politics in poetry

[BooMerengue]

I wrote Stormwash

"Dishonest thunderstorms will smoothly wash the burning radio."

Mama blocks our view outside the house
The Thunderstorms roll loudly toward us
we want to play in the rain we hear coming
Papa screams No! No! and we hear a smashing sound.
I burst past Mama and see Papa
on the ground holding our radio all broken now
as the soldiers laugh and smash
our music, our news. our link to the world
and then the fires started
and the Thunderstorm smoothly rolls away.

because of The Tragedy Of The Sudan

The first sound Zahara Abdulkarim heard when she woke that last morning in her village was the drone of warplanes circling overhead. Then came gunshots and screams and the sickening crash of bombs ripping through her neighbors' mud-and-thatch huts, gouging craters into the dry earth. When Abdulkarim, 25, ran outside, she was confronted by two men in military uniform, one wielding a knife, the other a whip.

I can't help but ask should we (the U.S.A.) be involved in this? But I think a better question would be why aren't we already involved in this? Or are we again already supplying advisors and arms to the oppressors?

 

[Angeline]

I wrote Stormwash

"Dishonest thunderstorms will smoothly wash the burning radio."

Mama blocks our view outside the house
The Thunderstorms roll loudly toward us
we want to play in the rain we hear coming
Papa screams No! No! and we hear a smashing sound.
I burst past Mama and see Papa
on the ground holding our radio all broken now
as the soldiers laugh and smash
our music, our news. our link to the world
and then the fires started
and the Thunderstorm smoothly rolls away.

because of The Tragedy Of The Sudan

The first sound Zahara Abdulkarim heard when she woke that last morning in her village was the drone of warplanes circling overhead. Then came gunshots and screams and the sickening crash of bombs ripping through her neighbors' mud-and-thatch huts, gouging craters into the dry earth. When Abdulkarim, 25, ran outside, she was confronted by two men in military uniform, one wielding a knife, the other a whip.

I can't help but ask should we (the U.S.A.) be involved in this? But I think a better question would be why aren't we already involved in this? Or are we again already supplying advisors and arms to the oppressors?

You read my terzanelle. Don't get me started.

 

[BooMerengue]

jog my memory, would ya? I've read a zillion poems lately!

 

[Angeline]

Well...

there's this--

Soldiers
by Angeline ©

Is it very hot there? Do these people care
Past flags and dollars, conference rooms
In fortresses of fountain pens, chilled air?

Beyond the silk-draped windows lie the tombs
Of soldiers, lessons resting in the bone,
Past flags and dollars, conference rooms.

Are walls inscribed and figures made of stone,
Rifles raised and years surveyed in wordless eyes
Of soldiers, lessons resting in the bone

While smiles reach out for honor like a prize,
Fingers never feeling quiet cities, wind, birdcall,
Rifles raised and years surveyed in wordless eyes.

The clink of glass, ring of voices mask the fall,
Leaves scraping cross the thaw and rock
Fingers never feeling quiet cities, wind, birdcall.

Leaves scraping cross the thaw and rock,
Silenced by the ticking of the doomsday clock.
Is it very hot there? Do these people care
In fortresses of fountain pens, chilled air

and this:

Spangled Pride
by Angeline ©

Always old men lost
in blue flickers of remembrance
gamble on someone else's
untested bravery.

Vicarious misplaced
pridemongers wave freedom,
but someone else blooms
deadly in bloody remove
from the recliner.

War is safe shielded
by cigar smoke. The mist
of a cold one makes it
vaporous.

On the History Channel
even GI Joe can storm Normandy,
lose a leg, and charge renewed
to the next rerun.

No sand-gritty boots.
No sweltering fear.
No shots in chaotic carnivals
deconstructing to confusion
and tear-stained orphans,
who know nothing of nations
or resources caught unfurled,
star spangled.


and this:


Glossolalia

My voice is speaking
in tongues you cannot hear,
or will not listen
to voices crying over and over.

This is not glory.
This false hubris

is dead faces in gas masks
or bodies falling from boats
and filling the Atlantic,

where daddy was a medic in the
Third Wave.

