Putting dialogue and monologue into their own paragraphs

[8letters]

I have a new beta-reader for the story I'm currently working on. He started his feedback with:

Rule of thumb and formatting Literotica prefers is to keep dialogue and Monologue in separate paragraphs as much as makes sense. It makes it more readable on a web page.

I asked for more details, and he replied:

I don’t know which blog the Rule of thumb came from but Literotica does have a best practices page. I think their reasoning is that unlike a Word document that is formatted to fit on an 8X10 page, their pages are formatted by whatever the screen size they are rendering to. So it could be a phone, tablet or computer. When monologue and dialogue are separated, there tends to be natural breaks between them making them easier to read and not lose their place.

It might not be a rule any longer, but I still go by it. If you look at the submission guildlines under rule 7 it says:
Please break your story into reasonably sized paragraphs. Reading on a screen is different from reading from a book or magazine, as the flicker from computer monitors is tiring on the eye. Excessively long paragraphs are hard on readers’ eyes.

My style has been to put mix action and dialogue in the same paragraph as long as the dialogue is done by the actor of the paragraph. So I had originally:

Matthew immediately jumped up and offered his hand. “Mr. Taylor! Good to see you!” As they were shaking hands, Dad stood up and shook his hand too. Once the handshaking was done, Dad and Matthew sat back down.

His recommendation is to break that into three paragraphs:

Matthew immediately jumped up and offered his hand.

“Mr. Taylor! Good to see you!”

As they were shaking hands, Dad stood up and shook his hand too. Once the handshaking was done, Dad and Matthew sat back down.

What do you think?

 

[KeithD]

I'm not aware of nor do I follow any such "rule."

 

[SimonDoom]

I think both ways are acceptable. In your example, there is no monologue. The unquoted text is narrative, not monologue, so there's no confusion. There could be confusion if you combined monologue and dialogue in the same paragraph.

I also think the example you gave is so short that there's no fear of readers finding the length of the paragraph tiring.

I tend to write in short paragraphs in Literotica stories, because I think they read better that way, but I mix it up, and sometimes have longer paragraphs for description or narrative. I'm fairly strict on using separate lines for different bits of dialogue. But I see nothing wrong with doing it the way you want to do it.

 

[Voboy]

I do not structure my paragraphs the way the OP's editor does. It's not a "rule" of any sort.

I'm not aware that my paragraphing has limited my readership. But I've never had a comment critiquing my line spacing. So, I'll just continue doing what I'm comfortable with.

 

[8letters]

I'm going to try it for my next story and see what readers think. Or if they even notice.

I do think it fits how I read. I think when I'm reading a story, I skim the non-dialogue sections and read the dialogue. I think being able to find the dialogue quickly would make me navigate and process a story more efficiently. I wonder if there's any research on how people read to support that.

That being said, editing my story to follow the rule would result in lots of one-sentence paragraphs, which I don't like. For example, I prefer:

My boss gave me a knowing smile. “That’d be a great idea. Take your time and learn all you can.” He smiled at Hector and almost winked. “Thanks for offering, Hector.”

to

My boss gave me a knowing smile.

“That’d be a great idea. Take your time and learn all you can.”

He smiled at Hector and almost winked.

“Thanks for offering, Hector.”

 

[SimonDoom]

That being said, editing my story to follow the rule would result in lots of one-sentence paragraphs, which I don't like. For example, I prefer:

to

I totally agree on that point. I'm a big fan of one-sentence paragraphs as an exception but not a rule. They're good for emphasis, but if there are too many of them it reads weird.

 

[NotWise]

I combine action and dialog in the same paragraph as I see fit.

I've read that they should be separate unless the action is needed to clarify who is speaking, but I combine them when the action is important to conveying the meaning in the dialog: expressions, gestures, body language, and so on.

And sometimes I combine them because I damn well feel like it.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I think both ways are acceptable. In your example, there is no monologue. The unquoted text is narrative, not monologue, so there's no confusion. There could be confusion if you combined monologue and dialogue in the same paragraph.

I also think the example you gave is so short that there's no fear of readers finding the length of the paragraph tiring.

I tend to write in short paragraphs in Literotica stories, because I think they read better that way, but I mix it up, and sometimes have longer paragraphs for description or narrative. I'm fairly strict on using separate lines for different bits of dialogue. But I see nothing wrong with doing it the way you want to do it.

I agree. I will use formatting like 8Letters original example any number of times. It's a nice change from strict he said/she said dialogue formatting.

 

[DarkRaven13]

I'm not a professional, nor do I profess to be anywhere near in talent to those I've seen responding here. However, one of the things I've been actively doing when reading stories, is paying attention to how writers interlace dialogue with narrative.

One of the things that struct me as I studied stories on a technical basis, was that those who did an excellent job at moving back and forth between dialogue and narrative did so in a way that required me to ACTIVELY look for the transitions.

But, to your question regarding separating out the dialogue from the narrative - I just saw @NotWise post, and am in full agreement with him on all points. I myself do a combination, where at times I'll separate the dialogue, and at times I'll combine it with narrative or action.

