Learning toi Swim

[XXplorher]

I wrote a story a long time ago. It didn’t get much respect. I just read it again cuz someone thought it was good. They were right. It’s GREAT!

How come this story did not meet success in the reader’s eyes? Why do I think it’s great if it isn’t? I’m quite a bit critical of myself… and though I do have a tremendous ego… I think I might be exersising some humility in asking you to look at it. I need to know what’s wrong with it.

Would you please go look at it and tell me what’s wrong with it?

And while we’re on that subject…

How come writers only encourage positive feedback? If I was to only hear positive feedback? I’d be done already. I’d never get any better, right? It would be over. You are doing me a TREMENDOUS favor pointing out your opinion of something I may have done wrong. You’re gifting me…

I just wish people were maybe better able to absorb criticism. Because it IS – so fucking important to the process.

Please criticize me. I’m sort of desperate for it. I love that piece… what’s wrong with it? (and I’m not a ‘Dom’ with a giant black cock, for the record. Nor a 4eyed accountant who wants you to spank me. I just want you to react. I feel like that piece earned a better reaction. And I want to know why I’m wrong).

Thanks


http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=209530

 

[mjl2010]

Well. That was something to read.

Use of the word negro probably hurt you. For many, it just isn't acceptable.

You broke a lot of grammar rules. A lot of places you use the ellipse and way overuse it and incorrectly. And i didn't mind right then. But I filed it away to mention it.

Don't do this

Carmen continued to suck... reinventing every combination of ways to wet a finger.

This ellipse should be a comma. You do this a lot. It's distracting.

Then this.

Carmen closed her mouth...

And waited. Unmoving...

You were using the ellipse to create a pause I think, is that what you intended? Why not "Carmen closed her mouth and waited. And waited some more."

"I wish you would have fucked me, but he's fucking me instead... And I like it very much... And I want to cum so bad on you... while he fucks me... And his big dangerous dick makes my horny cunt feel so much better... makes my cunt so very greedy... and all I want is more, more, MORE!... And his dick has so much size to it... it won't ever go away... like you did... It just keeps fucking me and fucking me, Daddy... It's so strong and powerful... and all of it inside of me."

Why ellipses and not periods? I didn't get it.

OK enough about the ellipse.

There's places I was just laughing. Maybe I was supposed to laugh. It didn't seem like it but I was. There was a definite pulse of unreality to the entire story. Sorry, but I just didn't buy it.

Here's some stuff that bugged me. Save it for the high school locker room

She yanked herself closer by the shaft of his steel hard fuck-pipe

satiated fuck-channel

Have you been a good girl? Getting fucked by a nigger?

pumped her fuckbox full of incredibly potent Man-meat

There was more, I just put these here for examples.

And this. I get the point but. Maybe overdone.

"Oh Goawww, gwwwwlllthddt... garywwwwlll, grrrrrlllll, Ku... mmmmmm... cock, kllllllthhdt, cuwwwww... Ku, gggggggg, cu-ohhhhhhhh... oh, oh, oooooooohhhhhhhhhh... cu... ku... Oh God fucking KUM for me, PLEEEEEEASE!!!"

Maybe you went a little over the top using negro and the "N" word once or twice. I still enjoyed it. You need to be really careful about those words. Personally I find them offensive even when used by black people. Leave them out.

Putting it all aside, I have to say I enjoyed reading the story. But what you're going to get with this is some people are going to love it, some will hate it and some will be indifferent. There's the credibility factor. This just isn't going to happen in real life. Then there's the incredible amount of her body fluids and you made it seem like he filled buckets too. Calling it BDSM seems a stretch to me. I think it needs to be in that category, but thats not what it is in my opinion.

Hey. You know, I did enjoy reading it. It is readable and I wasn't inspired to hit the back button every other minute.