There was no glory,
he said to me
or the night sky.

There was no honor.
Just death and surf,
and death and sand,
and death and death.

Innocence ripped
from exhausted boys,
knee deep in malaria
in north Africa and Bataan.

In Mei Lai the flames of children
screaming in Treblinka
or vaporized flash gone
in Nagasaki.

Children rolling over deserts
rife with land mines,
the legless ones who never walked,
hollow eyes in camps,
hordes hungering in mountain passes.

And even senseless children firing
the last of their innocence
at children sprawled
on the thorns of death
over art history and
organic chemistry books
on a warm spring morning.

We march into the unknown
only to discover
what mothers always know:

It’s just someone else’s child.

It’s all the same in the end,
all this marching
and cheering and waving
goes on and on and on,
but nobody ever owns
the world.


You get the idea. I believe in this:



http://users.rcn.com/lizard.nai/peacesign.JPG

 

[twelveoone]

I wrote Stormwash

"Dishonest thunderstorms will smoothly wash the burning radio."

Mama blocks our view outside the house
The Thunderstorms roll loudly toward us
we want to play in the rain we hear coming
Papa screams No! No! and we hear a smashing sound.
I burst past Mama and see Papa
on the ground holding our radio all broken now
as the soldiers laugh and smash
our music, our news. our link to the world
and then the fires started
and the Thunderstorm smoothly rolls away.

...is always a dangerous thing, this however, is a wonderful thing. I question the use of the word "smoothly"

 

[BooMerengue]

the Thunderstorms are the invading soldiers... tanks, gunfire etc. If you were an invader and you just annihilated a tribe like you were supposed to do, don't you think you'd be kinda smug or 'smooth' as you left the ruins behind?

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Re: Re: politics in poetry

...is always a dangerous thing

Why?

 

[BooMerengue]

thank you.

 

[BooMerengue]

thank you.


nothing personal twelveoone, but I believe poetry is a perfect place for politics. what's more emotional? and isn't poetic expression all about emotion?

 

[Angeline]

Re: Re: Re: politics in poetry

Why?

if you watched the debate last night, you'd say it's a stupid thing.

 

[BooMerengue]

*banging my head on the desk...

May I ask why?

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Re: Re: Re: politics in poetry

Why?

Seriously. Man is a political animal. It's an essential part of human nature.

Poetry is, before anything else, communication. It offers a medium to share a message and a personal experience of hope, of despair, of conformity, of possibility, free from the barrage of misinformation, doublespeak and rhetoric of partisan politics and media. It constitutes a privileged vehicle to record your time, your society, your environment, your anguishes, your afflictions. If you can't extract a political statement from everything you write, some sort of social commentary, what is the fucking point? What drives you to write? Why should I waste a second of my time reading it?

Mixing politics in poetry is dangerous? Hell, yes! Writing is dangerous.

The alternative, though, is far worse.

I know it's a bit corny to quote myself, but to write is to wrap your soul in a body of explosives, Al Qaeda-style.

 

[BooMerengue]

Not to be facetious but politics have been in play since Eve won out over Lilith.

War is the birthchild of politics gone awry.

Poetry is one of many ways of expressing the joy or tribulations in our lives.

twelveoone... participate here. A dignified exchange of ideas is politics at it's best.

But there is no escaping the politics in our lives. Even the most primitive tribes in existence are political.

So why aren't the bleeding heart Americans in Dharfur?

 

[BlueskyBeauty]

Re: Re: Re: Re: politics in poetry

Seriously. Man is a political animal. It's an essential part of human nature.

Poetry is, before anything else, communication. It offers a medium to share a message and a personal experience of hope, of despair, of conformity, of possibility, free from the barrage of misinformation, doublespeak and rhetoric of partisan politics and media. It constitutes a privileged vehicle to record your time, your society, your environment, your anguishes, your afflictions. If you can't extract a political statement from everything you write, some sort of social commentary, what is the fucking point? What drives you to write? Why should I waste a second of my time reading it?

Mixing politics in poetry is dangerous? Hell, yes! Writing is dangerous.

The alternative, though, is far worse.



