London carbombs......

[OUTSIDER]

Ahh it's just like old times again here in London.....the fear the paranoia the worry...is that car parked outside a bomb or just a person visiting a friend, I thought all this crap was over but it's come right back to bite us in the ass again.
Just when you thought sanity had prevailed a new bunch of nutcase's pop up and "BANG" off we go again, they seem to not have noticed that for the first time in years life and business in Ireland are good, money is pouring into the province there are more jobs than there are people to fill them and Ireland is even calling back ex pat's to work there, so why are these guy's bombing London again....power, they've lost power and they want it back, the power to kill and maim at will not for any real just cause but because they fear the future that no longer need's them.
Now I will have to revert to old way's of thinking when I'm in the city centre, like is that car a bomb..? should it be there..? should I call someone because that car is worrying me...? if you live in a part of the world that has seen this kind of thing then you'll know exactly what I'm talking about, if on the other hand your lucky enough to live somewhere that has not then I envy you your peace of mind.

 

[Starfish]

 

[alexander tzara]

I've not been watching the news. Who's claimed responsibility?

 

[OUTSIDER]

The password given was that used by the "real IRA", a splinter group who split from the provisional IRA some time ago, after the peace accord's were signed and are happily bombing and shooting people for wanting peace and understanding....go figure.

 

[Cheyenne]

I can't imagine living in fear like that.

One thing I've discovered is that from being on this board and meeting people, I pay more attention when there is a tragedy. A plane goes down, and I think "who do I know from Lit that lives in that area?" Same for earthquakes, killer storms, etc. People die and I wonder if there is a remote chance that it is anyone I know. It's like having relatives across the world to worry about and check on to make sure they are okay.

 

[OUTSIDER]

This time the bomb was disguised in a London black cab and parked outside a BBC office and went off at midnight, no one was killed but a man was hurt, this bomb was by all account's a large one and if it had gone off when people were arriving for work in the morning then the carnage could have been extreme.

 

[alexander tzara]

There are people on both sides - Unionists and Irish Republicans - who just don't want the peace process to work. There's too much money involved. There's obviously a lot of sectarian bigotry learned over the generations that keeps the conflict alive but I think a lot of it is also to do with greed. I worked for a while with a nurse from Belfast and she said that after the initial ceasefire, crimes involving violence and robbery drastically increased in Ulster 'cause the people who were previously making their money through "political terrorism" (mostly cash-injections from misguided supporters in America who don't understand the reality of the Irish troubles) were now turning to mainstream crime so they could carry on living in the way they were accustomed.

 

[OUTSIDER]

I worked for a while with a guy who was in the army in Northern Ireland and he told me that the IRA and other organisation's used to shoot known drug dealers in the kneecaps just to take over their trade....strange how they never seemed to kneecap the junkie's...oh but silly me then they'd have no one to sell to.

 

[Siren]

Just awful.

 

[wildfire]

Just in case you need clarification these people are not Irish.They are a by product of the British system.
Irish economic sucess is due to massive investment from american multinationals and astute financial controls.
At the end of the day alls fair in love and war.

 

[MunchinMark]

Just in case you need clarification these people are not Irish.They are a by product of the British system.

They probably are Irish, maybe citizens of the Republic of Ireland or maybe citizens of the United Kingdom who most likely do call themselves Irish (even the majority of Northern Ireland, who wish to remain British, call themselves Irish). But this kind of thing does happen elsewhere and it's never a good thing.

A product of the inhumanity in humanity.

And it is not a war and there is no love lost here, so its not fair.

[Edited by MunchinMark on 03-04-2001 at 04:40 PM]

 

[Nogard]

Civilians are not targets during war. Targeting civilians is terrorism plain and simple. It is done by cowards that are afraid to confront armed opposition

 

[Ask For More]

There was a bomb up in manchester where I am a couple of months ago. It's a scary thing here now after half of the town centre was demolished by an IRA bomb about eight years ago. Thankfully it was just a scare but it's still a worrying thing...

 

[alexander tzara]

Just in case you need clarification these people are not Irish.They are a by product of the British system.
Irish economic sucess is due to massive investment from american multinationals and astute financial controls.
At the end of the day alls fair in love and war.

I need clarification. I don't understand what you're saying.

