Native English speakers, question !

[SnoopDog]

I've got a short question for english native speakers.

I've just read something in a thread and I wanted to know what's behind it.

I've came across a phrase like that twice now.

One is, ' ...if he would up and retire...'
The other one is, '...he up and died...'

Now to a non-native speaker the word up doesn't really make sense there. Can someone explain ? Or at least try to bring some sense to it ?

The first one will get a kiss or a dance (you chose)
Thnx.

Snoopy

 

[cloudy]

It's a quick way to say "suddenly" or "unexpectedly."

I'll take the kiss!

 

[lewdandlicentious]

What she said!

You can keep the kiss and the dance!

 

[SnoopDog]

It's a quick way to say "suddenly" or "unexpectedly."

I'll take the kiss!

Thnx so much sweety.

http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/love/love26.gif

Snoopy, not in the mood for just a 'cheek'

 

[Pure]

Here are some related uses of 'up' and 'up to' from Merriam Webster. They have the idea of moving toward, arriving, completing.

up


(1) : going on : taking place <went out to see what was up -- Francis Shean> <begins to realize something is up -- Anne Brooks> (
2) : WRONG, AMISS <there was something up with her voice -- Richard Llewellyn>

3 a : come to an end : COMPLETED, ENDED, TERMINATED <the ringing of a bell in the classroom means that the hour is up -- Ralph Linton> <his term of duty is nearly up -- A.H.Townsend> <the game is up at 15 points>

up to

- up to 1 a : capable of performing or dealing with : competent or able to cope with : capable of <feels she is up to her role in the play> <is now up to seeing visitors> <was up to doing the job in a little over six days -- Robert Bendiner> specifically : capable of carrying without strain <require a horse up to 13 stone -- F.C.Hitchcock> b : aware of and prepared for <should certainly be up to his tricks by this time>

2 : engaged in especially secretly and with intentions that are bad or not altogether good <ferreting out clues as to what he was up to -- R.H.Popkin> <was always up to something -- H.G.Wells>
-------

I agree with posters who mention 'suddenly' as a reasonable reading of 'up and died.'

Another possibility: The idea is of surprise to the speaker. "You'll never guess what happened. He up and joined the army."

It's as if the *speaker* suddenly found out, or is *surprised* to find out.

How quickly the process actually took place might be unknown.

 

[SnoopDog]

Here are some related uses of 'up' and 'up to' from Merriam Webster. The have the idea of moving toward, arriving, completing.

up


(1) : going on : taking place <went out to see what was up -- Francis Shean> <begins to realize something is up -- Anne Brooks> (
2) : WRONG, AMISS <there was something up with her voice -- Richard Llewellyn>

3 a : come to an end : COMPLETED, ENDED, TERMINATED <the ringing of a bell in the classroom means that the hour is up -- Ralph Linton> <his term of duty is nearly up -- A.H.Townsend> <the game is up at 15 points>

up to

- up to 1 a : capable of performing or dealing with : competent or able to cope with : capable of <feels she is up to her role in the play> <is now up to seeing visitors> <was up to doing the job in a little over six days -- Robert Bendiner> specifically : capable of carrying without strain <require a horse up to 13 stone -- F.C.Hitchcock> b : aware of and prepared for <should certainly be up to his tricks by this time>

2 : engaged in especially secretly and with intentions that are bad or not altogether good <ferreting out clues as to what he was up to -- R.H.Popkin> <was always up to something -- H.G.Wells>
-------

I agree with posters who mention 'suddenly' as a reasonable reading of 'up and died.'

Another possibility: The idea is of surprise to the speaker. "You'll never guess what happened. He up and joined the army."

It's as if the *speaker* suddenly found out, or is *surprised* to find out.

How quickly the process actually took place might be unknown.

Thnx a lot for the info Pure.
Since you were not the first one, you can have a the second prize.
A limerick or the dance, you choose.

Snoopy

 

[Guest]

Snoop, this is from the OED online. There are many usages for "up" but your use comes under intransitive verb; I've edited the passage for your interest. P.

up, v. SECOND EDITION, 1989 [f. UP adv.1 Cf. OE. uppian (once), to mount up, rise.]

