Now that Bush has got his own blood lust up...

[p_p_man]

he's becoming more of a threat to world peace than he was before all this started.

Here you have a man who loves to speak in homely, folksy phrases, who seems to see himself as a cross between the Lone Ranger and Indiana Jones and who, in the last few weeks has completely destroyed one stone-age country in the pursuit of a single individual.

The very fragile coalition that was built up between America and the rest of the world is now close to breaking down completely. The bandits of the Northern Alliance are putting their collective foot down and saying, in effect "Thanks for your help but we don't need you now. Piss off!" and the Western world is looking at Bush and hearing his words with something akin to disbelief. The Islamic world is being what the Islamic world always has been and probably always will be. A tight collection of religious zealots.

I'm not sure he actually wants to catch bin Laden. The longer the man stays free and out of touch then the longer it gives Bush a reason to start settling old scores.

The Sudan, Aden, Somalia, Lybia, Iraq are all becoming legitimate targets in Bush's eyes. And after them, who next? Cuba, Vietnam, Sierra Leone? Any country small enough not to be able to retalliate on anything like equal footing to the US?

He is reverting to type. Don't like Kyoto? Walk away from it. In the pockets of the oil barons? Drill Alaska. Want to buy votes? Give everyone a tax rebate. Want to show how America is the real world leader? Exhume the old Star Wars concept

Want to settle old scores? Chase a will-o'-wisp around the globe for the next hundred years...

He won't be allowed to get away with it of course. The rest of the world won't let him.

And it's then, when he is opposed by the international community, that he will be quite capable of becoming even more dangerously extreme...

 

[miles]

he's becoming more of a threat to world peace than he was before all this started.

pee pee, can we please discuss the facts instead of your wrong- end- of- the -binoculars view of the world? I know, the facts are boring.. Rhetoric is so much more fun.

You have no shame, old boy.

 

[Guest]

dont forget enron!

bush's pal Ken Lay blew up the stock market hiding his off the book accounts while he was busy picking bush's energy executives for him. bin laden saved bush from a big scandal.

 

[Moridin187]

::raises his hand:: I would like to make one point p p. Although I'm not a Dubya fan (in fact I'm one of his biggest detractors), I thought I should mention that not Every country is getting away from us. Your island is jumping right on the boat when it comes to attacking Iraq.

 

[InnesLane]

The Islamic world is being what the Islamic world always has been and probably always will be. A tight collection of religious zealots.

This is more than a bit stereotypical, and doesn't help your argument a bit. No doubt you lost a lot of folks right here, including (almost) me.

I'm not sure he actually wants to catch bin Laden. The longer the man stays free and out of touch then the longer it gives Bush a reason to start settling old scores.

But you won be back with your very next sentence. This scares me too. Papa Bush has a scorecard, and a lost administration to set to rights, and George W is loading his popgun.

 

[InnesLane]

The Islamic world is being what the Islamic world always has been and probably always will be. A tight collection of religious zealots.

This is more than a bit stereotypical, and doesn't help your argument a bit. No doubt you lost a lot of folks right here, including (almost) me.

I'm not sure he actually wants to catch bin Laden. The longer the man stays free and out of touch then the longer it gives Bush a reason to start settling old scores.

But you won me back with your very next sentence. This scares me too. Papa Bush has a scorecard, and a lost administration to set to rights, and GeorgeW is loading his popgun.

 

[InnesLane]

huh...now how the hell did I do that? TWO posts?

leave it to a newbie...sorry about that

 

[Moridin187]

Well, if we're gonna discuss what Bin Laden is doing for Bush, don't forget.. Before September 11th he had a record low on his approval rating, afterwards he hit the highest ever....

 

[felixdakat]

wrong end of the binoculars

i'm afraid that the wrong end of the binoculars is probaly the right end to look through when dealing with global politics. we all want our country to be in the right, but sadly our government is probaly the most corupt when it comes to the consideration of other countries. we live in a country where the media is no longer truth driven, but has reverted to the same motivation as most of this country, economicly driven ceo's will only run stories that will gain them public support. the truth doesn't sell any more, only a glamorized view of our countrys glory will sell to the general public. no one wants to believe the truth, which is that americans in general are foolisih and bostfull. we talk big, we act big, and we fight big. we have burned the idea that bigger is better into the back of our skulls. so remember that the next time you read the paper or watch cnn.

what i think bush is trying to do is create a christian orriented world. this is all politics, the christians tend to vote republican, it's as old as the the anglocin church. the church holds a large percent of the vote, despite the christian views that war is wrong, most christians will back a war against another religion. in fact they've been doing it for thousands of years. bush is not crazy, more likely he's an emptyheaded pupet with a "royal visere" whispering in his ear. so it's not his sanity, but his counselors that we should be more concerned with.

