limitations and compromises vs. freedom of sexual expression

[eastern sun]

For me, I'm grateful that I have an equilibrium of expectation and reality.

Meaning that what is expected of you jibes with reality?

 

[Recidiva]

Meaning that what is expected of you jibes with reality?

There's an equilibrium between what I give and what I get. What I expect and what is expected is in balance.

 

[eastern sun]

There's an equilibrium between what I give and what I get. What I expect and what is expected is in balance.

I'm curious to ask others in D/s or M/s dynamics . . . do you feel there's an equilibrium between what you give and what you get? That what you expect and what is expected of you are in balance?


I keep thinking of Velvet's description of the power vacuum that exists between two people.

Wait, how does this question relate to the thread?

 

[intothewoods]

I'm curious to ask others in D/s or M/s dynamics . . . do you feel there's an equilibrium between what you give and what you get? That what you expect and what is expected of you are in balance?


I keep thinking of Velvet's description of the power vacuum that exists between two people.

Wait, how does this question relate to the thread?

Well, it's interesting to see who is doing the compromising, right?

I would say what I expect and what is expected are me are pretty well-matched. There have been times I have wanted more, but I think I haven't always done a good job of stepping up my giving in order to up my getting. Or whatever.

 

[CutieMouse]

You have always struck me as having one of the more clearly defined sexualities on the board, CutieMouse. And your description of yourself at work supports my image of who you are (and want to be seen to be). Even being compartmentalized fits that image.

So, then, I think to myself, this is one integrated woman.

That's one of the nicest things anyone's said to me in ages. Thank you.

[random ramble]

I think I confuse the guy I'm dating. It's not technically a "power based relationship", although I've always been blunt about who/what I am and that I don't run the show (to which he always says - "Good, because I do." LOL), but I'm not sure he really knows what to do with the opportunity [me]. I'm pretty open about my sexuality, sex drive, what I *need* to feel desirable, etc and sometimes I get the feeling that I break his head. Like he doesn't realize I'm serious when I say that being in a relationship gives him free reign.

I do feel "integrated" (great descriptor of what I've worked my ass off to achieve the last few years, BTW ), but I still inhibit myself. I could probably step outside my little shell, take greater risks and live a deeper, rounder life [re: my wants, needs and desires], but I don't. Maybe I don't believe it's possible, or I don't really deserve it... I'm not sure I will ever reach a point where I can afford the luxury of not working on myself as a sexual being.

[/random ramble]

 

[rida]

All very true, just to make a distinction, there's a big difference between the fear of being bored, and what I was trying to express - the fear of being boring. Two entirely different things.

Yes.
But even the fear of being boring it is a state of mind.

I'm trying to think of the people I met so far in my life and the most boring persons were the one that kept doing things just to fill their lives. No substance behind their actions.

Why would religion want to teach us to repress our sexuality?

I have a theory of why many religions prohibits many things: when those prohibitions were introduced they had a practical value, either for guaranteeing the power of the powerful or to protect the powerless, or controlling the masses, depending on the type and scope of the religion.

Within the Christian Faith, that originally appealed to the poor and the rejected, the whole demonizing of sex had to do with protecting the women, still seen as objects and property with no right. The moment you made sex outside the sacred knot of marriage sinful (with no possibility of divorce), there was a protection in place for the woman and the children.

And at the same time the Church got also a tool to control the powerful.

Now I am no scholar so I'll leave the discussion here.

*SNIP*

But there's a huge distinction between obsession and addiction.

*SNIP*

In your case, if you don't obsess, but you become addicted and it's a downward spiral, it's something I wouldn't do.

Very good points.
And there is indeed a huge difference between an obsession and an addiction.
I, like Recidiva, have an obsessive personality, but not addictive.

I get totally swept away by something and all I do is think and talk and write and, when possible, act within the obsession.

My current obsession is, if it was not clear, discovering the depth of my submission, understand the whys and the whats of mine and other people submission and Dominance. Not necessarily in relation to sex, but as a personality drive.

Addictions are hard to kick. But if both of you know you are prone to them, perhaps you can avoid them. Even if you cave to your Husband desires.

I'm curious to ask others in D/s or M/s dynamics . . . do you feel there's an equilibrium between what you give and what you get? That what you expect and what is expected of you are in balance?

My first gut feeling answer is no: I give more than I get.
But the truth is a little bit more complex, I've learned: I'm an emotional masochist. And the perception that I'm giving more than I'm getting is where I take my pleasure from. (I like to bank my "credits" even if I know they are not redeemable currency )

Of course in reality there is a balance in the imbalance, if only because I accept that it is an imbalance of my own making.

