Raw vs Passion vs Sensual

[CharleyH]

Sensual
It would almost be stupid to ignore the auditory - but I will for just a moment. My background is visual art, originally architecture, then Fine Art, somehow crossing through the visual and sensuality of food and back to architecture, for the moment, I can take or leave Fine Art, I've reached a comfort zone that I can re-visit for the sensuality embodied in certain works, and artists.

I've never been comfortable with an artist that I couldn't undress (fortunately ms neonlyte obliges). By this I mean a need to take a view across a body of work rather than a single work from a portfolio. This is where the sensuality comes from, it's a refinement of choices, practised, perfected and finally displayed in the right setting, the right lighting, the perfect ambiance, presented for observation - or created by the observer who visits his/her own desires and sensuality on the scene.

I don't need to see my wife - my lover to appreciate her sensuality any more than I need to re-visit Le Corbusiers chapel Notre Dame at Ronchamp to understand the sensuality that a building can possess. Both seduce. They have rehearsed and honed performances, stored in my mind ready for me to activate and condition my perception.
We three grow old together, I see Ronchamp at Easter 1976, the sun screaming of the dewed grass, inside my wife stood bathed in the red reflected sun light staining the side chapel. Outside the choir practised Easter Hymns, the sound of their singing drifting into sanctuary, caressing the silence off the walls.

Sensual - for me it's visual, I locked down my images and bring them out as benchmarks, that's not to say they are not surpassed - but those images, the one's I locked down, are mine.

I find sensuality in many things, but they are nearly always triggers to a past event or experience. It can be a smell, a sound, a sight that issues an avalanche of sensual thought, pleasure taken, in my mind.

"Sensual is slow, loving, savouring, enjoying." I can see that, is it auditory, too? Sexually, is not the voice, the moan the cry, as sensual? Do you not hear the voice, the scream sometimes in an historic setting, architechetually(sp). You responded to the first question emotionally, which is great. Sensual, you said is visual, but do not buildings speak, and alternately, does not the beauty of a form, in architecture, S/m or lesbian, or in anything, speak? A question

 

[NoJo]

Well said! and as a gemini I include all, hopefully :|

Wer'e twins, Charley. I always suspected.

 

[CharleyH]

Wer'e twins, Charley. I always suspected.

which makes sex, a dichotomy and always THRILLING

 

[Guest]

Oh la la, Charlus and Joe: my twin fantasy.

Perdita

 

[CharleyH]

Oh la la, Charlus and Joe: my twin fantasy.

Perdita

Add a dash of P, and we got it goin'!!! HOT Grr. panther no more . . LION, rip. lol

 

[rgraham666]

My turn.

Raw would be that place beneath cognition. Where your animal brain drives you. It cares nothing for the finer emotions, it simply wants, now.

Passion is a broad word. It can be applied to so many things. Architecture, art, another human being. It wants, but is capable of recognising and enjoying the subtleties of emotion.

Sensual is the things that feed passion. The light that illuminates the building we love. The balance of paint and technique that catches our eye. The bend of a neck, the feel of a breast, the taste of her sweat, the sound of her joy, the odour of her arousal. All these feed our passion.

Sensuality feeds our passion and our passion often becomes raw. All have their place in the spectrum of our lives.

 

[SweetVA]

...whereas MY take on it, is as follows:

Passion is mind-consuming. It makes your thoughts take a time-out, and you're all emotions for a while. Like an animal. Passion can be raw, or it can be sensual.
"Raw" is the feeling of "I gotta go with these feelings, I must have pleasure, I can't stop doing this because it feels so fucking GOOD!"
"Sensual" is more "I love every feeling I snse; the way your skin is soft under my hands, the way you moan when I lick you, the way my skin gets goosebumps when you pull the shirt off my shoulders..."

Zorro would make love to a woman passionately. Jack Sparrow would make love in a raw way.

I kinda like Jack Sparrow.

Or is it Johnny Depp?

Darn.. why does he have to be married??

VA

 

[SweetVA]

Passion to me is: excitement, enthusiasm, love of ________ - and the communication of that excitement to someone else. Sensuality doesn't have to be shared, it can be secret, it doesn't need to be about sex, it can be about food - ever eaten a mango? It's more a feeling of something so good it's almost forbidden: really good chocolate.. high thread count sheets.. a kiss on your inner elbow... Raw is unthinking, just feeling. A hard place for some of us to reach.

