Question about submitting a changed version of a story as a new story

[IsabellaEmily]

In a chat here, someone suggested that I take a story I've written in the incest category, and change it just a bit to submit it as a different story without any of the incest elements. It would basically be the same story with minor relationship changes (changing 'cousin' to 'old friend from college' for instance).

I would start the 'new' story with a disclaimer explaining what I'd done so that no one reading felt 'cheated' once they realized I'd plagiarized myself.

But even with the disclaimer would this be allowed? I have zero interest in breaking any Lit rules, and this isn't something I feel I NEED to do....and right not it's not even a serious plan....just an idea that I'm toying with.

Any and all feedback is appreciated. Thanks in advance!

 

[RejectReality]

If you're deleting the original incest version, go for it. No conflict so far as the site is concerned. You're not really supposed to have multiple versions of the same story up ( with some exceptions for significant alteration ) but if you're pulling one version down and replacing it with a version that removes the incest, you're all good.

You're also smart to include a disclaimer that it previously appeared on Lit in another form, because knee-jerk plagiarism complaints are very much a real thing.

If you want to keep them both up, that's much more tricky, and Laurel is the only one who can really answer the question for you.

 

[LexxRuthless]

Why not just make it a completely new story? Give the characters slightly different backgrounds to go along with their new names. If incest is no longer driving the sexual impetus, what is?

I essentially had this happen in reverse, when I took notes from a series and turned it into a standalone incest story. I just made new characters that were similar to the ones in my series, and it took about two days to write that story and submit it.

If you simply aren't happy with your incest story then RR's advice is better. Just write the new non-incest version and put a note to have the original removed when the new version is posted.

 

[KeithD]

In a chat here, someone suggested that I take a story I've written in the incest category, and change it just a bit to submit it as a different story without any of the incest elements. It would basically be the same story with minor relationship changes (changing 'cousin' to 'old friend from college' for instance).

I would start the 'new' story with a disclaimer explaining what I'd done so that no one reading felt 'cheated' once they realized I'd plagiarized myself.

But even with the disclaimer would this be allowed? I have zero interest in breaking any Lit rules, and this isn't something I feel I NEED to do....and right not it's not even a serious plan....just an idea that I'm toying with.

Any and all feedback is appreciated. Thanks in advance!

I rework stories to different categories occasionally, but I post these to a different site. I have expanded stories posted here, but, again, I usually post them elsewhere. The one that I wanted to expand but leave the original here under the sr71plt account ("Silas' Choice") for some reason I can't remember now, Laurel let me do, but not without a struggle over leaving the original here. But that was to the same category. You might be able to do what you want here. No reason not to try it. Do it under the same account name, with the note you mention to ensure readers don't question ownership.

 

[8letters]

If you move a story from I/T to say EC, you are presenting the story to a completely new audience. My impression is that there's very little overlap between the audience for the different categories. So I would do it without giving it a second thought. Yeah, put a note, but I wouldn't spend a lot of time changing the story (except to clean things up so that the new version fits the new category).

 

[IsabellaEmily]

Thank you all!

Lots of great insight and advice here.

It's not really something I'm seriously considering doing....in fact it never would have occured to me except that someone suggested I do it. And since I didn't know if it was allowed I thought I'd ask....better to know than not know.

I appreciate you all and your advice! I'll most likely just leave things as they are, since I have more story ideas than I have time to write anyway....no sense wasting time redoing something I've already done.

Hope you all have an amazing weekend!
IsabellaEmily

 

[Voboy]

It would never occur to me to plagiarize myself. Aside from the site rules, it just strikes me as "not the way to do things."

If I no longer liked an older story, I'd pull it down. But regardless, I'd always write a new story. Some plot elements might recur from time to time, unavoidably, just because of my individual interests and predilections, but to take an existing story and just move the pieces around strikes me as disrespectful to my own work. If that makes sense.

 

[KeithD]

I think if it's your own work it isn't really plagiarism; it's just a variant version.

 

[Voboy]

I think if it's your own work it isn't really plagiarism; it's just a variant version.

OP used the word herself; that's why I followed suit. FWIW, I'm not sure I'd call it that either. I still think there's something undesirable about doing it, though it's hard for me to express why.

 

[gordo12]

I've seen versions like you describe before. Changing character names, for instance, but the rest of the story is identical. They got reported and kicked out.

 

[KeithD]

OP used the word herself; that's why I followed suit. FWIW, I'm not sure I'd call it that either. I still think there's something undesirable about doing it, though it's hard for me to express why.

If in changing the category, you take the story in a whole new thematic direction while staying in the basic footprint of the original, I think that's being creative and would be interesting for the discerning reader.

 

[Voboy]

If in changing the category, you take the story in a whole new thematic direction while staying in the basic footprint of the original, I think that's being creative and would be interesting for the discerning reader.