II. intr.
6. a. To rise to one's feet; to get up from a sitting or recumbent posture; to arise; to rise from bed. Also in fig. context.

1915 C. H. SORLEY Lett. (1919) 255 Suddenly the division ups and marches to Aldershot.

b. colloq. and dial. To start up, come forward, begin abruptly or boldly, to say or do something. Usu. followed by and. Cf. UP adv.1 33.

(a) 1831 S. LOVER Leg. 82 The bishop ups and he tells him that he must mend his manners. 1865 DICKENS Mut. Fr. IV. xiii, Then we both of us ups and says, that minute, ‘Prove so!’ 1867- in general dialect use (Eng. Dial. Dict.).

(b) 1883 STEVENSON Treas. Isl. xxix, And you have the Davy Jones's insolence to up and stand for cap'n over me! 1884 ‘MARK TWAIN’ Huck. Finn xxv, All of a sudden the doctor ups and turns on them. He says: [etc.]. 1898 ‘H. S. MERRIMAN’ Roden's Corner xxvii, A gesture that served..to..invite the Frenchman to up and smite him. 1935 E. E. CUMMINGS Let. 31 Jan. (1969) 135 And he ups and hands Am [Eimi] such a boost as would knock Karl Marx's whiskers out of Benjamin G. Woozeythought's cabinet d'aisance. 1958 ‘A. GILBERT’ Death against Clock 81 So you upped and fled. 1961 O. NASH Coll. Verse 33 One of these days not too remote I'll probably up and cut your throat. 1973 Black World Jan. 62/1 It did no good. I upped and died. 1979 J. RATHBONE Joseph I. i. 20 As soon as we could we upped and fled.

 

[SnoopDog]

Snoop, this is from the OED online. There are many usages for "up" but your use comes under intransitive verb; I've edited the passage for your interest. P.

up, v. SECOND EDITION, 1989 [f. UP adv.1 Cf. OE. uppian (once), to mount up, rise.]

II. intr.
6. a. To rise to one's feet; to get up from a sitting or recumbent posture; to arise; to rise from bed. Also in fig. context.

1915 C. H. SORLEY Lett. (1919) 255 Suddenly the division ups and marches to Aldershot.

b. colloq. and dial. To start up, come forward, begin abruptly or boldly, to say or do something. Usu. followed by and. Cf. UP adv.1 33.

(a) 1831 S. LOVER Leg. 82 The bishop ups and he tells him that he must mend his manners. 1865 DICKENS Mut. Fr. IV. xiii, Then we both of us ups and says, that minute, ‘Prove so!’ 1867- in general dialect use (Eng. Dial. Dict.).

(b) 1883 STEVENSON Treas. Isl. xxix, And you have the Davy Jones's insolence to up and stand for cap'n over me! 1884 ‘MARK TWAIN’ Huck. Finn xxv, All of a sudden the doctor ups and turns on them. He says: [etc.]. 1898 ‘H. S. MERRIMAN’ Roden's Corner xxvii, A gesture that served..to..invite the Frenchman to up and smite him. 1935 E. E. CUMMINGS Let. 31 Jan. (1969) 135 And he ups and hands Am [Eimi] such a boost as would knock Karl Marx's whiskers out of Benjamin G. Woozeythought's cabinet d'aisance. 1958 ‘A. GILBERT’ Death against Clock 81 So you upped and fled. 1961 O. NASH Coll. Verse 33 One of these days not too remote I'll probably up and cut your throat. 1973 Black World Jan. 62/1 It did no good. I upped and died. 1979 J. RATHBONE Joseph I. i. 20 As soon as we could we upped and fled.

Thnx for the effort P. Reliable as usual.

Since Pure didn'T pick up the prize, you get a limerick or a dance if you like.

Snoopy

 

[Guest]

Ok, thanks. I'll take a non-erotic limerick (you are too young for me to be lewd with ).

Perdita

 

[SnoopDog]

Ok, thanks. I'll take a non-erotic limerick (you are too young for me to be lewd with ).

Perdita

You know I'm not like that.

There once was a lady called P.
No better seniorita you'll see,
She's gorgeously smart,
Both in science and art,
Muchas Gracias, for talking to me.

Snoopy, sorry it sucked.

