Grassroots Discussion, 9-12-04, by "impressive"

[Pure]

Two Down
As I'm stuck on a story in development, I figured now would be a good time to throw something out for review/discussion. I'm using the time to go back over my older submissions with an eye to improve them. In the year since my first story was published, I've grown (I hope) considerably as a writer. While I have no aspirations to write professionally, I do want to continue to improve. Thus, I'd like to have the story I consider my weakest dissected.

The story is entitled Two Down and it is located at:

http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=108599

{link fixed, I hope}

 

[Varian P]

broken link

The link above appears to be broken. Hopefully this will work:

Two Down

 

[impressive]

Beat me to it! Thanks, Varian. I was just about to post.

 

[Lying Eyes]

Nice short story, but I have to say it was just too short. Normaly something this short I usually asume is written by a man since that usually suits male readers while female writers usually create something much longer. But either for a male or female reader I think the length of this piece is too brief for most. My guess is its not even half a literotica page, around 3500 words can fit on a normal page. I would think some readers would just be starting to get warmed up and then disapointed that it is already over.

Just a couple of older women having coffee. They appeared to be about 20 years older than me, maybe a little less. One tall and dark, the other petite and fair. Both with the type of curves that really get me going. I can't stand stick thin women. No ass. No tits.

I'm not a big fan of stick thin women either so a little discription of their clothes clinging to those womanly curves would be appreciated

I lined up four of those huge trash cans nearby in order to replace the liner bags, and I was taking my good old time. From where I stood, I could clearly hear their naughty conversation, but they could only see me from the waist up.

I think more of the coversatation the women were having should of been written in. It would of helped build up the sexual tension the character and many readers would build up before the actual sex scene.

I could tell they were turned on by the conversation,

How could he tell?

The fair haired one – whose named turned out to be Liza – was providing a blow by blow (yeah, pun intended) description of an iced job she'd recently given.

I think a more in depth blow by blow (good pun) account would of been apreciated by readers. Though the thought of the "ice job" and using her teeth made me cringe, sounds a little too uncomfortable for my tastes.

Liza starts chatting with me about life in general while her pal is giving me the best head I've ever received. What a mouth! To anyone passing by, we looked totally ordinary. No one could see what was going on behind the trash cans. But I was having considerable trouble carrying on a coherent conversation.

Pity you didn't actual write the "normal" converation. This set up could of been quite funny. You could have had other customers looking nearby or even his boss within view glancing at him confused while he is trying to not look like anything is out of the ordinary but he can barely keep his composure. This would also help build up some tension in the story as he is trying to not get caught and risk his job.

I looked across the food court, and I could see my supervisor walking our way with a thunderous expression on his face.

This at the very end hints that his job was at risk, I think it would of been much better if their was more hints early on that he was so close to being caught.

 

[Varian P]

Impressive,

Since you’ve invited a dissection with an eye toward improving an older story, perhaps I’ll stick to the things I think might be improved.

I gather, based on various factors, that this is essentially meant to be a basic stroke story—a quick encounter where everyone gets their jollies in under a page. For that to work for me, I think what I’d need is juicier description of everything that’s going on sexually.

How does his hand feel around his cock as he’s there eavesdropping in the food court? Is he nervous he’ll be caught? Does that turn him on?

Or this passage:

Liza starts chatting with me about life in general while her pal is giving me the best head I've ever received. What a mouth!

To anyone passing by, we looked totally ordinary. No one could see what was going on behind the trash cans. But I was having considerable trouble carrying on a coherent conversation. All of a sudden, Karen replaces her mouth with her hand, pulling my balls away from my body. She sure knew how to prolong the pleasure! I had been just about to come.

The best head of his whole life, and really we only got two sentences about it. For this kind of story, I think you should give a very detailed description of just how it feels when her tongue, her lips, her mouth move over his cock. Does he look down and see her looking up at him? See his cock disappearing into her mouth? What does she do that makes it the best head a guy who fucks 3 times a week ever experienced? The people want to know!

Same goes for all the naughtiness—more detail, please, on just what is being touched how, and how it feels.

