"I know no one is looking for realism in porn (I'm definitely not)"

[AG31]

This statement by @jlightfoot75 a few weeks ago caught me up short. Not only does it not apply to me, but I simply don't understand it.

My main question here is to @jlightfoot75 and others who share their perspective. What do you want in porn or erotica? Why would realism be a problem?

My subsidiary question is this: To what degree is realism in erotica important to your enjoyment?

Here's my answer.

I realized that for me, any physical interaction or sensation that I can't vividly imagine is a turn off. I'm quite happy to willingly suspend my disbelief on a whole host of issues, the way sex clubs "really" work, the fact that no such society as the one in the story ever existed, etc., etc., But if I'm interrupted from putting myself physically in the situation described, it's a problem. An example would be double penetration where the players are positioned in an impossible way. I need to understand how every limb is positioned. And here's an innocuous example that's not even from erotica:

The last time he heard the words, "You're an absolute gem," was when he'd handed in his arithmetic homework with no mistakes."*
The problem here is that the teacher couldn't have said those words when he handed in the paper, because she hadn't had a chance to grade it. I wanted Beaton to replace "when he'd handed in" to "when she returned".

Death of a Smuggler by M. C. Beaton

What about the rest of you?

 

[TheLobster]

The more the author buys me with his craftsmanship, the more of my disbelief I'm willing to suspend.

(Which also means no one should ever apply this criteria to my stories, because then they'd have to be straight-up documentaries and they're obviously not).

 

[ElectricBlue]

What about the rest of you?

You are far more literal than most readers. You don't visualise what you're reading, from what you've told us, so you deconstruct a story intellectually (edit: "somatically", to pick up on the OP's later observation), to understand the meaning within each word. You don't see a movie in your head, you experience the engagement in a different way - which is foreign to me, for example.

I think there are different meanings being applied to the words "realism" here. Your meaning is "anchored in the real world" - you prefer everything to be relatable to that reality. The fellow you've cited, on the other hand, probably wants the idealised porn view of the world, where every woman wants the stud, so he's unrealistic in that sense.

Like everything, there's a very wide spectrum. I, for example, have a very visual mind, I see everything in my mind; but I also have an ability with words such that I can describe it, to provide that filmic view for those that envision the same way I do. But also a poetic view, for those who see the beauty in the words. Both words that commenters have used, often.

 

[ElectricBlue]

The more the author buys me with his craftsmanship, the more of my disbelief I'm willing to suspend.

(Which also means no one should ever apply this criteria to my stories, because then they'd have to be straight-up documentaries and they're obviously not).

That's an excellent way of putting it.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

Reality is overrated.

 

[AG31]

You are far more literal than most readers. You don't visualise what you're reading, from what you've told us, so you deconstruct a story intellectually, to understand the meaning within each words.

You're right about that, and thanks for remembering. But I've lately come to a more vivid understanding about my perceptions. I'm somatic. When I read about a person handing in (or getting back) a homework paper, I feel it in my arms. When I read about a complicated sexual scene I try to get my arms and legs mentally into what must be going on.

You don't see a movie in your head, you experience the engagement in a different way - which is foreign to me, for example.

I think there are different meanings being applied to the words "realism" here. Your meaning is "anchored in the real world" - you prefer everything to be relatable to that reality. The fellow you've cited, on the other hand, probably wants the idealised porn view of the world, where every woman wants the stud, so he's unrealistic in that sense.

Yes, that's a possiblity that I can understand. Thanks again.

Like everything, there's a very wide spectrum. I, for example, have a very visual mind, I see everything in my mind; but I also have an ability with words such that I can describe it, to provide that filmic view for those that envision the same way I do. But also a poetic view, for those who see the beauty in the words. Both words that commenters have used, often.

As you know from my comments, I really respond to your writing. I think part of it is the intense focus on the physical reality. I can feel it.

 

[AG31]

Like everything, there's a very wide spectrum. I, for example, have a very visual mind, I see everything in my mind; but I also have an ability with words such that I can describe it, to provide that filmic view for those that envision the same way I do. But also a poetic view, for those who see the beauty in the words. Both words that commenters have used, often.

I thought more about why I like your stories and I went looking in the two most recent for a reference to freckles. Couldn't find it, although wrinkles at the eyes was nice. Somewhere you notice freckles on a woman's hands, I think. For a non-visual person like me, the singular focus is very attractive. I think you should add "intense focus" to your list.

 

[ChuckWolf]

Yeah, not really looking for that either.

However, tiny superficial touches that make the story more believable, I appreciate.

Things that kill my suspension of disbelief are outdated names (Edward, Agnes, etc.), a wildly unlikely premise set in the real world (A CFNM story involving a workplace or institution where all the males have to be nude) or clichéd and/or dated dialogue.