MJL

 

[elfin_odalisque]

As mjl said, that was quite a read, and I'm glad you drew my attention to it. However you're quite wrong to think it's great. It has the potential to be great - the story concept, the tongue-in-cheek humor and characterization are great.

There is just so much wrong with the writing that detracts from the story. You need to get a good editor.

I agree with all mjl's comments and would add some more grammar points.

Capital letters should only be used at the beginning of sentences and for proper names – like Paul, America , Dulles Airport etc. Certainly not for ordinary nouns like librarian or he. Yes, caps for the Man and the Cock because you are personifying them and that is the point. Get rid of the rest

Paragraphs often get too long and you have a big problem with setting dialogue correctly.

Using short or long sentences is a great way to speed up or slow down a narrative. It is very disconcerting when an author uses staccato non-sentences.

Once upon a time, she had allowed a penis inside her. Found it quite unremarkable. And never had interest in knowing one again.

I would find this easier to read as;

Once upon a time she had allowed a penis inside her and, finding it quite unremarkable, had never any interest in knowing one again.

Though no cleavage was bare to speak of (she kept her shirts buttoned to the neck),

Though no cleavage to speak of was exposed as she always kept her shirts buttoned-up,

Whilst you work hard at creating sexual tension, you often use inappropriate words and don't consider the references. For example;

Carmen set her ass on the ankles of her high heels and felt herself squirm and allow for the flame. Her hands met the shaft of her torso and funneled their way to her chest. Her breasts smashed shamelessly against the material, nipples popping obscenely at the Man. She webbed her hands to the points of her tits, and pinched herself as she needed so desperately before. A moan escaped her new lips. Again a sharp pinch, "Ohhhhhhwww." Her pussy responded to the manipulation of her hands. The nerve from clit to the rest of it – so suddenly sincere. Pussy burning with determined attention. If you build it, He will come...

Whatever you were on when you wrote this, can you tell me where to get some! What with popping nipples, torso shafts and shameless breasts smashing against the material of - her chest?

It is a fault throughout, but here is just one more example;

The Man just continued to slap his Cock left to right across the edge of her nerves. Then he planted it THICK between her breast cavity, it interrupted her neckline – and swatted at her nipples with his large left hand. Like an annoying bug being dismissed, he mistreated her stray nipples with a sharp left and right.

But I take my hat off to anyone who can write. “And she knew what she must do...

Gargle like a quacking duck and get fucked down the esophagus.”

His ballsack scrapped the nape of her neck. Mission accomplished.

In a BJ? Mission impossible.

"Oh Goawww, gwwwwlllthddt... garywwwwlll, grrrrrlllll, Ku... mmmmmm... cock, kllllllthhdt, cuwwwww... Ku, gggggggg, cu-ohhhhhhhh... oh, oh, oooooooohhhhhhhhhh... cu... ku... Oh God fucking KUM for me, PLEEEEEEASE!!!"

Never do this. However muddled the words, use proper spellings; otherwise describe the noises, something like ‘she gurgled incoherently’ or ‘screamed like a banshee’.

It's probably a bit long, although I didn't get bored, and it is a bit single paced after the first page.

In summary, I think it reads like the first draft of a wonderful story. My advice is to go through it again with a critical eye and get an editor to review the revised version. When all the boring work is done, resubmit.

I don't think it's BDSM. Fetish possibly - or even Erotic Couplings.

Elle

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

Not a bad story idea, but, as pointed out above, some of the language and structure needs some work. If if were mine, I'd do an edited version and resubmit it. It's pretty good, but could be a lot better.

I'm not too wirried about the "N" word. It seems appropriate in the context. You will, get a few negative comments from it though, because the readers on lit pretend to be socially correct. (On a pron site?)

 

[elfin_odalisque]

(On a pron site?)

What's a pron site? D'you mean 'prone'? With you there.

 

[mjl2010]

What's a pron site? D'you mean 'prone'? With you there.

She must have meant Tron site. You know, the whole computer aspect of it all and everything.