As for the prose, I found it rather flat (and having glimpsed at your other writing, I agree that you’ve improved a great deal). For starters, looking at the intro paragraph:

I came to town about a month ago to take classes at the community college. I decided to get a part-time job at the mall Food Court for a little extra cash. I figured it'd help me meet lots of people, from all walks of life. Plus, the mall has an awesome fitness center that is kept open after hours just for mall employees. Staying in shape is very important to me. Not that I'm vain or anything. I just want to remain healthy and feeling good. Plus, sex can be a vigorous activity – especially certain positions. I don't want to be petering out (yeah, pun intended) in the middle of some serious fucking.

“I came…” “I decided…” “I just want…” “I don’t want…”

I think this paragraph would be immensely improved with a little attention to varying sentence structure. Also, it’s just a bit dry. No vivid images, no action, no emotions. I do think you’re developing a voice for the narrator, so I wonder if you could throw in a bit of color here and there by giving him a bit more personality (though I’m on thin ice here—goodness knows I’m no master of voice). For example:

“Not that I'm vain or anything” could be, “Not that I’m one of those pretty boys,” or something to that effect—a little more individualized in his language, and perhaps showing us some of his attitude (whatever it is). This would also clue us in to the narrator’s sex before we know he has a hard on (petering out is a hint, but I’m a bit dense for such subtlety).

Ditto these sentences:
Plus, the mall has an awesome fitness center…

Does he check out the sweaty hotties when he’s at the fitness center? Maybe he stakes out a spot by a particular machine that affords him a good view of his favorite body part. Or does he watch the game while he spends an hour on the treadmill? Somehow I doubt it (which means I have a feel for his character).

Staying in shape is very important to me.

You do personalize this in the following sentences, but this line is one I’ve seen before, and it sort of raises a cliché flag for me. You could make it a little funny, with a line about how he’s got to keep his abs tight for the hunnies, or since he’s not vain and is in it for the health and stamina, you could cut out that line and just cut to the benefits of a regular workout.

I think you got a little more out of your narrator here:

I don't want to be petering out (yeah, pun intended) in the middle of some serious fucking.

More on voice (apparently my latest obsession). Would the narrator really say:

Being the new hire, I was given the least desirable duties

Or would he say

“Being the new hire, I got stuck with the crappiest jobs.”

Would he say “naughty” conversation, or “nasty” conversation?

All that said, I think you did a fairly good job with the voice. I also think that while your choice of locale calls for some suspension of disbelief, it was good fun imagining the food court janitor having a frolic right there among the early arriving, unsuspecting shoppers. Makes me think that I haven’t been looking for fun in the right places when I go to the mall.

I hope that’s at least a wee bit helpful!

-Varian

 

[impressive]

Thank you, Lying Eyes and VarianP, for taking the time to review my very first Lit story.

I agree totally with EVERYTHING you've said.

Funny, I intentionally stayed away from this thread yesterday -- fearing the worst. But I needn't have.

You've given me some great ideas, which I WILL incorporate when I start editing.

It's true that this was only intended to be a bit of stroke -- and almost a "Can I do this writing thing?" experiment.

Thanks for pointing out that I have improved over the last year. That means a lot to me.

Back to work ...

 

[GingerV]

Hi. I don't know the rules on posting feedback here. I've been lurking on the board for ages hoping to see if you needed to sign up to review as well as to be reviewed, but it doesn't seem to be forthcoming. The rules at the top just scared me . So I've decided to just jump in with both feet. I don't know if mine is the sort of review you're looking for, I'll appologise if it isn't…and outright delete if I'm told I shouldn't be here at all. I know my experience is much more geared to helping the inexperienced, as it were.

Having said that, though here you go. Free thoughts from the desk of Ginger.

If this is your worst, I wish my worst lived up to its standard! There were a couple of images in there I really liked. The idea of him jacking off behind the blasted trash cans (about which much more later) was effective, and I liked the idea of him sneaking closer to hear just a little more.