What I have found when looking at stories that I've thought were written well, is that when combined in a single paragraph, the dialogue portions often is placed at the beginning, or near the front of the paragraph. I think that way, as people read, the dialogue doesn't get as lost in the reading.

For instance, I thought your 1st example worked well. However, in your 2nd example, while still acceptable in my mind, it was a little harder to keep straight regarding action/dialogue - who was talking. Once I read though it twice it was clear to me ... but it did cause me to back up a little.

Those are just my thoughts though ... I say write how you feel comfortable ... and like @MelissaBaby said, its nice to mix it up.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I do think it fits how I read. I think when I'm reading a story, I skim the non-dialogue sections and read the dialogue. I think being able to find the dialogue quickly would make me navigate and process a story more efficiently. I wonder if there's any research on how people read to support that.

That being said, editing my story to follow the rule would result in lots of one-sentence paragraphs, which I don't like.

Apply common sense, I reckon, but don't slavishly follow a "rule", because it probably won't be a rule, merely a good suggestion. The number one objective should always be, "Make it clear who is saying what to whom, and who is doing what to whatever."

It's odd, though, that you skip narrative to find dialogue. Seems to me if you do that, you're not reading the same story the author wrote. Surely they've written the narrative for a reason?

 

[XerXesXu]

I write my paragraphs conventionally, but since anything I write will be read on a screen I then go through it looking for an opportunity to create white space every 8 lines or so. It's convenient to do this between speakers in dialogue. If a speaker goes beyond 8 lines I'll create an artificial double-line break at a convenient point using ellipses to indicate continuity. This isn't paragraphing, it's creating white space to make the text screen friendly for the reader.

 

[lovecraft68]

I tend to write more like the latter example, but it depends on the action after or between the two statements. In the OP's example the first way reads clunky, but better when broken up, but that could be because of the actual writing in that case because to me, the true answer is you can do a little of both based on each situation.

As far as research on the topic goes, I'd say its a waste of time and stop worrying about what everyone else does or has done.

To add to others posts, I have never had a complaint about paragraphs. For myself I do see people who end up with huge blocks of text that are hard to read because they're paragraphs are on the longer side, but that's not quite what is being discussed here.

 

[PennameWombat]

I think this 'rule' is another case of "here is a bit of useful advice that you should keep in mind" that's morphed into a hard and fast 'do or else' rule, at least in that reader's mind. Like "show, don't tell." Useful guidance, but I see plenty of postings in amateur writing groups "oh no! I 'told!' Please, someone, tell me how to show here." Or... "this famous author told and didn't show! How can they be successful!" And, yeah, it applies but if you treat it as concrete fact, you'll wrap yourself in pretzels without useful reason.

I do consider how I place and break up action (or narrative) and dialogue in a paragraph. I use both styles as described in this thread, but consider following one or the other without thinking about each to be nuts. Do I get it 'right' all of the time? Probably not. But I can't see how forcing this advice to be followed without regard to overall flow and context is useful.

I don't optimize my writing for phone screens, although it's supposedly a major avenue for readers here. But I do pay attention to overall paragraph length and I try to avoid walls of text.

 

[RejectReality]

I try to keep my paragraphs short, and I tend to have dialogue as either the beginning or the end, but I don't separate it out from all narrative. The way I would have written that passage is:

Matthew immediately jumped up and offered his hand. “Mr. Taylor! Good to see you!”

As they were shaking hands, Dad stood up and shook his hand too. Once the handshaking was done, Dad and Matthew sat back down.

There is indeed a rule about overly long paragraphs, but it's subjective, and not often enforced unless especially egregious and frequent from what I've seen.

 

[AlinaX]

I try to keep my paragraphs short, and I tend to have dialogue as either the beginning or the end, but I don't separate it out from all narrative. The way I would have written that passage is:
...

I like that, although I'd have gone further:

Matthew immediately jumped up and offered his hand. “Mr. Taylor! Good to see you!”

Dad stood and shook his hand, and after, they both sat back down.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

I'm not a professional, nor do I profess to be anywhere near in talent to those I've seen responding here. However, one of the things I've been actively doing when reading stories, is paying attention to how writers interlace dialogue with narrative.

One of the things that struct me as I studied stories on a technical basis, was that those who did an excellent job at moving back and forth between dialogue and narrative did so in a way that required me to ACTIVELY look for the transitions.

But, to your question regarding separating out the dialogue from the narrative - I just saw @NotWise post, and am in full agreement with him on all points. I myself do a combination, where at times I'll separate the dialogue, and at times I'll combine it with narrative or action.

What I have found when looking at stories that I've thought were written well, is that when combined in a single paragraph, the dialogue portions often is placed at the beginning, or near the front of the paragraph. I think that way, as people read, the dialogue doesn't get as lost in the reading.

For instance, I thought your 1st example worked well. However, in your 2nd example, while still acceptable in my mind, it was a little harder to keep straight regarding action/dialogue - who was talking. Once I read though it twice it was clear to me ... but it did cause me to back up a little.

Those are just my thoughts though ... I say write how you feel comfortable ... and like @MelissaBaby said, its nice to mix it up.

