Rape in the US Military

[Lancecastor]

Another rape scandal has come to light, this time with Air Force cadets.

Given that the US Forces are the largest in the world, it should come as no surprise that they have so many incidents of rape in a culture where abuse against women is so often ignored.

After all, do we expect to train men to be cold blooded killers without any side effects?

What to do? Each time this sort of thing is exposed, some old General expresses dismay, someone eventually is punished and we all forget about it...until it happens again.

Korea, Vietnam, the Phillipines, Tailhook, etc etc etc

Should military men be kept away from the rest of society like the French Foreign Legion?

Should we prohibit them from marrying?

Should there be a valid legal defence for military men who go nuts and kill their wife or rape a subordinate?

Do you really think you can get trained killers to stop hurting people when they are off duty?

Discuss.

Background reading:

Military Rape

The ugly secret in the American armed forces
BY GREGORY FLANNERY

Women in the U.S. armed services are increasingly at danger -- not from foreign terrorists, but from men in the U.S. armed services.

Full article: http://www.citybeat.com/2002-08-22/news2.shtml

 

[I am a Dolt]

I don't think it can be attributed ONLY to US Military, though

 

[Linedrive]

You're looking in a microscope...and while one rape is one too many, I don't see any more reason to be concerned about this than rape in everyday society.

 

[Lancecastor]

I would encourage each of you to read the article in the link provided.

 

[NaughtyLilVamp]

Rape occurs in every society, in every occupation. It even occurs against each sex.

 

[BgMma]

At the risk of sounding ill-informed, I will say that there should be harsher punishment for military offenders.

If these men, I am assuming the attackers are men, are trained to be able to fight with dignity, honour, and with the control that a proper solider needs, then they should be held to a higher standard.

To me, that means that a smaller infraction should be dealt with more harshly than normal. I don't blame military training for any of this, it is something in the person.

I am personally frightened of these people. These are some of the examples of the folks who are sent in to protect this country? Knowing that one of them could snap like that under mild to high pressure and rape someone is highly disturbing.

There are so many talented and strong willing soliders out there. I weep for them with every horrible story I read. Those offenders do the honest men and women a terrible disservice!

There should be no valid defence for this. Everyone has an excuse for everything and I am tired of it. Accept that you did it and deal with it.
Fuck their defence, who is going to defend us from them?

 

[REDWAVE]

War & women

Militarism and victimization of women go hand in hand. The macho military culture, which deliberately fosters a mood of swaggering aggression, also fosters an attitude of treating women as mere things, to be conquered and taken forcibly.

Women, take note! Make love, not war!

 

[Lancecastor]

Rape occurs in every society, in every occupation. It even occurs against each sex.

Yes, that's true.

But rape is a crime of violence and the military is obviously a culture of violence...so the prevalence of violence against Forces wives and members is quite high.

It's an issue that people avoid talking about. I grew up in a military town and the abuse first hand in the families of my armed forces friends....alcohol and violence against women.

When it happens overseas like in Yugoslavia, Japan or the Phillipines, Armerican soldiers are sometimes treated as War Criminals....but not very often.

At home when they beat their wives or rape a subordinate...it's often swept under the rug.

 

[NaughtyLilVamp]

The story fails to show percentages. Rape in the military falls well below the norms for an average society. You are more likely to be raped by someone you know or a family member than a total stranger.

 

[Lancecastor]

At the risk of sounding ill-informed, I will say that there should be harsher punishment for military offenders.

If these men, I am assuming the attackers are men, are trained to be able to fight with dignity, honour, and with the control that a proper solider needs, then they should be held to a higher standard.

To me, that means that a smaller infraction should be dealt with more harshly than normal. I don't blame military training for any of this, it is something in the person.

I am personally frightened of these people. These are some of the examples of the folks who are sent in to protect this country? Knowing that one of them could snap like that under mild to high pressure and rape someone is highly disturbing.

There are so many talented and strong willing soliders out there. I weep for them with every horrible story I read. Those offenders do the honest men and women a terrible disservice!

There should be no valid defence for this. Everyone has an excuse for everything and I am tired of it. Accept that you did it and deal with it.
Fuck their defence, who is going to defend us from them?

What about police officers? I've seen a similar pattern anecdotally of violence against women, but haven't looked up the stats.

 

[Lancecastor]

The story fails to show percentages. Rape in the military falls well below the norms for an average society. You are more likely to be raped by someone you know or a family member than a total stranger.

Yes, there are stats in that story....here are some more from an ABC 20/20 investigation:

See: http://www.wench.com/2rant/ranks1.html

 

[NaughtyLilVamp]

Yes, there are stats in that story....here are some more from an ABC 20/20 investigation:

See: http://www.wench.com/2rant/ranks1.html

Please provide the link that compares those numbers to the rest of society. Without the other numbers those are incomplete.

 

[phrodeau]

Re: War & women

Militarism and victimization of women go hand in hand. The macho military culture, which deliberately fosters a mood of swaggering aggression, also fosters an attitude of treating women as mere things, to be conquered and taken forcibly.

Women, take note! Make love, not war!

That sounds like the Promise Keepers to me. Maybe you mixed up the two?

 

[Bent]

I have been surrounded by the military all my life, and I have NEVER met one single solitary man in all that time, that would even consider it...ok, wait, there is one, and yes, he got away with it, but other than him, no, I haven't, so there shouldn't be a generalization about servicemembers.

Rapists are sludge, and I don't believe that servicemembers should have a higher accountability because they are better trained...they should just be held accountable, period.

 

[BgMma]

The police are just as guilty.

