I believe I've had this thread coming for a while now

[Lucifer_Carroll]

All of you women out there, every last one of you, I am shocked and awed by the sheer power of forgiveness in your hearts. I am amazed by the sheer amount of credit you give us men despite all we have done. I am flabbergasted that you haven't locked us in a pen somewhere and started the meat grinder as should be due our fate. After all the insults, the attempted rapes, the molestations, the cheatings, the abandonment of families, the treatment of you all like shit, the treatment of you all like sex toys built for our pleasure, the insistence that being a lesbian means you just haven't found the right man yet, the insistence that we are always the right man for that, the abuse, the power trips, the ego boosts, the treatment of wives as freeloaders and chattle for only keeping a full time job and raise the kids and clean the house and run every little thing and deal with us on our little testosterone kicks, the taking of advantage of every single inebriated woman as if being intoxicated was an invitation for sex, the belief that once we sleep with you we own you, the constant attempt to make you do things you don't want to for our pleasure alone, the running of the world into the ground for our pathetic insignificant power trips, the coddling of our egos, the way we force you to bow before us as Gods, as masters, instead of deluded idiots who think we can control chaos and entropy, the violence, the murders, the rampant fucking unrepentant evil you still have the unbelievable heart to fight only for egalitarianism.

I'm a man and I want to waste all of us and hand you the key to the world and yet you still believe we somehow have merit, that we can be forgiven for these sins, that we're not all bad, that you are somehow in some inconceivably "as bad as us in some small little way". It boggles my mind constantly and unerringly, but breeds a deeper respect than I could ever hope to put into words. You are truly goddesses for putting up with men's shit as long as you have, smiling as they tried to remake you as Barbie Porno Princess and her bisexual friends and stick you with the bill. You are better than any man in the history of the world can ever hope to be.

Truly we don't deserve it. Seriously, we don't and will never.

 

[Samandiriel]

If you weren't a man I would sleep with you.

Serioulsly, don't be so hard on all men, especially the one you see in the mirror each day.

 

[Guest]

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

GYAHHH! How can you be so nice? How can anyone be this nice? Do you know what we talk about when there aren't women around? Do you know how much pleasure most men get out of watching you bleed and suffer, out of forcing you to do things you don't want? Do you know what gets respect in the male world?

We want to rape you in the ass until you bleed to death. We brag about raping passed out drunk chicks as if it was something to be proud of as long as they were hot. We rank ourselves on our ability to dupe women into being sex toys. And that's just the minor evil.

How could anybody be as good, as fair, as understanding as you? I don't get it. I don't think I'll ever get it. *Sigh*

 

[OhMissScarlett]

You're just saying that to pick up chicks, right?

Seriously, very well said.

You are truly goddesses for putting up with men's shit as long as you have, smiling as they tried to remake you as Barbie Porno Princess and her bisexual friends and stick you with the bill. You are better than any man in the history of the world can ever hope to be.

That should be on a monument somewhere.

 

[Guest]

I agree wholehearted with LC, but do remember LC, they get to outlive us by 7 years, and control most of the wealth in the nation.

I wish my wife controlled some wealth.

 

[NoJo]

I feel sorry for women becuase they cannot fart.

 

[rgraham666]

Sorry Luc. Much as I luv ya I'm going to have to tell you to fuck right off in this case.

Some of us with that Y chromosome actually make a real effort to treat women, hell, everybody with respect, until they've proven unworthy of it.

To lump all of us with the assholes really pisses me off.

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

. . . Do you know what gets respect in the male world? . . . rape . . in the ass . . . passed out drunk chicks . . . as long as they were hot . . . dupe women into being sex toys. . . How could anybody be . . . understanding . . . *Sigh*

Easy, Luci,

Puppy dogs want to chew up our slippers, hop up on the couch and eat our cookies, pee on the rug, and run anywhere they please when we take them for a walk.


But we break them of it.

It is only the men who actually DO what they all BRAG about, who deserve your censure.