MJL

 

[sophieloves]

Very briefly, (and as a reader only) I have to say I loved the image this whole piece seemed to hinge on - where the librarian is getting face-fucked as books crammed with knowledge bang against the back of her head. It says so much in that one moment.

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

Pron, Porn, Prone, Tron... it's all the same to me

 

[XXplorher]

MJL,

Truth – I break the rules of grammar. Often.

I generally do it… because I prefer the rhythm I’m generating, to that of those who wrote the book.

I’m no Lit major, so for quite a while there I simply made unintended mistakes. But I did go over ‘Learning to Swim’ and corrected most unintended flaws upon submission. Everything you see there, if it’s a broken rule, was generally intended at such. (In the case of the ellipse, I’m either saying a tiny moment of time has passed. Or the character herself was lost in thought for a moment. I specifically want the reader to slow down and consider for a moment… and I think I need to keep doing that.)

I can’t use: "Carmen closed her mouth and waited. And waited some more." I just don’t care for it nearly as much. To me, “And waited. Unmoving...” ? Is FAR more evocative. That would be my particular voice. I’ll be needing to stick with that.

Which isn’t to say I don’t appreciate you pointing that out. Cuz if that’s a continual problem for people? Then maybe I’m selfishly digging my own rhythm, eh. That ain’t good.

I’ll have to maintain my voice, but having it pointed out here that it’s particularly bothersome? It’s certainly something I’ll consider. (Did you see how I put a comma before ‘but’ there? It’s just the way I prefer it. I don’t feel the pause I intended at ‘but’ if there isn’t one. What can I say, forever the rebel.)

-There’s certainly quite a bit of intended humor in there, yes. It’s intentional. Though maybe not for the particulars you listed.

-I tend to get off on misspellings like, “Oh Goawww, gwwwwlllthddt... garywwwwlll, grrrrrlllll.” (in others works.) But yeah, that was a bit of overkill on that one. I like that stuff. I like that it doesn’t give a fuck. It says to me the character has totally lost it (which I love). But I hear ya.

-I definitely need to clarify the ‘negro’ thing. This story is clearly not one bit racist. There’s no way you can read it and think racist. In fact, there’s a piece in there where the black guy tells a nice little story about a bigot (which was clearly the rational perspective). So, in my defense, I don’t think that’s a credible comment.


ELFIN,

Right. To me the ‘once upon a time’ thing totally dismantles the sexual tension. That’s specifically why I go about it the way I did. To me that’s more important than… grammatically correct, I guess.

Whatever you were on when you wrote this, can you tell me where to get some! What with popping nipples, torso shafts and shameless breasts smashing against the material of - her chest?

It’s not an accident that I drew a parallel to her feeling her own torso in the same manner as she wished to feel his cock. That was purposeful. Following that, chest and breast are meant to be the same there. So her hands, while riding up her torso (from her waist), upon reaching her chest, actually crushed her breasts into the fabric of her shirt (outward). I try not to repeat the same term over and over for the sake of maintaining a sense of progression. But there’s no mistake in the description there. It says what I intended.

However, maybe I got the nape of the neck wrong. That’s actually the bottom of the neck, ain’t it? My bad, even that dude didn’t have balls that hangin’, eh. Doh!

Keep in mind, I’m not writing reality. How often does the scenario I described ever happen anywhere? It doesn’t. That’s why I wrote it. And that’s why I make it all larger than life. I’m not writing realism, it’s erotica. But I AM using quite a bit of psychoanalysis to determine the actions of the characters involved. That’s the part I enjoy.

Plus, I’d love for that Librarian to totally BURY me in squirteriffic excess. Since we can’t get that elsewhere? Well…



Hey, thanks very much for the comments!!

I don’t mean to sound defensive – just clarifying my intent. You just helped me understand what may be costing my material. Which is precisely what I asked for. I'm grateful for that and greatly apprecite your efforts at it. Rock on.