Maybe it's just me, but your narrator comes across as somewhat self-involved and a bit shallow. I think the self-interest is intentional, it's possibly inevitable as he spends most of the story talking about himself and describing his own reactions. The shallowness, that's almost certainly due to the one-dimensionality of the characters. All of them. I know you don't have a lot of space to flesh them out, but they're conveying about as much internal life as porn stars. That's great, if it's the internal world you MEANT this guy to have. If what I'm saying comes as a shock…one of us has seriously screwed up. But I guess that given the incredibly confident description of his sexual prowess we got up front, it was inevitable I was going to think he was a bit of a prick.

But having gotten yourself a convincingly sex-obsessed guy, you don't play with it. He doesn't do anything that surprises or shocks us. He, instead, sits back and journalistically reports the encounter with a couple of "oh MAN, it was good" editorials. I know I sound like I don't like your narrator, and while I wouldn't want to date him…I LOVE that you got me to dislike him so quickly. USE that. Tell me what he's thinking that makes him different from the nice guys I usually imagine, challenge me to be turned on by his overconfidence. Do something that makes his actions inform his character. Cause what you do seem to have him doing is hiding a lot. The contrast between the brash dude at the beginning who takes a job for the gym privledges and is "accustomed" (SO dismissive a word, so casual, conveying a sense that he feels he deserves that much action) to sex on tap, and the guy in the funny hat hiding behind the trash cans is one hell of a dissonance. It makes me feel like he's all mouth and no trousers. Part of the reason I'm dissing him now, I think. You've rendered him unworthy of respect. Possibly your intent…but if so, I'd have played with THAT. Let the women prick that ego a bit, instead of stroking it at the first opportunity.

I think there are LOADS of places this can go, and that's largely because I think the character breathes. I just don't think you gave him the script he deserves.

Other random things…the women. If he's the egotistical asshole I think he is, I totally understand why they aren't fleshed out more than that they were in fact fleshy (not sticks). I like that they aren't rail thin, but without venturing into the trite (the blonde had legs that went on for miles, and tits that must've cost a packet), is there any way to make them more than walking mouths and cunts? What would your narrator have cared about, what would HE have focussed on? Maybe you've already given me that…in which case, I'm right and he is a shallow son-of-a-pup. But wouldn't even shallow sons-of-pups notice more than hair colour? You can't tell me what they think or feel (and you try to at one point…"I thought she was going to scream"…why? What made you think that?), but you can tell me what he thinks and feels about them.

And that's more than enough from me on content. If I haven't made myself clear, it's hopeless now .

Stylistically, you're not making a lot of actual errors. And first person makes it hard to know what's voice, and what's unintentional awkwardness. But I'll let you know where my knee-jerk, "rewrite" flags came up in case you're interested. If you don't want tips on the sentences as well as the subject…skip what's coming, it's gonna piss you off.

I came to town about a month ago to take classes at the community college. I decided to get a part-time job at the mall Food Court for a little extra cash. I figured it'd help me meet lots of people, from all walks of life.

I hate to start right off the bat, but classically starting sentences the same way over does chop the flow and can be an indication that two or more, in this case, can be effectively combined. If this was intentional, I don't get a sense of hammering or escalation that would make it work for you. If that was what you were going for, maybe they weren't repetitive enough?

Plus, the mall has an awesome fitness center that is kept open after hours just for mall employees.

In fact, the whole first paragraph reads choppy to me. Part of the reason I think I may be stepping on style toes. But as each bit seems to be a different problem, I'm breaking it up. This time, I think the problem might just be passive voice. "Plus, the mall keeps its awesome fitness center open after hours for employees," might work better. Or "Plus, the mall has an awesome after hours employee fitness center," if that doesn't chop it too short for you.

Staying in shape is very important to me. Not that I'm vain or anything. I just want to remain healthy and feeling good. Plus, sex can be a vigorous activity – especially certain positions. I don't want to be petering out (yeah, pun intended) in the middle of some serious fucking.

Short punchy sentences. Good things. If it wasn't all of them. Which kind of dulls their impact. Had a writing prof tell me you don't win a boxing match with nothing but jabs.