We know men are dogs, but not all of us are willing to ONLY keep cats.

 

[AppleBiter]

Luc,

Sometimes a very cynical part of me feels that way, too. Thanks for the acknowledgement. I'm not saying all guys are like that or whatever, just that it can certainly feel that way at times. I appreciate the insight.

 

[Guest]

You've learned a valuable lesson at at early age, LC. Most men never learn it, but this proves you are better than them. My hat's off to ya.

http://warcrafty.com/spiff/e/clap.gif​

 

[minsue]

I've gotta say, men are getting a bad rap here. Look around, yes there are some sick men out there, but there are a lot more who are simply people. For all the bitching about how horrible men are, I've known far more men who were kind, caring, loving, fun, flawed, but no better or worse than I than I have known pure simple assholes.

Man as a whole, sucks (though unless and until women manage to gain the power our numbers would suggest we should have, we can't say we'd be any better). Men as people are simply people.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Though it's surely not going to net me any "feel-good-mushy-puppy-dog" points, I have to state that there is no correlation between gender and whether or not a quality person comes out of it. Men are not "crap" and women "goddesses" any more than woman are "all whores" and men "the only way to control them".

Blanket statements like that are designed to elicit a response, not strike at something true--given that they're not made, solely, out of ignorance for the facts.

Saying that men screwed up the world and that its a gender issue or difference is like that famous Pitch Memory experiment... the results found that women had far, far, far better pitch memory than men but failed to address that the sample was taken from a society where women were just more likely to have musical training than men--with that variable isolated, there was no difference between the pitch memory abilities of women over men at all. Men didn't screw up the world, men have had more access to the ability to do so; gender had nothing to do with the execution.

As a man, and a good one (I believe), I'm more or less offended that this kind of PR--even if well intentioned to make women feel good about themselves--is being conducted; as much as I would be if male chauvonists were purporting the opposite.

 

[amicus]

Lucifer Carrol needs counselling and not just that...but anger management and lessons in civility and sociability among other males.

This is one sick puppy.

amicus...

 

[Guest]

I agree wholehearted with LC, but do remember LC, they get to outlive us by 7 years, and control most of the wealth in the nation.

I wish my wife controlled some wealth.

Yet women hold only how many positions of authority in big businesses and the like?




Luc - no worries.

If you weren't so good in bed, we'd have dumped you long ago.

(That and your mowing the lawn, of course.)

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

As a man, and a good one (I believe)

I believe you have just proved my point.

Joe, I love you like the symbol of all I despise, but do think hard about yourself, your life, the shit you have done to women and BRAGGED ABOUT ON THIS VERY FORUM! Your constant cheating, your treatment of women as Kleenex without feelings, your treatment of the women on this forum with not a single ounce of respect due them, your taking advantage of intoxicated sorority girls, your fucking of the Puerto Rican while your girlfriend was bawling her eyes out. and you are somehow a "good man"?

So riddle me this, if you are a good man, how evil does a guy have to be to be a bad man?

I ain't gonna deny my soul has got its own set of stains on it or deny that I'm getting personal here, but the sheer audacity here and its perfect capturing of the arrogant malevolence that has enraptured my "fellow" males was too perfect to pass up.

And ami, dear ami, , you resemble my remarks most of all you sick little shit. When was the last time you took an honest look at the color of your soul, little buddy?

 

[amicus]

My soul, Luc, such as it is...is as clean as new driven snow and I am proud to be a man and a human and a lover of women for all their frailties.


amicus...

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

My soul, Luc, such as it is...is as clean as new driven snow and I am proud to be a man and a human and a lover of women for all their frailties.


amicus...

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Oh god, can't stop laughing for love of naked Buddha statue. Ah, funny gay prostitute, what quips you utter, what jests you bring to life.

 

[amicus]

Pleased than I entertain you.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

I believe you have just proved my point.