 

[Starfish]

yeah, alexander.

last I checked the IRA stood for *Irish* Republican Army.

I am part Irish and I am not in denial about who is doing this.

I am a firm believer that this is no way for the Irish to get the English to make ammends for their wrong doings in the past. I have never fully understood any of this irrational murder.

 

[Ally C]

Say what?

Just in case you need clarification these people are not Irish.They are a by product of the British system.
Irish economic sucess is due to massive investment from american multinationals and astute financial controls.
At the end of the day alls fair in love and war.

I need clarification. I don't understand what you're saying.

Me neither, unless you are speaking about some sense of 'Irishness' - characterised by living to ideals with which the terrorists preclude themselves by dint of their actions? I can't name names off the top of my head, but I know for a FACT that many terrorists (of all persuasions) in Ireland were in fact born and raised there ... this information is relatively easy to access from the BBC - the target of the bombing. Also (by your reasoning), American multinationals would be 'by-products of the British system'?

I think I can sort of get a sense of what you are saying (maybe!), apart from the 'all's fair in love and war' bit. That makes NO sense: Does this mean that Saddamm Hussain was 'fair' when he murdered Kurds [there are countless examples here...]??? Also, the point about astute financial controls is a bit unwarranted. Yes, controls are in place, but Ireland (not Northern Ireland however) actively ignores any idea of financial control at present, relying on a fiscal policy which plainly flaunts (financial) controls set by the EEC of which it (unlike the UK) has fully signed up to. [I apologise in advance for the fact that I am not fully conversant with world / European financial law. The points made are done so to the best of my knowledge, and I welcome further input, relying as I do on easily digestible reportage.]

I digress; the bomb might well have gone off during rush hour. It exploded while a remote bomb-disposal device was in the process of investigating it. Thankfully there were no fatalities ... 'all's fair'? ... I don't think anyone would ever say that if they had to wake each day with the prospect of them or their loved ones being blown to pieces ...

I'd really appreciate clarification too ...

 

[Golden]

I can't imagine living in fear like that.

One thing I've discovered is that from being on this board and meeting people ... It's like having relatives across the world to worry about and check on to make sure they are okay.

Hey I'm alive and well; the bomb went off about half a mile from where I live and boy was it a big bang; but we carry on as normal, eh?

 

[OUTSIDER]

With all due respect to you Wildfire your full of shit and none to bright either...these people "ARE" Irish with the avowed aim of making Northern Ireland part of the Republic of Ireland by any means possible, and as for the bit about astute US multi-nationals, they like all other investor's in Ireland only started to invest once peace looked like a going concern.
Let's do the math,Terrorism = no investment, Peace = investment and a higher standard of living for all, and as for "ALL'S FAIR IN LOVE AND WAR" tell that to the familys of innocent people killed by terrorists.....Oh and I noticed you never put down where you come from...?

 

[genderbender]

Re: Just awful.

No matter what the cause is...using terrorism to get
the point across is never right.

Killing and injuring innocent people in the name of a
group, issue or dispute will never garner support...dont
they ever get that?

I hope it is not the beginning of another era of bombs.
Sad.

I know this is off topic but I need to put my two cents in on the subject of terrorism. Sadly, terrorists acts can readily be perpetrated by just about anyone with a grudge and the willingness to put themselves at risk. I'm a supporter of the peace process in Northern Ireland and hope the terrorist acts will stop.

At the same time, I watch what happens in the Middle East and am not surprised by terrorist acts by Palestinians who've been repeatedly betrayed over the last century by just about anyone with any power. I can understand their profound frustration. That they're willing to die rather than live with the conditions imposed upon them is not at all surprising to me. Negotiations have been a farce.

Under the circumstances Siren, what would you have them do?

 

[Styphon]

At the end of the day alls fair in love and war.

All's fair??

I take it leaving a torch full of explosive for ANYONE to pick up is a political statement? Explain that to the young boy who picked it up, turned it on and blew his hand off....

Styphon

 

[OUTSIDER]

Not only his hand but his sight as well, that boy had already lost an eye as a small child to cancer then some evil bastard left a bomb in a torch and maimed him for life and all because he was a territorial army cadet...come on Wildfart or whatever your fucking name is tell that kid all's fair in love and war.

 

[genderbender]

...come on Wildfart or whatever your fucking name is tell that kid all's fair in love and war.