As I worked, I was fondly remembering my last sexual encounter – which took place just before I left my home town. I am accustomed to having sex several times a week.

And all of a sudden the voice pulls a switch. Still choppy, but the first two sentences sound almost supercilious. All of a sudden we've gone from semi-shallow college kid, to upper class twit. Or at least I have. I'm guessing, and correct me if I'm wrong, that you're not writing in your own voice in this piece? "Fondly" and "accustomed" just don't read true for the voice in the last paragraph, and may be bits of you leaking through. Or, I'm totally off base, in which case…you need MORE of those words in the introduction, because at least this reader didn't get a good idea of who she was reading about. Of which, more next.

So, there I was – doing my job with a raging hard on that would not subside.

Ah ha! "I'm" male. I'd honest to God guessed wrong up to this point. I just got criticised for this myself on my last story…I now get how big a speed bump it can be. If I'm the only one, maybe you should blow it off. I personally HATE self revelatory introductions. I've gone back through the beginning, and can't at the moment see where it could have been made more obvious. Quite possibly it's a non-issue.

My uniform was tight to begin with, so my arousal was very obvious.

Gonna feed my pet peeve now (one of many, I'm afraid). I understand that all sorts of sins get committed in pursuit of voice, but does it have to be "very." If obvious aint the right word, very isn't gonna help me figure out how obvious is wrong. It's not something you use a lot, so I'm guessing it's not done intentionally.

Just a couple of older women having coffee. They appeared to be about 20 years older than me, maybe a little less.

I'm gonna quit apologising for critiquing what might be intentional style. If sentence one contains little more than an antecedent, and sentence two begins with a pronoun or "it"…odds are all you did was put in a period for a breath. It's repetitious, by nature…and makes things sound choppy. Better than the sentences that just won't end, admittedly; but you've got me hypersensitized to choppy in this one.

I can't stand stick thin women. No ass. No tits.

Now here I think the style is working for you. This is great.

They were talking about giving head! That is not what I needed to hear if I wanted to calm down!

I think it's a mistake to punctuate both sentences with exclamation points. It takes away the emphasis.

Still, I couldn't stop myself from inching closer to eavesdrop.

I'm sure there's a name for the problem that I just can't think of right now. It's not precisely passive voice, it's not "be" verbs you're salting your prose with. But I think the whole thing would flow better with fewer prepositions. "Still, I couldn't stop myself inching closer to eavesdrop."

I lined up four of those huge trash cans nearby in order to replace the liner bags, and I was taking my good old time.

And again: "I lined up four huge trash cans nearby, taking my good old time replacing the liner bags."

The seemed oblivious to anything going on around them.

Not a style point, but I there were so few typos I don't want to do another section. Don’t know if you want this sort of critique, but…they, not the.

The fair haired one – whose named turned out to be Liza – was providing a blow by blow (yeah, pun intended) description of an iced job she'd recently given.

Now this confuses me, cause I think I really ought to be liking the reference to the earlier part of the work. I think that it's putting me off because it's the second parenthetical aside (effectively) in that sentence. You're breaking it up too much. Could you chuck Liza's name into the dialogue somewhere instead of trying to do it all at once?

"I just took a mouthful of crushed ice and a mouthful of Kevin," she said. "Now he's typically quiet, but he let out a moan that nearly woke the kids!"

I think you stole your own thunder there, having warned me ice was coming.

By this time, I was in pain.

Someone else check me on this, but that's a comma splice, right? It isn't needed?

There was no one else nearby, and the trash cans were blocking me from the waist down.

You literally JUST told us a sentence or two ago that you were blocked from the waist down. I don't think you need to repeat the fact, and using the same words really blows it (crumby pun not intended).

The other woman gave a sexy chuckle. "Yes, that will turn just about any man into a noise maker! Have you ever used your teeth?"

It's been a while since the first one spoke, "the other woman" seems like a vague descriptor. You specified the blonde before, could you say something concrete like "the brunette" here?

That did it! She had an incredible looking mouth with full lips, and just the thought of her teeth lightly raking my shaft made a low groan escape from my lips.

