Is it typically okay for there not to be any sexual interaction in the first chapter?

[ElsieElsewhere]

I am writing a story, and for the past few days, it's mostly been about character development, so the reader can get a feel for who the characters are. Not much about sex, considering both of the main characters are separated for the first couple of days, they're just talking through the phone for the most part.

I wanted to know would most readers get upset at the fact that it doesn't jump straight into the sexual aspect? Or would it be typically be okay for there to be a richer character development involved. For me personally, the thing that always had me hooked wasn't the act of sex itself, but everything before it that lead up to that point.

 

[sr71plt]

It's OK, but perhaps the most important question is how much background dumping is going on before there's any action? Pages and pages of telephone conversation can be quite deadly and you may lose readers because of that, not because there wasn't a graphic sex scene.

 

[ElsieElsewhere]

It's OK, but perhaps the most important question is how much background dumping is going on before there's any action? Pages and pages of telephone conversation can be quite deadly and you may lose readers because of that, not because there wasn't a graphic sex scene.

I see your point. It isn't all just phone conversations though. The main character is interacting with people around her that is a part of her life too. So a good portion has to do with that. Actually, the other main character isn't really able to talk too often, as he is bogged down with work, so it's not like they're spending excessive amounts of time talking on the phone. A lot of it is just the world through her eyes, and things that are leading up to them being reconnected.

 

[Hypoxia]

Some successful stories have little if any sex, delayed until deep into the story. It depends on your plotline, your genre, the dynamics of your tale. My highest-rated story, a historical romance about real people, has one BJ near the end -- that's the only explicit sex. But there's lots of thinking about sex, and anticipation, and implied fucking late in the tale.

If this is a multi-chapter story I'll suggest that you write it all before posting. Submit the parts on subsequent days so readers needn't wait long to get to the juicy bits.

 

[NotWise]

Aside from the points above, it also depends on what you want out of your story. If you want to get the highest possible rating, and a lot of follow-up views then you probably don't want to have a sexless first chapter.

If your first chapter isn't too long, then one solution is to combine it with later chapters and post them as a single "chunk" of the story. Readers seem to enjoy getting the story in longer chunks anyway.

 

[HandsInTheDark]

If you're writing a good story, sex happens when the characters want it to. It can even be erotic if they never get to the actual act.

If you want people to get off and aren't pretending to be literary, someone's hand should be down someone's pants by page 2 or 3.

It's possible to do both. It's just difficult.

 

[sr71plt]

I typically start with someone's hands down someone's pants--just to get that established--and then turn back to a storyline. If sex happens later too, all the better. But there are lots of good opening formulas--it's just that the good ones get the reader engaged in the read no matter what the specific content is.

 

[ElsieElsewhere]

Thanks for all of the useful information. I have a lot to think about.

 

[DemiAngora]

When I read erotica, I like hints of sex up front, at the very least. Otherwise I jump to the next story.

 

[Hypoxia]

When I read erotica, I like hints of sex up front, at the very least. Otherwise I jump to the next story.

Hints are good, to build erotic tension and anticipation. The quantity, quality, and placement of hints can vary with the category's audience. A character's erotic thoughts and speech can signal upcoming hot fun. My almost-sexless story starts with the explorer non-explicitly recalling whores of his past and prospects of his future. It seemed to work.

When I write, I usually like some active sex on a tale's first LIT page. When I read, I want a situation that draws me in, eager for more. Some very successful stories here have sexual content approaching zero -- instead, they follow the consequences of off-screen intimacy. Such are more 'dramatic' than 'erotic'. So I like drama. Sue me.

It's a good idea to include an Author's Note warning of delayed or minimal sex. Then readers won't be *too* pissed-off.

 

[autoplot]

Some people will like the build-up. Some people will complain. Actually, people will probably complain regardless, because that's how people are.

But I agree with what others have said: if you don't get to the naughty bits right away, either let people know or get there in a relatively expedient fashion afterward.

 

[Hypoxia]

My main Bonehead English prof in junior college was a dilemma. I first took a summer session class of his. This was at College of the Desert (29 Palms CA) so they were all night classes, and short. His assignment was to write a research journal, essentially blogging all we read and thought on a chosen theme. (My subject was the psychedelic deadly nightshade Datura.) That was great! The same paper got me through my psych class. And he didn't talk much.

