I'm now taking bets...

[p_p_man]

on who will win the election in Zimbabwe.

Does anyone think Mugabe won't?

So we all see a corrupt government, hold a corrupt election and win a corrupt victory and do nothing about it.

At least America's out of it on this one. Mugabe's pointing the finger of venom at British colonialism, despite the fact that we haven't been a colonial power for over 60 years.

And Tony Blair. But what the poor man's done wrong apart from being Bush's messenger boy and chief sycophanct, I don't know...

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

who will win the election in Zimbabwe.

Don't know who's going to win, (probably Mugabe) but it's just about a lead pipe cinch, the rest of the folks in Zimbabwe will be the losers. RF

 

[Mensa]

Mugabe is a despot and a murderer. Fair elections? He doesn't know the meaning of fair! He will threaten and intimidate and steal the Presidential Office. The Commonwealth cannot afford to let him get away with it if they wish to claim any credibility.

Tony Blair wanted to take pre-emptive action, good for him. Unfortunately, there are too many spineless politicians in power who can't be persuaded to do the right thing. They are always looking for an easy out. Well, sometimes there isn't an easy out.

 

[p_p_man]

Mugabe is a despot and a murderer. Fair elections? He doesn't know the meaning of fair! He will threaten and intimidate and steal the Presidential Office. The Commonwealth cannot afford to let him get away with it if they wish to claim any credibility.

Tony Blair wanted to take pre-emptive action, good for him. Unfortunately, there are too many spineless politicians in power who can't be persuaded to do the right thing. They are always looking for an easy out. Well, sometimes there isn't an easy out.

South Africa had the best chance to make an effect.

But they backed away from taking too heavy an option because they didn't want to be guilty of completely destroying Zimbabwe's economy.

 

[Mensa]

South Africa had the best chance to make an effect.

But they backed away from taking too heavy an option because they didn't want to be guilty of completely destroying Zimbabwe's economy.

For all intents and purposes, Zimbabwe's economy is already ruined. They have 50% unemployment for God's sake. Mugabe is a liar who will tell you what he thinks you want to hear. His teen militias are nothing more than a Zimbabwean form of Hitler's Brownshirts and he uses them in the same way. The one thing he tries to avoid is close international scrutiny of his methods.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

Zimbabwe?

Sorry Peeper, but I see a major problem here, and probably the reason nobody "gives a shit"!

We have an entire continent stuck back nearly 10,000 years. A "greater society" that can't seem to drag themselves above the level of eating each other. You seem to want to care, to drag them into a modern organized society that, it appears they are incapable of understanding!

The slaughter of Africa will continue, as it did with "Big Daddy Amin" and the current leadership of South Africa until the civilized world recognizes that "racial extermination" has no color lines and is just as unacceptable to "blacks" as it is "whites".

And, yes, I do know that canniblism is rare in Africa....alliteration.

RhumbRunner

 

[Mensa]

Re: Zimbabwe?

Sorry Peeper, but I see a major problem here, and probably the reason nobody "gives a shit"!

We have an entire continent stuck back nearly 10,000 years. A "greater society" that can't seem to drag themselves above the level of eating each other. You seem to want to care, to drag them into a modern organized society that, it appears they are incapable of understanding!

The slaughter of Africa will continue, as it did with "Big Daddy Amin" and the current leadership of South Africa until the civilized world recognizes that "racial extermination" has no color lines and is just as unacceptable to "blacks" as it is "whites".

And, yes, I do know that canniblism is rare in Africa....alliteration.

RhumbRunner

Zimbabwe was a modern country til Mugabe came to power. It is still redeemable if we could rid the country of his menace.

Americans "don't give a shit" because it isn't on their radar, they have no strategic interest in the area. This is a Commonwealth headache and we must deal with it.

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Re: Zimbabwe?

This is a Commonwealth headache and we must deal with it.

The Commonwealth Heads of States Meeting backed away from imposing any real muscle on Mugabe when they had the chance.

And Blair has now made a few major speeches that the West should concentrate on Africa, as a continent, to forestall any further growth in terrorism.

How far his ideas will get when other African countries, which stand to lose far more than they gain, support despots like Mugabe is hard to say.

It's not always political either.

Tribalism is still the influencing factor in African society...

 

[Mensa]

The Commonwealth Heads of Governments Meeting backed away because they were given an out by the lily-livered spineless toad that calls himself P.M.of Canada. Blair and Hawke were all for forcing Mugabe's hand but Jean Cretin wimped out with a proposal to let the Zimbabwean elections proceed and if there were any irregularities, then we would protest. Mugabe will be in the Presidential Office and ordering his goon squads to wreak havoc on all his opponents and laughing up his sleeve at any protests.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

With great respect.

Mensa,

"Zimbabwe was a modern country til Mugabe came to power. It is still redeemable if we could rid the country of his menace. "

And until whomever next comes to power! We are seeing the decline of South Africa to a third word country because of a liberally directed political shift! Wonderful, now instead of blacks killing other blacks in the gettos, they are killing whites on the farms, blacks in the gettos and destroying the nation! Brilliant!

RhumbRunner

 

[Mensa]

Re: With great respect.