"Made" seems like a weak verb here. A wasted opportunity. "From my lips" also seems out of place. Where else was I supposed to think his groan was coming from?

I turned away quickly, just as both women looked toward me with surprised expressions.

Too much turning going on. I suppose one of them could spin…but I think it'd be better to just say the women looked toward "me". If turning is necessary in the geography of the reader's mind, they'll include it.

"My name's Karen," said the brunette. "We couldn't help noticing your – um, dilemma. Can we help?"

I think you use hyphens like I use ellipses, something to chuck in when you don't know what else to use. Not a big problem altogether, but here is seems out of place.

To anyone passing by, we looked totally ordinary. No one could see what was going on behind the trash cans.

Enough with the trashcans, already! It’s a short story. A very short story. Unless you're writing for Alzheimer's patients…assume we remember why no-body can see. I don't know about anyone else, but being reminded of them brings a smell to mind that's a turn off all by itself.

But I was having considerable trouble carrying on a coherent conversation.

I love the alliteration. Please leave it right where it is, even if "considerable" and "coherent" sound like the wrong voice.

All of a sudden, Karen replaces her mouth with her hand, pulling my balls away from my body. She sure knew how to prolong the pleasure! I had been just about to come.

I think it's forgivable in a retelling like this, but technically "replaces" is a tense shift.

Just then, Liza swooned and grabbed my arm. It was then I realized that Karen's head was under Liza's skirt.

A better example of what I meant about sentences starting with "it." Usually it's a flag that you can do better, possibly but not always combining them.

She was almost my height with a sparkle in her eyes that promised incomparable pleasure.

Lovely…but is it the this kid?

Liza was struggling to get my cock entirely into her small mouth, and I was struggling to keeping my balance. I wanted to pump into her. The pressure was building.

Here, again, I think the short punches work well. You feel pressure building because of the sentence structure.

As my hands returned to Karen's pussy, then encountered Liza's hands.

Technically it's a fragment. Don't know why word isn't flagging it. There's no real subject…as your hands returned…what?

I looked across the food court, and I could see my supervisor walking our way with a thunderous expression on his face. Liza, still on her knees, was busily putting everyone's clothes back in order. Then, just before my supervisor rounded those trash cans, she dumped her purse on the ground.

OK, I'm going to admit that the trashcans are well placed here…but you don't need to use the word "supervisor" twice.

Karen and I immediately bent down to help her pick up her belongings, with Liza profusely thanking me for being so helpful and Karen telling my supervisor what a great employee he'd just hired.

"With" seems out of place. "Profusely" seems out of voice.

He just glanced from one of us to the other, knowing something had transpired, but not quite grasping what it was.

You knew I was going to flag up "transpired", right? It's actually damned hard to write for someone who can't or shouldn't have our vocabulary.

Then, before I could say more, they were gone. "Get back to work," my supervisor ordered.

I don't like the last three words. And to my shame and frustration, I can't explain why. Maybe because, in then end, what has been a consistently self-absorbed, self-referential point of view ended with something someone else said? Or maybe I'm making that up. Whatever's wrong with it, it reads weak to me.

And that's it. If you're still reading, bless you. I want to repeat that I think you did some things really really well. I don't think I made enough of them at the start. But if I spent a lot of time telling you what I thought you could improve on, believe it's because I WANT to see this again. You made me care enough to complain there wasn't more, and that's an achievement.

Now, I'm going to read the other review to see how off base I am about this story. And then I intend to run off and hide lest my sort of review isn't what's wanted or welcomed here.

G

 

[GingerV]

Thought about it again while walking to work...

I think Lying Eyes is right, more of the conversations you obliquely referenced would've been fantastic. And they might provide a point of contrast? What he thinks about what they're saying vs what they actually are saying? Just a thought.

Also, there was something early on in the story about his daydreaming about a past encounter. I meant to say above that it left me kind of cold. I either wanted to know more about it, to understand why it was arousing....or nothing at all. I don't think it's important that he CAME to the eavesdropping erect already.