But in my mind, where I can indulge my emotional masochism to the fullest, there are much bigger dramas, much bigger sacrifices, much bigger imbalances. Sometime I imagine how would it feel to experience them in reality. But the only way a true drama can unfold is if there is no recovery nor re-takes. And there is just a too much finality in a one shot deal.

 

[Recidiva]

Yes.

But even the fear of being boring it is a state of mind.

I'm trying to think of the people I met so far in my life and the most boring persons were the one that kept doing things just to fill their lives. No substance behind their actions.

Amen. I've made a conscious choice in my life to not be interesting, but to be interested.

 

[ecstaticsub]

I'm curious to ask others in D/s or M/s dynamics . . . do you feel there's an equilibrium between what you give and what you get? That what you expect and what is expected of you are in balance?


I keep thinking of Velvet's description of the power vacuum that exists between two people.

Wait, how does this question relate to the thread?

In both my D/s relationship and my vanilla marriage I feel I do the majority of the compromising. But it doesn't really matter (well,...too much) Not because I am an emotional masochist, because I definitely am not. It is because over the years I have learned to simply be happy with what I do get.

I feel I am a very lucky woman. Now in my mid-40's I have spent my 20's married but child-free and not much held me back sexually.

By the time I had children in my early 30's I was ready to settle down and move adventurous sex down a few rungs on the ladder of importance.

Now I have a fun mix of vanilla life with a swirl of chocolate. And I love it just the way it is. There are frustrating time when I wish I could just have the kids fend for themselves and fly to see Daddy on the spur of the moment. Or there are times I picture the 4 of us (the two of us plus spouses) living together in one open relationship.

But to have some of those things I would have to give up others. Expression of my sexuality is a minor priority to being able to spend time with my children. In less than 6 years they will be off to college and a life of their own.

I do worry that I will be too old to be sexy, too old to still enjoy anal, too old to crave pain and have a body healthy enough to do the things I do now if I put off more frequent play until the time they leave the home.

But I'll gladly accept that risk in exchange for what I do have.

I have no regrets for any compromises I have made throughout my life. I have experienced so much in life sexual and otherwise. There is nothing left on my sexual Bucket List. I want to continue with life as I am now living it.

 

[ataxia.girl]

i've been avoiding this thread but decided to take a peek today. i'm not going to answer the questions because all my answers would be downers most likely.

i have a very distinct feeling that my life has been something that has happened TO me, rather than something i have really lived\controlled. i struggle to own the "choices" i made which makes it difficult to feel comfortable compromising because of the outcome of said "choices." Because i never believed i had a choice my desires remained rather undeveloped, stunted, and distorted. i suspect a lot of my sexual preferences are a direct result of never feeling like i had any say in how i would live my life. i was taught it was a sin to even THINK about sex, to even THINK about not becoming a mother, to even THINK about choosing to have a career instead of a family.

i feel that i have found ways to express my sexuality as much as i want to given the constraints of my situation. i'm not exactly at peace with the whole thing but i'm not miserable and falling apart either... most of the time.

i know of a woman who after leaving the mormon church also left her husband and now shares custody of their 2 children but it looks like in the end he will end up with them. In some ways i envy her. i cannot bring myself to leave. i don't feel that my husband has done anything which justifies leaving him. i guess my view of marriage is still pretty traditional in that sense. Simply being unfulfilled is not grounds for divorce in my world. i also feel like it wouldn't really be any better if we separated because there are still the 4 children which have to be raised whom i love very much. Even if we divorced i'd still be stuck in this smallish town doing what i'm doing only with more stress and aggravation paying for what would amount to 2 households. Its just not a practical option and it wouldn't make it that much easier for me to be whatever it is that i am.

So i visit Daddy in the evenings 3 to 4 nights a month. i have to work during the day. It is hard to have a real relationship in a hotel room but i think we come pretty close. He is the only person i have ever felt free to be completely myself with. Even if he stopped fucking me or doing anything kinky at all i would still want to be with him.

i basically see myself as damaged and therefore unable to really develop a healthy sense of self in pretty much any sphere, including all things sexual. i'm not alone and that helps. i am as happy and fulfilled as i am able to be.