VA

 

[hmmnmm]

It just so happens that I've lately contemplated very similar questions, mainly that of Raw, less so of Passion & Sensual.
I think it depends on the context.
Raw that which is not yet refined.
There is no refinement of anything unless it first exists in raw form/state.
Raw is the most original and unblemished that anything is.
From raw existence comes all else.

Of course these thoughts are subject to refinement.

 

[neonlyte]

"Sensual is slow, loving, savouring, enjoying." I can see that, is it auditory, too? Sexually, is not the voice, the moan the cry, as sensual? Do you not hear the voice, the scream sometimes in an historic setting, architechetually(sp). You responded to the first question emotionally, which is great. Sensual, you said is visual, but do not buildings speak, and alternately, does not the beauty of a form, in architecture, S/m or lesbian, or in anything, speak? A question

CharleyH
Yes they do speak but not to me in the way they do for you. Tis a curious thing but since reading this comment of yours I've been able to hear your voice in your stories, not that I know your voice - particularly the Taxi piece you posted recently for a quick review, I can hear you narrating it - and it's damn sensual!

For me the kind of expressive aural sexuality you refer to falls under Passion and Raw, of which more later. Sensuality, My Sensuality is calm, luxuriant, voices and sounds sooth, they are a backdrop to the visual and sound has the power to restore the vision - but it is the vision upon which I feast.

 

[yui]

Sensual
It would almost be stupid to ignore the auditory - but I will for just a moment. My background is visual art, originally architecture, then Fine Art, somehow crossing through the visual and sensuality of food and back to architecture, for the moment, I can take or leave Fine Art, I've reached a comfort zone that I can re-visit for the sensuality embodied in certain works, and artists.

I've never been comfortable with an artist that I couldn't undress (fortunately ms neonlyte obliges). By this I mean a need to take a view across a body of work rather than a single work from a portfolio. This is where the sensuality comes from, it's a refinement of choices, practised, perfected and finally displayed in the right setting, the right lighting, the perfect ambiance, presented for observation - or created by the observer who visits his/her own desires and sensuality on the scene.

I don't need to see my wife - my lover to appreciate her sensuality any more than I need to re-visit Le Corbusiers chapel Notre Dame at Ronchamp to understand the sensuality that a building can possess. Both seduce. They have rehearsed and honed performances, stored in my mind ready for me to activate and condition my perception.
We three grow old together, I see Ronchamp at Easter 1976, the sun screaming of the dewed grass, inside my wife stood bathed in the red reflected sun light staining the side chapel. Outside the choir practised Easter Hymns, the sound of their singing drifting into sanctuary, caressing the silence off the walls.

Sensual - for me it's visual, I locked down my images and bring them out as benchmarks, that's not to say they are not surpassed - but those images, the one's I locked down, are mine.



I find sensuality in many things, but they are nearly always triggers to a past event or experience. It can be a smell, a sound, a sight that issues an avalanche of sensual thought, pleasure taken, in my mind.

Very well said, neon! You defined your concept of sensuality so beautifully.

It's interesting to me that your gut reaction to "sensual" is visual. I'm not disagreeing with you, you are absolutely right in every beautiful word you said, but for me, the first thing I think of when trying to define "sensual" would be touch, the tactile. Heat from my lover's skin on palm of my hand, the texture of the wood grain on the handrail, the smooth, warm glide of silk panties, the sharp sting of pine needles, how soft the skin on my tummy feels to me…these are the I think of immediately when someone says "sensual."

Of course I understand that sensuality encompasses all the senses, but I like that when we react from the gut, specific moments, images, are very much sensual in the mind's eye.

I don't think this is a very lucid post, but I'm posting it anyway. Apologies if I come across as clear as mud.

Luck,

Yui

 

[DrFreud]

It's interesting to me that your gut reaction to "sensual" is visual. I'm not disagreeing with you, you are absolutely right in every beautiful word you said, but for me, the first thing I think of when trying to define "sensual" would be touch, the tactile. Heat from my lover's skin on palm of my hand, the texture of the wood grain on the handrail, the smooth, warm glide of silk panties, the sharp sting of pine needles, how soft the skin on my tummy feels to me…these are the I think of immediately when some says "sensual."

