Hi, character treatments for story idea

[dirtyriceking]

I have a story idea (with vignettes written of major live events) and I'd like some feedback on whether you think my characters are realistic/authentic:

Stephanie
HT:6' WT:220
E:Br H:collar length Br
Build:Bodybuilder Misc:thick pit tufts and leg hair, powermuff extends from treasure-trail to her navel up her asscrack, tattoo from elbow-to-elbow, (snake coiled around swords) wears wife-beaters/boxer-briefs
Misc:Uses Old Spice
Hobbies:NHL Center Ice/NFL Sunday ticket subscriber, playing women's football, smoking jumbo cigars, modeling for Mandy
Career:Chemistry Professor

Amanda (Steph's Wife)
HT:5'4 Wt:140
E:Bl H:Shoulder length d. blonde
Build: Runner
Hobbies:semi-competitve barefoot runner
Career:Artist

Zach
HT:5'3 WT:130
E:Grey H:Br
Build:Thin Misc:Intact
Hobbiesarties, running
Career:"Rainbow" Lawyer

Todd (Zach's Husband)
HT:6'1 WT:210
Buid:Athletic
E:BR Hair:Br/beard Misc:Intact, goes "commando", jokes he's "a mix of Welsh and Hungarian"
Hobbiesarties
Careerrivate Equity

There are other characters I'll discuss if interestesd.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

In fiction, a character's physical traits are actually the least important thing about them. What really interests a reader are their character and personality, not whether they have armpit hair or work in the equities field. It's character that drives a story, not appearance.

 

[dirtyriceking]

thanks doc

I'm a lousy beginning writer. Good lesson.

 

[3113]

I'm a lousy beginning writer. Good lesson.

Not lousy. This is common. Most writers start off creating characters this way. And, to be fair, you *do* have to know these things, as your character has to be alive and real to you--so you need to know them inside out, be able to answer any question asked about them. But the reader doesn't have to know all these things, and all these things need not appear in your story.

You certainly don't need the character saying, "Oh, and by the way, I'm 5'3" and weight 130..."

What is most important to remember is that if you make a character a chemistry professor, you don't just say it. The character doesn't get to say as they're getting naked for sex, "I'm a chem professor" and that's it. If the person is a chem professor it may or may not get mentioned. But as you now know that, what do you know about them? What does it say that they excelled in chemistry and took all those math and science classes, and went on to use it to be a professor rather than working in a lab?

There's a whole show on AMC called "Breaking Bad" about a high school chemistry professor, and believe me, that he's a chem professor is very important. It's important to his background, to his personality, to the whole plot line. A person may work at a McDonald's because they need the money, not because they've any interest in fast food. But if they become a chemistry professor, that takes years of study and work. That's a profession, a career, and they decided on it. It interested them for some reason, and they had to be good at it.

So be aware of what professions you give characters and what that says about them--their personality, their motivations, their wants, needs, drives and the way they think.

Yes?

Edited to add: And by the way, it makes no earthly sense that the Chem professor looks like a bodybuilder. He can work out and have a good body, but that kind of body requires hours of gym time; Chem professors don't have the time to that. Either he's a body builder, or a chem professor. Oh, and even if you happen to know a body-building chemistry professor...keep this mantra in mind: "Truth is stranger than fiction." Don't ever write up any character that is hard to believe even if you've got a real-life example of them. I can believe a chem professor who stays in shape and cares about his body. I find it hard to believe a chem professor with all those extras you've given him. Pile too much on a character and they become outrageous.

So WHAT is the important part of this character? Decide that, his essence, and then you'll know what he does for a living, what he would naturally do because it's his passion and interest. Would someone that deeply into bodybuilding, sports, cigars and such really end up teaching chemistry at a college? Why? Where is the interest in chemistry in his real life? Where are the science magazines and collection of antique chemistry flasks?

See what I mean?