 

[felixdakat]

he may be closer with the religious zealots remark then you might think.... remember, not all countrys have the education that we have, nor do they have the freedom to chose there own religion. what's left a million people with no other choice then to believe their leader and hope they can stay out of hell. bin laden speaks, his people listen.

 

[WriterDom]

bullshit alert

Well, if we're gonna discuss what Bin Laden is doing for Bush, don't forget.. Before September 11th he had a record low on his approval rating, afterwards he hit the highest ever....

Actually I think his approval rating was higher than Clinton or Reagan at the same point in their administration. Light years away from Carter's 27% or so.

 

[p_p_man]

Well, if we're gonna discuss what Bin Laden is doing for Bush, don't forget.. Before September 11th he had a record low on his approval rating, afterwards he hit the highest ever....

What you're confusing here is a surge in national patriotism with an increase in Bush's popularity.

To fight a war in the name of patriotism is inevitably followed by increased ratings for the boss.

It doesn't make the boss correct.

And in Bush's case I think it makes him positively dangerous.

 

[InnesLane]

Re: wrong end of the binoculars

the christians tend to vote republican

Hate to burst your bubble, but I voted for McGovern way back before terrorism was a word...AND I can say a full rosary (courtesy of an Italian mama)...so please keep your generalizations to yourself.

The VAST majority of labor union members are both Christian and Democratic. Which Christians were you referring to? Pat Robertson isn't representative of most of us, you know.

 

[PowerOfOne]

To p_p_man

p_p_man, just out of idle curiosity....terrorists, with the backing and strategy of Bin Laden, killed over 5000 people here. Not all were Americans. You have a lot to say for someone that is not sitting in the hot seat, so tell me...What would YOU do?

 

[felixdakat]

i was refering to all christians, and i knew that that generalization might get to a few of you, but there are a hundred catogories that christians fall under here are some:

catholic
jahovas witness
protistant
7th day advocast
baptist
this list goes on, but why bother, we all know. and the fact still remains that most of these christians vote the same way.... conservative. why is that??? because billy grahm says so, because benny hin says so, because all of the phoney balogna are also tied to the same economic structure that the george w.'s are tied to. and weather your willing to admit it or not the christian vote says GEORGE BUSH i'm sure that there are those of you who vote liberal, but that is not the majority, it is the minority. and out of curiosity..... what percentage of the union is made up ofpracticing christians?

 

[WriterDom]

Tony Blair is actually another Bush brother who was sent to London as a infant as a sleeper agent.

 

[morninggirl5]

i was refering to all christians, and i knew that that generalization might get to a few of you, but there are a hundred catogories that christians fall under here are some:

catholic
jahovas witness
protistant
7th day advocast
baptist
this list goes on, but why bother, we all know. and the fact still remains that most of these christians vote the same way.... conservative. why is that??? because billy grahm says so, because benny hin says so, because all of the phoney balogna are also tied to the same economic structure that the george w.'s are tied to. and weather your willing to admit it or not the christian vote says GEORGE BUSH i'm sure that there are those of you who vote liberal, but that is not the majority, it is the minority. and out of curiosity..... what percentage of the union is made up ofpracticing christians?

You might want to rethink that sweeping generalization. My entire family is Southern Baptist. Out of the 11 of us who voted in the last election, I was the only one to vote for a Republican. I'm the one that has "gone astray" according to the rest of the family, they're the deacons, ministers, and prayer chain leaders.

By the way, Billy Graham and Binny Hin are the last place the majority of Christians would look to for direction.

Yes, yes, I know, it's a Billy Graham quote in my sig line. I like the quote, the only sermon of his I've ever listened to was the one at the memorial service for the WTC, Pentagon, and Pa victims.

 

[Guest]

our rights

Bush is taking them away as fast as he can. We're in big trouble now.

 

[felixdakat]

i think that's funny.... the billy grahm thing, and it is time for me to keep this generalization to myself. i don't want to argue about it, but i'm sure the people who disagree with me will be quicker to speak then those who agree. any way, i'd like to hear a responce to the general theme of what i was saying instead of nitpicking the details of weather or not your christian family voted for bush or not, i mean isn't that what this is about?