Then I took his standard course, and it was awful. So boring. He followed this strategy: 1) Tell-em what you're gonna tell-em. 2) Tell-em what you want to tell-em. 3) Tell-em what you told-em. In a droning voice. Fuck, now I know why he ended up at this podunk school.

But that strategy, properly employed, could work in erotica. 1) Tell-em what you're gonna tell-em: We're gonna fuck, babe. 2) Tell-em what you want to tell-em: Oh hot damn, fucky-fucky-fucky! 3) Tell-em what you told-em: Holy shit, that was a great fuck-all! We could write numerous 50-word stories with that structure.

 

[NotWise]

I just checked some of my stories to refresh my memory. I think that in the majority of my stories and chapters I postpone sex until the second half; it doesn't seem to make much difference to the rating.

My highest-rated standalone story gets to sex after about 950 words. My second highest-rated standalone story doesn't get to sex until it's more than halfway through--after about 4500 words.

The highest rated chapter in my series gets to sex near the end of the first typed page, but the second highest waits until right near the end of the chapter to get to the sex. That series doesn't get to sex at all until the third chapter and only four of the 9 parts even include sex. Some of the sexless chapters even have a red H.

In my mother/son pair of stories the first part goes about 2/3 of the way through before there's any sex and the second part nearly starts with sex; the first part with the slow turn to sex has a significantly higher rating.

A lot of things go into determining the success of a story, and how quickly you get to sex doesn't seem to be a controlling factor. If you have a story to tell, then at least some readers will stay with it and appreciate the result.

 

[Hypoxia]

A lot of things go into determining the success of a story, and how quickly you get to sex doesn't seem to be a controlling factor. If you have a story to tell, then at least some readers will stay with it and appreciate the result.

That's my experience. Sex up front; sex delayed; sex at the end; almost no sex; whatever. Story dynamics and need should control the placement. Is it a complex tale or a quick stroker? Do you want to involve readers in characters' live or should consumers start wanking right off? My highest-rated submission has minimal sex, long-delayed; next-highest has tons of sex up front and throughout, and a strong tragedy. The basic formula: Tell a story. Let the sex fall where it will.

BTW to OP: I received your piece. I'll check it when I can. Don't sweat.

 

[ElsieElsewhere]

I just checked some of my stories to refresh my memory. I think that in the majority of my stories and chapters I postpone sex until the second half; it doesn't seem to make much difference to the rating.

My highest-rated standalone story gets to sex after about 950 words. My second highest-rated standalone story doesn't get to sex until it's more than halfway through--after about 4500 words.

The highest rated chapter in my series gets to sex near the end of the first typed page, but the second highest waits until right near the end of the chapter to get to the sex. That series doesn't get to sex at all until the third chapter and only four of the 9 parts even include sex. Some of the sexless chapters even have a red H.

In my mother/son pair of stories the first part goes about 2/3 of the way through before there's any sex and the second part nearly starts with sex; the first part with the slow turn to sex has a significantly higher rating.

A lot of things go into determining the success of a story, and how quickly you get to sex doesn't seem to be a controlling factor. If you have a story to tell, then at least some readers will stay with it and appreciate the result.

Thank you for going through the effort of checking that! I take great comfort in knowing I don't have to throw genitalia all over the place right out of the door with a new story.

That's my experience. Sex up front; sex delayed; sex at the end; almost no sex; whatever. Story dynamics and need should control the placement. Is it a complex tale or a quick stroker? Do you want to involve readers in characters' live or should consumers start wanking right off? My highest-rated submission has minimal sex, long-delayed; next-highest has tons of sex up front and throughout, and a strong tragedy. The basic formula: Tell a story. Let the sex fall where it will.

BTW to OP: I received your piece. I'll check it when I can. Don't sweat.

Thank you very much.

My main Bonehead English prof in junior college was a dilemma. I first took a summer session class of his. This was at College of the Desert (29 Palms CA) so they were all night classes, and short. His assignment was to write a research journal, essentially blogging all we read and thought on a chosen theme. (My subject was the psychedelic deadly nightshade Datura.) That was great! The same paper got me through my psych class. And he didn't talk much.

