Interact 7 - Maria2394 - a real person

[twelveoone]

"Words are, of course, the most powerful drug used by mankind." - Rudyard Kipling

"This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper" - .T. S. Eliot "The Hollow Men"

I read Maria2394's "straw man down" I immediately thought of Eliot's Hollow Men, the hollow man, the straw. I thought of the ending. I thought of all the "great" things that came out of The Great War, like the Spanish Flu, Nazism, Communism; the great destroyers of humans, of the goodness of humanity. I thought about Ezra Pound's odious embrace of anti-Semitism. I thought about the huge shadow Pound and Eliot cast over Modernist Poetry. I thought about Pound as the "greatest" of all the "great" poets, and how totally useless he is in helping anybody deal with everyday reality. Mostly, I thought about the ending of "The Hollow Men".
"Not with a bang but a whimper"
I think I think too much.

Her "straw man down" seems to be a an antithesis of Eliot's "The Hollow Men", a humanist rejection of. The ending has defiance, the feel of Dylan Thomas's "Rage, rage against the dying of the light. "
I like that.




straw man down

un-stuff the hay, fledgling crow
scare away the glean and pinch
of pulling push towards sorrow

empty man fills up on beauty
tryin’ to take it to his grave

hollow man fills up on dread
his heart already in his grave

patience wins the war of age

listen young crow, you gotta keep on
preenin' and pluckin’ and pulling straw,
don’t be takin’ no lessons from ravens
on how to pester with squawk and caw

lonely man fills up on meat
angry man fills up on hate
humble man fills up on faith

you can’t fight the flood with fire, ya know

answer me, old crow with your booty
whose biddin’ will you do
when there’s no straw man a lurkin’
causin’ problems for you, for you?

whose biddin', whose biddin’
will you do?


We are here to discuss this, and
angle and view, deja vu
http://english.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=152867

Artificial Light
http://english.literotica.com:81/stories/showstory.php?id=169719

The focus being on the emotional, less of the technical; the power of words, where our poems really come from, influence of childhood, parents, disappointments, hopes, and fears.



Let the anthesis begin.

 

[twelveoone]

angle and view, deja vu

angle and view, deja vu
by Maria2394 ©


sit back and watch
the grass become shaggy
it’s not a sin to let it grow
ankle deep infuse of green
highlights and deep
sun shadows

long past morning
depending upon degree of tilt
Earth’s axis to face of the sun-
this movement reminds me
of laughter

will there ever be a day
identical twin of this one?

same thoughts, same clouds
same woulds and wishes
same now?

remember this day, inscribed
as genetic, pre-planned
yet somewhat insignificant
sibling of mitochondrial DNA

I have to say, it’s been a pleasure
my Father, my buddy
companion, Deja vu

but you are, in fact
just another yesterday
on hysterical brink
of tomorrow
and I’m becoming tired
of you

so pack up your memories
buy a new map and find
your way
to someone else's
brand new day

because I need something
more to do
than sitting around here
waiting for repetition

shallow duplication
of what can never
again be you

 

[twelveoone]

Artificial Light

Artificial Light
by Maria2394 ©

Stellar bright or fluorescent blight,
I cannot tell the difference anymore.
Why won't someone attempt to define,
with foundation, structure and frame,
this gnawing known only as hope?

is it light or perception of right,
or visions of an afterlife
immersed in virtuous glow, I do not know,
nor do I wish to know, for now
six senses alert and accepting
warmth in any form

to light a way, casting shadows of yet
another day,
always ending to pale, when appraised
alongside carnal self.
How arrogant it seems to assign a value
to how I reason, dream, or feel

this essence never changes
and mirrors return the same reflection-

absorbed by thought, acutely aware
of every mortal blink and sigh,
and knowing tomorrow, already surrendered,
is in itself, a version of life,
each second awash in noon and night.

Hope is a soul is a constant, it shines
especially in artificial light.

 

[twelveoone]

I lied, a little - technical comment:

same thoughts, same clouds
same woulds and wishes
same now?

lonely man fills up on meat
angry man fills up on hate
humble man fills up on faith

good use of repetition, in two of the poems
For new writers
anything important can be repeated twice, word for word, the mind will change the inflection automatically.
repeats with variants, are not a problem up to three times "man fills up on"
repeats of more than three, better lead up to something, note what she did with "same"
Any disagreement on this?

 

[twelveoone]

Maria,

In “straw man down”

How conscious was this, a rejection of the feel of “the hollow men”?

Who are the crows?

 

[Maria2394]

Maria,

In “straw man down”

How conscious was this, a rejection of the feel of “the hollow men”?

Who are the crows?