I know it's a bit corny to quote myself, but to write is to wrap your soul in a body of explosives, Al Qaeda-style.

mmm mmm mmm..you need to run for office!

 

[twelveoone]

Not to be facetious but politics have been in play since Eve won out over Lilith.

War is the birthchild of politics gone awry.

Poetry is one of many ways of expressing the joy or tribulations in our lives.

twelveoone... participate here. A dignified exchange of ideas is politics at it's best.

But there is no escaping the politics in our lives. Even the most primitive tribes in existence are political.

So why aren't the bleeding heart Americans in Dharfur?

I must of touched a button, I think your poem is fine, better than fine. I believe it was YDD said once in a critique that you lose half your audience, I agree if it does not raise above a message. What I saw above was not Politics it was Humanity, very well written, if it had a political agenda behind it, all the better.
Back to politics, Ezra Pound wrote poety, Ezra Pound hated Jews, Ezra Pound wrote politicised poetry about Jew hatred. There have been other cases of "poets" inciting race hatred (politics).
Again, what you wrote was Humanity not Politics.
Now, if you want to write about politics, go ahead, I do. I am not beyond that.

Here is an excerpt from something I am writing that has alot of politics in it, Loomis gets mentioned a couple of times
"but politics have been in play since Eve won out over Lilith. "
So let's go back to the root of the problem
A PRAYER
O lord- Sophia
In the next genesis
Send us an easier snake
With the fruit of wisdom for the dumb woman
To tempt her even dumber man
No knowledge, no knowledge,
no knowledge, nevermore,
Amen

Well, that should provoke some

 

[BooMerengue]

lol provocation is a GOOD thing.

My poem however was meant to be political. Thats why I included the accompanying article. My question is "Are US politics keeping us from doing the humane thing in The Sudan simply because we have nothing to gain there? (read- O I L)"

 

[Lauren Hynde]

What I saw above was not Politics it was Humanity

How do you make the distinction? In fact, isn't the implication that such distinction exists an even more dangerous political statement, which not only alienates but adds insult to that other half of your audience?

Back to politics, Ezra Pound wrote poety, Ezra Pound hated Jews, Ezra Pound wrote politicised poetry about Jew hatred. There have been other cases of "poets" inciting race hatred (politics).

What are the implications of this? Do the politicised poems lack artistic integrity because their content? Do the non-politicised poems lack integrity because of their author? Or does poetry - or does art - lift itself above politics? Does the danger you were talking about lie on the politic those poems defend or does it lie in the poems themselves?

Is mixing poetry and politics dangerous to whom?

A PRAYER
O lord- Sophia
In the next genesis
Send us an easier snake
With the fruit of wisdom for the dumb woman
To tempt her even dumber man
No knowledge, no knowledge,
no knowledge, nevermore,
Amen

Well, that should provoke some

I'm feeling provoked by the use of "Sophia" - it seems dislocated, a concept you wanted to include but couldn't figure out where. Please explain.

 

[twelveoone]

I'm feeling provoked by the use of "Sophia" - it seems dislocated, a concept you wanted to include but couldn't figure out where. Please explain.

Sophia - Gnostic Archetype of Feminine Wisdom, in some schools the original creator

 

[twelveoone]

lol provocation is a GOOD thing.

My poem however was meant to be political. Thats why I included the accompanying article. My question is "Are US politics keeping us from doing the humane thing in The Sudan simply because we have nothing to gain there? (read- O I L)"

if you wish, and you are probably right.
I saw something sad

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Sophia - Gnostic Archetype of Feminine Wisdom, in some schools the original creator

I know, but how does it fit the construct of the poem?

 

[twelveoone]

How do you make the distinction? In fact, isn't the implication that such distinction exists an even more dangerous political statement, which not only alienates but adds insult to that other half of your audience?

What are the implications of this? Do the politicised poems lack artistic integrity because their content? Do the non-politicised poems lack integrity because of their author? Or does poetry - or does art - lift itself above politics? Does the danger you were talking about lie on the politic those poems defend or does it lie in the poems themselves?