Then I took his standard course, and it was awful. So boring. He followed this strategy: 1) Tell-em what you're gonna tell-em. 2) Tell-em what you want to tell-em. 3) Tell-em what you told-em. In a droning voice. Fuck, now I know why he ended up at this podunk school.

But that strategy, properly employed, could work in erotica. 1) Tell-em what you're gonna tell-em: We're gonna fuck, babe. 2) Tell-em what you want to tell-em: Oh hot damn, fucky-fucky-fucky! 3) Tell-em what you told-em: Holy shit, that was a great fuck-all! We could write numerous 50-word stories with that structure.

Very informative. I'll remember that strategy for future stories/chapters I guess. It's just really hard to employ that strategy with what I am doing with the first part of this story because of the way it is laid out. I tried imagining how I would retrofit that strategy into what I've already written, and it just can't work. Unless I am limiting myself somehow. But thank you for that post. It helps me a lot.

 

[Hypoxia]

Very informative. I'll remember that strategy for future stories/chapters I guess. It's just really hard to employ that strategy with what I am doing with the first part of this story because of the way it is laid out. I tried imagining how I would retrofit that strategy into what I've already written, and it just can't work. Unless I am limiting myself somehow. But thank you for that post. It helps me a lot.

That's only one of many strategies. I've mentioned a few of mine:

* Visualize the desired ending; build a setup and storyline to reach that point.
* Create setting, players, and some plot points, and let the players tell the story.
* Create the setup; at every branching point, pick the least likely path to follow.
* Follow some standard formula but finish with a 'twist' O-Henry ending.
* Follow a known path (as from journals or history) and embellish like hell.

In all of these, since the LIT audience expects sex of some sort, in the early stages there should be at least a hint, a promise of sex to come. Let readers know they're not facing a field guide (well, some of my essays are such) or political thriller (I have one of those, too) or murder mystery. Set a tone. People are gonna fuck eventually, or they've fucked and now they're sorry, or they're living innocent lives until they're fucked. A little adversarial drama doesn't hurt.

It's a matter of storytelling. Learn from previous bards and liars.

 

[KayceeCharles]

How long is your story?

If it's a novella or a novel, then obviously the answer is no you don't have to.

Remember, sex is there to help tell a story, but the story is about interaction between characters. Sex is just one way to SHOW that interaction, be it hurling plates at each other or tearing each other's clothes off.

If you are doing short stories, then you'll have to compress the plot points quite a bit and push up the sex a bit more.

I myself am still working my way through the plot. I got my romance beat sheet half done (some major revisions needed) and I don't have the characters having sex until almost half point, and due to some cultural thing, I plan only third-base until the HEA, which is when they go all the way.

 

[Bramblethorn]

It probably depends on category, but in my experience there are plenty of readers who are more interested in the setup than in the details of the sex itself. I have a couple of "hot"-rated stories that have no graphic sex at all.

That said, if you are planning on including graphic bits in a later chapter, it might be an idea to hold off on posting until that's ready to go. Then you can post Chapter 1 with a note mentioning "the sex doesn't happen until Chapter 2" and let readers skip ahead if they choose.

 

[ElsieElsewhere]

That's only one of many strategies. I've mentioned a few of mine:

* Visualize the desired ending; build a setup and storyline to reach that point.
* Create setting, players, and some plot points, and let the players tell the story.
* Create the setup; at every branching point, pick the least likely path to follow.
* Follow some standard formula but finish with a 'twist' O-Henry ending.
* Follow a known path (as from journals or history) and embellish like hell.

In all of these, since the LIT audience expects sex of some sort, in the early stages there should be at least a hint, a promise of sex to come. Let readers know they're not facing a field guide (well, some of my essays are such) or political thriller (I have one of those, too) or murder mystery. Set a tone. People are gonna fuck eventually, or they've fucked and now they're sorry, or they're living innocent lives until they're fucked. A little adversarial drama doesn't hurt.

It's a matter of storytelling. Learn from previous bards and liars.

Thanks for all of the useful tips. I'm going to take note of them all and put them to use from here on. Also thanks for the info on the Authors note being used as to state that the intimacy may come later. I'll definitely do that as well.

How long is your story?