PS How come I didn’t get any grief for misspelling the thread title? Lmfao. Seriously, if anything’s ugly – THAT is! Ouch!


Thanks guys,

DoubleX

 

[sophieloves]

nape of the neck: lowest point of the neck at the back

 

[mjl2010]

XXplorher,

I feel like that piece earned a better reaction. And I want to know why I’m wrong

You asked for criticism and we gave it to you. What you do with that and where you take it is up to you. I won't argue your use of the ellipse or other broken grammar rules. Obviously you have and never had any intention of taking any advice on that, however sincerely you worded your plea for criticism. I felt that the criticism I gave was constructive. So was that from Jenny and Elfin.

To quote Elfin - There is just so much wrong with the writing that detracts from the story. You need to get a good editor.

This is the point exactly. You are choosing to not use grammar rules because it suits you, because that's your writing 'style' and then complain it's not getting the reviews you hoped for. Sorry. When the game is over and done, An outstanding story idea that you could have turned into an excellent piece of writing will simply remain what it is. Mediocre at best. Use the rules of the language to create the rhythm and sense of pace that you want. Don't make up your own.

-I definitely need to clarify the ‘negro’ thing. This story is clearly not one bit racist. There’s no way you can read it and think racist. In fact, there’s a piece in there where the black guy tells a nice little story about a bigot (which was clearly the rational perspective). So, in my defense, I don’t think that’s a credible comment.

I did not imply that you or your story was racist. What I did point out is that some people, including myself, find the use of that word unnecessary and to some degree, repulsive. I was only pointing it out, because you asked why people didn't think your story was great, and that was one possible reason. Some people, no matter how well you write and how appropriate the context, are going to dismiss this particular work for that reason alone.

To clarify my own position on your use of those "N" words in this particular context, you did it right in as much as that can be done right. I hesitated to even quote it from your story, thinking someone would somehow believe I condoned its usage, in spite of what I was saying. Perhaps, as a writer, I lack courage in that respect.

I wish you well in your writing.

MJL

 

[Selena_Kitt]

Use the rules of the language to create the rhythm and sense of pace that you want. Don't make up your own.

Fuck that. Make up your own.

I'm in the middle of reading this incredible book called Writing Down the Bones. Wow does this woman "get" how I do writing.

I love this piece of work, flaws and all. Yeah, there are flaws. If I were to edit it, we'd talk about those. Some of what you think is your "voice" isn't, actually. But that's okay.

Breaking the rules is the important part. You can have the most BORING technical piece in the world, and it's still blahblahblah when it's all said and done.

I applaud your breaking of the rules. Keep breaking them. It's what makes your writing come alive.

There's another writer here in the AH, Neonlyte, who writes sentences so long they make your head spin. Some people would tell him to stop. As an editor, I'd put in a FEW periods. But not too many. Because he lets words flow, and that's important.

Commas aren't everything. In fact, they're nothing, without good writing. Sometimes you have to break the rules to say what you mean to say.

I did not imply that you or your story was racist. What I did point out is that some people, including myself, find the use of that word unnecessary and to some degree, repulsive.

And some of us find it daring and hot and a relief.

Perhaps, as a writer, I lack courage in that respect.

To be fair, so do I.

 

[XXplorher]

Ya – don’t misunderstand me, mate. I’m pretty sure I said thanks and I value your opinions. (Yup, I did.) I don’t mean to understate that at all. You took time out of YOUR day to read my stuff and critique particulars. I’m not the least bit dismissive about that. And I apologize if it appeared I was. Thanks again! Please trust I’m sincere about that. It’s important to me you hear that. I don’t do lip service.

My comments on your comments only said I guess I’m perpetually stuck with the grade it gets, cuz I prefer the way I have it to the alterations advised. And it matters what I think. It’s mine. (I need to like it as much, or more, than you do.) And that, yes – I’m willing to take that and walk if that’s the difference between an A and a B+.

