It's a sad day when....

[Inkent]

....shit like this happens. It's appeared on an authors profile today, and a good one at that.

"My brief stint here has been... interesting, to say the least.

The site is good, but ruined by a toxic portion of the readership. It's a shame, because there are some wonderful people who visit the site to enjoy some good stories. Unfortunately, the horrendous comments and emails authors receive counters them somewhat.

I may write for the site again one day. Until then, enjoy the stories I've written."

I'm sure there's a few out there whooping and cheering, in reality they aren't here for the stories. I'm fairly sure their own beliefs (and there are a multitude of reasons why) want to turn on those that they feel don't subscribe to their views.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Sad. From the nature of his/her problem, I might venture to say they were posting in Loving Wives. I avoid LW for just this reason.

 

[Inkent]

I would say 75-80% in Romance, the rest in LW category. Every single piece has earned a red H. Criminal and gutted to see an author feel this way

 

[gunhilltrain]

If you are going to submit to an open site like this, where millions of people with a keyboard can read and comment on anything, then one has to develop a kind of Stoicism. After six years, I don't care if somebody doesn't like everything I do. If they have something constructive to say, I'll read it. Otherwise, I'll ignore it. If it's really nasty or incoherent, then I'll just delete it. They have no power to stop me or anyone else here. It's just words on a screen.

Do you think Francis Ford Coppola loses any sleep because Megalopolis bombed at the box office? "Oh, the audience just doesn't get it." (He put plenty of his own money into it too.) After decades in the business, he knows the score and he probably also thinks, FTJ. (I just made that up, but what it is abbreviated from should be obvious.)

 

[SimonDoom]

Every single piece has earned a red H. Criminal and gutted to see an author feel this way

I don't know who this author is and I want to tread carefully, but I don't understand. You wrote that "every single piece has earned a red H." That means, necessarily, that this author has received overwhelmingly positive feedback to their stories.

So, what's the problem?

A few bad comments? Almost certainly, it's not more than that, because stories just don't get that many comments most of the time here at Literotica.

I'm trying not to sound callous and unsympathetic, but I don't understand authors who get thrown into a tizzy because of a few bad comments, or because somebody gives their story a "1" and it knocks their story score down a bit. I just don't get it. Over the course of my 8 years here I've received many negative comments, some of them almost comically vicious. I've had readers tell me I should immediately stop writing. It's the way it goes. Most of us deal with this, especially if we choose to write stories in certain categories, like Loving Wives. I have many stories without red Hs. So?

 

[Nicenashguy615]

I have another profile I use for writing and there was a time, not long ago, where I felt the same way. In fact, I changed my profile message to something similar.

It’s a real kick in the balls to spend months polishing something and the initial votes in the first ten minutes are ones. A 30k word story could never be read in ten minutes so you know right off the bat it’s just poison. Then you spend the next three months hoping the score eventually overcomes this and gets back up there. But the damage is done. It can never hit 4.7, 4.8 or better if it has twenty one votes. There are very few stories that really deserve a one.

I enjoy writing immensely but a part of the reason I enjoy it is knowing others enjoy it. If I get 50,000 views but only 50 votes, that means only one out of a thousand viewers care enough to vote. And with only 5 comments, that means only one out of ten thousand people could be bothered to say something about your work.

And I often get comments like, “Great story. Loved it, but you really need an editor. I spotted a missing comma and had to give it a four for this reason.” Comments like that often have me questioning why I bother.

In fact, I have more than ten stories all finished and ready but I often feel like publishing them is just an opportunity for others to be dicks. I had my fun writing them and if there’s no gain in publishing them, might as well let them sit and collect dust.

And for what it’s worth, I’ve seen this in mature and BDSM a lot. Loving wives is basically where the most hate is. I’d never publish a story there unless I enjoyed having people urinate on me and my work.

 

[Inkent]

Gunhilltrain I have exactly the same ethos as you. I generally write in LW, and love to play on deep emotions along the way. The kickback is that some people feel I've actually inflicted the pain on the characters, and do lash out. For me, that's a win, if they've become that immersed in the story they want to comment on it, goes with the territory. There is a wide cross section of readers, and I still find it bizarre, that people with no interest in Erotica want to read stories...but they don't. What they want is for everybody else to bow to their ideals, so by chasing the source away (authors) they can claim a victory.

Sad world, you just need to get real friendly with the delete button !!

 

[Nicenashguy615]

I don't know who this author is and I want to tread carefully, but I don't understand. You wrote that "every single piece has earned a red H." That means, necessarily, that this author has received overwhelmingly positive feedback to their stories.

