider. I have a friend I've known since junior high school. Some of us have remained friends for nearly 50 years. He was an usher in my wedding. He used to date and party with us, but he never really got involved with girls long term. As a young man, he also double dated with me on occassions, but most of us that knew him always had some undefinable feeling from some of his behavior and interests that he had those tendencies. It wasn't till 30 years later that he finally came out. None of us were really put off by it or suddenly hated him because of it or anything like that. It was more of a relief that it was out in the open.

I doubt that it's another woman. Even if men have affairs on the side, it usually doesn't diminish their desire for their wives unless there are also other issues in the marriage. Did he have some strict upbringing that made him feel ashamed about sex? Are there sexual things he would like that you've perhaps made him feel guilty about? There are too many things that "could" be going on but unfortunately, you are probably not going to resolve them yourself and it soundsl llike he truly needs to find some motivation to seek therapy. Many men are afraid of therapy. I know I was terrified when I had to face marriage counciling with my wife about 10 years ago as a result of my going outside our marriage. It makes them feel vulnerable and out of control. It makes them feel like they've failed in one way or another. However, it's usually the only way to get someone to be honest with themselfes and really see themselves as others see them and to recognize how their behavior affects others who care about them.

As for you finding someone outside your marriage to satisfy your sexual needs. There are pluses and minuses. I've been there. I know. On the plus side is that if you indeed find someone in the same situation as you (married, doesn't want compications, compatible personality and sexuality) it can indeed be nice. It can allow you to open up and really be yourself. On the negative side, it can also backfire in one or the other of you. In my case my "friend with benefits" found the relationship so comfortable and satisfying that she decided that she wanted to make it permanent and wanted my wife out of the way so that she could leave her husband and we could ride off into the sunset. Now what I wanted. She went over the edge and outted me to my wife. It got really ugly with police being called in, court cases, and nearly a divorce for me. Counciling was a must to survive. I DO NOT recommend the extramarital affair unless (unlikely but possible) your husband would agree to it for the pure sexual needs you have. I also onde had an affair with a married woman who's husband was in a somewhat similar situation as yours, and he actually agreed to let his wife find another partner as long as she was discreet and there were truly not going to be emotional complications. It only lasted about 6 months before both of us felt pretty crappy about the whole situation. Mutual swinging is one thing, and some husbands that "get off" on the notion that their wife is having sex with another man do exist. However, the husband that sits home knowing his wife is out because of whatever physical or emotional limitations he has and his only motivation is "letting her ge happy" is probably really experiencing something this side of torture. There was a foreign movie about that back in the 70's called "Husbands and Lovers". Started out sexy, turned sad and ugly, ended up ok.

Botton line. I'm new to this website and it seems to be largely for people who want to flirt around or talk about kinky, sexy things so that they can be tittilated, amused, educated. Nothing wrong with that. I enjoy that part of it too. However it can also be for people with serious questions to make their own sex lives better. I applaud that. May of us, probably near all of us here are the type of prople that enjoy sexual topics and sexual contact of all sorts. We tend to enjoy hearing about other prople's "fun times". However, it can also be a venue for those with serious issues and need help. I truly hope that you can get your husband to JOIN you in some sort of therapy because I think it's the only real way to get to the root cause or what's going on in your marriage. It may not change him or turn him into a horny stallion, but at least you'll know the ground rules and know what you might have to build with and what decisions can be made for the long term. Good luck, seriously.

 

[HornyVikingMN]

Should I simply be happy with what I have? After all he is a loving supportive kind husband who doesnt drink, smoke, run around, is a great dad, works full time and does all the man-stuff at home (mow the lawn, fix the sink, etc.) he's a good man. he cooks. he bought me a phone charger tonight because he noticed mine wasn't working. he's not into cards, flowers or romance, but he does other things.

I have tried therapy on my own (he won't go.) We have talked about it - but that was years ago. It's in some ways the 800 lb. gorilla in the room and in other ways it's about as much a part of our marriage as competitive polka-dancing is. (i.e. - not at all and no one seems to care.)

Is this worth leaving him? I fantasize about a relationship where love and romance and passion are all part of it. Where I feel desired and hungry with desire. But maybe that is a just that - a fantasty - and I am thinking of throwing away a perfectly good relationship for a pipe dream?

Any advice is welcome ... thank you.

I am sympathetic to your situation - and as you can tell, you are far from alone. Beyond that, I have two main comments about your post:

• "Should" is a terrible word. It's all about others' expectations or others' views. If you're not content, you're won't be content, no matter what anyone here says you "should" be. Take the advice that makes sense, but listen to your heart and your head and do what is best for you.
• The fact that he won't go to counseling with you is very telling. In my experience, it likely means he's either hiding a secret of some sort or afraid that the "blame" is going to be placed on him. My advice to you is this: Make another appointment, invite him to go. If he refuses, go alone. One more attempt can't hurt.
• Only you can decide whether it's time to go or not. It does seem like there's more work that can be done, one more try at saving things, before you go to that very difficult next step. The hardest way is always through the problem and and the easiest way is almost never the best solution.

Good luck - don't settle, and keep talking to him!