Is there a difference to you between PORN and EROTICA?

[PoliteSuccubus]

In another thread someone said "Gotta love porn" and I replied:

To me porn and erotica are two different things.

Porn is glossed over advertiseing for impossiable dreams, and primarily for men. Erotica is is more about what is really sexy to the writer and/or reader, and thusly more initmate.

 

[Un-registered]

It's all in the point of view:

I write literature which is about love and life;

You write erotic stories;

(S)he writes porno trash.

 

[curious2c]

Good question...I just don't know. I write, but I am not sure what people actually think of it as in erotic or porn. Until then I guess I write stories with sex in them.

 

[Dirt Man]

My Webster's Dictionary says...

Erotica: n. Literature dealing with sexual love.
Pornography: n. obscene literature or pictures.


So basically it comes down to what each person considers obscene, and what each person considers sexual love. Not love as in: "I love you" love, but love as in fornicating, as in making love. Nothing said there indicates that it has to be with one's legal spouce, or otherwise. So obscene becomes a matter of personal opinion. If I say; "I love the neighbor's dog," I may just be saying that the dog and I are good buddies. But then again I might also be saying that we are sexually compatible too, depending on the context, right? For instance, when little Timmy at age 10 says; "I love Lassie," we assume that he loves his collie the same way most young boys love their dogs; as faithful pets. But when Timmy is over 21 and says the same thing just how should we take it? After all, Lassie is a bitch, not a stud. Have I said anything obscene so far? No? Have I implied a few obscene thoughts? Maybe.

Literature dealing with sexual love is as pornographic as each of our minds make it to be. Ask any groom on his wedding night if his thoughts are pornographic, and obscene, and you'll get few varied honest answers. Does he love his wife? Yes. Is she his sexual object of the moment? Of course she is. Does this make their love making obscene? That's up to each of us to decide on our own. Surely what the newlyweds are doing in bed with each other is no different than what one might see on any triple X video. The fact that they are doing it in the privacy of their hotel, or home with or without cameras recording the event changes nothing. Add a word or two of dialogue in text though, and you add voyurism to their little love nest by bringing in an audience. Is voyurism obscene? Again, depends on opinion.

Make the newlyweds unwiting brother, and unknowing sister that haven't met each other since birth, and have we yet interjected obscenity into the context in anyone's mind but the one reading the story, or watching the video? And is that any different from a brother and sister making love to each other on purpose?

The truth is, Erotica, and Pornography are basically the same thing once they are put to paper, or film. Why? Because until that moment what happened was a private affair. Put into print, or placed in view so that others may see it out in the open makes it obscene by a willful judgement on the part of the reader, or viewer. No sexual act between consenting partners in the act is obscene until someone else's mind is brought to bear on the subject.

Which means that most romance novels, (and all of them with sex in them) could be considered pornographic depending on who is reading them. And here in lies the great debate here at literotica as to what is erotic, and what isn't. Why? Because for most young women their first taste of erotic literature comes through reading romance novels, magazines, and such. Where as for young men, it's through purchasing, stealing, or borrowing a copy of Penthouse, Playboy, or some such other magazines that have pictures of naked women as well as explicit stories to highten their libido. So it comes down again to whose mind is viewing the related literature. Now that's not to say that women don't read Penthouse, Playboy, or whatever, or that men don't read romance novels, or at least the sex parts. But by and large it makes for a relative difference of predudicial view points on this subject between male authors, and female authors here at literotica, and for readers in the world outside here as well.

Therefore, how an author treats to write erotica/porn is their own perogative, and what porn/erotica the reader choses to read is theirs. In each case we give, and take what we want from each story. We therefore each of us decide what is truely erotic, and what is truely pornograpic on our own. No one person, group, or state can force, or persuade any us to do otherwise. To argue about it here within these haloed halls where subject catagories such as Incest, and Bondage are involved is an indulgence of pettiness beyond comprehension, and snobbish at best. IMHO there is no difference between the word erotica, and the word pornographic by the meanings put forth in Webster's Dictionary, or by the work that I've read here at literotica.

As Always
I Am the
Dirt Man

 

[Octavian]

The difference

Could this be the difference?

Pornography concentrates on graphically depicting sexual action to the exclusion of virtually everything else.

Erotica seeks to provide a reasonable context to justify sexual action, irrespective of whether such action is graphically depicted or not.

Octavian

 

[Diane Marie]

I just hate men who know it all, men who’s opinions become in their minds fact. I also hate being preached to.

I agree PoliteSuccubus there is a big difference.