So, what's the problem?

A few bad comments? Almost certainly, it's not more than that, because stories just don't get that many comments most of the time here at Literotica.

I'm trying not to sound callous and unsympathetic, but I don't understand authors who get thrown into a tizzy because of a few bad comments, or because somebody gives their story a "1" and it knocks their story score down a bit. I just don't get it. Over the course of my 8 years here I've received many negative comments, some of them almost comically vicious. I've had readers tell me I should immediately stop writing. It's the way it goes. Most of us deal with this, especially if we choose to write stories in certain categories, like Loving Wives. I have many stories without red Hs. So?

I totally get where you’re coming from and I respect that. I would love to be the kind of person who could not give a crap about anything but I am who I am. Many of us do care.

I certainly don’t get butt hurt over honest criticism. Sometimes that’s very useful. What pisses me off is the lack of decency many have towards others. I don’t walk up to overweight women and say, “Jesus lady! Just cause they make it in your size doesn’t mean you should wear it!”

Beyond it being an awful and unnecessary thing to say, it might get me punched in the face. Why, because people are offended by stuff like that in the real world. Turns out they are equally offended in the virtual world too.

 

[Inkent]

I don't know who this author is and I want to tread carefully, but I don't understand. You wrote that "every single piece has earned a red H." That means, necessarily, that this author has received overwhelmingly positive feedback to their stories.

I was surprised myself, bearing how well their work scores. Personally, I've had some shit feedback via emails, "If I could find you, I'd.....pick something unpleasant and insert it here, and I do mean unpleasant. I'm old enough and ugly enough to shrug them off, but can everyone do that/feel that way??

 

[gunhilltrain]

I was surprised myself, bearing how well their work scores. Personally, I've had some shit feedback via emails, "If I could find you, I'd.....pick something unpleasant and insert it here, and I do mean unpleasant. I'm old enough and ugly enough to shrug them off, but can everyone do that/feel that way??

Fortunately I've rarely gotten negative emails, As for "if I could find you. . . . :" empty threats from someone "blowing off steam," or possibly having a mental episode.

 

[MillieDynamite]

I've had my fair share of negative comments and a few (but very few) emails about what douch I am. More emails with the, "How about we have an online trist," variety.

 

[Inkent]

I've had my fair share of negative comments and a few (but very few) emails about what douch I am. More emails with the, "How about we have an online trist," variety.

LOL I've had some "can I have your Mrs phone number" off the back of some of my early work!

 

[MillieDynamite]

Well, that's sooo icky.

LOL I've had some "can I have your Mrs phone number" off the back of some of my early work!

 

[pink_silk_glove]

I'm trying not to sound callous and unsympathetic, but I don't understand authors who get thrown into a tizzy because of a few bad comments, or because somebody gives their story a "1" and it knocks their story score down a bit. I just don't get it.

It's because they are writing for the applause instead of the love of sharing their writing. It's ego driven writing and as the example clearly demonstrates, ultimately less satisfying.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

There are very few stories that really deserve a one.

I beg to differ. The majority of stories on lit I would personally rate a 1.

 

[Belegon]

I would say, and I'm aware it sounds a bit harsh, that part of becoming a success is developing a thick skin. If they think it's hard to take a negative comment here, they certainly don't want to venture any further and perhaps it is best for their mental health if they do exactly what they did. Seriously, if you think it's not fun to get a bad comment on Lit, try getting a harsh rejection from a publisher or a bad review on a site that focuses on reviewing. And believe me, there are plenty of review sites out there whose whole deal is to see how snarky and mean they can get. That is their readership, people who enjoy authors getting ripped a new one.

The other side of that is how good it feels when a snark site says something nice about your writing. It can be quite a rush. I just wish those moments directly translated into income, which they don't always do. It's nice to be respected, but the bill collectors don't care about your reputation.

 

[SimonDoom]

There are very few stories that really deserve a one.

I don't go quite as far as pink silk glove, but I disagree. If you grade on a curve, by definition 20% of stories deserve a one. Based upon my own subjective opinion, of what I've read, I believe about 20% of stories, or maybe more, deserve a one. I think stories here are generally over-rated, and the tendency to push against downvoting stories disserves readers. The whole point of a rating system is not to please the author but to provide information to potential readers, and a system that skews toward 4s and 5s fails to provide readers the information they need to make optimal decisions.