Is an author/artist really supposed to just make alterations according to others? I think they need to measure their own intentions on the work involved, matched against the incoming comments – and let that determine if an alteration needs to occur. Ultimately, you can’t be an artist at all if you don’t make those determinations yourself (in this vein, since it’s a one-person creation, as opposed to a group effort.) Otherwise… aren’t we all just writing/creating the very same thing… according to the rules? Wouldn’t ‘perfection’ ultimately get quite a bit dull? Thanks god it doesn’t exist.

In this case, I’m not going to make those alterations. I like what I have there. But that does not at all discredit the need for a truthful/negative critique. You can often learn far more from one of those, than you can a ‘glorious’ critique. I am absolutely certain I need to get better. And that’s why I asked. So thanks again for going there.

-I do have to say, and I don’t mean to be insulting… It’s a shame that I wasn’t able to smash the idea that a black man is anything much like a ‘nigger’ – when he obliterated that very thought against the wall with an apple, after telling us the difference. And be respected for doing so. I felt it very important I use that word initially (although I think I said ‘negro man’. And only once). I thought I said something there. And sometimes… the word needs to be used in order to denounce it.

I’m a white guy. I thought I did a pretty good job saluting a black guy. At least Carmen thought I did. ; )


-Soap - The nape of the neck is in the BACK?!! Holy shit!!!! GLARING error. Okay, that’s very, very bad. I meant that little soft spot at the base of the neck in the front. (Still, that would make his sack unattractively slinky. So I definitely choked that particular spot…. No pun intended.)

-Hmm… look at Kittyn! Wow, man. Awesome! (You go, grrrrrl. And I must say, that AV fuckin’ rocks. That’s really hot and TRULY original. Well done.)

Sometimes you have to break the rules to say what you mean to say.

Precisely. In fact, maybe it looks like I’m saying I just want to break rules? I don’t. I just need to get across what I’m trying to say the way I feel is most effective. And if that requires I break the rules?… Thank god for Hendrix, eh? (Not that I’m Hendrix, christ - I did NOT just say I’m Hendrix. Man, that’ll look bad… I’m, uh… a GIT reject. Yeah, that about sums it up.)

… A daring, hot, relief?

Did I start this off asking for criticism? I must have been delusional. I think I just heard enough to never question this story again. Mission accomplished. (Fuckin’ Leo’s… such suckers.)


Edit: Correction. 'He' did use the word 'nigger'. My understanding is as long as a black person uses it - it's fine (see endless amounts of Rap on that). However, I think it clear he used it as something to smash - as opposed to a chain around his neck. (In any case, I didn't say it - he did. I'm not any of these people.)

 

[XXplorher]

Important excerpt

Again, this story... is about breaking boundaries. (‘Learning to Swim’, ocean is endless). She, him, racism, restraint, control, rebellion, her past, the location, the incest affiliations… acceptance – all of that is very intentional.

And I know I’m saying a lot more of that to myself while it hits the page, you’re not supposed to actually see that stuff – but it’s there. It’s the reason I wrote it. Because of that, it’s bothering me very much… the way you got put off by the N-word. So I think I should maybe print that spot in particular here. I feel the need to do that (I'll be done after this. Thanks again fer lookin'):



In a span of time that may have been hours, or seconds (Carmen could not deduce either, yet she had not moved an inch), the Man returned.

The door opened and his sweaty, exposed, muscular chest marched in - the enormity of his lathered black dick hardly veiled in his spotted white pants. They hit the floor immediately. It hung past the middle of his thigh. Impossible.

He carried with him a small suitcase. It landed next to Carmen. And then opened.

The first thing she noticed was a black leather whip of several strands. He took it out and laid it menacingly next to her hip. Two large clamps were visible (perhaps used for heavy clothes, but far wider in the clamp area than could be considered necessary) with small pear-shaped weights attached to them by a tiny distance of chain. There was a Newspaper. A length of rope. And two egg-shaped metallic bulbs – attached via wire to some electronic device… with a remote. And… a green apple.