There are over six billion people on this planet, more than 100 million dying each year. As I write this, everything that it is possible for human beings to do is happening. People are making love, men and women are being raped, people are being killed in every imaginable way, people are blissfully watching a sunset while others are being mugged and stabbed. Right now!

A boy losing his hand, his eyesight is horrible! So is every act of senseless violence. But some we turn our eyes from, willing to ignore the suffering and others we cringe at, we cry loudly about. I don't discount your anguish Outsider, but then I don't think what happened to the boy is any more horrific than all the other deaths and woundings that occur day by day because we human beings can so easily get caught up in passion and hatred. It takes great courage to hold one's heart open in the face of all that, to not indulge one's own hatred when faced with tragedy. Its a profound spiritual practice.

 

[OUTSIDER]

...come on Wildfart or whatever your fucking name is tell that kid all's fair in love and war.

There are over six billion people on this planet, more than 100 million dying each year. As I write this, everything that it is possible for human beings to do is happening. People are making love, men and women are being raped, people are being killed in every imaginable way, people are blissfully watching a sunset while others are being mugged and stabbed. Right now!

A boy losing his hand, his eyesight is horrible! So is every act of senseless violence. But some we turn our eyes from, willing to ignore the suffering and others we cringe at, we cry loudly about. I don't discount your anguish Outsider, but then I don't think what happened to the boy is any more horrific than all the other deaths and woundings that occur day by day because we human beings can so easily get caught up in passion and hatred. It takes great courage to hold one's heart open in the face of all that, to not indulge one's own hatred when faced with tragedy. Its a profound spiritual practice.

you will get no arguement from me there friend, I feel that every murder and death is a crying shame but the way wildfart tried to justify terrrorism with a cliche sickened me and I'll bet many others on this BB too.

 

[Cheyenne]

I can't imagine living in fear like that.

One thing I've discovered is that from being on this board and meeting people ... It's like having relatives across the world to worry about and check on to make sure they are okay.

Hey I'm alive and well; the bomb went off about half a mile from where I live and boy was it a big bang; but we carry on as normal, eh?

That's even closer than I feared! I can't imagine "normal" being never knowing when bomb might destroy you or your family. I know it can happen anywhere in the world, it just happens so much more often in London.

 

[Ally C]

...come on Wildfart or whatever your fucking name is tell that kid all's fair in love and war.

There are over six billion people on this planet, more than 100 million dying each year. As I write this, everything that it is possible for human beings to do is happening. People are making love, men and women are being raped, people are being killed in every imaginable way, people are blissfully watching a sunset while others are being mugged and stabbed. Right now!

A boy losing his hand, his eyesight is horrible! So is every act of senseless violence. But some we turn our eyes from, willing to ignore the suffering and others we cringe at, we cry loudly about. I don't discount your anguish Outsider, but then I don't think what happened to the boy is any more horrific than all the other deaths and woundings that occur day by day because we human beings can so easily get caught up in passion and hatred. It takes great courage to hold one's heart open in the face of all that, to not indulge one's own hatred when faced with tragedy. Its a profound spiritual practice.

you will get no arguement from me there friend, I feel that every murder and death is a crying shame but the way wildfart tried to justify terrrorism with a cliche sickened me and I'll bet many others on this BB too.

The sad state of the world, as you accurately describe it genderbender, is way too much for anyone to comprehend ... I've commented elsewhere on the BB (and this theme continually crops up) about how we interpret and give precedence to certain events over others. Leaving a critical overview of the media out of this, I think that although we do turn away from and ignore so many horrors - by default at times, I think this is an understandable human response. The world may be getting 'smaller' so to speak, but despite all of the technological advances which make this happen, I think that the ability for any human individual to internalise and respond to the tidal wave of horror stories which constitute 'world news' remains minimal. Primal fears and escape and / or attack reflexes are easier to conceal when we are unthreatened. When a threat becomes more 'personal' they aren't far below the surface however ...

I'm with Outsider on this one. I don't think it's very helpful - and certainly not an example of 'profound spiritual practice' - to casually use cliches - certainly not when dealing with a specific case. Emotions tend to run higher when such events take place closer to home. Thankfully I haven't had to deal with terrorism and its effects, but I do feel anger ... and hatred can often be the next instinctive emotional response.