If it's a novella or a novel, then obviously the answer is no you don't have to.

Remember, sex is there to help tell a story, but the story is about interaction between characters. Sex is just one way to SHOW that interaction, be it hurling plates at each other or tearing each other's clothes off.

If you are doing short stories, then you'll have to compress the plot points quite a bit and push up the sex a bit more.

I myself am still working my way through the plot. I got my romance beat sheet half done (some major revisions needed) and I don't have the characters having sex until almost half point, and due to some cultural thing, I plan only third-base until the HEA, which is when they go all the way.

I am not sure how long it is yet, it entirely depends on the reception of it I guess. I intended on it being a multi-parter though.

It probably depends on category, but in my experience there are plenty of readers who are more interested in the setup than in the details of the sex itself. I have a couple of "hot"-rated stories that have no graphic sex at all.

That said, if you are planning on including graphic bits in a later chapter, it might be an idea to hold off on posting until that's ready to go. Then you can post Chapter 1 with a note mentioning "the sex doesn't happen until Chapter 2" and let readers skip ahead if they choose.

I am definitely writing a lot of it before posting any. Maybe a few (5-6) parts before posting any.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Thanks for all of the useful tips. I'm going to take note of them all and put them to use from here on. Also thanks for the info on the Authors note being used as to state that the intimacy may come later. I'll definitely do that as well.



I am not sure how long it is yet, it entirely depends on the reception of it I guess. I intended on it being a multi-parter though.



I am definitely writing a lot of it before posting any. Maybe a few (5-6) parts befortsting any.

as well ae posting
Unless you are writing a 'stroke story' develop your characters a bit so there is characterisation

 

[elfin_odalisque]

I typically start with someone's hands down someone's pants--just to get that established--and then turn back to a storyline. If sex happens later too, all the better. But there are lots of good opening formulas--it's just that the good ones get the reader engaged in the read no matter what the specific content is.

Weren't you looking for formulae?

 

[Areala-chan]

I am writing a story, and for the past few days, it's mostly been about character development, so the reader can get a feel for who the characters are. Not much about sex, considering both of the main characters are separated for the first couple of days, they're just talking through the phone for the most part.

I wanted to know would most readers get upset at the fact that it doesn't jump straight into the sexual aspect? Or would it be typically be okay for there to be a richer character development involved. For me personally, the thing that always had me hooked wasn't the act of sex itself, but everything before it that lead up to that point.

My findings are that if the story is well-written, the sex happens when it feels right and readers are more than willing to go along with the ride if you give them a good reason. The highest-rated story I have so far that isn't in Non-Erotic is "Crash Into Me", my most recent one. The sex act itself is built up over the course of the first 7 LIT pages, but there's also quite a bit of teasing and hinting at what the main character wants to happen. She fantasizes, she pleasures herself, and she imagines what it might be like several times before the "payoff". According to the comments I've received so far, I'd say I got it right in terms of balancing character development with drama.

I think you can attempt to satisfy all appetites, but ultimately what it comes down to in my experience is to identify how long of a story you want to tell, and then build the sex into that framework. If it's a short story, you're going to need to get to it fast. If it's longer, let your readers know up front and take your time.

I'll leave two more examples from a different writer that I think absolutely knocked it out of the park in both ways.

"Forcing the Issue, Ch. 1" by zoemiller drops a reader right into the thick of it. It starts with Abigail's head between Michelle's legs and charges on from there. It's 3 LIT pages with enough girl/girl sex to satisfy half the population of Lesbos, but there's a well-handled undercurrent of drama and character development in such a small arena.

Contrast that with a different story of hers, "The Smell of Old Books" which is 4 LIT pages and has no sex at all save for a masturbation scene on page 3, and was written so well that I didn't even notice the absence of a girl/girl scene in a story posted in 'Lesbian Sex' until after I was done reading. THAT'S an accomplishment and a half, in my opinion.

 

[sr71plt]

Weren't you looking for formulae?

Back to back biting, are you? To your usual "getting it wrong?"

Webster's Collegiate dictionary (the standard for U.S. publishing) prefers "formulas"--it's the first-listed option given. Go ahead and look it up. If you'd like help on using the dictionary, I have a "How To" posted here on that: https://www.literotica.com/s/dictionary-smarts-can-up-ratings

 

[Hypoxia]

as well ae posting
Unless you are writing a 'stroke story' develop your characters a bit so there is characterisation

I just now read her first excerpt and returned it with my comments and an edit of the first long paragraph.