 

[Guest]

Snoopy, sorry it sucked.

No, that was really sweet. Gracias, perrito amigo. P.

 

[cheeryorchid]

Adendum

My random unrelated thought to the thread....

Yes my Adult ADHD has kicked in, or maybe my shiney redneck syndrom. I just wanted to say.

I LOVE Snoopy!!!! I am a huge Peanuts fan, and it has made me smile very much to see a Joe Cool Snoopy picture here and a person referring to themselves as such.
I love him so much I have him permenately with me at all times on my right shoulder with his pal Linus.

Any man that calls himself snoopy can sit on top of my red dog house anytime , or in my case my little green house.

Buenos Suertes con la ingles! Y lo siento por me espanol peor!
Adios!

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

Ok, thanks. I'll take a non-erotic limerick (you are too young for me to be lewd with ).

Perdita

Perdita,

Just think of Snoop as an inchoate dirty old man. Heck, even I was too young once upon a time.

Rumple Foreskin

 

[Guest]

Rumples: you're so cool. P.

 

[snooper]

... I've just read something in a thread and I wanted to know what's behind it.
I've came across a phrase like that twice now.
One is, ' ...if he would up and retire...'
The other one is, '...he up and died...'
Now to a non-native speaker the word up doesn't really make sense there. Can someone explain ? Or at least try to bring some sense to it ? ...

This is no longer in use in real English; only in the USA do they still use this old dialect phrase. Most Brits would tell you that it is an Americanism, in spite of Dickens' use of it.

... The first one will get a kiss or a dance (you chose)
Thnx.

Snoopy

Be glad this fat old man didn't win!

 

[SnoopDog]

Re: Adendum

This is no longer in use in real English; only in the USA do they still use this old dialect phrase. Most Brits would tell you that it is an Americanism, in spite of Dickens' use of it.

Be glad this fat old man didn't win!

LOL I hope you would have chosen a dance.

My random unrelated thought to the thread....

Yes my Adult ADHD has kicked in, or maybe my shiney redneck syndrom. I just wanted to say.

I LOVE Snoopy!!!! I am a huge Peanuts fan, and it has made me smile very much to see a Joe Cool Snoopy picture here and a person referring to themselves as such.
I love him so much I have him permenately with me at all times on my right shoulder with his pal Linus.

Any man that calls himself snoopy can sit on top of my red dog house anytime , or in my case my little green house.

Buenos Suertes con la ingles! Y lo siento por me espanol peor!
Adios!

So it seems we won't have a fight on these boards.

Snoopy,

P.S.: I might remind you of the offer of sleeping on your dog house.

 

[Alex De Kok]

Re: Re: Native English speakers, question !

This is no longer in use in real English; only in the USA do they still use this old dialect phrase. Most Brits would tell you that it is an Americanism, in spite of Dickens' use of it.

Not in this part of the world, we wouldn't.

Alex

 

[Guest]

Re: Re: Re: Native English speakers, question !

Not in this part of the world, we wouldn't.

Alex

Not here, either (at the other end of the country! ). I say it, and hear it said, often, and I've never thought of it as an Americanism.

Lou

 

[minsue]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Native English speakers, question !

Not here, either (at the other end of the country! ). I say it, and hear it said, often, and I've never thought of it as an Americanism.

Lou

This is oddly fascinating. I must need coffee.

 

[cantdog]

Coffee.

 

[minsue]

Coffee.

Hmmm, that didn't bring the effect I was hoping for. Thanks for trying, though!

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Hey Snoops,

He up and did something is also a southern colloquialism. It usually is used to show a sudden decision that is inexplicable, given the person's earlier behavior.

There is usually an impled verb that is ommited.

We were all eating dinner when the parson just (got) up and left.

We were just settleing into the blind when Bubu just (jumped) up and started shooting.



-Colly

 

[Guest]

Colly:

Bubu? Is that like a Bubba Jr.? P.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Re: Colly:

Bubu? Is that like a Bubba Jr.? P.

Wouldn't be a true colly post without a typo would it?



*HUGS*

 

[Guest]

Re: Re: Colly:

Wouldn't be a true colly post without a typo would it?

Ah ha ha, I didn't even think of that (I was not making fun of you). P.