Thank You, 1201, for the time you have put into this. I feel honored, I truly do

straw man down was a poem I had in my head for a month or so before I tried to write it. I can see where the reference might lead to Hollow Men but I did not consciously intend this.
( although T.S. Eliot is one of my favorites, it might have been in the back of my mind.)

Eliot has a poem, from Four Quarters, Burnt Norton, is my favorite poem that exists, because of the message and I think it's sort of funny that I had this one in mind of Eliot and the poem made you think of Hollow Men.

He writes,
" Time past and time future
What might have been and what has been
Point to one end, which is always present"

and earlier on,"go go go, said the bird: HUman kind
cannot bear very much reality"

and that is why I write, I escape myse;f from this reality.

Men ( or women) are not hollow! Some may want us to believe that they are, but they are not. The crows in straw man down are the peoplein our lives who profess to teach us, then tear us down, they often succeed and then what do they have? An empty starw man, but one with a soul, one with a drive, desire to be, desire to live and contribute.

They are The ones who build the world, and then try their damndest to destroy, that concept, well it angers me. A thing of beauty or wonder, tends to exist only as long as no one else creates something better.

I likened it to the empty scarecrow, an empty pair of pants, hat, shirt, I must have left out that line when I sent you the poem.
The ravens are the masters, the ones who sit atop the world, beside Thor, in norse mythology and reprt back to him on the state of the human world, that is exactly what I was thinking then, the crows are merely the dirty deed doers

I would have to say a lot of what I write is political in disguise...

 

[My Erotic Tale]

good timing~

I had time today to research
what it takes to get the green "E"
so I read most of her stuff
and neo's and anna's

Maria is an Icon, paramount here as a
poet/ writer
I couldn't begin to touch a soul with words
like she has, dedicating a thread to her is
well deserved, Way to go Twelveoone~

Hi Maria~
<waves>
Nope I'm not just blowing wind up her dress
I;m licking the clit too!

<grin>
Art~

 

[twelveoone]

Thank You, 1201, for the time you have put into this. I feel honored, I truly do

straw man down was a poem I had in my head for a month or so before I tried to write it. I can see where the reference might lead to Hollow Men but I did not consciously intend this.
( although T.S. Eliot is one of my favorites, it might have been in the back of my mind.)

Eliot has a poem, from Four Quarters, Burnt Norton, is my favorite poem that exists, because of the message and I think it's sort of funny that I had this one in mind of Eliot and the poem made you think of Hollow Men.

He writes,
" Time past and time future
What might have been and what has been
Point to one end, which is always present"

and earlier on,"go go go, said the bird: HUman kind
cannot bear very much reality"

and that is why I write, I escape myse;f from this reality.

Men ( or women) are not hollow! Some may want us to believe that they are, but they are not. The crows in straw man down are the peoplein our lives who profess to teach us, then tear us down, they often succeed and then what do they have? An empty starw man, but one with a soul, one with a drive, desire to be, desire to live and contribute.

They are The ones who build the world, and then try their damndest to destroy, that concept, well it angers me. A thing of beauty or wonder, tends to exist only as long as no one else creates something better.

I likened it to the empty scarecrow, an empty pair of pants, hat, shirt, I must have left out that line when I sent you the poem.
The ravens are the masters, the ones who sit atop the world, beside Thor, in norse mythology and reprt back to him on the state of the human world, that is exactly what I was thinking then, the crows are merely the dirty deed doers


I would have to say a lot of what I write is political in disguise...

1.) don't thank me, I thank you and the other 7 (Tara appeared as an other named thread) I should thank anonamouse, but he did't have much to say. Maybe I'll go ask him some questions about jokes.
2.) I like that anger, I've noticed the "political in disguise" I think it is a good way to go people.
I could tell you where pissed, and this was political. I think these Interacts are it is a good way for the writer and the audience to examine how well the intent of the poem was received.
I was confused about the young crow and the old crows, we will get back to that.

Should we break this up a little differently, how about telling us about "angle and view, deja vu " and the emotional aspect of writing, invite people to comment on "Artificial Light"

BTW I'm getting old, I forgot the invitation for the comments.

 

[champagne1982]

It has been said that artificial light is cruel.
The stark white harshness of the glare
Revealing too much.

And then, to have that clear portrait
reflected back, relentless
and truthful.

Damned neon..
Damned mirror.

I think Maria captures that feeling perfectly. I just wonder if that was what she was going for.

 

[WickedEve]

Hi, Maria.

I'll be back soon and read this entire thread. Then I'll say something witty, brilliant and insightful--much better than "Hi, Maria."

