Little Fish, Big Fish, Swimming in the Water
- Thread starter lavender
- Start date
registered "^^"
"^^"
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2001
- Posts
- 2,869
WOW
is that a conservative comment. Sounds so liberal!
is that a conservative comment. Sounds so liberal!
Merelan
Lady's Love
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2000
- Posts
- 10,812
Hey would you mind.... there is a poster who has asked some of us to fill ot a survey... it had some very interesting questions. Some of which you have raised. If interested in filling it out, please do, or even just part of it. At least read the questions.
When attending a social gathering or group in ‘real life’ ethical behavior,
communication, honesty and trusted relationships are all expected. People assume
when they go to these groups that the members will act accordingly. These
assumptions usually pay of with developed healthy acquaintances, friendships and
loved partners.
Online communities are good sources also for these kinds of interaction. The
communities usually are focused around a central theme or topic. Members, though,
often interact beyond the topic and move into personal discussions and friendships.
This survey is helping to address whether the same standards of ethical
interpersonal and group behavior in face-to-face groups operates in the same way
in online communities?
If you would like to answer the questions one section at a time, and send those
results separately, that will be fine. Take your time to think about the ethical issues
raised and how they impact both you and your community. If you can only do one
section, please answer the questions in section four on Relationships.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Questions are categorized into four sections: general, community vs. individual,
communication, and relationship.
A. General
1. Do you expect members of an online community to behave with the same ethics
that your friends and family do? Why?
2. Is it possible a keyboard and monitor can provide a means to create a new
personality? Do you trust that people are as they describe themselves to be?
3. Does anonymity bring out behaviors that people would not do otherwise in ‘real
life? Why?
4. Do you think the ethical standards of daily life, such as trust, honesty, fairness,
apply to online communities? Why?
5. Are online communities subject to the same ethical issues as real life? Will they
collapse and fail if ethical behavior is ignored?
6. Are the expectations online higher towards ethical behavior or lower?
B. Individual vs. Community
1. Is interacting in an online community an individual experience or does the aspect
of ‘community’ influence how you perceive your role there?
2. Is an individual responsible for the overall health and spirit of a community? Why?
3. Are individuals responsible to other ‘members’ of the site? If so, how and why?
4. Can one individual damage or destroy a community? How and why?
5. Is there a collective system of values in an online community?
If so, it is possible to keep it stable? How does it form?
6. What is the balance between Freedom of Speech and responsibility to the
community?
7. Are there struggles for leadership and power in a community? How does it
manifest itself?
8. Most people bond with others like themselves. What are the values that you
bond with in others in your community? How do you observe other sub-groups
bonding? What do you think ties them together into a sub-group.
C. Communication
1. How important is trust in communicating with fellow members? Why?
2. The majority of face-to-face communication is non-verbal: body language,
gestures, facial expressions, and voice inflections. Do you find it challenging while
communicating with fellow members not to use non-verbal cues?
3. How do you get your intended meaning across without those nonverbal cues?
4. Much of face-to-face communication is a quick give-an-take to make sure both
parties understand the context of the conversation. Those quick exchanges or
short check-ups do not usually exist on a message board. How easy is it to
misunderstand a posted message without that ability to check quickly on the
implied meaning? Can that affect the community as a whole?
5. Do you find most posted messages are declarations or conversational in tone?
Does that affect how well you feel you understand the intended message?
D. Relationships
1. Do you feel its possible to develop relationships online that are as close as those
offline? Why?
2. What kind of relationships do you interact within in your community? How would
you rate them? Intimate, close, friend, acquaintance, stranger, other human with
only shared interest in site’s subject matter?
3. What criteria do you use to base your ideas about other person? What makes
you take interest in becoming friends with them?
4. How much do projected perceptions of others impact your understanding of
members in your community? Is it based on word choices, grammar, tone, and
subject matter?
5. Explain your tolerance level towards the following ethical relationship issues:
a. trust
b. honesty
c. manipulation
d. duplicity
e. transparency
f. sex
When would you consider terminating a relationship based on these issues? How
would you recognize crossing the line and not being able to repair the relationship?
6. Considering all communication is done in text, how is it possible for someone’s
feelings to be hurt within a community?
7. Is conflict resolution easier or more difficult to obtain online? Why?
8. Can you be sure that someone is honestly representing his or her true selves?
What methods do you use to judge transparency and honesty in another?
9. Is it possible for someone to pretend to be a completely different person
(gender, age, personality, history) and not be discovered? How much of an ethical
issue is that in a community? What impact can lying have on a community?
10. What impact can impostering or hiding behind a false identity have on
individuals and the community?
11. In ‘real life’, most people forget what was said hours after a conversation. In an
online community, words are kept archived for sometimes years. Does this have an
impact on the relationships within the community? If so, how?