Personally I hate porn stories where women act like men. At times I wonder if many of the male writers here have ever had sex with a woman, much less made love to one.

 

[Octavian]

Diane Marie

I am only expressing my opinion. I had imagined PoliteSuccubus was eliciting other people's opinions, otherwise why initiate this thread.

Octavian

 

[Pookie]

From Merriam-Webster:

Main Entry: por·nog·ra·phy
Pronunciation: -fE
Function: noun
Etymology: Greek pornographos, adjective, writing about prostitutes, from pornE prostitute + graphein to write; akin to Greek pernanai to sell, poros journey -- more at FARE, CARVE
Date: circa 1864
1 : the depiction of erotic behavior (as in pictures or writing) intended to cause sexual excitement
2 : material (as books or a photograph) that depicts erotic behavior and is intended to cause sexual excitement
3 : the depiction of acts in a sensational manner so as to arouse a quick intense emotional reaction <the pornography of violence>


Main Entry: erot·i·ca
Pronunciation: i-'rä-ti-k&
Function: noun plural but singular or plural in construction
Etymology: New Latin, from Greek erOtika, neuter plural of erOtikos
Date: 1854
1 : literary or artistic works having an erotic theme or quality
2 : depictions of things erotic


Main Entry: erot·ic
Pronunciation: i-'rä-tik
Variant(s): also erot·i·cal /-ti-k&l/
Function: adjective
Etymology: Greek erOtikos, from erOt-, erOs
Date: 1651
1 : of, devoted to, or tending to arouse sexual love or desire <erotic art>
2 : strongly marked or affected by sexual desire


I have always viewed erotica as just a type of pornography. There is nothing wrong with that IMO. I know some authors that just don't like the connotation that comes with the word "pornography" (cheap, trash, etc). There is "cheap" and "rich" pornography. It is up to the writer as to what theirs will be. Readers will certainly make the distinction in their own way regardless of the writer's intentions.


Pookie (and her dictionary)

 

[Dirt Man]

IMHO

I just hate men who know it all, men who’s opinions become in their minds fact. I also hate being preached to. I agree PoliteSuccubus there is a big difference.

Well, I don't really hate anyone, but I am disappointed by people who give their opinions without stating why they came to that opinion. If you believe there is a big difference, then here is the thread that allows you to explain how, and why, and you didn't.

Personally I hate porn stories where women act like men. At times I wonder if many of the male writers here have ever had sex with a woman, much less made love to one.

Then you've obviously never read any lesbian stories written by women on this site that are considered very erotic, and not pornographic at all. Is this then to become a pissing contest between male authors, and female authors? As for making sex with women, or lovingly pleasuring my lover, as a male I find that insulting commentary, and very much like throwing down the gauntlet. But then that would be a woman acting like a man, and you don't like those type of women, right?

As Always
I Am the
Dirt Man

PS I knew that by taking a stand on this issue I would create a great deal of controversy in here again. By PoliteSuccubus posting this thread they have at last allowed a forum to discuss this stigmatizism of opinion for views on what each of us think determines whether something published here is erotic, or pornograpic in a healthy environment. Remember, each of us has a right to our own opinions. Please, let us not get into a battle of the sexes over a difference of opinons here. Because as a marine sargent once told me when I was late getting back to base once after having to identify the bodies of my best friend and his wife after a car crash: "Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one." Here you can at last state what you think the difference between erotica, and pornography is to you. So why not take advantage of it?

DM

 

[Diane Marie]

Diane Marie

I am only expressing my opinion. I had imagined PoliteSuccubus was eliciting other people's opinions, otherwise why initiate this thread.

Octavian

Your not like that Octavian

 

[jfinn]

Before this thread degenerates into a battle of the sexes:

Seems to me that what's being said here by some is that pornography is a bad term while erotica is not. This doesn't really make sense to me though because I've always thought of pornography as the term to describe a broad variety of ways to show sexual situations. You can do this through pictures, movies, stories etc. Written porn includes stroke, slash, hardcore, softcore, and any number of other forms that get some people hot.

My definition of Erotica is that it's a way of showing sexual situations and the emotions that accompany them usually in the format of an actual story with a plot though not always. So I guess what I believe is that erotica is always a form of pornography, but not all porn is erotica.

It does not offend me to have my writing referred to as pornographic, erotic, romantic, or any other damn title someone wants to use. A rose by any other name and all that. Personally I read them all and care more about the writing and how it engages me then I do about what category it fits in.

Jayne

 

[Couture]

Here's the difference.

Erotica is what I read and write. Porn is for all those other sick fucks.

::Tongue planted firmly in cheek::

 

[sweetnpetite]

Re: The difference

Could this be the difference?

