Porn and Hollywood

[CharleyH]

I have just been writing a review on the Hollywood issue of Vanity Fair. The metaphors and ideological visual and text words by Tom Ford are intriguing. I am SHOCKED that his art direction was so sporadic. I am DOUBLY shocked that no one in the news discussed Sienna Miller's topless smoking fetish shot, Viggo Mortensson's foot fetish and especially Reese Witherspoon in baby doll photos. Before I talk further, as I know almost everyone has heard of the cover, what's your impression of the cover and all the PR surrounding it?

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I have just been writing a review on the Hollywood issue of Vanity Fair. The metaphors and ideological visual and text words by Tom Ford are intriguing. I am SHOCKED that his art direction was so sporadic. I am DOUBLY shocked that no one in the news discussed Sienna Miller's topless smoking fetish shot, Viggo Mortensson's foot fetish and especially Reese Witherspoon in baby doll photos. Before I talk further, as I know almost everyone has heard of the cover, what's your impression of the cover and all the PR surrounding it?

Not everyone. Haven't seen it or hgeard about it.

 

[CharleyH]

Not everyone. Haven't seen it or hgeard about it.

Ok so not Colly. www.vanityfair.com

 

[TxRad]

Ok so not Colly. www.vanityfair.com

Me either..... I didn't even know they still published VanityFair.......

Live and learn I guess.....

 

[CharleyH]

Me either..... I didn't even know they still published VanityFair.......

Live and learn I guess.....

Am I talking to wankers here! Too bad, Tex and Colly, the issue really blends a lot of porn conventions into the Hollywood mix. It's interesting , especially the implications of porn in the mainstream - but only to me, perhaps. Thanks for responding.

 

[MissBri]

 

[CharleyH]

I hadn't heard of it either, but it looks interestin'.

 

[Liar]

I have just been writing a review on the Hollywood issue of Vanity Fair. The metaphors and ideological visual and text words by Tom Ford are intriguing. I am SHOCKED that his art direction was so sporadic. I am DOUBLY shocked that no one in the news discussed Sienna Miller's topless smoking fetish shot, Viggo Mortensson's foot fetish and especially Reese Witherspoon in baby doll photos. Before I talk further, as I know almost everyone has heard of the cover, what's your impression of the cover and all the PR surrounding it?

This cover? Just the cover?

http://www.vanityfair.com/images/main/060207mapr01.jpg

Looks like any ol' perfume ad to me. Would probably upset the occational equalist here due to the uneven male/female skin exposure ratio. But porn influence? Must me an americaln thing to fuss about it.

I fail to see foot fetish or smoking tho, so I don't know if this is the cover you mean?

 

[Guest]

I am curious what it would have looked like if the original three gals did the photo shoot. Having him in there changed it into something - else.

 

[Guest]

 

[CharleyH]

I am curious what it would have looked like if the original three gals did the photo shoot. Having him in there changed it into something - else.

Thanks Liar for the pic and yes, Sarrahhh ... it would have changed it into something different. The original idea was supposed to be three naked chicks in a bed. Ford, on the cover as an art director (dominant) fully clothed with two naked babes turned it into what it has always been for women .... misogyny and male dominance. The excuse for no bed scene with two girls? Too lesbian. From Tom Ford? I AM disappointed. He should have just DONE IT!

 

[cloudy]

Thanks Liar for the pic and yes, Sarrahhh ... it would have changed it into something different. The original idea was supposed to be three naked chicks in a bed. Ford, on the cover as an art director (dominant) fully clothed with two naked babes turned it into what it has always been for women .... misogyny and male dominance. The excuse for no bed scene with two girls? Too lesbian. From Tom Ford? I AM disappointed. He should have just DONE IT!

Actually, I saw an interview with Ford, and the reason that particular photo was changed was because the third girl (forget who it was not), opted out at the last minute.

His photography's beautiful, but I haven't seen the whole issue, just some of the photos.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I subscribe to Harper's.

The cover is delicious and my daughter and I are fighting for possession of it.

For the rest of it, I haven't had time to sit down with it yet...

I don't understand your shock though.

If I happen to hear that Viggo Mortenson has a foot fetish, it strikes me as a matter of personal taste- and also, a nice little background quirk of his personality that may inform his acting ability, hopefully for the better. Why not? In what other way would it matter to me the general public?

