I like Crown Prince Abdullah of Saudi Arabia...

[p_p_man]

Source Guardian

"George Bush? He's nice but dim, says crown prince

Matthew Engel in Washington
Wednesday May 15, 2002
The Guardian

In the most regal possible manner, Crown Prince Abdullah of Saudi Arabia skewered President George Bush yesterday as a man so ignorant about the Middle East, and specifically about the suffering of the Palestinians, that he needed several hours of personal tuition to bring him up to speed.
When the prince visited the presidential ranch in Texas last month, the two men spent five hours together, far longer than expected. This was an indication - according to the White House spin machine - of how well they got on. Prince Abdullah presents a different interpretation: the time was spent coaching the president in political realities."

There's more of the same and then right at the end of the article, this appears:

"However, despite the veiled criticism, Mr Bush can take comfort in the opinions of the people who matter most to him: a poll conducted last week suggested that 70% of the American public approved of his Middle East policies."

Does this opnion poll mean that a vast majority of the American public are also "ignorant about the Middle East, and specifically about the suffering of the Palestinians".

At least when I thought it was just Bush I thought America had a chance but now...

Mmmmmm!

ppman

 

[Siren]

Bush a dim bulb?

 

[freescorfr]

Veiled criticism can also be veiled praise. "Veiled" is a good Saudi concept, too.

I don't doubt Bush's "niceness" and also his desire to be liked and approved of. These are great personal weaknesses which entail the impossibility of his knowing where he really stands, since it is dependent upon the regard of others - hence another aspect of ignorance, not lack of knowledge, but lack of position.

So, yes, it is the American people who need to be better informed.

 

[bluespoke]

Matthew Engel

Hey p_p!

I don't want to question your sources but....................... isn't Matthew Engel a cricket writer?

 

[juicygirl]

Well of course Bush has no clue. Thats why its such a mess now due to the earlier isolationist attitude that shrub took. I don't know why people insist that his cabinet knows shit either. Talk about low wattage. Pretty sad when a President has to get things explained to him a thousand times, and then by a leader of a pretty brutal regime.

 

[bharman4102]

juicygirl, i have a feeling that you could settle the middle east dispute and probably 5 other raging wars with a flash of your breasts....that would stop everyone from speaking, and you could quickly hammer out the settlement!

jeez -- a sexy, intelligent woman -- a truly deadly mix!

 

[SINthysist]

... and now for the other side...

The "prince" comes from a long-line of desert nomads who had nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents when the oil age began.

The "prince's" family made themselves the weathliest people on the face of the earth. Meanwhile thier people continued to be desert nomads who had nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents.

Now he supports terror and unrest in the Arab lands to maintain his hold on the throne for his family that they may have many more generations in which to keep thier people in the desert nomads who have nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents.

I think he spent five hours groveling to the only person who could maintain his throne, and then went out and immediately blasted the man in order to salve his ego and make himself look really important to a bunch of desert nomads who have nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents...

 

[miles]

Juicy Junior

I don't know why people insist that his cabinet knows shit either. Talk about low wattage. Pretty sad when a President has to get things explained to him a thousand times, and then by a leader of a pretty brutal regime.

Stick with the pics, JJ.

 

[Rex1960]

Re: Bush a dim bulb?

...
what he doesnt know about foreign politics could fill an olympic pool.

wait a minute... easy....

he is a texian... and he knows something about.. mmh...lets say North Dakota or Vermont

what, if he thinks this is foreign politics ?

Rex

 

[bluespoke]

Re: Bush a dim bulb?

more like a dead bulb.

what he doesnt know about foreign politics could fill an olympic pool.

An Olympic Pool? More like an Atlantic Ocean!

 

[Ishmael]

What I find ......................

so interesting about the majority of the responses, and the original premise of this thread is these same words were used to describe Reagan's foriegn policy. And the lack of intelligence and direction behind them.

Now, with the passage of time, the same people that were so critical during his administration are, if not singing his praises, giving him grudging credit for ending the Cold War and re-building the military infrastructure that Bush the Elder used so effectively in Desert Storm.