I think to your point, without dialogue tags, separating narrative from dialogue in many instances would be more confusing. The narrative helps identify who is speaking. It becomes the "tag" that makes the spoken words sensible. Separating the lines nullifies that in many cases.

 

[stickygirl]

Clarity and consistency.
We all appreciate long paragraph can make for difficult reading, especially on public transport - try it. Equally, sticking slavishly to a separate para break for every time a speaker makes another point is irritating.

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief. "What made you change your mind?"

is simpler than

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief.

"What made you change your mind?" he asked.

On the subject of those "" and '' things - what are they called? I almost failed Eng Lang so...

As a style and for clarity I use

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief.

'I wonder if she really meant that?' he mused.

Does that make sense or do I get sent home early with a note to Mum? I'm not sure I like Peter - he seems so judgemental. Patronising bastard with his 'musing' back at her.

 

[Northstar4695]

A new paragraph for each new speaker is a typical rule of thumb, but it’s not necessary to separate every bit of dialogue from every bit of narrative. It might be confusing if it’s the same speaker, actually.

Some it is style rather than rules, but I would only split dialogue from one speaker if it was a long or if there’s a significant bit of narrative between the dialogue. If a bit of narrative is related to the dialogue, I would group that together.

 

[SimonDoom]

On the subject of those "" and '' things - what are they called? I almost failed Eng Lang so...

As a style and for clarity I use

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief.

'I wonder if she really meant that?' he mused.

Does that make sense or do I get sent home early with a note to Mum? I'm not sure I like Peter - he seems so judgemental. Patronising bastard with his 'musing' back at her.

They're quotation marks.

Concerning your way of handling internal dialogue -- that's one way of doing it. Another is to use italics. But I'm increasingly gravitating toward the free indirect style where I just incorporate it into the narrative, which is kept close to the person's perspective. So I would handle it this way:

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief. Did she really mean it?

It may seem a little confusing with that short example, but when you use the style consistently it works. It completely dispenses with the need for quotation marks, special formatting like italics, and also tags. The tags are implied.

 

[oggbashan]

I think is not so much a lit rule but a practice recommended by style books.

I almost always follow it which makes my pages full of spaces. BUT I wouldn't do it for a short remark in the middle of action:

Chloe jumped up and kissed me "Like this," she said as she continued to demonstrate.

It would be unnecessarily pedantic to set it:

Chloe jumped up and kissed me.

"Like this," she said

As she continued to demonstrate.

 

[stickygirl]

They're quotation marks.

Concerning your way of handling internal dialogue -- that's one way of doing it. Another is to use italics. But I'm increasingly gravitating toward the free indirect style where I just incorporate it into the narrative, which is kept close to the person's perspective. So I would handle it this way:

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief. Did she really mean it?

It may seem a little confusing with that short example, but when you use the style consistently it works. It completely dispenses with the need for quotation marks, special formatting like italics, and also tags. The tags are implied.

We call 'em inverted commas over here
bananas, potatoes, aluminium...
Lets call the whole thing orf

 

[8letters]

Clarity and consistency.
We all appreciate long paragraph can make for difficult reading, especially on public transport - try it. Equally, sticking slavishly to a separate para break for every time a speaker makes another point is irritating.

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief. "What made you change your mind?"

is simpler than

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief.

"What made you change your mind?" he asked.

The alternative I'd use is:
Peter smiled with relief.

"I'm pleased to hear you say that. What made you change your mind?"

'I wonder if she really meant that?' he mused.

I've moved to avoiding quotations mark for anything but dialog. Internal thoughts I put into italics.

I would also avoid doing something like:

"Talk to Fred," said Michael. "He's the man with the dog."

So I walked over to "man with the dog" Fred.

I avoid that because anytime I see quotation marks, I assume dialog. I'd go with So I walked over to man-with-the-dog Fred.

 

[ElectricBlue]

"I'm pleased to hear you say that," Peter replied with a smile of relief. Did she really mean it?

It may seem a little confusing with that short example, but when you use the style consistently it works. It completely dispenses with the need for quotation marks, special formatting like italics, and also tags. The tags are implied.

Agree this. The context should make it clear that it's a thought, and whose thought it is. Plain text works. I can think of several good novels that were written on type-writers.

 

[SimonDoom]

That plain text works with several novels doesn't mean there's anything wrong with using the tools that have been provided for us. I've also read several stories on Lit that made great use of several text-formatting options. Stories where formatting provided added value.

Yes, there are plenty of examples in stories of all kinds where those tools have been used effectively. There's no "right" answer. But what I've found is that when I dispense with formatting it forces me to focus more on word choice, and I find that to be a useful exercise, and I prefer the way my writing turns out when I focus my energy in that direction.

 

[ElectricBlue]

That plain text works with several novels doesn't mean there's anything wrong with using the tools that have been provided for us. I've also read several stories on Lit that made great use of several text-formatting options. Stories where formatting provided added value.

I agree, but so many people seem to overlook simple techniques, and try too hard with bells and whistles. As this thread shows, people can go down meaningless garden paths with formats and such, when all they need to do is pay more attention to their words.

The usual purpose of italics is to add emphasis, not to designate thoughts. Sure, you can do it that way, but there's no need to.