 

[StillStunned]

In my stories, I don't mind creating fantasy worlds and magical beings. I'll happy set up an outlandish scenario to get my characters in a situation where things are going to happen.

But once it happens, I try to make it as realistic, or at least plausible, as possible.

For porn, I also prefer natural people, not plastified actors.

 

[AG31]

from what you've told us, so you deconstruct a story intellectually, to understand the meaning within each words.

This is the second time I've gotten up from the couch where I'm trying to launch my Sunday nap.

Back to somaticism. In the example about the homework, the reason the trifling inaccuracy stops me, is that I'm mentally handing the paper to the teacher and experiencing the disconnect when they say something about it, having not yet seen it. So it's not intellectualism. It's somaticism.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

For the most part I want my porn to be believable, at least when we are talking about things in the real world. If we are in SciFi/fantasy territory I want it to be internally consistent within the scope of the world building.

I'm willing to suspend some disbelief, we don't need to get dragged down by worries about pregnancy and diseases, but the whole "His sister walks in on him jerking off sees his 10in cock and immediately has to have him..." yeah...no. The world doesn't work like that.

 

[AG31]

Still haven't been able to drift off to my nap.

I just read another example of where a trivial lack of realism interrupts my belief suspension. It's from the same book as cited in OP.

The problem for me is how they staunch the bleeding without getting his shirt off. Are they applying bandages over the shirt sleeves?????

Would this bother any of you??

"They found him...bleeding from deep cuts at the tops of his arms.... but these cuts are the biggest problem. He's lost a lot of blood." He produced two packets from his medical kit, tearing them open and removing towo large dressings. He handed one of the dressings to Hamish... "Hold this on the wound, apply pressure and keep his arm raised."

 

[Kelliezgirl]

Still haven't been able to drift off to my nap.

I just read another example of where a trivial lack of realism interrupts my belief suspension. It's from the same book as cited in OP.

The problem for me is how they staunch the bleeding without getting his shirt off. Are they applying bandages over the shirt sleeves?????

Would this bother any of you??

Not really. If there is serious bleeding apply pressure now, cut whatever remains of the shirt away later.

 

[Dearelliot]

Reality: and especially in film!
Maybe it's me, but tearing her clothes off because of the heat of the moment?
I can't recall ever.
I suppose if she asked me to.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

Reality: and especially in film!
Maybe it's me, but tearing her clothes off because of the heat of the moment?
I can't recall ever.
I suppose if she asked me to.

There's a comedian who has a bit about this.
Attempting to tear her panties off...
Her: what are you doing!
Him: Being Sexy!
Her: You're giving me a wedgie!

 

[lovecraft68]

I think its a mix of both that can make a good story. Realism as far as characters and plot, how people react to situations, conflict, etc are all things I try to work into a story and enjoy in other's works.

But when it comes to the actual erotica I tend to lean more to the sexy fantasy than realism.

Example from a recent e-book release. Its about an escort and it's a book two of a series. In both books and anything moving forward, she bare backs her clients.

Now in real life any escort who does this most likely has already caught something so doesn't care and thinks she'll get more business by letting guys rawdog her. When it comes to the males paying for her, you'd have to be out of your mind not to wrap it up to have sex with anyone you don't know, let alone a pro.

But that's reality and there is nothing sexy about condoms, so fuck it, my characters live in a no STD no pregnancy zone. Sue me.

I've gotten a few reviews and some comments and feedback on a site where I posted a couple of the chapters and no one mentioned it.

I have a feeling if I post it here I am going to get some "They're not even protecting themselves from this diseased whore!"

 

[crookedletter]

As far as actively not wanting realism, I would expect that to mean you can dispense with some of the less convenient aspects of reality in favor of eroticism or just general narrative movement.

Unless there's a reason for it your story, your characters don't need to worry about things like birth control or STDs or the awkwardness that can ensue in the aftermath of casual sex. If they're doing things in public or in a group or with family members you can manufacture, with the godlike powers of author, the general buy-in of everyone involved. Situations where in reality there might be some discomfort, where there might be people around who would not approve or might intervene or call authorities, in the fantasy world of a lot of erotica you can be reasonably assured that everyone involved is at least okay with what's going on, if not wholeheartedly into it.

People can have sex on the beach without getting sand in uncomfortable places. And everybody gets off, as often and as intensely as you want, and nobody walks away unsatisfied or embarrassed. Again, unless you want them to for the sake of the story.

Sex, in reality, is great. I'm a fan. But it can also occasionally be awkward and uncomfortable and disappointing. It can complicate relationships, it can make people do strange and unfortunate things. That in itself is fodder for a certain kind of compelling realistic fiction. But it can also be dispensed with, if you want, in the interest of good old fashioned smut.

 

[AG31]

Interesting mix. I'm going to address these in excruciating (realistically speaking) detail.

As far as actively not wanting realism, I would expect that to mean you can dispense with some of the less convenient aspects of reality in favor of eroticism or just general narrative movement.