And also – there was a knife.

He pulled out the Newspaper… The Wall Street Journal, and the apple. And began to read. While eating the apple.

“Did you know…” snap, crunch went the sharp apple into his teeth, “that they still call people of my color ‘niggers’ in the South?”

Carmen didn’t answer. All she could feel was the soft burn of her throat. The relaxed pores of her skin. The cold air on her wet naked tits. The throb between her legs. A fixation on his exposed dangling Cock. And the need to know what’s next…

His Cock slapped down on the table. Pointed directly between her legs. How could it be a part of him… yet appear all its own the way it did? As if he was simply towing it around.

“Niggers… You see this name on the front page?” All Carmen saw was Cock. “I fucked his wife with this”. And he thumped it down onto the desk again… inches closer between her knees (Carmen hadn’t fully removed her knee length skirt. Her knees sat before her, together, ass back on the plastic coated leather of her high heels. As was his intention). “Her man had made me a bet that I couldn’t. One-hundred-grand as a matter of fact, that arrogant retard.” Carmen watched the Cock throb on the table before her. His veins grew thicker. “So after I fucked her, while he watched, and he gave me his precious money…” Carmen suddenly realized her hands were held of her own volition, behind her back… she dared not move them, but now… “I threw that paper cash into the fireplace. And watched it burn.” Her hands moved along her thighs now, cautiously calculating the muscle. “And I said to the rich bigot… Who’s your nigger now, bitch?” Carmen’s hands had made the table in front of her, she was ready to grasp it…

Initially unknowing, the Man slapped her hands away in disgust. “Get that shit outta here. What are you grabbin’ at? Did I tell you to grab? I did not tell you to grab. Don’t get suddenly overconfident, just because I let you throat my cock, bitch.” He threw the apple across the room, it shattered green against the wall, and grabbed the knife in a sudden motion – slamming it down between her legs and ripping it back between her knees. It was a precise cut. The skirt was now open like an envelope. Her thighs exposed to the light of the room… and a trickle of blood from a tiny cut, bled ever so slowly...

 

[Selena_Kitt]

I meant that little soft spot at the base of the neck in the front.

hollow of the throat


right now I'm feeling like someone dug mine out with a spoon.

 

[sr71plt]

I almost feel like I should read this story--because something must be wrong with it that the author doesn't seem to want to take hold of. The author is the one who has brought the story up here because the author feels readers haven't given it its due (because the author "knows" its great--which is rather a leading with the chin comment right there) and both he and SK at least seem to be saying fuck the reader on being able to comfortably read it (Screw the rules of grammar and punctuation; break all you can).

I too think the rules should be dropped when they get in the way of the best read (which, however, shouldn't often have to be the case--the "rules" of writing fiction for publication are actually pretty flexible). And I have no way of knowing what I think of the rule breaking in this particular story until/unless I read it (and I have no idea whether I will--the introduction of how great it was despite the reaction was offputting to me, even though some of the stories of mine I like the best don't get a good reception either. So, there you go. Ambivalent about it at best).

But I do have the suspicion that there's a disconnect here somewhere on the understanding of who matters the most with a published short story--the author or the reader. It's the reader who matters most, not the author (as any publisher will tell an author who's peddling a story for the publisher to buy). And if the rule breaking goes beyond the reader's tolerance levels (which a couple of the reviewers here have said it does for them at least), there are some red flags waving all along the horizon here.

Whenever I get the impression that an author is saying "screw the reader; I thought what I wrote was great," my initial reaction is that they then should shove it in their desk drawer and take it out and admire it from time to time--but not bother another reader with it.

 

[mjl2010]

sr71, I encourage you to go read it.