Pornography concentrates on graphically depicting sexual action to the exclusion of virtually everything else.

Erotica seeks to provide a reasonable context to justify sexual action, irrespective of whether such action is graphically depicted or not.

Octavian

That's pretty good, I like that.

I'll admit it, I write porn.

I write about men's fantasies as well as woman's. Sometimes I even write from the point of view of a man.

I think there's a shortage of *porn* and I mean porn for woman to enjoy. I like dirty nasty rough pure smut- but I prefer when its focused on the woman's pleasure- not "i did this to her, then i did this to her, then i did this to her, then i came" maybe I'm sexist in the opposite direction, but I just think there's plenty of porn that focuses on the man's pleasure.

Also, I'm not huge on romance (although its nice) but I want passion. (in real life and in my stories).

As for women who act like men, I'm not exactly sure what Diane Marie meant by that. I like woman who act masculine, agressive, sexist or whatever as much as if not more that those who act steriotypiclally 'female'.

But if she means something else, which I can' t exaclty put into words, but there are some male writers who can't write females, and those stories tend to be pretty jaring. Like: a girl who's a virgin (a real virgin, not just a "vaginal virgin") is never going to turn into a total slut and start sucking your dick, and all of your friends dicks and talking like a bad porno movie. And a woman just doesn't get turned on immediatly upon seeing a hot guy- not to the point that she's ready for him to just pop it in. I've seen stories like that, and I wonder if that's what she means?

 

[TheEarl]

IMHO: Porn is cheap, tacky and designed solely for wanking to. Erotica still has the stroke aspect, but it is contained within a story and actually has pretensions above just "Tab A into Slot B, done now."

THe Earl

 

[pop_54]

Hi all

I write porn stories because I use a lot of dirty words, and disgusting detail, simple as that.
Should I choose to soften the language a little sometimes, a couple of my stories may turn into erotica. But then no body would get off reading them so what's the point posting them on a porn site, you can get erotica in the local news paper shop under Mills & Boone.

I get my woman's view point from the boss, my darling wifey, if I write a bit of unbelievable crap concerning female actions and feelings she makes me alter it bless her, I don't argue, what the fuck do I know I've never had a dick stuck up me.

I know what some of you mean though, the virgin who volunteers for a gang fuck first time sex act, crap.

The brother who dives straight on his sister on her 18th birthday without her crying rape, crap.

The man and woman who dive straight into an orgy first time ever without a hint of jealousy or possessive thought for each other, crap.

Almost all people need to be seduced in some way, seduction can take weeks, or on odd occasions an hour or so with a few drinks thrown in, very rare that a girl jumps a guy within minutes of meeting him unless you can write in a mental problem or two.

And for the lady who claims no man ever made love to a woman, crap. I try to do it all the time, doesn't always last long enough to work, but hey I try.


pops............

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

I'm too sleepy to really respond fully to the depth that this thread deserves, but I am glad I asked the question and have gotten such a wide range of answers.

It helps me grow as a person and as a writer to read these and see the various viewpoints or (not naming any names ) technical defintions.

Night night time now.

 

[fiery_jack]

In another thread someone said "Gotta love porn" and I replied:

To me porn and erotica are two different things.

"If women like it, it's erotica. If men like it, it's pornography." - Anonymous

 

[Lauren Hynde]

I think the one that got closer was jfinn: 'erotica is always a form of pornography, but not all porn is erotica.'

Pornography is the single most powerful form of literary expression of our days. A lot of very sucessful authors have realized this a long time ago. It has nothing to do with being cheap, tacky, purely masturbatory material. That's just bad pornography.

JG Ballard, Nicholson Baker, Bret Easton Ellis, they don't call their own work erotic. It isn't. In Crash, for example, Ballard (one of the most respected authors in the world) uses crude, explicit sexual depicment as a tool to creat a metaphor for life in today's society. I rememberer reading something he once wrote:

'In a sense, pornography is the most political form of fiction, dealing with how we use and exploit each other, in the most urgent and ruthless way.'

Erotica is a mere subgenre of pornography, condemned to never become truly great.

 

[Dirt Man]

This may well be the defining truth in here...

"If women like it, it's erotica. If men like it, it's pornography." - Anonymous

A simple truth is often times truth enough.

Erotica is what I read and write. Porn is for all those other sick fucks.

Even tongue in cheek, it is an opinion shared by more than you might know in here.