Joe, I love you like the symbol of all I despise, but do think hard about yourself, your life, the shit you have done to women and BRAGGED ABOUT ON THIS VERY FORUM!

There are things I've done with women, I don't know about to them--I can't really substantiate that. However, me being a braggart in private (this place constitutes privacy for me, certainly from the "real world") about the things I've done with women has no moral weight that I can justify. What of it was serious (out of much of it that wasn't), still isn't anything more horrid than a guy happily getting laid... this is hardly a crime. As a matter of fact, I can't think of anything I've "bragged" about that wasn't a loving, beautiful thing done between two consenting adults (most likely my girl, who is very proud of me that I am so open and find our sex life something to "brag about"... as many people in relationships can testify is a flattery).

Your constant cheating, your treatment of women as Kleenex without feelings, your treatment of the women on this forum with not a single ounce of respect due them, your taking advantage of intoxicated sorority girls, your fucking of the Puerto Rican while your girlfriend was bawling her eyes out. and you are somehow a "good man"?

I've never constantly cheated on a girl. I have done it twice. I don't see how that constitutes a "constantly". I have never treated a woman as a Kleenex without feelings--short of those times when I've hooked up at a party and we were using each other for sex, but that would be treating them as a sexual object and not tissue paper. I have never, to my knowledge, taken advantage of intoxicated sorority girls. I have treated women on this forum with the same amount of respect I have recieved from them, on an individual basis--I pride myself on rarely ever being the first person to start slinging mud or calling names--and do so with the guys as well. The girl was Panamanian, I was sixteen years old, and that was a terrible thing to do--however, that, as an act, practice, habit, or justified thing has never been a part of my life.

So riddle me this, if you are a good man, how evil does a guy have to be to be a bad man?

I would say that a guy has to conduct himself in such a manner that he causes, knowingly, the suffering of other people for reasons that abandon the greater good or survival. Of course, that's a rough and working definition, for now. In a nutshell, I would say a "bad man" is one who participates in moral evils as an acceptable lifestyle.

I ain't gonna deny my soul has got its own set of stains on it or deny that I'm getting personal here, but the sheer audacity here and its perfect capturing of the arrogant malevolence that has enraptured my "fellow" males was too perfect to pass up.

I have nothing intelligent to say about souls, in this thread--yours and its stains, or anyone else's. If you truly believe that men, as a gender, are somehow naturally more prone to horrible acts, beliefs, practices, or infrastructure than women are... I'd be delighted to hear some evidence leading toward proof on the matter (and anecdotal experience and spicy prose are far, far from that).

However, and this is something that ought be paid attention to: My status as a "good guy" or not is entirely independant of the point of my original post, as my post could just as likely have come from a genuinely "good guy" or a "bad guy" or a "good woman" or a "bad woman". The point in the post was a-gender-specific and I would be much more agreeable to discussing that, rather than me. Though I'll do what I can on either topic.

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

Pleased than I entertain you.

More than you realize, sweetcheeks. Pleasant dreams.

 

[Belegon]

alright, I usually stay out of this bullshit...


but I do feel the need to say this....no one thinks that they are evil. Characters in Austin Powers movies notwithstanding.

Most "evil" is easily described as selfishness...and that is the core of it. Evil is not about willingly doing mean things, it is about paying attention to your own desires to the exclusion of others feelings. I mean, even Hitler thought he was doing good things...and no, get the fuck off the horse Joe, I AM NOT comparing you to Hitler. I do not place you anywhere near that, believe me...

Hell, I've done things many would probably consider evil...

I'm not as down on my gender as Luc is right now, but I do think there is an awful lot of shit that can be laid at our door...I just recognized that the same is true of the other gender...

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

alright, I usually stay out of this bullshit...


but I do feel the need to say this....no one thinks that they are evil. Characters in Austin Powers movies notwithstanding.