You know, I started out by saying this was some read. And I meant it too. The idea behind the story is amazing. Great. And, it wasn't terribly hard to read, mostly. Honestly it wasn't and I thought I said so.

In places though, it was distracting the way ellipses were used for a pause, things like that. Very staccato sentences. Non sentences. A lot of them. Some of the language I remember from grade school. And in some places, I suppose it fits.

I admitted that sometimes I laughed. I wasn't sure I was supposed to. It turns out I was. You should read it. It is and I give XX a lot of credit for this, an amazing read. Yet, the times I had to go back and re-read a portion, and sometimes, reread it a third time, was a distraction.

It wasn't that he broke a rule here or there to emphasize something or draw attention to something. It was that he threw the rules out the window and made it, sometimes, difficult to read. I would find myself skimming, then going back and trying again because the idea, the thought, was great and not to be missed by skimming.

I applaud his idea, his pace, the thoughts he conveyed. Just. Well you have to read it.

Five Lit pages, take some time and go read. It's worth it for any number of reasons.

MJL

 

[sr71plt]

sr71, I encourage you to go read it.

You know, I started out by saying this was some read. And I meant it too. The idea behind the story is amazing. Great. And, it wasn't terribly hard to read, mostly. Honestly it wasn't and I thought I said so.

In places though, it was distracting the way ellipses were used for a pause, things like that. Very staccato sentences. Non sentences. A lot of them. Some of the language I remember from grade school. And in some places, I suppose it fits.

I admitted that sometimes I laughed. I wasn't sure I was supposed to. It turns out I was. You should read it. It is and I give XX a lot of credit for this, an amazing read. Yet, the times I had to go back and re-read a portion, and sometimes, reread it a third time, was a distraction.

It wasn't that he broke a rule here or there to emphasize something or draw attention to something. It was that he threw the rules out the window and made it, sometimes, difficult to read. I would find myself skimming, then going back and trying again because the idea, the thought, was great and not to be missed by skimming.

I applaud his idea, his pace, the thoughts he conveyed. Just. Well you have to read it.

Five Lit pages, take some time and go read. It's worth it for any number of reasons.

MJL

Ah, yes, the five Lit. pages. I'd have to be hired to read a Lit. story segment over two pages, I'm afraid.

 

[XXplorher]

It wasn't that he broke a rule here or there to emphasize something or draw attention to something. It was that he threw the rules out the window and made it, sometimes, difficult to read. I would find myself skimming, then going back and trying again because the idea, the thought, was great and not to be missed by skimming.

…………..

Do you have ANY idea how satisfying a thought that is for me to hear? (Huge, enormous, magnificent… so fucking large.)

I’m beaming….

Thanks for reading that thing, man. And thanks for saying what you just did. Maybe…. I’m actually saying something. Fucking damn… you just accidentally said I am.

 

[sophieloves]

Ah, yes, the five Lit. pages. I'd have to be hired to read a Lit. story segment over two pages, I'm afraid.

that's unfortunate. you must miss a lot of stuff.

 

[sr71plt]

that's unfortunate. you must miss a lot of stuff.

lol. I miss out on a lot of verbiage, of course. I cleave to the classic definition of "short story": something the reader is able to read at one setting. My activities are varied and full enough that 7,000 words is pretty much my limit for reading anything at a setting. (It's also been well-proven to be long enough to produce a story that succinctly covers all of the bases of what makes a good short story.) And this is well above the average words these days for what is publishable and/or accepted in competition. That sets parameters on what I write, so I pretty naturally take on those parameters for what little I read--either a full story or a chapter here at Lit. of no more than two Lit. pages.

As your posting indicates criticism that I must read it all and that it's somehow a sin to not do so, I admire your ability/willingness/time available/lack of a real life to read it all here so that you won't miss anything.

 

[mjl2010]

Do you have ANY idea how satisfying a thought that is for me to hear? (Huge, enormous, magnificent… so fucking large.)

I’m beaming….