I think of a "five" story as one that's roughly in the top ten percent of all stories at Literotica, regardless of subject or category. In practice, I almost never give anything less than a "four" because I only vote for stories I finish and I almost never finish stories that I judge to be lower than a "four" in quality.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

If you are going to submit to an open site like this, where millions of people with a keyboard can read and comment on anything, then one has to develop a kind of Stoicism. After six years, I don't care if somebody doesn't like everything I do. If they have something constructive to say, I'll read it. Otherwise, I'll ignore it. If it's really nasty or incoherent, then I'll just delete it. They have no power to stop me or anyone else here. It's just words on a screen.

Do you think Francis Ford Coppola loses any sleep because Megalopolis bombed at the box office? "Oh, the audience just doesn't get it." (He put plenty of his own money into it too.) After decades in the business, he knows the score and he probably also thinks, FTJ. (I just made that up, but what it is abbreviated from should be obvious.)

I feel the same. Negative comments don't matter to me, at all. I've found via the subreddits, that the softest writers write fanfics.

 

[Wifetheif]

You simply cannot have a thin skin and be a writer. In fact, I recommend every L.com author post at least one story to LW to understand real vitriol. Sometimes criticism is misplaced but honest criticism makes us better writers if we are open to seeing our flaws. If you cant' take the heat .... you end up like the woman who boldly proclaimed se could not take criticism so she founded her own publishing company and published her novel without editing (I chose the wrong word? No the editor HATES me!) which hit the market with a thud and was not well-reviewed. The frustrating part was that the novel had good ideas and snatches of decent prose, had the author believed in editing and beta readers, it could have been commercially published. Her thin skin killed her literary career before it even began. We have no idea what this leaving writer considers vitriol. Were they personal attacks? That's an issue for Laurel. Were they complaints about the writing style or subject matter? Welcome to the world of authorship, my friend.

 

[MillieDynamite]

Me either.

I don't know who this author is and I want to tread carefully, but I don't understand. You wrote that "every single piece has earned a red H." That means, necessarily, that this author has received overwhelmingly positive feedback to their stories.

So, what's the problem?

A few bad comments? Almost certainly, it's not more than that, because stories just don't get that many comments most of the time here at Literotica.

I'm trying not to sound callous and unsympathetic, but I don't understand authors who get thrown into a tizzy because of a few bad comments, or because somebody gives their story a "1" and it knocks their story score down a bit. I just don't get it. Over the course of my 8 years here I've received many negative comments, some of them almost comically vicious. I've had readers tell me I should immediately stop writing. It's the way it goes. Most of us deal with this, especially if we choose to write stories in certain categories, like Loving Wives. I have many stories without red Hs. So?

 

[SimonDoom]

You simply cannot have a thin skin and be a writer. In fact, I recommend every L.com author post at least one story to LW to understand real vitriol. Sometimes criticism is misplaced but honest criticism makes us better writers if we are open to seeing our flaws. If you cant' take the heat .... you end up like the woman who boldly proclaimed se could not take criticism so she founded her own publishing company and published her novel without editing (I chose the wrong word? No the editor HATES me!) which hit the market with a thud and was not well-reviewed. The frustrating part was that the novel had good ideas and snatches of decent prose, had the author believed in editing and beta readers, it could have been commercially published. Her thin skin killed her literary career before it even began. We have no idea what this leaving writer considers vitriol. Were they personal attacks? That's an issue for Laurel. Were they complaints about the writing style or subject matter? Welcome to the world of authorship, my friend.

I actually did this, more or less. My third story, published about three weeks after my first, was a silly Mike Hammer detective-style spoof about a detective investigating a possible cuckold case, and I hit the readers with a twist at the end that drove many of the "BTB" readers nuts. I received far more nasty, vicious comments to that story than to any other I've ever published. I was a bit taken aback by the viciousness, but on the other hand I knew I should have expected criticism. I've had a tough skin ever since that story, and I also developed the comforting belief that it's not the end of the world if your story gets nasty comments and votes. That story is closing in on 100,000 views after 8 years, and it's received plenty of support along with the nasty comments. I wouldn't do anything differently.

 

[gunhilltrain]

I actually did this, more or less. My third story, published about three weeks after my first, was a silly Mike Hammer detective-style spoof about a detective investigating a possible cuckold case, and I hit the readers with a twist at the end that drove many of the "BTB" readers nuts. I received far more nasty, vicious comments to that story than to any other I've ever published. I was a bit taken aback by the viciousness, but on the other hand I knew I should have expected criticism. I've had a tough skin ever since that story, and I also developed the comforting belief that it's not the end of the world if your story gets nasty comments and votes. That story is closing in on 100,000 views after 8 years, and it's received plenty of support along with the nasty comments. I wouldn't do anything differently.