Most "evil" is easily described as selfishness...and that is the core of it. Evil is not about willingly doing mean things, it is about paying attention to your own desires to the exclusion of others feelings. I mean, even Hitler thought he was doing good things...and no, get the fuck off the horse Joe, I AM NOT comparing you to Hitler. I do not place you anywhere near that, believe me...

Hell, I've done things many would probably consider evil...

I'm not as down on my gender as Luc is right now, but I do think there is an awful lot of shit that can be laid at our door...I just recognized that the same is true of the other gender...

I have to intensely disagree with your definition of evil, mostly because it raises a number of problems with seemingly acceptible ethics. Very few ethicists would agree that "selfishness" is the defining core of all evil things. By your definition, then, I cannot consider myself evil--but regardless, this isn't really a discussion about "evil" so much as whether or not Luc's depiction of men-as-a-people and women-as-a-people is accurate.

To which I politely disagree and for the reasons I previously stated. It sounds like, and correct me if I'm wrong, Bel, that you agree with my point as originally stated.

 

[Belegon]

By your definition, then, I cannot consider myself evil--but regardless, this isn't really a discussion about "evil" so much as whether or not Luc's depiction of men-as-a-people and women-as-a-people is accurate.

To which I politely disagree and for the reasons I previously stated. It sounds like, and correct me if I'm wrong, Bel, that you agree with me.

I don't think you're "evil" Joe, but I think you have done some things others (including me) would regard as , at the very least, disappointing and beneath you. And I often disagree with you, as you should be well aware by now.

Most of the time Joe, I regard you as a pretty intelligent guy who can be a real ass at times...which, to be honest, is kinda how I see myself. Although I do think you a have a stubborn streak that really trips you up a lot...you can be pretty self righteous ya know...again, kinda like me.

I must admit, my opinion of Luc is pretty high. He says a hell of a lot of things that make sense to me. I think that he is going too far in this case. But I also think that this is part of the personality he chooses to translate to this forum. He lets his extreme thoughts out here, and I have an appreciation for that. I hope that he is less down on his gender in "reality", but I also recognize that there are a hell of a lot of fuckwads out there, and especially at the age that he is likely to be exposed to on a college campus, that fit his descriptions pretty fucking well...

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

Joe.

I'm going to be completely honest here.

You just cut completely and utterly through my rage spiral. In a way, I'm impressed. In another, I am mortified.

You frighten me Joe because you are so utterly oblivious. When was the last time you did an honest introspection? Have you ever? Cause...shit, now I feel all bad for you and that's awkward because honestly I despise you more than words could ever express.

As for your last point, you know as well as I that if we enter that one, we will not only fail to adequately tackle the question, but I will give you an honest opportunity to let slip your "accidental" misogyny in the name of "fairness." I know your style well enough not to enter that one because I don't feel like rage spiraling all week long. My tolerance for misogyny is low enough right now without it going further down. The anecdotal is the strongest, because it is what surrounds and pervades, what is and what shapes, what reveals the most. Statistics are a fool's playgrounds for evil. If I brought out the charts on the near 100% gender stats for male rapists, male perpetrators of assault or violent crimes, male child molesters, male sex crimes. It is nearly always men commiting these horrors, but these do not capture "evil" in a neat box. In truth, it deviates from it into a pathetic attempt to control reality and chaos in the palm of one's hand. The facets do not capture the whole. The evil lurks in the subjective world, in the sexism, in the locker rooms, in the anecdotal conversation world you hate so much. There is the honest belief that women are rag doll fuckbuddies to be used and discarded. There is the sexist language. There is the rhetoric betraying truth. But as I said before, this paragraph is a pointless deviation built to start an argument that will not "logically prove" what it sought to.

But anyway, back to what I needed to say. I really feel bad for you right now. Fuck, you never knew, did you? That must suck. I'm not being sarcastic or quippy or whatnot, I'm literally sitting in front of my computer feeling so much pity for you. It's...truthfully, kinda creepy. Uh...what do you say at a time like this? Um...I really hope you someday figure it out and have time to repent.