Thanks for reading that thing, man. And thanks for saying what you just did. Maybe…. I’m actually saying something. Fucking damn… you just accidentally said I am.

I never said it wasn't a great story or a great idea. In fact I said just the opposite.

All I did was give you my opinion on why some people may not have finished reading it, or voted a lower score. I will still maintain that there are a lot of things you could do to make more READABLE. There are places you have to read sections two and three times to get the gist of it. This is both annoying and distracting and detracts from the readers overall enjoyment of the piece.

MJL

 

[staciliv]

I'm gonna go way out on a limb here and perhaps offer a different criticism. I agree the story is difficult to read because of the numerous grammatical errors. Yes, I agree rules can be broken. But before rules are broken one must write something someone wants to continue to read.

I got through the entire first part and about half of the second before I gave up. I think you have a good idea; the stuffy female librarian getting what she so clearly wants and fears from someone she might consider inferior. The problem I had was, I was never really interested in either Carmen or the Man as people.

Why was Carmen so stuffy? Why was the Man so domineering? What brought them together? I had trouble believing he just walked in off the street then started teasing her with a book about female ejaculation. How'd he know she wouldn't call the police? Or grab the gun behind the counter and shoot him?

Also, overall the story moves too slowly for my taste. A nice slow lead in is fine, but going on and on about reaching for the book was a bit much I thought.

So I have, in addition to clean up the grammer, scrub the ellipses, bag the choppy sentences: generate interest in the characters, and move it along already.

Again, just my opinion for what it's worth.

 

[sophieloves]

lol. I miss out on a lot of verbiage, of course. I cleave to the classic definition of "short story": something the reader is able to read at one setting. My activities are varied and full enough that 7,000 words is pretty much my limit for reading anything at a setting. (It's also been well-proven to be long enough to produce a story that succinctly covers all of the bases of what makes a good short story.) And this is well above the average words these days for what is publishable and/or accepted in competition. That sets parameters on what I write, so I pretty naturally take on those parameters for what little I read--either a full story or a chapter here at Lit. of no more than two Lit. pages.

As your posting indicates criticism that I must read it all and that it's somehow a sin to not do so, I admire your ability/willingness/time available/lack of a real life to read it all here so that you won't miss anything.

actually, you read that into my post. i merely offered a thought that - by not reading some pieces due to length or other problems - you might miss out on some things worth reading. i'm not an author, and would never presume to do what you have suggested i did.

please don't go this silly route of 'lack of a real life'. my life is perfectly real, and my current circumstances offer me a greater scope for reading more, in single sittings, than perhaps many have. i also read fast. and THAT does nto equate to skimming or not taking in the details or relevance of what i have read.

i also appreciate your use of the word 'verbiage'. it is a word i approve of. however, in my own reading experiences i have come across almost as much of this in short stories as long.

 

[sr71plt]

actually, you read that into my post. i merely offered a thought that - by not reading some pieces due to length or other problems - you might miss out on some things worth reading. i'm not an author, and would never presume to do what you have suggested i did.

please don't go this silly route of 'lack of a real life'. my life is perfectly real, and my current circumstances offer me a greater scope for reading more, in single sittings, than perhaps many have. i also read fast. and THAT does nto equate to skimming or not taking in the details or relevance of what i have read.

i also appreciate your use of the word 'verbiage'. it is a word i approve of. however, in my own reading experiences i have come across almost as much of this in short stories as long.

Have no need to fight over this. We all have to set limits on what we'll read and what we'll do--and then, yes, we all miss out on what we haven't done. It's inevitable.

I just didn't like your condescending tone and your implication that what I do read is not as important or satisfying as what I don't read. You have no way of knowing that--so there's no particular reason why you should have been saying it other than to be condescending and derogatory--and to start a fight.

This is a sex site. If you can't get me interested and aroused in two Lit. pages, I don't see the need to wade through your seven pager. There are more than enough satisfying two-pagers here.