Last Question: Do the terms ‘real-life’ and ‘virtual life’ contradict each other?
When attending a social gathering or group in ‘real life’ ethical behavior,
communication, honesty and trusted relationships are all expected. People assume
when they go to these groups that the members will act accordingly. These
assumptions usually pay of with developed healthy acquaintances, friendships and
loved partners.
Online communities are good sources also for these kinds of interaction. The
communities usually are focused around a central theme or topic. Members, though,
often interact beyond the topic and move into personal discussions and friendships.
This survey is helping to address whether the same standards of ethical
interpersonal and group behavior in face-to-face groups operates in the same way
in online communities?
If you would like to answer the questions one section at a time, and send those
results separately, that will be fine. Take your time to think about the ethical issues
raised and how they impact both you and your community. If you can only do one
section, please answer the questions in section four on Relationships.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Questions are categorized into four sections: general, community vs. individual,
communication, and relationship.
A. General
1. Do you expect members of an online community to behave with the same ethics
that your friends and family do? Why?
2. Is it possible a keyboard and monitor can provide a means to create a new
personality? Do you trust that people are as they describe themselves to be?
3. Does anonymity bring out behaviors that people would not do otherwise in ‘real
life? Why?
4. Do you think the ethical standards of daily life, such as trust, honesty, fairness,
apply to online communities? Why?
5. Are online communities subject to the same ethical issues as real life? Will they
collapse and fail if ethical behavior is ignored?
6. Are the expectations online higher towards ethical behavior or lower?
B. Individual vs. Community
1. Is interacting in an online community an individual experience or does the aspect
of ‘community’ influence how you perceive your role there?
2. Is an individual responsible for the overall health and spirit of a community? Why?
3. Are individuals responsible to other ‘members’ of the site? If so, how and why?
4. Can one individual damage or destroy a community? How and why?
5. Is there a collective system of values in an online community?
If so, it is possible to keep it stable? How does it form?
6. What is the balance between Freedom of Speech and responsibility to the
community?
7. Are there struggles for leadership and power in a community? How does it
manifest itself?
8. Most people bond with others like themselves. What are the values that you
bond with in others in your community? How do you observe other sub-groups
bonding? What do you think ties them together into a sub-group.
C. Communication
1. How important is trust in communicating with fellow members? Why?
2. The majority of face-to-face communication is non-verbal: body language,
gestures, facial expressions, and voice inflections. Do you find it challenging while
communicating with fellow members not to use non-verbal cues?
3. How do you get your intended meaning across without those nonverbal cues?
4. Much of face-to-face communication is a quick give-an-take to make sure both
parties understand the context of the conversation. Those quick exchanges or
short check-ups do not usually exist on a message board. How easy is it to
misunderstand a posted message without that ability to check quickly on the
implied meaning? Can that affect the community as a whole?
5. Do you find most posted messages are declarations or conversational in tone?
Does that affect how well you feel you understand the intended message?
D. Relationships
1. Do you feel its possible to develop relationships online that are as close as those
offline? Why?
2. What kind of relationships do you interact within in your community? How would
you rate them? Intimate, close, friend, acquaintance, stranger, other human with
only shared interest in site’s subject matter?
3. What criteria do you use to base your ideas about other person? What makes
you take interest in becoming friends with them?
4. How much do projected perceptions of others impact your understanding of
members in your community? Is it based on word choices, grammar, tone, and
subject matter?
5. Explain your tolerance level towards the following ethical relationship issues:
a. trust
b. honesty
c. manipulation
d. duplicity
e. transparency
f. sex
When would you consider terminating a relationship based on these issues? How
would you recognize crossing the line and not being able to repair the relationship?
6. Considering all communication is done in text, how is it possible for someone’s
feelings to be hurt within a community?
7. Is conflict resolution easier or more difficult to obtain online? Why?
8. Can you be sure that someone is honestly representing his or her true selves?
What methods do you use to judge transparency and honesty in another?
9. Is it possible for someone to pretend to be a completely different person
(gender, age, personality, history) and not be discovered? How much of an ethical
issue is that in a community? What impact can lying have on a community?
10. What impact can impostering or hiding behind a false identity have on
individuals and the community?
11. In ‘real life’, most people forget what was said hours after a conversation. In an
online community, words are kept archived for sometimes years. Does this have an
impact on the relationships within the community? If so, how?
Last Question: Do the terms ‘real-life’ and ‘virtual life’ contradict each other?
Problem Child
titleless
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2001
- Posts
- 27,935
I'm not a big fish. Some people like me, more probably hate me. I don't like your big fish theory. I think it stinks and it's all wet too.
cymbidia
unrepentant pervert
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2001
- Posts
- 8,786
Watching, characterizing, and assessing the growth and development of online communities is a thing i find endlessly fascinating. I've been online a very long time and have been a member of a few places before coming to Lit. Each was very different from those that came before and after, but all of them, including Lit, have some striking similarities, too. The places include forums, like Lit (and like the very first place i called home 10 years ago, a forum on Compuserve called The Coffeeshop), and IRC channels along with their ugly stepsisters, real time chat rooms.