What you said makes sense. It's a well known fact that people's way of thinking can be visual, auditory or kinaesthetic. Usually we tend to favor one mode over the others.
Neon's reaction to sensual was visual while yours (and mine too) is kinaesthetic(touch). I can imagine other people's reaction would be to imagine a sensual laugh or a throaty voice.

DrF

P.S: I loved the "how soft the skin on my tummy feels" part. So sensual

 

[neonlyte]

It's interesting to me that your gut reaction to "sensual" is visual. I'm not disagreeing with you, you are absolutely right in every beautiful word you said, but for me, the first thing I think of when trying to define "sensual" would be touch, the tactile. Heat from my lover's skin on palm of my hand, the texture of the wood grain on the handrail, the smooth, warm glide of silk panties, the sharp sting of pine needles, how soft the skin on my tummy feels to me…these are the I think of immediately when someone says "sensual."

Yui,
Thank you for your words - i'm touched!

When I first saw this question about these words (sensual / passion / raw), I was immediately split between my own instinctive values and the almost conventional values society places on these words used in a sexual context. If I were to use 'sensual' in a story, it would be conditioned by touch, sight, smell, and sound. But for me personally it is visual, doesn't mean all the other things don't apply, but visual is the trigger. I'm having much more trouble with Passion trying to understand why my 'gut reaction' was aggression.

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

I tend to think of those words in terms of the visuals they conjure.

When I think sensual, I think slow sort of giggling foreplay where everything is innuendo and the actual event is a long way away. For visual imagine someone tracing a strawberry or ice cube up someone's naked body like in those quasi softcore scenes they slip into action movies so that you don't notice there's no plot.

When I think passionate, I think more of the sort of all-consuming event that ignores the outside world. A type of slow enjoyment that you would expect depicted with various close-ups and possibly complex shading schemes.

When I think raw, I think more of a sort of lack of foreplay, thrust away type of event. Not so much romance as an attempt to fuck the brains out of each other. For visual, imagine the stereotype bed-squeaking scene between the pool boy and the mother who actually looks younger than him while 70s pimp music plays over a grainy soundtrack.

 

[Guest]

I'm having much more trouble with Passion trying to understand why my 'gut reaction' was aggression.

That's a very interesting thought, Wills. Here's my gut reaction. I become possessive of things I am passionate about. I want to be the only one who hears Maria Callas like I do. I want my Garbo, my Shakespeare. Sometimes I resent when others have theirs. It's not a neurosis, just a gut thing. E.g., I've seen a fave book on someone's shelf and thought, "They don't deserve to have that." Not arrogance, really; sometimes I merely feel protective about "my" passion.

As for a particular sensuality I love the human voice, sung and spoken. I know why, but it's personal so I won't say it here. But I truly love the uniqueness of a voice, and if it belongs to someone I love (however I might love) then it's as distinctive as their face or body. I know it also has to do with language itself, the music and structure of it, and the interpretation by whoever is speaking, or singing. A voice can caress, soothe, frighten, arouse, etc. In love or sex, without the voice I can't respond. Yet the voice is also there in the written word. I don't mean "the voice" as in literature, just a particular person's written voice, how I identify them among so many ways. Perhaps they even speak to me with a particular timbre or mellifluousness, then their voice becomes mine (even if only to me).

One thing I love is that I hear myself in my brother's voices, and them in mine. I hear parents' voices in their children, or other siblings voices among themselves. I find it remarkable and beautiful that a voice can be inherited as well as other physical traits.

I love the way Callas talked about her voice as if it were an entity detached from her. She always said "the voice", not my voice.

rambling done, Perdita

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

That's a very interesting thought, Wills. Here's my gut reaction. I become possessive of things I am passionate about. I want to be the only one who hears Maria Callas like I do. I want my Garbo, my Shakespeare. Sometimes I resent when others have theirs. It's not a neurosis, just a gut thing. E.g., I've seen a fave book on someone's shelf and thought, "They don't deserve to have that." Not arrogance, really; sometimes I merely feel protective about "my" passion.