 

[jenniferbaby]

It took me forever just to get through the first page on this thread. I kept going back over certain phrases, wiping tears, digging through the large variety of thoughts and experiences and opinions. Now I have to read the whole damn thing. *heads back over to page 2*

 

[HottieMama]

i've been avoiding this thread but decided to take a peek today. i'm not going to answer the questions because all my answers would be downers most likely.

i have a very distinct feeling that my life has been something that has happened TO me, rather than something i have really lived\controlled. i struggle to own the "choices" i made which makes it difficult to feel comfortable compromising because of the outcome of said "choices." Because i never believed i had a choice my desires remained rather undeveloped, stunted, and distorted. i suspect a lot of my sexual preferences are a direct result of never feeling like i had any say in how i would live my life. i was taught it was a sin to even THINK about sex, to even THINK about not becoming a mother, to even THINK about choosing to have a career instead of a family.

i feel that i have found ways to express my sexuality as much as i want to given the constraints of my situation. i'm not exactly at peace with the whole thing but i'm not miserable and falling apart either... most of the time.

i know of a woman who after leaving the mormon church also left her husband and now shares custody of their 2 children but it looks like in the end he will end up with them. In some ways i envy her. i cannot bring myself to leave. i don't feel that my husband has done anything which justifies leaving him. i guess my view of marriage is still pretty traditional in that sense. Simply being unfulfilled is not grounds for divorce in my world. i also feel like it wouldn't really be any better if we separated because there are still the 4 children which have to be raised whom i love very much. Even if we divorced i'd still be stuck in this smallish town doing what i'm doing only with more stress and aggravation paying for what would amount to 2 households. Its just not a practical option and it wouldn't make it that much easier for me to be whatever it is that i am.

So i visit Daddy in the evenings 3 to 4 nights a month. i have to work during the day. It is hard to have a real relationship in a hotel room but i think we come pretty close. He is the only person i have ever felt free to be completely myself with. Even if he stopped fucking me or doing anything kinky at all i would still want to be with him.

i basically see myself as damaged and therefore unable to really develop a healthy sense of self in pretty much any sphere, including all things sexual. i'm not alone and that helps. i am as happy and fulfilled as i am able to be.

ataxia.. This really resonated with me, probably because I was in a similar situation than you for several years. I made the decision to leave. It hasn't been pretty all the time and it hasn't always been happy but overall I am MUCH better mentally and emotionally than I was. I hope, that no matter what your situation is, that you find joy and peace.

 

[ataxia.girl]

ataxia.. This really resonated with me, probably because I was in a similar situation than you for several years. I made the decision to leave. It hasn't been pretty all the time and it hasn't always been happy but overall I am MUCH better mentally and emotionally than I was. I hope, that no matter what your situation is, that you find joy and peace.

In all honesty i don't leave for purely practical reasons. We get along. We like each other. We're good friends and we left a cult together. i don't want to raise my kids with anyone except their father is what it basically comes down to. If i had a big life do over i likely would not have a family at all. i didn't know i had an option which i'm sure sounds really weird but its true.

i do have a big chip on my shoulder. i'm extremely angry but there's no recourse. Life is what it is and all i can do is accept it and make the best of it to the best of my ability which is what i do.

Being a mother has enriched my life experience immeasurably. There is just a whole set of knowledge you cannot know without being a parent. While in another life i might have chosen to go without that knowledge i can still appreciate it for what it is. i make sacrifices every day for my children. They are more important to me than anything else. In many ways i feel lucky that i have been able to find ways to fulfill myself because it makes me a better mother. Daddy eases the resentment and leaves me free to love the people i am with.

 

[intothewoods]

I wonder if any men will post in this thread.

 

[sb2009]

i think the way I look at life is that it's a huge series of stages...each stage calls for various priorities and some phases overlap.

Also, since March i've been unemployed and while at first I embraced being a bum (still doing my family, home, etc things!) now I'm more than ready to get back to work..I find that I need to have some work so I can enjoy my free time more fully.

When the kids were smaller - I actually resented thier impact on my doing fun things, like taking the time to read. And have a nice sex life. Now they are older and I am finding more time for that.

Having kids seriously cramps expression of anything other than diaper changing!

 

[Recidiva]

i think the way I look at life is that it's a huge series of stages...each stage calls for various priorities and some phases overlap.

Also, since March i've been unemployed and while at first I embraced being a bum (still doing my family, home, etc things!) now I'm more than ready to get back to work..I find that I need to have some work so I can enjoy my free time more fully.

When the kids were smaller - I actually resented thier impact on my doing fun things, like taking the time to read. And have a nice sex life. Now they are older and I am finding more time for that.

Having kids seriously cramps expression of anything other than diaper changing!

It's interesting how parenthood has different effects on different people.

I was lucky and it just reshaped my life into different priorities that made total sense to me, no resentment.

