Not a Trysail Thread

[ishtat]

In these few graphs in the attachment below Edmund Conway (plus sources at Societe Generale and OECD) shows that the position of the Greek economy is far from unique and that pretty much the whole of the first world has indulged in a binge of debt over the past 50 years to fund massive increases in social welfare and state pensions. Their economies are insufficiently robust to repay the debt without politico/social upheaval.

The western economies now find themselves in the position of not being able to afford it. In addition most of them, with the possible exception of the USA are facing a population time bomb. Japan has already started to lose population and most of western Europe is placed to follow them.

20 years ago Communism failed largely because it rotted from within. Will the Social Democracies follow them into failure as they progressively default on their debts or is any democratically elected government capable of restorative measures short of a revolution.?

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/edmundconway/100004906/

Please note that no green was used!

 

[sr71plt]

Still wonder how you are going to fit that into an erotica story hook.

 

[Guest]

Still wonder how you are going to fit that into an erotica story hook.

Add butt sex.

 

[TE999]

The US has been accumulating a crushing amount of debt since the 1960's beginning with LBJ's 'guns and butter' economic strategy and every administration since has only added to it. With Obama's spending spree we may very well have reached the saturation point. Raising taxes to pay for all of this will strangle the emerging economy in it's crib and/or the looming health care burden may do the deed.

Short version: Our income is less than our outgo. Kicking the financial can down the road is careless and irresponsible. Congress needs to cut spending now or our creditors overseas may well do it for us by not buying any more of our paper or calling their markers in. For the US to default on it's debts would precipitate a global economic catastrophe and we'll all be eating dandelion soup.

 

[sr71plt]

Yes, I guess that might work for an erotic hook:

"What's wrong, Candi? Why are you packing?"

"No offense, Sheldon, but your in come is less than my out go. So, hasta lavesta, baby."

 

[The_Fool]

Add butt sex.

Sarahh and butt sex just seem to go cheek to cheek.

 

[Verdad]

In these few graphs in the attachment below Edmund Conway (plus sources at Societe Generale and OECD) shows that the position of the Greek economy is far from unique and that pretty much the whole of the first world has indulged in a binge of debt over the past 50 years to fund massive increases in social welfare and state pensions. Their economies are insufficiently robust to repay the debt without politico/social upheaval.

The western economies now find themselves in the position of not being able to afford it. In addition most of them, with the possible exception of the USA are facing a population time bomb. Japan has already started to lose population and most of western Europe is placed to follow them.

20 years ago Communism failed largely because it rotted from within. Will the Social Democracies follow them into failure as they progressively default on their debts or is any democratically elected government capable of restorative measures short of a revolution.?
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/edmundconway/100004906/

Please note that no green was used!

I don't know, but I am wondering. I'd enjoy hearing what you and others think.

 

[trysail]

In case you haven't noticed, there are some closet dictators 'round this joint whose apparent self-appointed mission in life is to suppress opinion that does not conform to their own.

If they had their way, we would shortly discover that "All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others."

 

[sr71plt]

Domination techniques in a closet. Yes, that has some story hook possibility for a Lit. story too.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Yes, I guess that might work for an erotic hook:

"What's wrong, Candi? Why are you packing?"

"No offense, Sheldon, but your in come is less than my out go. So, hasta lavesta, baby."

Think it's 'Hasta la vista, baby', but I'd never question your editing skills. I assume she wants him to take his underwear off quickly.

 

[sr71plt]

Think it's 'Hasta la vista, baby', but I'd never question your editing skills. I assume she wants him to take his underwear off quickly.

Yeah, I figured what I wrote was wrong--but hardly worth looking up (My languages are German and Mandarin and a smattering of British English). But it's in dialogue, so it's good to go as her bastardized pronunciation.

But you shouldn't complain. It wasn't in the first person.

 

[Pure]

i don't think all the social democracies will succumb, though obvious belt tightening is going to happen. i doubt if the people of, say, Holland, want to be entirely subject to "the market", and give up decision making about the economy and social welfare.

one reason, and it's similar to the content of responses to the original article. there are types of debt. US debts lately and under LBJ were war related. the US is greatly in debt, AND the infrastructure hasn't been attended to. i don't think this affects the social democracies so much. because of the type of their debt, i think they will do better; timing is another factor one responder wrote about. the Greek debt is particularly nasty because of the short term nature of the borrowing. i don't have the figures at hand for the US. do you? IOW is the US going in the direction of shorter and shorter terms on its t-bils and similar securities?


European citizens have the the maturity to link, for example, taxes and roads. in the US, the "reduce taxes" people either ignore the roads, or borrow (issue bonds) to pay for them: 'reduce taxes' and 'shrink the government' continue to dominate the RHETORIC of the right. the government does not ever shrink of course, it merely grows in military related areas, instead of education.

indeed, in the current state, we have 'tea party' types demonstrating against higher taxes, when their taxes have been lowered. so it's hard to see the US in particular, finding a rational solution. so 'forces' and 'the market' will find it. one element is perpetual wars as a solution, as envisioned by orwell.


the other part is less clear: as the Chinese buy parts of the US's economic engine, they'll end up making the hard decisions.

there are foreshadowings of market "solutions" in such states as California. the people will face massive cuts in services, lose libraries, health clinics, face escalating costs in electricity and water. Grover Norquist's chickens will come home to roost: vote the 'lower tax' candidate who figures on borrowing, and see what happens to services.