 

[CharleyH]

Actually, I saw an interview with Ford, and the reason that particular photo was changed was because the third girl (forget who it was not), opted out at the last minute.

His photography's beautiful, but I haven't seen the whole issue, just some of the photos.

I know, and she was a Canuck, but it was a bed scene and no one knew till they got there I heard. Three chicks in a bed is playful, 2 is lesbian . Saw or read the interview. Not his photos, though, the brilliant Annie Lebowitz (sp) took the cover. Art direction is the IDEA of the pic and the umph behind a shot, Which begs to question who is an artist in a photoshoot?

 

[CharleyH]

I subscribe to Harper's.

The cover is delicious and my daughter and I are fighting for possession of it.

For the rest of it, I haven't had time to sit down with it yet...

I don't understand your shock though.

If I happen to hear that Viggo Mortenson has a foot fetish, it strikes me as a matter of personal taste- and also, a nice little background quirk of his personality that may inform his acting ability, hopefully for the better. Why not? In what other way would it matter to me the general public?

You have misread me.

I am only shocked by Ford's reluctance to go futher in his art direction, as he has always in his own ads. He is my hero, as is Alexander McQueen in the fashion world. My shock is the text he wrote as a lead in to the portfolio and how he never delivered what he promised, or did what was anti-establishment, like he normally does.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I know, and she was a Canuck, but it was a bed scene and no one knew till they got there I heard. Three chicks in a bed is playful, 2 is lesbian . Saw or read the interview. Not his photos, though, the brilliant Annie Lebowitz (sp) took the cover. Art direction is the IDEA of the pic and the umph behind a shot, Which begs to question who is an artist in a photoshoot?

Depends on which of the two is more powerful, the AD or the photographer- it's always a balancing act. I worked as a model for a long time... too damn long... Elite/Casablanca agency.

I've known AD's that trust the photographer, that sketch out the layout- girl goes here, house behind, edge of tree or something, okay? and leave the photographer to make the decisions once he got behind the lens.

I've known others who can not leave the models alone, untill the shoot bogs down- they will try to direct the models, turn this way, that way- but they are not seeing what the photog sees.

Then there are times when the photog and the AD make up such a brilliant team that you can't tell who is making the desicions- it's like magical telepathy.

And sometimes, someone else- the makeup artist, the model, the stylist- becomes de facto AD. (Especially in Japan, where the salaried part of the team are expected to go out drinking with the client the night before, rendering themselves hungover and unfit for work in the morning. I learned to keep miniatures of various likkers in my kit, so I could leave them casually in sight... sometimes we got a little faster start because of that)

And plenty of photographers are their own AD, Annie Liebowitz being one of those... What mostly happens with someone like Annie, is the art director's IDEA is that "we get a few gorgeous young starlets and powder their bodies white, and get Annie Liebowitz to shoot them- and we'll have them laying down, so we can make it a gatefold cover!" Annie being the direction the shoot is to take, you see.

 

[3113]

If I happen to hear that Viggo Mortenson has a foot fetish, it strikes me as a matter of personal taste- and also, a nice little background quirk of his personality that may inform his acting ability

Aragorn and those big-footed hobbits. Do I want to go there? No...I don't think I do....

 

[CharleyH]

Perhaps being a creative director and reluctant model in my previous life makes me a bit curious about your statements.

A model, a make up artist or stylist being a power house in the sum of a photo? No one else has power but the CD and photographer in an great shoot. There are shoots where corporate BS or a star persona/ vanity plays in the shoot, to detriment. Mainly, they are TOLD what to do. It does come down to the photographer and art director, though and that is one aspect of the discussion: whose vision is it in the end? Perhaps it's simply that one can make a statement about it? Perhaps Annie needs more credit than Ford in this instance? I see a touch of Ford in the pics, and a lot of Anniie in the cover and certain pics, but not her ideas. Who is the artist in the Hollywood Vanity Fair issue?

Thanks for the thoughts, Stella.

Depends on which of the two is more powerful, the AD or the photographer- it's always a balancing act. I worked as a model for a long time... too damn long... Elite/Casablanca agency.

I've known AD's that trust the photographer, that sketch out the layout- girl goes here, house behind, edge of tree or something, okay? and leave the photographer to make the decisions once he got behind the lens.