 

[Stella_Omega]

3113, the chem prof is a dyke.

I like what you've started with. I like Steph, with her unconventional looks and hobbies-- and I can imagine quite a lot of her character from those things. She's built like a truck, and doesn't shave her body; this means that people notice her, and I bet she gets a lot of double-takes. people say; "is that a boy or a girl?" And I bet it pisses her off sometimes. But I bet she was pissed off long before she started body-building. I bet she has butch attitude that won't quit.

Amanda is a runner, but nothing like as competitive as her wife. Does Steph's attitude get on her nerves sometimes? Does she snap and tell Steph to knock it off-- and how is the make-up sex?

What age are these people? The things that their looks tell us change depending on their ages. Todd is a bear, evidently-- going commando is kindaremarkable for a younger man, but someone past middle age might have simply done so all his life...

The bare facts you've given us are suggestive of a lot of possibilities. But it
s the possibilities that are going to make your story interesting.

 

[NoJo]

In fiction, a character's physical traits are actually the least important thing about them. What really interests a reader are their character and personality, not whether they have armpit hair or work in the equities field. It's character that drives a story, not appearance.

Thanks for pre-empting a torrent of scalding, withering sarcasm

 

[dirtyriceking]

Hi Stella

Thanx for your thoughts. My characters, (same academic year) all become friends during HS and live into their 90's. Todd goes "commando" once he starts doing his own laundry (14 or so), Steph transitions to boxer-briefs and wife-beaters (under dress shirts) around the same time. Steph played football and hockey growing up, so she's a workout warrior.

 

[3113]

3113, the chem prof is a dyke.

My bad! Well. That makes all the difference. Of course a body-building dyke who smokes cigars would be a chem professor!

 

[cloudy]

Steph played football and hockey growing up, so she's a workout warrior.

Um, where did she play football? Most hs programs won't allow girls, and powderpuff football isn't what I think you have in mind.

I'm with Dr. M. No one really cares that she played football, or works out, or has a tattoo on her wrist - that's all superficial outward appearance. As a reader, I could really give a rat's ass what someone looks like, or what sports they play unless it tells me something about how her mind works. So far, she sounds like what someone who hasn't seen much imagines all butch lesbians to be like. She would be more interesting if she wasn't a cartoonish stereotype.

Show the reader how she reacts to situations, how she relates to her girlfriend, to her friends, how she handles a crisis, what hurts her soul, and what makes it sing.

 

[dirtyriceking]

cloudy, ever hear of Title IX?

BTW, I already stipulated that I'm a bad beginner. ITA, the info is really extemporaneous (sp?). Merely a starting point.

 

[cloudy]

BTW, I already stipulated that I'm a bad beginner. ITA, the info is really extemporaneous (sp?). Merely a starting point.

Of course I have. Regardless of Title IX, how many grown women ever played full contact football in high school? How many do you know?

Zero....that's what I thought.

Forgive the hell out of me for trying to help. Mea culpa.

 

[dirtyriceking]

not zero

certainly not 1000's, but I'd guess 100 nationwide. BTW, she plays in an all woman league called the International Woman's Football League. (never mentioned b4, my bad).

 

[NoJo]

I really think you need to learn the difference between fictional characters and Pokemon cards

 

[Stella_Omega]

certainly 1000's, but I'd guess 100 nationwide. BTW, she plays in an all woman league called the International Woman's Football League. (never mentioned b4, my bad).

let's not get into an argument about title IX or how many women played full contact football in real life.

This is a work of fiction. Your characters have to be believable in the fictional world you create for them. If you can make contact football seem like something normal within your story-- that's all that matters.

If her playing football is a really important element in your story, you can explain how there are a few hundred women who actually play in an actual league that most of your readers have never heard of-- if you have more important fish to fry, let it go.

 

[cloudy]

I really think you need to learn the difference between fictional characters and Pokemon cards

Exactly. Thank you.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

I really think you need to learn the difference between fictional characters and Pokemon cards

Hey! You've been pre-empted. Now stay empted, would you?