Bush is being judged by the Mid-East political morass. And that's exactly what it is, a morass. I sincerely believe that only the total elimination of the "Shi'ah" (Shiite) philosophy as an effective branch of Islam will make a political solution possible.

Prince Abdullah and his ilk are walking a political tightrope of their own. I give very little credence to his 'public' utterances. Afterall, he is not speaking just to the world in general, but to his own people and the peoples of the Mid-east as well. With out the abiltity to focus on an external enemy (Isreal and the US) the torments that the principalities of the Mid-east have inflicted on their own peoples will fuel the uprisings that will overthrow their regimes. They know it, and we know it.

The "Old Man of the Mountain" has returned. Find Alamut and destroy it forever.

Ishmael

 

[Rex1960]

... and now for the other side...
The "prince" comes from a long-line of desert nomads who had nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents when the oil age began....
...I think he spent five hours groveling to the only person who could maintain his throne, and then went out and immediately blasted the man in order to salve his ego and make himself look really important to a bunch of desert nomads who have nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents...

i guess you're absolutely right... but

#1- how come we still support the Saudi or other regimes in that region ? Do i smell oil ?
#2 - there are more regions we're supporting the wrong people

Rex

 

[RTWudder]

... and now for the other side...

The "prince" comes from a long-line of desert nomads who had nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents when the oil age began.

The "prince's" family made themselves the weathliest people on the face of the earth. Meanwhile thier people continued to be desert nomads who had nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents.

Now he supports terror and unrest in the Arab lands to maintain his hold on the throne for his family that they may have many more generations in which to keep thier people in the desert nomads who have nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents.

I think he spent five hours groveling to the only person who could maintain his throne, and then went out and immediately blasted the man in order to salve his ego and make himself look really important to a bunch of desert nomads who have nothing, nothing, nothing, but sand, camels, goats, and tents...

Everyone in the region came froma long line of goat herders. That is what desert nomads do. They did it for thousands of years until the "oil age" began.

Standard Oil of New Jersey made them rich. You and I continue to make them rich. Cut out wasteful oil use and make them go away. Some suggestions to cut oil use: eliminate jet skis, atvs, snowmobiles, single occupant car commuting, night and indoor sports (baseball and football) events and reduce plastic packaging and wasteful plastic, aka hydrocarbon, production.

For thousands of years each tribe in the middle east maintained their piece of the desert by moving their goat herds to a new piece of desert or by fighting off other goat herders for control of the oasis. Take away the US dependence on oil and they will go back to fighting over sand dunes because it takes a shit load of money to buy weapons.

Lastly, why can't Americans admit that they are ignornat of anything that is happening in the world that did not happen either next door to them or in a sports stadium that depends on Arab oil for lighting. Time and again surveys have been conducted to show that the average American has no idea where most countrues are on a map, who runs those countries, and scarier still, cannot find Nebraska on an unmarked map of the US.

I would tend to believe an arab goat herder who has noone to impress by lying and therefore no reason to than a politician who, immediately had a poll taken to see if what he did was acceptable to the voters to whom he owes his soul.

 

[Rex1960]

Re: What I find ......................

Bush is being judged by the Mid-East political morass. And that's exactly what it is, a morass. I sincerely believe that only the total elimination of the "Shi'ah" (Shiite) philosophy as an effective branch of Islam will make a political solution possible.

what about the "Sunni" - are they any better ? majority of islamic terrorists follow their way as far as I know.

Prince Abdullah and his ilk are walking a political tightrope of their own.... With out the abiltity to focus on an external enemy (Isreal and the US) the torments that the principalities of the Mid-east have inflicted on their own peoples will fuel the uprisings that will overthrow their regimes. They know it, and we know it.

the "status quo" helps the oil flowing. What if the region looses this balance, even if it's built on morass ?

The "Old Man of the Mountain" has returned. Find Alamut and destroy it forever.

I follow your picture, but who do you think the newlyborn Hasan ibn al-Sabbah (founder of the ismaili assassin order who built the mountain fortress Alamut) is ?

Rex

 

[Ishmael]

i guess you're absolutely right... but

#1- how come we still support the Saudi or other regimes in that region ? Do i smell oil ?

