"Morally Decadent Empire"

[Zeb_Carter]

Cuba slams 'morally decadent' US

Cuba has labelled the US a "morally decadent empire" as diplomats from more than 100 developing countries meet at the Non-Aligned Movement summit.
Cuban vice-president Carlos Lage told delegates in Havana that America wanted to impose "a worldwide dictatorship".

So, are we a morally decadent empire? If so what should we do about it?

Or is this the rhetoric of a dying government?

 

[3113]

So, are we a morally decadent empire? If so what should we do about it?

Or is this the rhetoric of a dying government?

Yes and yes. Of course we're morally decadent. What else is new?

One of the best thing about being morally decadent, however, is that you don't have to care what other countries think of you. They're all just jealous anyway.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Every country is "morally decadent", according to other countries. It's because one culture deems "immoral" what another culture doesn't. It's because "morality" is largely subjective (unlike ethics, which to me is more objective, though I could be wrong about that).

Voltaire pointed this out. He noted that Russian Christians would approve of drinking vodka, but condemn polygamy. Turkish Muslims, on the other hand, would keep plural wives, but frown upon alcohol.

 

[R. Richard]

So, are we a morally decadent empire? If so what should we do about it?

I suppose we are. We don't even have the morals to put critics of our government in jail, as Castro does. We don't even have the morals to send doctors to latin American countries while our own people lack medical care.

Or is this the rhetoric of a dying government?

The government of Cuba is definiately not dying. The people may be a little hungry, but they do get food assistance from relatives in Miami. The people may want to leave because of the harsh conditions, but the Cuban government holds most of them within Cuba. And those who do drift to sea on rafts and maybe die were just counter-revolutionary elements anyhow.

 

[Pure]

yes, the US is a morally decadent empire--

except there are a few sterling specimens of virtue here at AH.

 

[TriggerHippie]

yes, the US is a morally decadent empire--

except there are a few sterling specimens of virtue here at AH.

You've a gift for underappreciated sarcasm that is truly beautiful.

Is the US decadent? How can we be decadent and prudish at the same time? How can we be whore and right-wing Christian? Doesn't it seem as if the US is a chameleon? We become, whatever it is that people need to hate, regardless of what's actually happening.

I mean, do people who like to think of themselves as knowledgeable about what is happening in "the world" even consider what is happening inside our borders? Do they worry that there are children that are hungry or people that aren't getting medical care because they don't meet arbitrary guidelines? Do they care that people here, too, are homeless on the street and that violence is a way of life for some children? Do they worry about anything other than the USA's GNP?

It gets tiring, defending the fact that the people in the US are just as much "victims" of their government as any other nation. Because we're "rich" by other standards doesn't mean people aren't hungry. It doesn't mean people have what they need. I'm tired. Tired of being the bad guy when I make $10.50 an hour and my paycheck is gone for necessities a week before I get paid again. Yeah, I have everything I need, mostly. Yeah, I'm not starving and I have medical care and I live in a nation that doesn't battle dysentery and polio and smallpox. Am I rich? In longevity of life, perhaps. Does my child stand a chance for a tomorrow that is better than my today? Yeah, cos I'll beg, borrow and steal to make sure he has choices.

Am I decadent? No. I'm just a person doing the best that they can, not a victim so much as a survivor. Hate me if you will. Try to kill me if you want. I'm no different than you.

Peace,

TH

 

[Pure]

youre right, trigger--

a good section of the US population--e.g. the working poor-- don't have the money to be morally decadent, though their taste in TV leaves something to be desired!

indeed, it's a sign of decadence of the US as a whole that the better off, esp. the Republicans, don't give a shit about the less well off (and have for a decade or two been cutting any assistance to them).

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

youre right, trigger--

a good section of the US population--e.g. the working poor-- don't have the money to be morally decadent, though their taste in TV leaves something to be desired!

Actually their choice in TV is determined by a few decadent, unimaginative program directors who copy what all the other decadent, unimaginative program directors schedule. The working poor watch all thats available.