In my writing and reading I'm definitely happy to dispense with the possible complications of anal sex. And the need for condoms... Although I have read some stories that I thought were improved by attention to both. But these don't include impossible or confusing physical interactions.

Unless there's a reason for it your story, your characters don't need to worry about things like birth control or STDs or the awkwardness that can ensue in the aftermath of casual sex. If they're doing things in public or in a group or with family members you can manufacture, with the godlike powers of author, the general buy-in of everyone involved. Situations where in reality there might be some discomfort, where there might be people around who would not approve or might intervene or call authorities, in the fantasy world of a lot of erotica you can be reasonably assured that everyone involved is at least okay with what's going on, if not wholeheartedly into it.

Yup. Again, not bumping into the laws of physics.

People can have sex on the beach without getting sand in uncomfortable places.

Well, I might get halted a little in my immersion in the story if they didn't deal with the sand thing.

And everybody gets off, as often and as intensely as you want, and nobody walks away unsatisfied or embarrassed. Again, unless you want them to for the sake of the story.

Psychology doesn't enter into my question.

Sex, in reality, is great. I'm a fan. But it can also occasionally be awkward

If it's physically awkward, I want the author to deal with it.

and uncomfortable

If it's uncomfortable, I want the author to deal with it.

and disappointing.

That's up to the author.

It can complicate relationships, it can make people do strange and unfortunate things. That in itself is fodder for a certain kind of compelling realistic fiction. But it can also be dispensed with, if you want, in the interest of good old fashioned smut.

Again, that makes it clear to me that my question deals with physics, not psychology. Thanks for helping to clear that up!!!

 

[iwatchus]

I have occasionally had characters try a porn trope, only to realize it doesn't for them the way they expected/had seen. They laugh about it, than have sex that does work for them.

I personally find lovers laughing together to be very erotic.

 

[crookedletter]

Interesting mix. I'm going to address these in excruciating (realistically speaking) detail.

In my writing and reading I'm definitely happy to dispense with the possible complications of anal sex. And the need for condoms... Although I have read some stories that I thought were improved by attention to both. But these don't include impossible or confusing physical interactions.

Yup. Again, not bumping into the laws of physics.

Well, I might get halted a little in my immersion in the story if they didn't deal with the sand thing.

Psychology doesn't enter into my question.

If it's physically awkward, I want the author to deal with it.

If it's uncomfortable, I want the author to deal with it.

That's up to the author.

Again, that makes it clear to me that my question deals with physics, not psychology. Thanks for helping to clear that up!!!

That's all fair, and I'd say I agree. As some others have said I don't mind bending the laws of physics if it's justified within the world of the story, but whatever physical laws exist within that world need to be respected. I don't mind if two people are having interdimensional sex through a wormhole, but if the mechanics of whatever they're doing don't make sense within whatever wormhole rules are laid out in the story then yeah, you're gonna lose me.

 

[AG31]

Not really. If there is serious bleeding apply pressure now, cut whatever remains of the shirt away later.

Good point, but I would prefer it if the author removed the uncertainty and said something like "right over the sleeve."

 

[AG31]

I have occasionally had characters try a porn trope, only to realize it doesn't for them the way they expected/had seen. They laugh about it, than have sex that does work for them.

I personally find lovers laughing together to be very erotic.

I like that approach.

 

[Craighalbert]

Things that kill my suspension of disbelief are outdated names (Edward, Agnes, etc.), a wildly unlikely premise set in the real world (A CFNM story involving a workplace or institution where all the males have to be nude) or clichéd and/or dated dialogue.

I'm not black myself, but having black characters named Jamal or Tyrone or Marcus takes me out of a story. I'm sure there are black people with those names - I even know a Marcus - but they show up so often it makes me think the author has no experience with black people outside porn.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

Good point, but I would prefer it if the author removed the uncertainty and said something like "right over the sleeve."

There's always a conversation to be had about "how much detail is enough".
I recently received a rather critical comment that took the view that I was providing too much detail and thus it was boring.

The challenge is for every reader like you there is probably another one who takes the view, "he's bleeding, you bandaged it, MOVE ON!!!!"
and doesn't want to hear about the details of first aid that don't advance the plot.

 

[lovecraft68]

There's always a conversation to be had about "how much detail is enough".
I recently received a rather critical comment that took the view that I was providing too much detail and thus it was boring.

The challenge is for every reader like you there is probably another one who takes the view, "he's bleeding, you bandaged it, MOVE ON!!!!"
and doesn't want to hear about the details of first aid that don't advance the plot.

There's a How To here-I think its still here-called making a cup of tea, which discusses details in the sense of how much blow by blow to you need?

Course if its a blow job you need all the details and if we're talking blowing blow you'd want all that to.

I need to come up with better expressions, I keep distracting myself.