But I compare parenthood to ocean travel. You never know until you start whether or not it's going to make you seasick or make you feel you've found your home. And then, there's no going back without sinking something.

 

[Adakgirl]

Okay!

 

[sb2009]

It's interesting how parenthood has different effects on different people.

I was lucky and it just reshaped my life into different priorities that made total sense to me, no resentment.

But I compare parenthood to ocean travel. You never know until you start whether or not it's going to make you seasick or make you feel you've found your home. And then, there's no going back without sinking something.

I know! I think I was one of those people who took a while to adjust. But when I talk to my friends about it, they are *shocked* that I felt that way. To them, I looked like I was in my element, and one even said she was jealous because I seemed to throw myself into it all - cosleeping, breastfeeding, never leaving the kid alone. Which is another important lesson: we shouldn't compare ourselves to anyone else, we really don't know thier true story!

But I can honestly say that if I had to chance to change it, no way. I love what parenting has done for me and I love the girls so much. If I could go back I wouldn't eat as much during each pregnancy, but that's because I have a fat ass still!

 

[ataxia.girl]

Being a mother makes you extremely vulnerable to emotional blackmail and guilt. i think i'm pretty much over that but i have to stay on my guard. People make so many assumptions about what a "good" mother should\shouldn't do\be.

my 6 year old is like me. She is obsessed with God and finding out if it is male or female. She is very concerned about gender issues. She's always asking me why i wash the dishes more, why do i let Daddy sleep more (he has a chronic auto immune disease which weakens his immune system). She is ridiculously sensitive to any gender imbalance she perceives in our home.

She is the child i left the church for. Of the 4 she is the one that feels the most like "mine". i never put her down as a baby and was quite jealous of her. She is the reason i finally grew the balls to google my own religion and get out. i wouldn't raise her the way i was raised.

i recognize that my relationship vis a vis this particular daughter may be a bit unhealthy and co-dependent but i'm not in a place where i can stop it. She is an extremely demanding and intense child. It takes more effort and more attention from both of us to balance her. When i get really bad i often look at her and wonder how much of my condition is due to the religion and how much is simple genetics. i'm not raising her mormon and she still has gender issues i don't know how to explain to her.

She just knows...

 

[sb2009]

ataxia - I have a friend who is 23 now but she tells me that she remembers questioning her gender as young as five. She identifies as a gender queer, and that she is attracted to a person not a gender. most of her relationships have been with women. Her family is non-religious, other than attending a few weddings, etc. She just has always felt like she was not all "girl" but not a "boy" either.

 

[ataxia.girl]

ataxia - I have a friend who is 23 now but she tells me that she remembers questioning her gender as young as five. She identifies as a gender queer, and that she is attracted to a person not a gender. most of her relationships have been with women. Her family is non-religious, other than attending a few weddings, etc. She just has always felt like she was not all "girl" but not a "boy" either.

my daughter is very much a girl but she perceives being a girl as being less than a boy. She is constantly looking for clues to find out which gender is more important\capable.

 

[Recidiva]

my daughter is very much a girl but she perceives being a girl as being less than a boy. She is constantly looking for clues to find out which gender is more important\capable.

I think that's entirely normal for children trying to get black and white answers.

My son is in the autistic spectrum, and he always wants to know what's right and wrong about everything. Takes a good long while to grow out of trying to find categories that have 100% answers all the time. Hell, I'm still not past that stage.

 

[eastern sun]

my daughter is very much a girl but she perceives being a girl as being less than a boy. She is constantly looking for clues to find out which gender is more important\capable.

My daughter is nine, and is working through similar issues. But, at this age, she's decided that "religion is sexist." That, in fact, a lot of things are "sexist."

That's why she wants to dress like a boy.

 

[ataxia.girl]

My daughter is nine, and is working through similar issues. But, at this age, she's decided that "religion is sexist." That, in fact, a lot of things are "sexist."

That's why she wants to dress like a boy.

Tell her to research lipstick feminism. Girl power.

 

[StrayKat]

My daughter is nine, and is working through similar issues. But, at this age, she's decided that "religion is sexist." That, in fact, a lot of things are "sexist."

That's why she wants to dress like a boy.

Well, she is smart, religion is sexist in most cases.

 

[sb2009]

Well, she is smart, religion is sexist in most cases.

yeah, pretty much!

At six she still has so much she can learn about herself, there's a lot you can do to help her know she is strong and capable.

Be careful what you wish for though - my 12 year old lacks for no confidence and her teen horemones are kicking in - ouch!