It's a sad commentary on America when the Decadent force the Non-Decadent down to their level.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Interesting definition of decadence. I guess it depends on who defines it. There is the question of who should get public assistance and who not. I'm not opposed to the disabled and the elderly getting state assistance. I just want it to be done constitutionally and with some restraint. I don't want to pay taxes for generational welfare and such. I don't mind paying for reasonable public assistance, as I define it. I don't favor confiscatory, Marxist, redistributionist schemes to penalize the middle class and the rich. Does that make me decadent? I think not, but others might disagree.

On the other hand, at least you're not labeling hedonism as decadent. That's the definition that I find most annoying of all.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Oh, and judging by its membership, the group involved is about "non-aligned" as Pakistan (tied to China).

 

[Pure]

SEV I don't favor confiscatory, Marxist, redistributionist schemes to penalize the middle class and the rich.

P: i do. those are the finest redistribution schemes!

S Does that make me decadent?

P: not necessarily; but right wing.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

SEV I don't favor confiscatory, Marxist, redistributionist schemes to penalize the middle class and the rich.

i do. those are the finest redistribution schemes!

Does that make me decadent?

not necessarily; but right wing.

So, people should be punished for succeeding, just so generations of people can live on welfare?

 

[Pure]

definitions:

decadent: decaying, corrupt

signs of decadence: more and more people not doing anything that advances the common good.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

decadent: decaying, corrupt

signs of decadence: more and more people not doing anything that advances the common good.

Interesting notion, but how does stealing people's money and giving it to other people advance the "common good", Pure?

 

[Pure]

So, people should be punished for succeeding,

P: why not? is the cosmos fair?

P: seriously: they should be punished for succeeding *in amassing a fortune that they deploy for their private ends.*

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

So, people should be punished for succeeding,

P: why not? is the cosmos fair?

P: seriously: they should be punished for succeeding *in amassing a fortune that they deploy for their private ends.*

What's wrong with having a fortune for private ends? Or should everyone be poor? Because that's the usual result of socialism. How much should they have to give up? 50%, 60%. If you're going to lose that much, get married, get caught with your pants down doing a hooker, get divorced and taken to the cleaners by your equally unfaithful trophy wife. It's a little bit more fun than getting reamed by the IRS.

 

[Pure]

S: but how does stealing people's money and giving it to other people advance the "common good", Pure?

P: how does stealing (taking) people's substance and labor power and putting the proceeds in one's own bank acct advance the common good?

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

S: but how does stealing people's money and giving it to other people advance the "common good", Pure?

P: how does stealing (taking) people's substance and labor power and putting the proceeds in one's own bank acct advance the common good?

Uh, you're not stealing it. You're paying for it. Workers get paid, bosses get work and profits. Or do you think that private property is theft?

 

[Pure]

SWhat's wrong with having a fortune for private ends?

P: judged in terms of those private ends, nothing!

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

SWhat's wrong with having a fortune for private ends?

P: judged in terms of those private ends, nothing!

I note that Pure didn't answer my other question. Hmmm...wonder why.

 

[Pure]

Sev: Uh, you're not stealing it. You're paying for it.

P: Uh, the IRS is not stealing, it's taxing.

Sev: Workers get paid, bosses get work and profits.

P: Paying someone is not incompatible with stealing (taking) from them.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Cuba slams 'morally decadent' US

Cuba has labelled the US a "morally decadent empire" as diplomats from more than 100 developing countries meet at the Non-Aligned Movement summit.
Cuban vice-president Carlos Lage told delegates in Havana that America wanted to impose "a worldwide dictatorship".

So, are we a morally decadent empire? If so what should we do about it?

Or is this the rhetoric of a dying government?

And, of course it's the rhetoric of a dying government. Castro's at the end of his rope.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Sev: Uh, you're not stealing it. You're paying for it.

P: Uh, the IRS is not stealing, it's taxing.

Sev: Workers get paid, bosses get work and profits.

P: Paying someone is not incompatible with stealing (taking) from them.

Interesting notion. Stealing by definition is taking without right or permission. If you're paying them, doesn't that negate that?

And in my book, taxation is often theft. When the amount gets confiscatory, it no longer has right or permission, at least under the property rights principle.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

I still think that this is even worse than being taken to the cleaners by your ex. At least then you get laid in the process.

 

[TriggerHippie]

I still think that this is even worse than being taken to the cleaners by your ex. At least then you get laid in the process.

Wait ... sleeping with the ex or the IRS, cos I have standards.