 

[Maria2394]

It has been said that artificial light is cruel.
The stark white harshness of the glare
Revealing too much.

And then, to have that clear portrait
reflected back, relentless
and truthful.

Damned neon..
Damned mirror.

I think Maria captures that feeling perfectly. I just wonder if that was what she was going for.

hi champagne1982

yes, that is exactly what I was aiming for, and on a different level, light as being an idealistic thing, like hope is, and when I wrote it, the feling that any light was better than none, it really gets dark in here sometimes, and the perception of the mirror part, that no matter what light there is, I ( we) always see the same thing, it comes from within, like, well, hope

 

[WickedEve]

I would have to say a lot of what I write is political in disguise...

Maria, can you give me links to a couple of your poems that are political in disguise? I think I've read most of your poetry, but I'd like to read the political ones again, and see how I interpret them with that in mind.

 

[Maria2394]

Hi Eve

all the frog poems were "sort of" political, and the one I wrote for you, I am the Cricket definitely was. The one posted on poets against the war, and ohh, here is one, I deleted a lot of my stuff to work on, revise and this one was obvious. I will send you some of the delted ones if you like

almost all of normal jeans stuff has a political/social aspect, urban sprawl and those type poems, I love writing stuff like that

~~~

lest he paint another

~

Who could presume to steal a Scream?

In daylight broad as a solstice grin
that Munch was spirited away
and now the thought occurs to me

Who is the old master that summons up visions
of evil as brilliant as war?

He is the one who begs us to taste
sanguine deaths
and ache hysterical orange, while

Our world is nourished with green
and the earth gleans
nutrients from bloodied stains,
that will disappear into ditches and streams

Sorrow feeds on the violet blood of heroes,
the martyr’s blood runs blue and black,
the blood of an innocent and the murderer’s blood
are all washed away with one pounding rain

We are given the truth in brush strokes and glimpses,
it is up to us to understand
that war is a stain on the soul of humanity, and

We must separate the canvas and brushes,
keep all of the paint out of just one hand
so that such a terrible masterpiece
may never be painted again
~~

 

[WickedEve]

I remember this one. I was going to write a poem about it, but then I read yours and realized that I didn't have enough to say about it.
Now I need to go back and read that frog/cricket poem again.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

One of the things I always admired in Maria's poetry is this undefinable quality, someone between the most biting sarcasm and the purest humanity. So many people are afraid to admit politics and social commentary into their work, depriving themselves of the one thing that makes writing worthwhile: a message.

In her poems, though, that message is everpresent without being in-your-face, a primary focus, but written in a way that is just distant enough to be dry and witty instead of "preachy", and present enough to drive it home.

 

[annaswirls]

1201, I am so glad that you are doing Maria's poetry. I was going to request this! I have enjoyed reading the back and forth "interview" and have agreed with the many kind things that others have said. It is a real tribute to her writing.

One thing about Maria is that she switches it up in her writing. She has her traditional garden poems, and of course the amphibian theme but overall, if you look at her body of work, you will find a great variety of subjects and even voices. This is not easy to do, to keep it fresh. Maria takes risks. She notices things. She is a poet.





write on

 

[twelveoone]

1201, I am so glad that you are doing Maria's poetry. I was going to request this! I have enjoyed reading the back and forth "interview" and have agreed with the many kind things that others have said. It is a real tribute to her writing.

One thing about Maria is that she switches it up in her writing. She has her traditional garden poems, and of course the amphibian theme but overall, if you look at her body of work, you will find a great variety of subjects and even voices. This is not easy to do, to keep it fresh. Maria takes risks. She notices things. She is a poet.





write on

er, anna, I think you did, as did a lot of others
her and eve played hard to get - southern belles
yeh, she takes risks in her comments too (she likes some of my stuff)

 

[Maria2394]

Eve, Lauren, Anna, 1201,
you guys are spoiling me!! I could get to liking all this attention, I'm grinning here, cause most of you know I shy away from too much of it.

Messages in poetry, to me that is what it is all about!! I have written some of that mushy love sick why the heck doesnt he notice me type stuff, I just couldnt help myself, but I think its all gone now, flushed out of my system, and I will admit, I am a product of my ( weird) childhood, and my poetry is a product of that and so many influences here at Lit.

Anna, you know about the voices thing, lol, I saw a bumper sticker once that said, I need caller ID for the voices in my head..it is almost the truth. I dont know why I feel more comfortable saying something as normal jean that I couldnt say as Maria.