What do you want to put first, a person, the state, or even worse some great idea. At worst, some person may run amuck kill a couple dozen people, the state a couple of million, its the great ideas that bring it up into the 10's of millions. At best, another person will bring out the best of humanity in you. State may toss you a check, that it stole from somebody else. Now what has any great idea done for me? You?
Now as far as Ezra goes, he was full of great ideas, looks like pretty much 800 pages of bullshit to me, not that there is anything wrong with bullshit, I've generated quite a bit, it makes great fertilizer...sometimes for the mind.
The problem with politics is that nobody is right, and the tendency to focus on a grand scale either compounds the problem or creates a different set of problems.
Let me ask both of you, what are the most important things in your life?
Another person? Who wins the elections? Or god (whoever it is? - heh, heh) forbid some idea of what the world should be.
Pablo Neruda was a poet
Pablo Neruda was Stalinist
Pablo Neruda wrote "political" poems the focused on the suffering in Spain, or humanity.
I'm not sure if Pablo Neruda wrote any "I love communism" poems, I haven't come across any.
And Neruda is noted for what kind of poetry?
The things that matters most to you are?
What are your solutions?
I am rather flattered that you think I made a dangerous political statement. Which one was it?

 

[twelveoone]

I know, but how does it fit the construct of the poem?

Had to have a prayer to some god, she's was perhaps the best, no? She is the identified both as the creator and with wisdom and with a sect of christianity. I love the idea of a prayer for "no knowledge" to a gnostic figure. Was that the question? Or where does the entire thing fit? Parts allude to the unholy union of church and state, that part precedes a genesis of sorts.
Knowlege no good, wisdom ok, must have been dumb of god to leave that tree there.
I saw the Lilith reference...but just imagine suppose we had gotten the easier snake, we really wouldn't be talking about this, would we?
Politics I just don't see as wise, nor do I see slaughtering the next town, because they are different as wise.
But dammit, we sure know how to do it.

 

[Maria2394]

thank you.


I believe poetry is a perfect place for politics. what's more emotional? and isn't poetic expression all about emotion?

Boo, you couldnt be more right in my opinion. Think back on all teh poets who wrote about war, and horror and death and how those poets are revered today, because they had the courage to speak up, some of them were persecuted and artists of all genre are still being persecuted, labeled and scorned.

WE have a voice and we speak it, it is our job to tell the world the truth in words they can relate to and understand on an emotional level. we are communicators and politics affect everyone on this planet, and we can communicate to everyone involved about our human situation, what could ever be more relevant?



great thread

 

[BooMerengue]

twelveoone said "Let me ask both of you, what are the most important things in your life?
Another person? Who wins the elections? Or god (whoever it is? - heh, heh) forbid some idea of what the world should be."

The most important thing in my life varies throughout my day. When I first wake up it's my cigarette. And so on throught the day.

When I'm writing a poem, or a letter or an essay, tho, I want my prayers to come thru. And I pray always that my Grandsons get to live in a world without strife, lies, hunger etc.

In order for that to happen I have to understand the political world around me. In America we have some control over that. Not a lot. But more than most other countries. And so I try to pay attention to what's going on in the world.

If my poem alerts people to a sad thing going on in North Africa thats good. But... if my poem makes people go look to see whats going on in North Africa and then call their representatives to task on it, than that is waaay better. So...

Yes- my poem is about more inhumanity. But my poem is really about "wake the fuck up someone and STOP this!" And thats why it's political, and thats good.

I'm not well read as far as Pound and Neruda. But Dickens. Man he can sure write a great story, right? And his stories are a scathing indictment of the politics of his day.

Certainly I write poems about nonsense. But I think anyone who has a chance to be heard on any level owes it to himself to try to better his own environment.

Peace. y'all!

 

[BooMerengue]

By the way. This thread is not about my poem or it's content. Thats already been done. It's about Dharfur. It's about Big Brother American Gov't. and it's choices of when to get involved and when not. And why...

And it's not just for Americans. American politics are more and more spilling over onto the rest of the world, thereby giving the rest of the world the right to speak their own minds.

I guess the thread topic is misleading. I'm sorry.