Here are some of the things i've noticed that tend to remain constant from place to place:
1. You never ever post (blurt, spit out, release) confidential and personal info about other members aloud. This is always Rule # 1 in every place i've been, stated or unstated. Common sense, boys and girls. There are nut cases out there.
2. Some days you don't like the place. On those days it's better not to post cuz your mood is gonna get you into trouble.
3. The members that have been around awhile always complain about the newbies wrecking the place and remember reminisce endlessly sometimes 'bout the good old days.
4. New members of all online places are always called newbies. It's a weird thing. Always. BDSM places, both forums and rt chats, here, Chatropolis, Salon.com... all over. "Newbie" is a universal term for people who havn't settled in yet and carved/claimed/captured a place for themselves from the fabric of the environment.
5. Moderators/Site owners/etc are Gods. All of them. Every one, all the time. Laurel does the best job i've ever seen of remaining able to play with the rest of us - but we know who owns the site. Yes, we do.
6. There are particular roles that are always filled in every online place. Some of them are filled by individual people, others are filled with a variety of poeple. Most of them have both male and female components. Some of them off the top of my head are Asshole, BMOC, Ingenue, Player, Intelligensia, Nice Guy, Best Friend, Backstabber, Just Wants To Fuck/Be Fucked, WAY Needy, blah blah blah.
Okay. I'm stopping now cuz i'm even boring myself.
Where is Saturn Return? This is her area of expertise. I'd love to hear from her on the issue of the evolution of online communities.
And lavy? Big fish? Hmmm. I think that characterization is a matter of perspective, darlin'; there're *definitely* those who would strongly protest the "who" in your counting. And if you're counting big fish, baby, you're right in there with the very biggest. Anyway, this much is true for us all: Some days you eat the bear and some days the bear eats you.
Here are some of the things i've noticed that tend to remain constant from place to place:
1. You never ever post (blurt, spit out, release) confidential and personal info about other members aloud. This is always Rule # 1 in every place i've been, stated or unstated. Common sense, boys and girls. There are nut cases out there.
2. Some days you don't like the place. On those days it's better not to post cuz your mood is gonna get you into trouble.
3. The members that have been around awhile always complain about the newbies wrecking the place and remember reminisce endlessly sometimes 'bout the good old days.
4. New members of all online places are always called newbies. It's a weird thing. Always. BDSM places, both forums and rt chats, here, Chatropolis, Salon.com... all over. "Newbie" is a universal term for people who havn't settled in yet and carved/claimed/captured a place for themselves from the fabric of the environment.
5. Moderators/Site owners/etc are Gods. All of them. Every one, all the time. Laurel does the best job i've ever seen of remaining able to play with the rest of us - but we know who owns the site. Yes, we do.
6. There are particular roles that are always filled in every online place. Some of them are filled by individual people, others are filled with a variety of poeple. Most of them have both male and female components. Some of them off the top of my head are Asshole, BMOC, Ingenue, Player, Intelligensia, Nice Guy, Best Friend, Backstabber, Just Wants To Fuck/Be Fucked, WAY Needy, blah blah blah.
Okay. I'm stopping now cuz i'm even boring myself.
Where is Saturn Return? This is her area of expertise. I'd love to hear from her on the issue of the evolution of online communities.
And lavy? Big fish? Hmmm. I think that characterization is a matter of perspective, darlin'; there're *definitely* those who would strongly protest the "who" in your counting. And if you're counting big fish, baby, you're right in there with the very biggest. Anyway, this much is true for us all: Some days you eat the bear and some days the bear eats you.
Rubyfruit
ripe
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2001
- Posts
- 18,859
cymbidia said:
Very interesting insights into board dynamics, cym. I've been around online for many years too. Before the internet was readily accessible, I was on local bulletin boards. Anybody remember "Westside" in Los Angeles? It was the biggest, baddest board around with 32 lines! lol
I don't know if most people fall into a category though. For instance which one would you fall into? How about me? Of course, there are some people who consistently do post along one line or the other, but I feel that for the most part, if people are genuine, they will show many sides of themselves.
___
Lavender,
I agree with what you're saying. I've been on small boards before and some people really do stick out on them. Frankly, I really like the dynamics of a board this big and busy. There are always interesting people with different views than mine. Hey, I even learn something once in a while.
Ruby
Problem Child
titleless
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2001
- Posts
- 27,935
Mischka said:
edited cuz ruby beat me.
Mischka
Ms Snooby Pants
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2001
- Posts
- 15,820
Damn. Does this mean I have to get back to my paper now?