I truly was in the frame of mind when I came here, that most of my work rhymed ( well, i Hadnt actually written any poetry in about 20 years when I posted my first poem on here) and how quickly I learned that no rhyme is necessary for poetry, unless it is a form, that I havent allowed myself to grasp yet. I havent given up on form, I read the Mistresses of the Form(s) on here and just marvel

 

[WickedEve]

Eve, Lauren, Anna, 1201,
you guys are spoiling me!! I could get to liking all this attention, I'm grinning here, cause most of you know I shy away from too much of it.

Ahhh... well, you deserve to be spoiled. This is the Maria thread, and the only thing better than a Maria thread is another Eve thread. What?
Now, one thing I want to totally agree with is Lauren's comment:

One of the things I always admired in Maria's poetry is this undefinable quality, someone between the most biting sarcasm and the purest humanity. So many people are afraid to admit politics and social commentary into their work, depriving themselves of the one thing that makes writing worthwhile: a message.

In her poems, though, that message is everpresent without being in-your-face, a primary focus, but written in a way that is just distant enough to be dry and witty instead of "preachy", and present enough to drive it home.

...especially the part about not being preachy. I've read other poets who are, and I simply run from their poems, gasping for air and tearing out my hair! Fortunately, you're talented, Maria. You've never made me pull my hair out. I will though--for cash.

 

[Liar]

Maria was one of my first poetic aquaintances here at lit about a year ago, and I've since then gawked at the integrity of the work, a consistent tone that carries on through quite versatile expressins and themes. It seems to me that there is alwaus both a strong message on a nor really direct level, and a human warmth and empathy on another also not directly accesible level. And at the same time, every line is pleasing to the eye and exactly where it wanna be. Balance, eloquence, attitude, message and empathy. What else can a reader ask for?

And because I haven't participated much in those threads, I don't think I have saluted the toastmaster, soI'll get right onnit: 1201, your interact threads are awesome. You keep on lining up my idols, and turn their creative minds inside out for us all to see. Ten thousand thumbs up!

#L

 

[twelveoone]

here, can I cut in, these where not my idea, not my choices, although I agree with the choices. I am glad they are recieved well, I write the intro, 'cause nobody else volunteered. And I go ask people.
I think we may be getting a little to generalized, we have three poems posted, can we do some comments on them, object being illustrations of what makes good writing, perhaps something that isn't working well even.

 

[twelveoone]

One of the things I always admired in Maria's poetry is this undefinable quality, someone between the most biting sarcasm and the purest humanity. So many people are afraid to admit politics and social commentary into their work, depriving themselves of the one thing that makes writing worthwhile: a message.

In her poems, though, that message is everpresent without being in-your-face, a primary focus, but written in a way that is just distant enough to be dry and witty instead of "preachy", and present enough to drive it home.

BTW I agree with this totally, and wanted to see it in bold.

 

[annaswirls]

er, anna, I think you did, as did a lot of others
her and eve played hard to get - southern belles
yeh, she takes risks in her comments too (she likes some of my stuff)

okay I requested but I did not get to the point of demanding

which I was about to
get to

 

[twelveoone]

okay I requested but I did not get to the point of demanding

which I was about to
get to

Now how would that look?
She always leaves such nice comments on my stuff, 1201's just asking people that just say nice things about his stuff. (not true, BTW)
She would have been up earlier, but for, computer problems.

 

[twelveoone]

Hi Eve

all the frog poems were "sort of" political, and the one I wrote for you, I am the Cricket definitely was. The one posted on poets against the war, and ohh, here is one, I deleted a lot of my stuff to work on, revise and this one was obvious. I will send you some of the delted ones if you like

almost all of normal jeans stuff has a political/social aspect, urban sprawl and those type poems, I love writing stuff like that

~~~

lest he paint another

~

Who could presume to steal a Scream?

In daylight broad as a solstice grin
that Munch was spirited away
and now the thought occurs to me

Who is the old master that summons up visions
of evil as brilliant as war?

He is the one who begs us to taste
sanguine deaths
and ache hysterical orange, while

Our world is nourished with green
and the earth gleans
nutrients from bloodied stains,
that will disappear into ditches and streams

Sorrow feeds on the violet blood of heroes,
the martyr’s blood runs blue and black,
the blood of an innocent and the murderer’s blood
are all washed away with one pounding rain

We are given the truth in brush strokes and glimpses,
it is up to us to understand
that war is a stain on the soul of humanity, and

We must separate the canvas and brushes,
keep all of the paint out of just one hand
so that such a terrible masterpiece
may never be painted again
~~

Maria, I'm sure I remember this, it was one of the many I see that , that I probably did not comment on, because I had to think about it, with the intent of getting back to it with something intelligent to say.
(whoa, what did I just admit to?)
But now that it is here, can you go into some detail about it?