I've known others who can not leave the models alone, untill the shoot bogs down- they will try to direct the models, turn this way, that way- but they are not seeing what the photog sees.

Then there are times when the photog and the AD make up such a brilliant team that you can't tell who is making the desicions- it's like magical telepathy.

And sometimes, someone else- the makeup artist, the model, the stylist- becomes de facto AD. (Especially in Japan, where the salaried part of the team are expected to go out drinking with the client the night before, rendering themselves hungover and unfit for work in the morning. I learned to keep miniatures of various likkers in my kit, so I could leave them casually in sight... sometimes we got a little faster start because of that)

And plenty of photographers are their own AD, Annie Liebowitz being one of those... What mostly happens with someone like Annie, is the art director's IDEA is that "we get a few gorgeous young starlets and powder their bodies white, and get Annie Liebowitz to shoot them- and we'll have them laying down, so we can make it a gatefold cover!" Annie being the direction the shoot is to take, you see.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Perhaps being a creative director and reluctant model in my previous life makes me a bit curious about your statements.

A model, a make up artist or stylist being a power house in the sum of a photo? No one else has power but the CD and photographer in an great shoot. There are shoots where corporate BS or a star persona/ vanity plays in the shoot, to detriment. Mainly, they are TOLD what to do. It does come down to the photographer and art director, though and that is one aspect of the discussion: whose vision is it in the end? Perhaps it's simply that one can make a statement about it? Perhaps Annie needs more credit than Ford in this instance? I see a touch of Ford in the pics, and a lot of Anniie in the cover and certain pics, but not her ideas. Who is the artist in the Hollywood Vanity Fair issue?

Thanks for the thoughts, Stella.

True, true- in a GREAT shoot- but not too many of them are, you know. Some of the shoots where I called the shots ended up in the nationals. But that was near the end of my career, when I really had more knowlege than the people I was working for... I went on to do some stylist work, and later some AD-ing as well, as you can imagine.

I worked with a few of the big names from back in my day ('76-85)Bret Lopez, Norman Seef, Arturo Toscani, Sue Choi, Matthew Ralston... And, yes, those photographers called the shots. In other situations, it might be the AD.

And my point is that it's NOT simple to make a statement about it. It's such a personality-driven biz.

as far as seeing who's finger's in the cover, it looks like Annie to me- she's a very versatile imagist.

 

[3113]

Actually there's be another, new complaint about the picture--that the women's ribs are showing and that they're giving off the anorexia vibe.

I'm not saying yea or nay on it, just reporting what I saw in today's letters section regarding the cover.

 

[3113]

I worked as a model for a long time... too damn long... Elite/Casablanca agency.

Hey, can we see one of your modeling pics? Pretty please? Maybe one of those pics that says, with a French accent: "Look at my impossible, airbrushed lovliness and know that you are not worthy of kissing the hem of my outrageously expensive designer gown...."

Got something like that you could post for us? Pleeeeease?

 

[Stella_Omega]

Hey, can we see one of your modeling pics? Pretty please? Maybe one of those pics that says, with a French accent: "Look at my impossible, airbrushed lovliness and know that you are not worthy of kissing the hem of my outrageously expensive designer gown...."

Got something like that you could post for us? Pleeeeease?

Yeah, I really have to scan and put it all on a gallery somewhere... But, the best photo I ever took was with Matthew Ralston- no makeup at all, and his old sweater to wear!
I hardly EVER got the Impossibly Expensive gowns. I always got the auteur designers, and the New Wave and the first Hip Hop fashions. In Europe, I got the Juniors fashions, I looked more normal there I suppose.
It was such a relief to quit at last- I could take up carpentry and let my facial hair grow out... And finally put those pound on.

 

[3113]

I always got the auteur designers, and the New Wave and the first Hip Hop fashions.

Ah. So your pics had more of a New York accent and said: "I'm the toughest, sexiest street bitch you'll ever meet and you're not worthy to kiss the toe of my incredibly hip shoes. "

Yes?

 

[Stella_Omega]

Ah. So your pics had more of a New York accent and said: "I'm the toughest, sexiest street bitch you'll ever meet and you're not worthy to kiss the toe of my incredibly hip shoes. "

Yes?

Um... yeah, okay! That works!

 

[Stella_Omega]

well, all right- In a massive spasm of narcissistic self-regard, I scanned my last porfolio
Hope you aren't disappointed