And hey! Cut me some slack - I'd never heard the expression before. We had Frat Daddies and SoHos, but no BMOC. Too big of a campus to have a single BMOC. Which ties in nicely with the original theme of this thread.
And hey! Cut me some slack - I'd never heard the expression before. We had Frat Daddies and SoHos, but no BMOC. Too big of a campus to have a single BMOC. Which ties in nicely with the original theme of this thread.
Last edited:
Svedish_Chef
On Walkabout
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2000
- Posts
- 9,937
PJ Harvey.
Merelan, you scared me... thats WAYYYY too long a post for you
Merelan, you scared me... thats WAYYYY too long a post for you
modest mouse
Meating People is Easy
- Joined
- Oct 21, 2001
- Posts
- 8,363
I thought this was a tribute to my swanky new av.
I'm crushed.
PJ Harvey ~ Down By The Water
I lost my heart
Under the bridge
To that little girl
So much to me
And now i moan
And now i holler
She'll never know
Just what i found
That blue eyed girl
{That blue eyed girl}
She said "no more"
{She said "no more"}
That blue eyed girl
{That blue eyed girl}
Became blue eyed whore
{Big blue eyed whore}
Down by the water
{Down by the water}
I took her hand
{I took her hand}
Just like my daughter
{Just like my daughter}
See her again
{See her again}
Oh help me jesus
Come through this storm
I had to lose her
Io do her harm
I heard her holler
{I heard her holler}
I heard her moan
{I heard her moan}
My lovely daughter
{My lovely daughter}
I took her home
{I took her home}
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
I'm crushed.
PJ Harvey ~ Down By The Water
I lost my heart
Under the bridge
To that little girl
So much to me
And now i moan
And now i holler
She'll never know
Just what i found
That blue eyed girl
{That blue eyed girl}
She said "no more"
{She said "no more"}
That blue eyed girl
{That blue eyed girl}
Became blue eyed whore
{Big blue eyed whore}
Down by the water
{Down by the water}
I took her hand
{I took her hand}
Just like my daughter
{Just like my daughter}
See her again
{See her again}
Oh help me jesus
Come through this storm
I had to lose her
Io do her harm
I heard her holler
{I heard her holler}
I heard her moan
{I heard her moan}
My lovely daughter
{My lovely daughter}
I took her home
{I took her home}
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
Little fish. big fish. swimming in the water.
Come back here, man. gimme my daughter.
cymbidia
unrepentant pervert
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2001
- Posts
- 8,786
Remember MUSH's and MUD's and MOO's? (Are they still around?) I telnetted into one called BayMOO (based, *very* loosely, on the physical layoput of the SF Bay Area) for a couple years in the early 90's. What a blast that was. I even learned a little programming just and only to make my space there more habitable. Like your Westside, this was back when forums were brand new things and IRC was still a programmer's wet dream.Rubyfruit said:
Most people don't fall into one or more of those online community categories itemized above, especially in bigger places. It's just like everyday life geography in that way. Small towns have readily identifiable characters roaming their streets while in large cities, there is more glitter and hustlebustle (not to be confused with ~shudder~ Doin The Hustle) but fewer individual community members shine. Lit is edging into large city territory as far as online places go, i think. You and i don't fall into any categories, Ruby. We transcend all such mortal coils.
And, babes? I got a some good things whispered into my ear about you from someone you're semi-related to who's also aboard this train ride. Apparently you're just a real and just as nice as you seem.
Lavy? I think you and Never are right: the Big Fish (note the use of a singular case there?) days of Lit are probably gone.
freakygirl
Literotica Guru
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2001
- Posts
- 27,432
oh.. oh...oh...oh.. *raising hand* Can I be the village idiot? oh wait.. that one is already taken..
Then I wanna be a gold fish..
Then I wanna be a gold fish..
Dixon Carter Lee
Headliner
- Joined
- Nov 22, 1999
- Posts
- 48,682
lavender said:
I dare you to find VHS footage of the awards ceremony where that was awarded or accepted by anyone. My title is over to the left. I'm not a Royal Untouchable. I'm not a Lit Bull God. I keep fucking telling you all...
I am Spartacus.
cymbidia
unrepentant pervert
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2001
- Posts
- 8,786
Man.Dixon Carter Lee said:
Everyone's on trip flashbacks tonight.
Ooooookay, Spartacus, why don't you bring your body-armored self right on over here and sit down next to Dill. Yeh. Wave your hand in front of your face just... like... that....
Uh huh. It *is* very cool, isn't it?
Rambling Rose
My Aim Is True
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2001
- Posts
- 10,901
If I don't get to transcend a mortal coil or two, then I am gathering my toys and going home!
Second choice? Intelligentsia. It has a nice beat and you can dance to it.
Second choice? Intelligentsia. It has a nice beat and you can dance to it.