But that's not what the OP's proposing. She's essentially changing pronouns and switching the context from incest to non-incest. If everything else stays the same, it's difficult for me to think of that as "creative."

 

[IsabellaEmily]

No need to argue

Since I was 99% sure it wasn't really something I wanted to try to start with, and the idea is less appealing the more I think about it, for a variety of mostly personal reasons.

I posed the question largely as a hypothetical (but didn't label it that way since that leads people to often feel the need to pontificate endlessly about hypothetical outcomes) to satisfy my own curiosity. Better to know than not know.

I see no creative value in revisiting a story that I'm already done with just to change names/locations/small details just to republish as if it's new.....on the other hand I'd hesitate to criticize someone else who wanted to do that to their own story.

If I wasn't happy with a story I'd take it down and bury it (so to speak), although I can't see myself hitting publish on something I didn't like at least a little.

If I wanted to change it after I'd hit publish I'd probably just live with it, since I rarely feel complete satisfaction with something I write anyway, and I'd just work whatever 'improvements' I'd dreamed up into something new and fresh.

And I certainly don't mean this to sound as if I'm overly impressed with my own skill or talent. I'm better than some who write. I'm worse than some who write. I have no illusions that I'm 'great', nor do I worry about not being good enough. I write for my own enjoyment and strive to improve as much as I can as often as I can.

Thanks again to all who contributed....but there's no real need to dig at each other over this.....it was just a random question and not worth much more than that.

 

[IsabellaEmily]

OP used the word herself; that's why I followed suit. FWIW, I'm not sure I'd call it that either. I still think there's something undesirable about doing it, though it's hard for me to express why.

I agree completely. And like you I'm not really sure how to word it or explain it.

Not that I'm bothered if someone else wants to do it to their own work. If you created it, you should be able to tinker with it endlessly.

But it strikes me as one of those silly conversations that people have about 'What would you do if you won a billion dollars?' or 'What would you do if you could travel back in time?'.

Fun to think about for a few minutes....but ultimately unsatisfying. The analogy doesn't really fit....but it's as close as I can get without investing too much more thought in it.

 

[Voboy]

I agree completely. And like you I'm not really sure how to word it or explain it.

Not that I'm bothered if someone else wants to do it to their own work. If you created it, you should be able to tinker with it endlessly.

But it strikes me as one of those silly conversations that people have about 'What would you do if you won a billion dollars?' or 'What would you do if you could travel back in time?'.

Fun to think about for a few minutes....but ultimately unsatisfying. The analogy doesn't really fit....but it's as close as I can get without investing too much more thought in it.

We've discussed this sort of thing in here before, and my reaction is similar to my [viscerally negative] reaction to George Lucas going back in and tweaking Star Wars (1977). I think once something's published, it belongs to the public and not to the creator anymore. Not that the stuff we produce here is on the level of Star Wars, but to me it's only a question of degree.

The stuff I've put out here is only posted because I thought it was good enough. I've been fortunate to have some readers who've agreed with me. I think my feeling is that taking a story they like and "recycling" it would be disrespectful to them, just as I feel Lucas disrespected fans of the 1977 film.

I dunno. It's a worthwhile thing to bring up, though, and a philosophically interesting thing to post about.

 

[BuckyDuckman]

. . . You're not really supposed to have multiple versions of the same story up ( with some exceptions for significant alteration ) but if you're pulling one version down and replacing it with a version that removes the incest, you're all good. <snip>

I've seen versions like you describe before. Changing character names, for instance, but the rest of the story is identical. They got reported and kicked out.

Is this accurate? Is there a FAQ or something that cites as much? Not trying to be belligerent, just surprised to see similar comments from two different people. Perhaps it depends on how similar the two stories are? It doesn't feel like something that would happen very often.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Is this accurate? Is there a FAQ or something that cites as much? Not trying to be belligerent, just surprised to see similar comments from two different people. Perhaps it depends on how similar the two stories are? It doesn't feel like something that would happen very often.

I tried to combine two chapters of a story into a single submission for the Covid Anthology last year, but Laurel didn't allow that - but I couldn't be bothered taking both chapters down first and resubmitting. So on that basis, Laurel doesn't like duplicates.

 

[gordo12]

Is this accurate? Is there a FAQ or something that cites as much? Not trying to be belligerent, just surprised to see similar comments from two different people. Perhaps it depends on how similar the two stories are? It doesn't feel like something that would happen very often.

I believe it is a violation of the T&C's here. I read an LW story last week and thought I'd read it before. Checking the author's stories, sure enough, the same story was posted last May. Nothing got changed except the title. I reported it, and it was gone the next day. Because I've been reading here for twenty years now, I'm very likely to notice crap like that. I report it and have no problem with the concept of reporting it as a violation. And they do get dealt with.