Of course, so what? Without it, the US would slip into a 7 year depression. Europe would slide into another dark age. Interestingly enough, France would probably be the least effected.

#2 - there are more regions we're supporting the wrong people

Rex

What is the "wrong" people? Governments deal with governments. We don't have to like them, but under international law, that's the way it is. A gentleman's agreement that as long as you keep your nose out of my business, I'll keep my nose out of yours. The US, and the former great powers of Europe have had their head handed to them on a platter virtually everytime we've engaged in 'country building'.

Ishmael

 

[Rex1960]

...For thousands of years each tribe in the middle east maintained their piece of the desert by moving their goat herds to a new piece of desert or by fighting off other goat herders for control of the oasis. Take away the US dependence on oil and they will go back to fighting over sand dunes because it takes a shit load of money to buy weapons...

+ it's definately not only the US depending on oil
+ it's not only the US that are producing and selling those weapons...

just in case anybody would forget these "facts"

Rex

 

[bluespoke]

+ it's definately not only the US depending on oil
+ it's not only the US that are producing and selling those weapons...

just in case anybody would forget these "facts"

Rex

Facts? Facts?

Why let facts get in the way of a good argument?

 

[Ishmael]

Re: Re: What I find ......................

what about the "Sunni" - are they any better ? majority of islamic terrorists follow their way as far as I know.

It is the Ismailis sub-sect of the Shi'ahs that are the leaders. Still headquartered in old Persia. Followers can come from anywhere.

the "status quo" helps the oil flowing. What if the region looses this balance, even if it's built on morass ?

That is still a distinct possibility. And the amusing (it's not really funny, but it is ironic) thing is that should Isreal cease to exist the possibility of a Mid-east political collapse is even greater. Go figure.

I follow your picture, but who do you think the newlyborn Hasan ibn al-Sabbah (founder of the ismaili assassin order who built the mountain fortress Alamut) is ?

Rex

There are several vying for the 'crown'. Even Saddam Hussein has found these zealots to be an effective tool. But isn't that the way the assasins were used in the first place? They exerted control on the Princes so that they would be monetarily rewarded, and in return they did the Princes bidding. A mutually parasitic relationship.

The key is in the "imam's".

Ishmael

 

[Viper Vic]

Me too, on a spit with BBQ sauce.

 

[p_p_man]

Originally posted by Ishmael [/B]

Europe would slide into another dark age. Interestingly enough, France would probably be the least effected.Ishmael [/B]

Oh yeah?

And what do you know that we don't?

Or are you using highly sensitive, never to be disclosed, kown only to you "sources" to make your usual idiotic statements.

ppman

 

[Ishmael]

Oh yeah?

And what do you know that we don't?

Or are you using highly sensitive, never to be disclosed, kown only to you "sources" to make your usual idiotic statements.

ppman

How much of Frances electrical power is dependent on fossil fuel?

 

[bored1]

How much of Frances electrical power is dependent on fossil fuel?

Gotta give the French credit for that one. Building standardized nuke plants was wise.

 

[android1966]

Gotta give the French credit for that one. Building standardized nuke plants was wise.

Yeah, but building one in Iraq was a bit rash.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

Seems like..........

.....Peeper likes anyone who concurs with his biased view of President Bush or Tony Blair......something tells me his picture is printed in Merriam Webster right next to "Bias"!

I was wrong, it's at "Wanker"!

"Some suggestions to cut oil use: eliminate jet skis, atvs, snowmobiles, single occupant car commuting, night and indoor sports (baseball and football) events and reduce plastic packaging and wasteful plastic, aka hydrocarbon, production. "


RT, you forgot bars and restuarants, all theaters and any "local" sport programs. We don't need to be taking those damn kids anywhere, they can play in the back yard! Outlaw vacations, people can hike to some local attraction! "Government" should build one giant highrise next to each factory for all the workers to live in, lights out (blow out your candles) three hours after sunset.

How does that last stanza go? ........"O'er the land of the free, and the home of the brave"

Rhumb

 

[Ishmael]

Gotta give the French credit for that one. Building standardized nuke plants was wise.

If I can think that through from public information, you should have been able to also.

Ishmael

*edited to apologize B1. I started to think I was talking to ppman*