As for a particular sensuality I love the human voice, sung and spoken. I know why, but it's personal so I won't say it here. But I truly love the uniqueness of a voice, and if it belongs to someone I love (however I might love) then it's as distinctive as their face or body. I know it also has to do with language itself, the music and structure of it, and the interpretation by whoever is speaking, or singing. A voice can caress, soothe, frighten, arouse, etc. In love or sex, without the voice I can't respond. Yet the voice is also there in the written word. I don't mean "the voice" as in literature, just a particular person's written voice, how I identify them among so many ways. Perhaps they even speak to me with a particular timbre or mellifluousness, then their voice becomes mine (even if only to me).

One thing I love is that I hear myself in my brother's voices, and them in mine. I hear parents' voices in their children, or other siblings voices among themselves. I find it remarkable and beautiful that a voice can be inherited as well as other physical traits.

I love the way Callas talked about her voice as if it were an entity detached from her. She always said "the voice", not my voice.

rambling done, Perdita

I'm so sorry Perdita, it was only a fling. I was looking at Midsummer's Night Dream and well we had grown a little nostalgic for the old days and before we knew it I had pulled back its cover and was deeply imbedded in Act II. I didn't mean to hurt you, realy I didn't.

Please *sob* forgive me.

 

[DrFreud]

You're rambling was pretty charming actually

I have a comment about the following thought :

One thing I love is that I hear myself in my brother's voices, and them in mine. I hear parents' voices in their children, or other siblings voices among themselves. I find it remarkable and beautiful that a voice can be inherited as well as other physical traits.

rambling done, Perdita

I absolutely agree with this, however something that really struck me here in the US is how people especially young women all have the same voice. By that I mean the same excited giggly tone, pitch, "oh my gosh", etc... It marks the loss of individuality to me and I find it such a turn off. I haven't seen that outside the US...

Do you have a take on this phenomenon P.?

DrF - over and out.

 

[Guest]

I absolutely agree with this, however something that really struck me here in the US is how people especially young women all have the same voice. By that I mean the same excited giggly tone, pitch, "oh my gosh", etc... It marks the loss of individuality to me and I find it such a turn off. I haven't seen that outside the US...

Do you have a take on this phenomenon P.?

Yes I do. I was like that in my teens. It's to be part of a clique, to belong, why they all dress alike, etc. Goes for teen boys too, and gangs.

You must not know any Japanese girls. P.

 

[DrFreud]

Yes I do. I was like that in my teens. It's to be part of a clique, to belong, why they all dress alike, etc. Goes for teen boys too, and gangs.

You must not know any Japanese girls. P.

It's true though I'm still looking for more insight. Will have to reflect more on this.

About the japanese girls. My issue being with voice and the lack of individuality, I am afraid that my command of japanese is not sufficient for me to observe the subjects talk in their natural voice/tongue and draw any conclusion. Maybe when I watch some more anime...

DrF

 

[neonlyte]

Yes I do. I was like that in my teens. It's to be part of a clique, to belong, why they all dress alike, etc. Goes for teen boys too, and gangs.

You must not know any Japanese girls. P.

Sweeping generalisations from me - I would see Japanese as trying to escape the mould of a regimented social structure that conforms to strict behavioural codes. Certainly the ones ore see in and around London are anything but conformists.

The pheneomena of cliques is just arriving in Portugal in a tangible format, by which I mean expressed through clothing and behaviour and readily observable. It's happening with young men principally. The norm is for boys and girls to wander together, these days you see an increasing number of similarly attired male 'gangs' wandering the streets within which 'leadership' becomes an issue and tends to be expressed through wanton destruction, vandalism and thugish behaviour.

Dating girls is hard and rejection is not an easy thing to handle as a young man but 'copping out' is no substitute for the thrill of the chase, the innocent fondle, or the throb of an erection carried on a glance. Gangs are sexless except by media portrayal.

 

[tolyk]

Svenska, well said in your astrology analogy. I shall reply to it further when I wake up more. This is mostly a shameless bump.

 

[neonlyte]

Raw

Raw = intimate. Shorn of every embelishment, pure, exposed, unadorned with the power to excite, seduce, intoxicate. To step beyond reason regardless of consequence, willing to risk everything to give and receive the gift of absolute surrender. To need to maintain that energy and desire, knowing you cannot exist in the shadow. And to know all of that is reciprocated, that is raw. It's the cutting edge you both straddle. It's the life blood that binds you. Never forget you only receive after giving, and if you find the price too high, then you haven't achieved the rawness of intimacy.