Now that the monthly contests are back...

[Aynmair]

I think all these contests are unfairly biased in favor of people who write well. How are those of us with no talent supposed to compete? I work just as hard as any of the contest winners - even harder maybe. Why should they get all the wealth and fame just because people like their writing better?

When I see the scores that some of the barely literate trash attracts on Lit, I am not sure that you are right.

And if you are talking only about contest entries, then of course the best-written should be right up there. It is writing contest, not a work-out contest.

I read walkerlong's post as entirely tongue in cheek - well done.

 

[walkerlong]

au contrare. The voting system here is a sieve for manipulative voting. The unfair bias is toward those who know how to post votes without having them swept away.

How did you discover this? Did you have to waterboard a contest winner until they confessed?

 

[squirrelzo]

I completely agree with this. It bothers me more for the "Top Lists" than the monthly contests (not even sure what those are.)

"Top Stories on Lit" should be top stories on lit!--not "parts" of top stories, not endless "fragments" of top stories. It irks me to no end to see these top lists taken up with freakin' 50 chapters of the SAME story.

I think that's a good solution, although I think the first chapter/intro often serves as a standalone story.

The reason individual chapters shouldn't be included is because they aren't a story. They're part of a story. I'd much rather see chaptered stories only become eligible on the day they're completed, and the criteria used an average of the performance of the entire story.

 

[RoyceConnors]

If a chaptered story is done well, each chapter is a story unto itself. If 50 chs. of the same story make up the Top Lists, then that writer has put forth something worth reading and is well liked by many.
I write chaptered stories and mine take up the Top Lists in either cat I'm in. Some chs. do better than others, because readers liked what was in that chapter more than other ones, so they're judging each chapter individually and not as a whole story, so the contests have to be judged just the same.
It's about the quality of what's written, not whether it's a single story or a chapter of one.
Chaptered stories tend to do better, because there's more depth to them, owing to the length and ability to create more of a story.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

I've been hanging round this place for longer than I can remember and have sadly watched it sink from a bubbly, happy forum to a cesspit of vituperation.

Contests used to be regarded as a bit of frothy fun. No-one cared much but loved it if, by chance, they bumped into a blue W. Money prizes? Hardly worth busting a gut about.

Scouries was great in getting the site to exclude chaptered stories from special contests. But that was all that was required.

'Chaptered stories' usually aren't. They are like a series of episodes of Law & Order or House. The real point being made here is to stop the soap opera effect - not against splitting a contiguous story into bite-size parts. Royce Connors is in the TV series mode not the literary world.

I guess that most active members here split into two camps - those that are ecstatic in getting their work on the site and those quasi-professionals who are hoping to sell their work. Lit supports both groups .

My suggestion for unblocking the top lists is to only allow the first post to be included and make readers click the following chapters.

P.S. Sr,

The voting system was overhauled by manu and is far less manipulative than before.

btw, don't flaunt what you don't know. I think you meant 'au contraire' not the gibberish you wrote.

 

[squirrelzo]

I write chaptered series, too and I still feel the same way.

Its not quite true that they rank higher because they are better written. There's usually far less votes coming from a built in fan base. The audience is so different. Its really comparing apples and oranges.

Id like to see a totally separate list for Chapters. It will be entirely taken up with Chapters and it will look meaningless and silly, but at least the silliness will have its own place.

If a chaptered story is done well, each chapter is a story unto itself. If 50 chs. of the same story make up the Top Lists, then that writer has put forth something worth reading and is well liked by many.
I write chaptered stories and mine take up the Top Lists in either cat I'm in. Some chs. do better than others, because readers liked what was in that chapter more than other ones, so they're judging each chapter individually and not as a whole story, so the contests have to be judged just the same.
It's about the quality of what's written, not whether it's a single story or a chapter of one.
Chaptered stories tend to do better, because there's more depth to them, owing to the length and ability to create more of a story.

 

[sr71plt]

How did you discover this? Did you have to waterboard a contest winner until they confessed?

More simple than that: I'm driven by long-term observation, long-term research, and common sense. I know, I know, a silly thing to do on the Internet.

 

[Sammael Bard]

Now that the monthly contests have been resurrected it has become more painfully obvious than ever that chapter stories have an unfair advantage.

Everyone who has a basic understanding of scoring will tell you Chapter stories have an unfair advantage when it comes to score especially long running ones.

The advantage is that in a chapter series people decide if they like it or not so by 3 or 4 you already see score increases and past that the scores are very high because the only people reading it are ones that like the series, people who were not interested wandered off.

Less trolls more fans that by a certain point are giving automatic five votes

I agree with that.

If this trend remains unchecked, then I feel that some authors will hog the limelight for more than 3-4 months. I can name a few to prove my point.

Fans outnumber trolls in a long running series is a good observation. I recently read a story from an author who has continued her story after a gap of 6 months.

Believe it or not, with 288 votes, it jumped to the top of that Category hall of fame the very next day. It wasn't that good as compared to her earlier works and felt a bit rushed, but that didn't stop the bombardment of 5* from her loyal fans.

Individual, stand-alone stories should be considered for monthly contests.

But....

That means that those who want to win monthly contests will have to abstain from posting a series, and compress it into a novel and.....since yearly contests don't allow chapters, I think authors can kiss that W goodbye from their series submission.

Aaaargh.

I'm pretty confused.