 

[WriterDom]

Someone needs to get your message to Georgia Christians. The republicans haven't held either house of the legislative branch nor had a republican governor since reconstruction.

 

[Jean Val Jean]

Bush stated very clearly from the beginning that getting bin Laden was a first step in a long war, and the world cheered.

p_p_man, do you not hesitate from time to time and think, holy shit, London is one important city, and we're allies of the colonies, and many think it is a possibility they have suitcase nukes, and other nasty devises. Maybe they've drove something in through the tunnel.

Should we just back off, allow the training camps to continue training, Saddam to continue funding, and for the Saudies to continue to play both sides against the middle?

Because you seem to be pretty sure that all of the attacks are aimed at the US only.

Musashi would say, In strategy, it is important to keep a near view of distanced things and a distanced view of near things.

 

[oakleyx4]

what????????

what rights have we lost???????????

 

[Spinaroonie]

PP.... Look at it this way...

If you want to Buy votes. Tell everybody that if you're elected a Cheque for $300 will arrive in your mail box...

Oh wait! Bush already did that! Sorry!

 

[Jean Val Jean]

Better yet, promise everyone over 65, even Bill Gates, free prescription drugs. Promise to soak the evil rich and give the money to the deserving, pure, beautiful poor. Promise to free the African-American man from slavery, which, we all know still really exists. Promise pure, clean air and water with more and more land nationalized to ensure it remains pure and pristine for future generations. Promise to keep that nasty oil and coal in the ground and to convert to electric cars, or better yet, public transportation for everyone. Promise to close the nukes, dissasemble the nukes, and ensure world peace. Promise to destroy those dams, free the fish, and to make the oceans a safer place by ending commercial fishing. Promise to save the spotted owl, the endagered newt, the horned toad, the leftwing fruit fly, the spotted skunk, and the armidillo. Promise to end industry in the US and stop global warming.

In short, send us back to the tee pee, or better yet, promise to rid the world of evil, scheming, despicable mankind and return it to the pure nature that mother earth was meant to be before we came along and polluted it.

 

[p_p_man]

I'm talking about Bush here...

not some credible leader of a democratic country.

Ah yes the Church is part of the Government. The famous Third Estate. Individual members of the Church vote anyway they wish in the US as they do in the UK. But the Church, as a body, tends to be strictly Right Wing.

I don't know whether it has voting rights in Congress or in the Senate but in Britain a number of Bishops are appointed to sit in the House of Lords as part of the Establishment. As a strong organisation in its own right, and as a body that is bound by tradition and religious belief, it tends to be satisfied with the more conservative way of life.

Jean Val Jean Now you're being silly! To buy votes by using bribery on the scale you mention would mean Bush would have to change his political colours and become a Democrat!

Of course the world publicly cheered when Bush announced his "war" on terrorism. America had just received a massive kick in the face and any reported public reaction other then full support for America would appear churlish. Just because Baby Blair leapt in before anyone over here had a chance to find out what was going on, doesn't mean to say we agreed with such a total commitment he made on our behalf.

I happen to think that it personally serves Bush more if bin Laden wasn't found and he could keep his score card going.

Bush sees this not as a revenge against a terrible outrage but as a way of keeping himself and his Government in power. We shall have to wait and see just how popular his ratings are as this "war" drags on and on and on...

Although the Administration made it quite clear in the beginning that the job would be a long one, and quoted "even maybe 10 years", people in the rest of the world were wondering which planet Bush had just come from. Just as one example; the UK, in the present round of British/IRA confrontation have been fighting for the last 60 years.

And even now, in the media, we are hearing the US Government make more frequent announcements about how long the "war" will last as it realises itself what Bush had committed it to before he could be stopped from making off the cuff speeches just after the terrorist attack.

But, apart from that, I feel that Bush has seen, as time passed, a distinct advantage in keeping this thing going and I also think his hawks agree with him. What better excuse to go marching into any country they want than to first warn that country, then bomb it to saturation point then send in ground troops, all because Bush had said that "any country harbouring terrorists" would be considered a legitimate target.

The man's on a roll.

The only thing that would prove my thinking wrong is if biin Laden is captured *dead or alive" or if he is never found at all and Bush suddenly turns off his search and destroy mode.