While the stories belong to us, there is a slew of authors looking to game the system. Multiple versions of the same story with nothing changed but the names, stolen stories from other authors, especially those no longer here. Trolling the scores, category hopping, the shit is endless. I have little patience with stuff like that.

I can take a story and put it up to gain followers, delete it and put it into another category to get more followers, delete it and ....!

So when somebody talks about deleting a story and posting it again...meh. I have to wonder at the intent. (Not to knock the OP for asking)

 

[SimonDoom]

I believe it is a violation of the T&C's here. I read an LW story last week and thought I'd read it before. Checking the author's stories, sure enough, the same story was posted last May. Nothing got changed except the title. I reported it, and it was gone the next day. Because I've been reading here for twenty years now, I'm very likely to notice crap like that. I report it and have no problem with the concept of reporting it as a violation. And they do get dealt with.

While the stories belong to us, there is a slew of authors looking to game the system. Multiple versions of the same story with nothing changed but the names, stolen stories from other authors, especially those no longer here. Trolling the scores, category hopping, the shit is endless. I have little patience with stuff like that.

I can take a story and put it up to gain followers, delete it and put it into another category to get more followers, delete it and ....!

So when somebody talks about deleting a story and posting it again...meh. I have to wonder at the intent. (Not to knock the OP for asking)

I don't get this at all. What's the harm?

An author writes a story, then a few months later decides the story could be re-written, with some changes, but a similar plot, that would put it in a different category. What possible harm is there? None. None at all. If an author wants to publish 10 different versions of the same story, with minor variations that warrant it being published in different categories, no harm of any kind is done, to anyone. I don't get the attitude that wants to play the cop to prevent this from happening. Let authors do what they want so long as they are not infringing the rights of others.

My advice to the original poster: Keep your existing story, because it's an incest story, and incest will draw more followers and readers to you and to your story catalog than any other category. Rewrite your story, with different character names, and omission of the incest elements, and publish it under a different name. Seems perfectly legitimate to me.

The poet Walt Whitman kept re-writing his poem Leaves of Grass. It worked for him. I don't see why anyone would complain about Literotica authors rewriting their stories and publishing new versions.

 

[Voboy]

If an author wants to publish 10 different versions of the same story, with minor variations that warrant it being published in different categories, no harm of any kind is done, to anyone.

...well clearly, based on the post just above yours, Laurel seems to disagree with you. And it's her site, so...

 

[SimonDoom]

...well clearly, based on the post just above yours, Laurel seems to disagree with you. And it's her site, so...

Where in the Site is it clear that Laurel disagrees with me?

 

[gordo12]

I don't get this at all. What's the harm?

An author writes a story, then a few months later decides the story could be re-written, with some changes, but a similar plot, that would put it in a different category. What possible harm is there? None. None at all. If an author wants to publish 10 different versions of the same story, with minor variations that warrant it being published in different categories, no harm of any kind is done, to anyone.

Simon, I think if you reread my post, you'll see a difference in the stuff I've sketched out VS yours. I would simply say that what I report gets deleted. That means the site agrees with me. It's behaviour THEY don't want to see either. I doubt anyone would accuse Laurel and Manu of being prone to pandering.

And BTW we're talking maybe a story every 2-3 months.

I have no desire to be a cop. But don't you think we owe it to keep this place in a reasonable condition? Do we want people dumping shit anywhere they feel like it?

So here you go. If I were rewriting a story with 10 different variations, as you've described, I would tell Laurel that in the author's notes when I submitted it. If she didn't accept, fine. Many would hope they slip through.

Whenever I submit a story, I outline anything I consider contentious to Laurel and tell her how I handled it. That way lies trust and good relations.

 

[SimonDoom]

Simon, I think if you reread my post, you'll see a difference in the stuff I've sketched out VS yours. I would simply say that what I report gets deleted. That means the site agrees with me. It's behaviour THEY don't want to see either. I doubt anyone would accuse Laurel and Manu of being prone to pandering.

And BTW we're talking maybe a story every 2-3 months.

I have no desire to be a cop. But don't you think we owe it to keep this place in a reasonable condition? Do we want people dumping shit anywhere they feel like it?

So here you go. If I were rewriting a story with 10 different variations, as you've described, I would tell Laurel that in the author's notes when I submitted it. If she didn't accept, fine. Many would hope they slip through.

Whenever I submit a story, I outline anything I consider contentious to Laurel and tell her how I handled it. That way lies trust and good relations.

I'm not trying to pick a fight. I'm just confused about what the rule is here. Where is it posted? What's the URL? I don't understand this point.

 

[gordo12]

Where in the Site is it clear that Laurel disagrees with me?

LOL, have you ever pressed the report button? It does lay out issues there.

 

[SimonDoom]

LOL, have you ever pressed the report button? It does lay out issues there.

No, I never have.

I'll repeat my question: where is the rule posted on this Site that prohibits this? I cannot find it.