Though, I am willing to admit that military and police rape is lower than average, the police would like to ignore the fact that their friends and superiors are also guilty as hell.

The code of silence is what kills me. You would be willing to sleep at night knowing that you let your buddy get away with rape?

Actually, I think I am going to drop out of this conversation. I am getting upset about it. No sense in wasting words.

Sorry, but I can't take this subject as lightly as some.

 

[Lancecastor]

Please provide the link that compares those numbers to the rest of society. Without the other numbers those are incomplete.

90% of women under the age of 50 who have served in the U.S. Military report being victims of sexual harassment. (Journal of Interpersonal Violence)

See: http://www.promotetruth.org/didyouknow/statistics.htm

 

[Lancecastor]

The code of silence is what kills me.

This is a strong point...the culture of heirarchy, loyalty to rank, etc, cultivates a culture of crime that festers in such organizations.

Thanks for participating in the discussion.

Lance

 

[BgMma]

This is a strong point...the culture of heirarchy, loyalty to rank, etc, cultivates a culture of crime that festers in such organizations.

Thanks for participating in the discussion.

Lance

My hat is off to you, Lance.

Sorry I couldn't be more contributory.

 

[phrodeau]

This is a strong point...the culture of heirarchy, loyalty to rank, etc, cultivates a culture of crime that festers in such organizations.

Thanks for participating in the discussion.

Lance

"Culture of crime"? Like all the rapists get together for beers and poker?

You're an individual, aren't you? Why do you insist on grouping people by motivation? It seems to me that in your mind the world is divided into cliques, cultures and conspiracies. Give individuality some credit. We are not sheep.

 

[Lancecastor]

"Culture of crime"? Like all the rapists get together for beers and poker?

You're an individual, aren't you? Why do you insist on grouping people by motivation? It seems to me that in your mind the world is divided into cliques, cultures and conspiracies. Give individuality some credit. We are not sheep.

I haven't said that 100% of the US Military are rapists.

But there is a problem that transcends the ordinary.

Ignore it or try to make it about me if you like.

That won't change the facts.

Lance

 

[Lancecastor]

Air Force cadets claim they were reprimanded for reporting rapes

DENVER (AP) - When five female Air Force Academy cadets reported that they had been raped by classmates, they sought some support from the military. Instead, they were treated as if they were either crazy or promiscuous, says a former Air Force captain and founder of a group that tracks sexual assaults in the military.

http://morningsun.net/stories/02182003/usw_20030218007.shtml


See also: http://staaamp.org/about.html

STAAAMP is a support and advocacy organization for military abuse victims.

 

[Guest]

 

[Lancecastor]

Coming from a family with a long line of Military AND Law enforcement......


If you are a police man, and you beat your wife, you get in a HELL of a lot of trouble, and can lose your job. Domestic violence is illegal, and breaking the law can cost them theire jobs.
Not to mention the rest of the police force looks down on them forever.


Now, my dearest friends husband got discharged from the Air Force for cheating on his wife and writing bad checks.
There is punishment for wife beating. It costs them their jobs.

So would you be in favour of removing Military Police from bases so the Military could be policed in the same way as everyone else?

 

[ma_guy]

Maybe you should start with your own military..

Feminist Daily News Wire
May 20, 1998

Rape & Sexual Harassment Rampant in Canadian Military, Says Report

A report published in Maclean's, a popular Canadian news magazine, alleges that rape and sexual harassment are pervasive in the Canadian military.

Maclean's interviewed 13 military women who said they had been sexually harassed and uncovered at least 27 cases in which women were sexually assaulted by their peers or superiors. "The cases also reveal a culture -- particularly in the navy and combat units -- of unbridled promiscuity, where harassment is common, heavy drinking is a way of life, and women ...are often little more than game for sexual predators," said the report.

Two women reported being raped by men while other men laughed and looked on. "He was laughing and all the other guys were laughing.... Nobody came to help me," said one woman, who later saw another woman being forced into the same guarded room where she was raped. The second woman claimed that her superiors retaliated against her after she reported being raped.

The chief of Canada's defense, General Maurice Baril, commented on the recent report by saying that it concerned him, but that the military would not investigate crimes detailed in Maclean's report. "Changing the mentality of 90,000 people is very difficult and unfortunately I cannot order it around," he said.


http://www.feminist.org/news/newsbyte/uswirestory.asp?id=3555

 

[Tungwagger]

Maybe you should start with your own military..

Feminist Daily News Wire
May 20, 1998

Rape & Sexual Harassment Rampant in Canadian Military, Says Report

A report published in Maclean's, a popular Canadian news magazine, alleges that rape and sexual harassment are pervasive in the Canadian military.

Maclean's interviewed 13 military women who said they had been sexually harassed and uncovered at least 27 cases in which women were sexually assaulted by their peers or superiors. "The cases also reveal a culture -- particularly in the navy and combat units -- of unbridled promiscuity, where harassment is common, heavy drinking is a way of life, and women ...are often little more than game for sexual predators," said the report.

Two women reported being raped by men while other men laughed and looked on. "He was laughing and all the other guys were laughing.... Nobody came to help me," said one woman, who later saw another woman being forced into the same guarded room where she was raped. The second woman claimed that her superiors retaliated against her after she reported being raped.

The chief of Canada's defense, General Maurice Baril, commented on the recent report by saying that it concerned him, but that the military would not investigate crimes detailed in Maclean's report. "Changing the mentality of 90,000 people is very difficult and unfortunately I cannot order it around," he said.


http://www.feminist.org/news/newsbyte/uswirestory.asp?id=3555

This is definately gonna get interesting now...