Elsie does go on with long conversations (like the first half LIT page) that develop characters but IMHO don't paint full-enough pictures of the contexts. Speakers need to do more than talk; they should note where they are, what they're doing, give us a taste of the environment. And for erotica we need hints of possible involvements. As is, there's drama and tension but little sexual anticipation. The MC's desires are part of her character too. She needs to go beyond her justified dissatisfaction. Nice touch with mom's creepy BF. Maybe make him creep her out more.

I forget to say in my comments that the story needs a hook up front. Why should we care what happens to the MC? We need reasons to stay interested. Elsie has a good start but needs both tightening and expansion. The story has potential.

 

[ElsieElsewhere]

I just now read her first excerpt and returned it with my comments and an edit of the first long paragraph.

Elsie does go on with long conversations (like the first half LIT page) that develop characters but IMHO don't paint full-enough pictures of the contexts. Speakers need to do more than talk; they should note where they are, what they're doing, give us a taste of the environment. And for erotica we need hints of possible involvements. As is, there's drama and tension but little sexual anticipation. The MC's desires are part of her character too. She needs to go beyond her justified dissatisfaction. Nice touch with mom's creepy BF. Maybe make him creep her out more.

I forget to say in my comments that the story needs a hook up front. Why should we care what happens to the MC? We need reasons to stay interested. Elsie has a good start but needs both tightening and expansion. The story has potential.

Once again, thank you so much for your help. Your insight helped me kind of hone in on what needs to be improved upon. I've spent the past couple of days just re-working that first chapter. I am still not sure if I am going in the right direction with the 'implication' aspect, but the rest seems to be fleshing out a lot more. Especially after reading some of the stuff that the other authors in this thread have written, it kind of gives me a glimpse into different writing techniques. It also makes me feel like a* dyslexic illiterate moron when reading how well put together, and fleshed out some of these stories are compared to whatever the heck is going on in my head when I decide to put words into what I am working on.

My findings are that if the story is well-written, the sex happens when it feels right and readers are more than willing to go along with the ride if you give them a good reason. The highest-rated story I have so far that isn't in Non-Erotic is "Crash Into Me", my most recent one. The sex act itself is built up over the course of the first 7 LIT pages, but there's also quite a bit of teasing and hinting at what the main character wants to happen. She fantasizes, she pleasures herself, and she imagines what it might be like several times before the "payoff". According to the comments I've received so far, I'd say I got it right in terms of balancing character development with drama.

I think you can attempt to satisfy all appetites, but ultimately what it comes down to in my experience is to identify how long of a story you want to tell, and then build the sex into that framework. If it's a short story, you're going to need to get to it fast. If it's longer, let your readers know up front and take your time.

I'll leave two more examples from a different writer that I think absolutely knocked it out of the park in both ways.

"Forcing the Issue, Ch. 1" by zoemiller drops a reader right into the thick of it. It starts with Abigail's head between Michelle's legs and charges on from there. It's 3 LIT pages with enough girl/girl sex to satisfy half the population of Lesbos, but there's a well-handled undercurrent of drama and character development in such a small arena.

Contrast that with a different story of hers, "The Smell of Old Books" which is 4 LIT pages and has no sex at all save for a masturbation scene on page 3, and was written so well that I didn't even notice the absence of a girl/girl scene in a story posted in 'Lesbian Sex' until after I was done reading. THAT'S an accomplishment and a half, in my opinion.

I just finished reading some of your stuff, and it helped address a lot of the concerns I was having regarding the pace of things, and whether or not I should just dive in with sex, or not. Initially, all signs were pointing to me just trying to force it into the story even though I didn't inherently have it in me to do that. I fell in love with your first example (Crash Into Me). I've never read any sort of lesbian romance before, but that is definitely one of my favorite stories on here now. I think it has to do with how you paint the world, as well as the way characters deliver simple (and complex) actions. So thanks for responding to my thread, and thank you for your example(s), because it gives me comfort knowing that I don't need to rush straight to the sex'ing.