Thanx for your thoughts. My characters, (same academic year) all become friends during HS and live into their 90's. Todd goes "commando" once he starts doing his own laundry (14 or so), Steph transitions to boxer-briefs and wife-beaters (under dress shirts) around the same time. Steph played football and hockey growing up, so she's a workout warrior.

Into their 90's?? Is that relevant for the story? Sounds like you're getting ready to write a trans-generational saga. (Or just setting the stage for some hot geriatric porn.)

But seriously, these few lines tell us more about your characters than all that wanted-poster stuff. But I worry with Cloudy that you're dealing in stereotypes here, and what we've got is the stereotype of a gay male couple and femme and butch lesbians. (Let me guess-- They get together for some mate-swapping?)

I'm not going to tell you not to use stereotypes. There are times when you want stereotypes, especially in porn. But there are such things as characters and then there are such things as caricatures, and you don't want to confuse the two. You really want these characters to be motivated by what they feel on the inside, not by what you impose from the outside because all gay guys or bitch dykes "always" act that way.

 

[dirtyriceking]

thanks for that

Yes Doc, this does become a saga. Need your help to avoid imposing the outside cliches on them.

 

[CWatson]

dirtyriceking, I'd like to set a challenge to you:

As several people have mentioned before, the physical aspects of a character are by far the least important details of their characterization. In fact, it's entirely possible for you to just leave those things blank and let personality fill in the details. If I tell you a girl has dark hair and pale skin, and also that she's quite shy and almost flees like a deer when the main characters sit down to talk to her (much less the person she's actually attracted to), which told you more about how she looks? I repeat, which told you more about how she looks? The personality sentence did, because our culture enforces certain stereotypes which we writers can employ (or defy) in our writing. Because--in writing at least (and in life to a lesser degree)--personality is appearance.

But, at the moment, everybody's dickering about the details, and what that means is that we're going at it from the wrong direction. If the details don't make sense, it's because they don't have a skeleton to hang off of. So, my challenge to you, DRK, is to give us a new set of paragraphs, one per character. In these paragraphs, say nothing about your character's appearance. Instead, summarize their life, from birth to death--the important choices they faced, the traumas they suffered, their favorite compliments, the way they feel about whatever bodies they were given... Tell us who they are. Tell us about their souls. Tell us who they are as people, not bodies.

After all, you're not writing a story about bodies, but about people. (Well, unless it's a murder mystery. But even then. )

 

[cloudy]

dirtyriceking, I'd like to set a challenge to you:

As several people have mentioned before, the physical aspects of a character are by far the least important details of their characterization. In fact, it's entirely possible for you to just leave those things blank and let personality fill in the details. If I tell you a girl has dark hair and pale skin, and also that she's quite shy and almost flees like a deer when the main characters sit down to talk to her (much less the person she's actually attracted to), which told you more about how she looks? I repeat, which told you more about how she looks? The personality sentence did, because our culture enforces certain stereotypes which we writers can employ (or defy) in our writing. Because--in writing at least (and in life to a lesser degree)--personality is appearance.

But, at the moment, everybody's dickering about the details, and what that means is that we're going at it from the wrong direction. If the details don't make sense, it's because they don't have a skeleton to hang off of. So, my challenge to you, DRK, is to give us a new set of paragraphs, one per character. In these paragraphs, say nothing about your character's appearance. Instead, summarize their life, from birth to death--the important choices they faced, the traumas they suffered, their favorite compliments, the way they feel about whatever bodies they were given... Tell us who they are. Tell us about their souls. Tell us who they are as people, not bodies.

After all, you're not writing a story about bodies, but about people. (Well, unless it's a murder mystery. But even then. )

That's exactly what we've all been trying to tell him, but some people ask for help, and then don't like the answers they're given.

*shrug*