I support writing longer stories into chapters but I feel as if I'm hacking off my own foot in this matter.

Either way, it rests on the shoulders of the moderator to decide upon this issue.

Yes, we can provide inputand stuff but it's up to her to decide.

So, I think I might abstain from voting.

 

[lovecraft68]

I mentioned I sent e-mails to the October/November winners.

I received this today from one of them.


I did find it and just sent Laurel a message. I really appreciate you mentioning it! I never would have thought to check that thread, especially since it has been so long since I posted that chapter. It does seem a little disingenuous to expect people to know to check those threads three years after the fact, and then give us 60 days to contact them to boot!


Very happy I could get this person their money.

But they came up with a very good word for this crap.

Seriously, of the 21 winners announced since the sudden return of these contests how many do you think are coming forward? Very little of this money is being paid out and its not fair, at least when they are this old.

All the time I assume it takes to shuffle through a months worth of stories and there can't be three minute(one per) to send an e-mail to the winner?

Odds are they will still keep some money, some people just wander off never to return, but at least an effort was made.

To me, just dump the damn things. They went away with no announcement and no reason and returned the same way mostly due to some griping.

But yet the griping that has been going on for years about the chapter entries not being allowed was totally unheeded and again, the return is for show this money is staying with the site.

Back where I grew up this was referred to as "Mighty white of you"

 

[BuckyDuckman]

I think all these contests are unfairly biased in favor of people who write well. How are those of us with no talent supposed to compete? I work just as hard as any of the contest winners - even harder maybe. Why should they get all the wealth and fame just because people like their writing better?

Fuck it all. I think the site should just award random "Laurel & Manu" prizes each month based on whatever criteria L & M want to use for that particular month. They could include a short note on the homepage highlighting the winners with that month's reason. Here are a few suggestions:

Our favorite story of the month . . .
Story that most made us cringe . . .
Story with the most favorites . . .
Story with the highest percentage of likes vs views . . .
Most creative use of the word "turtle." (Who doesn't love a turtle?)
Story by an author we really like who never wins shit . . .
Story by an author we hate, but, for whatever reason, everyone else likes them. . .
Biggest pain in the ass away (Non-anal)
Award for the worst grammar and most mistakes . . .
Award for someone because we like to give out awards award . . .
Best brown noser award . . .
Award for the story most likely to piss off Scouries . . .
Best "new submitter" award for this month . . .
Best "been here forever" award . . .
Best "We'll publish anything and this proves it" award . . .
Best story by someone with a female appearing pen-name . . .
Best story by someone with too many alts . . .
Most frequent use of the letter "Q" award . . .

If nothing else, the awards would be fun and give people LOTS of things to scratch their heads over.

 

[sr71plt]

That would require more effort when not enough effort already is going into it. That's rather the major point here.

 

[lovecraft68]

Fuck it all. I think the site should just award random "Laurel & Manu" prizes each month based on whatever criteria L & M want to use for that particular month. They could include a short note on the homepage highlighting the winners with that month's reason. Here are a few suggestions:

Our favorite story of the month . . .
Story that most made us cringe . . .
Story with the most favorites . . .
Story with the highest percentage of likes vs views . . .
Most creative use of the word "turtle." (Who doesn't love a turtle?)
Story by an author we really like who never wins shit . . .
Story by an author we hate, but, for whatever reason, everyone else likes them. . .
Biggest pain in the ass away (Non-anal)
Award for the worst grammar and most mistakes . . .
Award for someone because we like to give out awards award . . .
Best brown noser award . . .
Award for the story most likely to piss off Scouries . . .
Best "new submitter" award for this month . . .
Best "been here forever" award . . .
Best "We'll publish anything and this proves it" award . . .
Best story by someone with a female appearing pen-name . . .
Best story by someone with too many alts . . .
Most frequent use of the letter "Q" award . . .

If nothing else, the awards would be fun and give people LOTS of things to scratch their heads over.

First I'll echo Pilot, way too much work for a max profit, minimum effort site

Second, at least now the contests are (supposedly) based on reader votes. The way you have it two people will be deciding all of them.

 

[BuckyDuckman]

First I'll echo Pilot, way too much work for a max profit, minimum effort site

Second, at least now the contests are (supposedly) based on reader votes. The way you have it two people will be deciding all of them.

You're both right (what?! Pilot AND LC?) - but think of the endless bickering! The amazing amount of hurt feelings, the massive opportunities for finger-pointing and griping about how arbitrary results happen to be!

Or, kick back and enjoy the humor of my suggestion for how it was meant - very tongue-in-cheek.

I'd say I'm losing my touch at humor, except few would believe I ever HAD a touch.

 

[lovecraft68]

You're both right (what?! Pilot AND LC?) - but think of the endless bickering! The amazing amount of hurt feelings, the massive opportunities for finger-pointing and griping about how arbitrary results happen to be!.

All the above is why scouries is here. To promote bickering and finger pointing.

 

[Sammael Bard]

Okay, I do have a question.

Do you really think that this poll will be heeded by the moderator?

 

[sr71plt]

Okay, I do have a question.

Do you really think that this poll will be heeded by the moderator?

The answer to that should be obvious since this forum doesn't have a moderator. But, yes, I think it will go unheeded by the Web site administrators. Although I wouldn't doubt it if, after having had a spurt of contest updates from over two years ago, that the updates just go dormant again.