The truth can sometimes get pretty muddy on this subject. And one of the reasons why is that many authors here think that a story has to be long, and drawn out to the point of redundancy to be any good. Brevity is best in writing short stories as that's what the SHORT stands for. There are even contests for writing the best SHORT Story under a 1,000 words wherein it is really hard to develope each of the characters in your work. But then that's the challenge isn't it. And there isn't a short story on literotica under 5,000 words in any catagory, is there. I think part of the reason for this is because most of the authors here would really like to write novels instead of short stories. The thing is, a novel is just a bunch of short stories put together to tell a more indepth, and much grander story. Okay, end lecture.

As Always
I Am the
Dirt Man

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

Short Short Story

And one of the reasons why is that many authors here think that a story has to be long, and drawn out to the point of redundancy to be any good. Brevity is best in writing short stories as that's what the SHORT stands for.

This brings in mind the frist story I submitted to Lit, which was rejected for being too short!

The Kitchen

As she bent over to clear the dinner dishes, he couldn't help but watch her ass under the thin cotton gown. He stood and approached her quietly, and pushed her softly but firmly down so her breasts were crushed against the table. She didn't complain as he reached under her dress and began to move his hand over her panty-constricted bottom, following the line of the seam to the moistening crotch and up to her belly. She gripped the far side of the table and opened her legs wider, the hard edge of the table bit into her hips and under her nipples she could feel the pattern of the lace cloth.

He grabbed her panties from the back and began to pull them, but not off.... Up. In rhythmic small jerks he tightened and relaxed the white cotton against her clit and wedged it into the crack of her buttocks. Jerk, jerk, and jerk...the rhythm was making her ache. He pressed himself against her and she felt his hardness, but instead of releasing himself he rubbed his clothed dick against her nearly bare ass and continued the jerk, jerk, jerk of the white cotton.

Just as she began to moan and plead the front door slammed and running feet could be heard in the hall. By the time their child entered the kitchen she was back at the sink, washing dishes, and he was sitting at the table, one hand holding his cup, and the other feeling the warmth of the wood where she had just lain.

Finis~

Porn?

 

[gauchecritic]

I think this covers almost all the arguements here

Pornography n. 1) The obscene and exploitative depiction of erotic acts 2) written, graphic etc material consisting of or containing this.

Or am I being

Gauche

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Erotica is Spontaneously, he reached out his hands to touch her hair. His hand slid down to her neck, and rested against its warmth just a few seconds too long, and when she turned around and looked up at him, he could read her answer in her body language; she liked his touch.

Pornography is he grabbed her neck, pulled her closer, and saw that she wanted it bad.

 

[sweetnpetite]

two more definitions

good definitions, all; here are two more

porn is about tits and ass and pussies and dicks
erotica is about lips, arms, hands, the small of the back, the inner thigh, eating a peach, a ticking clock, falling rain (as well as all of the above)

I think that erotica is about eroticising anything, writing about anything in a sensual way (not neccesarily sexual but focusing on sensations and all of your sensed) while porn is stricly about sex. I think you can write erotica with "dirty" words and you can right porn with "clean" words, its really more about the attention to detail.

 

[sweetnpetite]

Re: Short Short Story

This brings in mind the frist story I submitted to Lit, which was rejected for being too short!

The Kitchen

As she bent over to clear the dinner dishes, he couldn't help but watch her ass under the thin cotton gown. He stood and approached her quietly, and pushed her softly but firmly down so her breasts were crushed against the table. She didn't complain as he reached under her dress and began to move his hand over her panty-constricted bottom, following the line of the seam to the moistening crotch and up to her belly. She gripped the far side of the table and opened her legs wider, the hard edge of the table bit into her hips and under her nipples she could feel the pattern of the lace cloth.

He grabbed her panties from the back and began to pull them, but not off.... Up. In rhythmic small jerks he tightened and relaxed the white cotton against her clit and wedged it into the crack of her buttocks. Jerk, jerk, and jerk...the rhythm was making her ache. He pressed himself against her and she felt his hardness, but instead of releasing himself he rubbed his clothed dick against her nearly bare ass and continued the jerk, jerk, jerk of the white cotton.

Just as she began to moan and plead the front door slammed and running feet could be heard in the hall. By the time their child entered the kitchen she was back at the sink, washing dishes, and he was sitting at the table, one hand holding his cup, and the other feeling the warmth of the wood where she had just lain.

Finis~

Porn?

Oooh, good story. I like it.

If you write a group of these you could post them together maybe as a collection. "Erotic Snapshots" or something.

 

[openthighs_sarah]

I've always thought the difference is that porn is the gross perverted stuff that turns other people on, and erotica is the cool, sexy stuff that turns me on. I hope I wasn't wrong all this time...