Sometimes a stopped clock is right, and I have had a couple of times where the reader-critics were right. For one guy, I didn't even consider his comment until months went by and I found it again by accident. (Somebody had posted a new comment right above his.) I tried a new version of the story with his suggestions (no, he wasn't exactly gentle about it) and, yeah, it was much better. I even grew a bunch of sequels and series from it after that.

I'm sure he long ago moved on and doesn't even remember what he said.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

And I often get comments like, “Great story. Loved it, but you really need an editor. I spotted a missing comma and had to give it a four for this reason.” Comments like that often have me questioning why I bother.

I loathe those comments.
I really appreciate constructive criticism, but yeah... a typo... beat me with a wet noodle.

 

[Belegon]

You simply cannot have a thin skin and be a writer. In fact, I recommend every L.com author post at least one story to LW to understand real vitriol. Sometimes criticism is misplaced but honest criticism makes us better writers if we are open to seeing our flaws. If you cant' take the heat .... you end up like the woman who boldly proclaimed se could not take criticism so she founded her own publishing company and published her novel without editing (I chose the wrong word? No the editor HATES me!) which hit the market with a thud and was not well-reviewed. The frustrating part was that the novel had good ideas and snatches of decent prose, had the author believed in editing and beta readers, it could have been commercially published. Her thin skin killed her literary career before it even began. We have no idea what this leaving writer considers vitriol. Were they personal attacks? That's an issue for Laurel. Were they complaints about the writing style or subject matter? Welcome to the world of authorship, my friend.

If you think Loving Wives gets vicious, that's only a start. Believe me, there are reviewers out there who actively search for ways to piss off authors and get them to damn themselves and even their careers. I've received multiple personal attacks, been told I couldn't possibly be a man, been told I was a twink masquerading as a straight male, been told that situations and the responses to them couldn't possibly be real when the actions in question were pulled directly from my real life ( not that the reviewer knew that) and many other things. Emasculation is probably the least of it.

I remember fondly the days when I thought Mrs. Giggles was tough on authors. She can be, but her feedback made me a better writer. That's not always the case. And while I have focused here on professional reviewers, there ARE people criticizing on Lit that can be very hurtful.

 

[Comshaw]

I don't know who this author is and I want to tread carefully, but I don't understand. You wrote that "every single piece has earned a red H." That means, necessarily, that this author has received overwhelmingly positive feedback to their stories.

So, what's the problem? (snip)

The problem (as I see it) is a psychological one and lies in the fact that we aren't all alike. It appears that you, like me and a whole bunch of others here have grown a crusty shell that allows vile comments to slide right off. But there are others not so lucky. A single word can cut them like a knife. I know this because way back in the beginning I was one of the second type. It took me a very long time to grow my shell. But some of those who don't have that shell just can not get to that point. It appears to me this author is one of those; a person who has never grown nor can a shell like ours. Which is unfortunate if they have such well-written stories. They are allowing a tiny minority to rob the majority of well-done works.

It's because they are writing for the applause instead of the love of sharing their writing. It's ego driven writing and as the example clearly demonstrates, ultimately less satisfying.

I disagree. They aren't strictly "writing for applause" because they weren't complaining about the scores or about genuine criticism of their work. They were complaining about vicious, toxic people who delight in trying to tear down someone for no other reason than the feeling they get by doing so.

Additionally, I would disagree that "the love of sharing their writing" isn't ego-driven. It's more ego-driven than the first type. throwing one's story out into the public with the thought that "you need to read this because it's good and if you disagree you're a troglodyte" is all ego.

I beg to differ. The majority of stories on lit I would personally rate a 1.

I don't think anyone will disagree with you on the last statement.

Sometimes a stopped clock is right, and I have had a couple of times where the reader-critics were right. For one guy, I didn't even consider his comment until months went by and I found it again by accident. (Somebody had posted a new comment right above his.) I tried a new version of the story with his suggestions (no, he wasn't exactly gentle about it) and, yeah, it was much better. I even grew a bunch of sequels and series from it after that.

I'm sure he long ago moved on and doesn't even remember what he said.

Yeah, I have a problem with this too. I could go into a long drawn-out explanation why but suffice it to say when criticism is used as a cudgel or presented in a brusk and dehumimizing manner I can't absorb it the first time around. Like picking a diamond out of a dog turd I need to leave it for a while before I can go back and get it.


Comshaw