Mensa,

"Zimbabwe was a modern country til Mugabe came to power. It is still redeemable if we could rid the country of his menace. "

And until whomever next comes to power! We are seeing the decline of South Africa to a third word country because of a liberally directed political shift! Wonderful, now instead of blacks killing other blacks in the gettos, they are killing whites on the farms, blacks in the gettos and destroying the nation! Brilliant!

RhumbRunner

Soth Africa stands on a precipice, it could go either way. Voices of reason are still heard in the land but if Zimbabwe falls into tribalism and black racism then there is sure to be spillover into South Africa. This is why Mugabe must be stopped and democratic rule of law restored.

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Re: With great respect.

Soth Africa stands on a precipice, it could go either way. Voices of reason are still heard in the land but if Zimbabwe falls into tribalism and black racism then there is sure to be spillover into South Africa. This is why Mugabe must be stopped and democratic rule of law restored.

Yep!

But as Bishop Tutu said last year the blacks in South Africa have never had the chance to exorcise the demon that all those years of Apartheid created.

Mendela was kind to the whites beyond liberalism. It almost seemed a deal had been made.

As Tutu said, where were the crime trials, the retribution, the revenge?

The blacks are worse off than ever, society is breaking down and the whites seem to be living much as they were before.

The country is ripe for a takeover from Zimbabwe.

ppman

 

[RhumbRunner13]

Mensa,

"Soth Africa stands on a precipice, it could go either way. Voices of reason are still heard in the land but if Zimbabwe falls into tribalism and black racism then there is sure to be spillover into South Africa. This is why Mugabe must be stopped and democratic rule of law restored."

We get little news about the continent, but from what I've heard SA is already sliding down the slope. White farmers are being attacked and killed with no legal action visible. Their farms are then "available" to anyone who wants it, and the farmer next door is wondering when it will be, "His turn"?!

How will Zimbabwe, with any kind of ruler, change the equation?

RhumbRunner

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Mensa,

[BWhite farmers are being attacked and killed with no legal action visible. Their farms are then "available" to anyone who wants it, and the farmer next door is wondering when it will be, "His turn"?!
[/B]

Are you sure about that young sir?

 

[Guest]

 

[Mensa]

Re: Mensa,

"

We get little news about the continent, but from what I've heard SA is already sliding down the slope. White farmers are being attacked and killed with no legal action visible. Their farms are then "available" to anyone who wants it, and the farmer next door is wondering when it will be, "His turn"?!

How will Zimbabwe, with any kind of ruler, change the equation?

RhumbRunner

The killing of white farmers is in Zimbabwe not South Africa. They are doing it with the blessing of Robert Mugabe. Instability is his ally. He is a danger to the entire region and must be dealt with, forcefully, but where are the politicians with enough backbone to do it?

A change in Zimbabwean leadership to a lawful democracy could stabilize the whole of southern Africa.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

Are you sure about that young sir?

Nope!!

I can only go on what little I see reported, but that is what I have seen reported.

Are you suggesting that all the reports of white farmers being driven from their lands with no action taken by the government are false? Where do such false reports come from? (Pardon my poor use of the mother tongue!!)

RhumbRunner


Master Baiter..........laughes and giggles!!!!

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Are you sure about that young sir?

Nope!!

I can only go on what little I see reported, but that is what I have seen reported.

Where do such false reports come from?
RhumbRunner


Master Baiter..........laughes and giggles!!!!

Mensa's answered your question already.

They're only false when relating them to South Africa.

They're perfectly true when you're talking about Zimbabwe...

 

[RhumbRunner13]

"Mensa's answered your question already.

They're only false when relating them to South Africa.

They're perfectly true when you're talking about Zimbabwe"


I don't get it! Hasn't the fairly recent past of Rhodesia been a disaster? Maybe I'm wrong, is Rhodesia now Zimbabwe? If it's not, who is Rhodesia now? Never mind, I'm confused.

Thanks, Peeps, you cleared this up for me!!

RhumbRunner

 

[freescorfr]

Southern Rhodesia became Zimbabwe and Nothern Rhodesia is now Zambia.
Interesting thread. I know many good Brits who supported Mugabe in his early days. Power currupts, I suppose.

I wish I knew more about Africa. It suffers, not just from tribalism and poor infrastructure and poverty, but from it's rampant aids epidemic.

 

[p_p_man]

Blair is right.

Africa is one continent where the West can still make a positive contribution.

It's teetering on the economic and political edge and, as freescorfr says, has a rampant Aids problem. But apart from individual countries having their own major problems which once over are soon forgotten, the continent as a whole is still holding together.

Now there is a vacuum in the East-West Cold War we can all look at Africa as a vast area which can be saved from itself.

We have it in our power, for once, to do a lot of good for good's sake and not for some petty political and economic point scoring. At the same time we will be going a long way down the route to making the place a no-go area for terrorists.

There's no point in them whipping up support for their causes, when most people are already content with their lot.

Will the world listen to Blair?

Have I just got a Socialist pipe-dream?

Who knows? But now that he's made himself into some sort of international statesman he may as well do something with his new found influence.

At least he's making the right speeches.

ppman