Now I really am gonna walk away. Promise .

G

 

[impressive]

If you're still reading, bless you.

OF COURSE I'm still reading! You have an incredible knack for pointing out flaws without making the writer feel small and inadequate. I noticed the same in other reviews you've written for the other feedback forum. I wish I had that ability!

Thank you so much for the very detailed critique.

Even with my clumsy character development, you nailed my male character as a "shallow" -- but not a full blown "prick." I wanted him to be confident (and not necessarily unjustly so) yet surprised and kinda humbled by two lusty older women -- and you've given me some great ideas for pursuing that.

The ladies, undoubtedly, need more depth.

The repetitive sentence structure -- especially at the beginning -- does suck and WILL be corrected.

All in all, I'm tickled that you feel it's worth fixing. I was actually prepared to scuttle the story altogether.

All the best,

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Well, I certainly hope your writing has improved, because this one left me totally cold. This isn’t porn, this is just a sex story.

This was a story written as you might tell it to a friend. The writing is okay as far as it goes—no obvious spelling or punctuation errors, although see below--but it’s all very “She did this and I did that. Then she did this and it felt great! She came and then I came.” Very tell-y and not show-y at all. There are no visual or emotional details, no characterization, and the things that do happen are implausible enough to strain even a willing reader’s credulity. A guy cleaning trashcans in a food court suddenly whips out his cock and starts masturbating because he overhears a conversation? Two women go down on him the food court for no reason other than they saw his cock?

Porn works on a lot of levels, but one of the first things it has to do is paint a scene in vivid colors. That scene might be visual or it might be emotional, but it needs those kind of details that bring it to life in our minds. That’s why we’re always told to show and not tell. There’s just nothing sexy about saying “She gave me head and it was great.” There is something sexy about painting a picture of the way she closed her eyes and opened her mouth, the way her tongue reached for you, and the way she hummed in pleasure as she licked the drop of pre-cum from the tip of your cock. Concrete sensual detail. It’s the foundation of porn.

Your beginning paragraph is awkward, but that seems to be common in all stories. We all have trouble with lift-off. But I don’t understand why you had to present this scene in flashback. It’s not like anything interesting was happening in the present that we were going to come back to. The real story starts with him overhearing the women’s conversation, so why not start it there? That might have helped with the sense of immediacy and taken us into the action rather than just having your narrator tell us about something that happened in the past.

You have trouble with jumps in verb tense. You’re writing in past tense, then when the sex begins you jump to present tense and then back again. Confusing.

Here’s an excerpt:

To anyone passing by, we looked totally ordinary. No one could see what was going on behind the trash cans. But I was having considerable trouble carrying on a coherent conversation. All of a sudden, Karen replaces her mouth with her hand, pulling my balls away from my body. She sure knew how to prolong the pleasure! I had been just about to come.

Just then, Liza swooned and grabbed my arm. It was then I realized that Karen's head was under Liza's skirt.

There’s your tense shift: “But I was having…” then “Karen replaces…” Of was that just a typo? And out of 5 sentences in the first para, only 1 is about the sex. The second paragraph gives the impression that he was so out of what was going on that he didn’t even notice Karen fumbling around getting her head under Liza’s skirt. Surely he would have seen or felt this.

That may seem like nit-picking, but porn is made of exactly these kind of nits. We have to believe that the narrator really experienced what he’s telling us about. We want to share that experience, see what he saw and feel what he felt. From this story it looks like you can write okay, you just have to focus more on what’s going on and find a way to describe that puts us in the story there with you. Give us the juice and the concrete sensual details, and you’ll be okay.

---dr.M.

Having read the other reviews now:

Yeah, I had trouble with this guy's character too. He came across to me as shallow and self-absorbed, and I didn't especially like him. A little self-deprecatory wit and less self-congratulation would have helped. He comes across too much like the usual Literotica 6'2" 190 lb stud who works out three times a week.

Also, I too didn't know the narrator's gender until he popped a woody. A simple "I'm the kind of guy who..." or telling us how he liked to look at the women there would have taken care of that.

Biggest problem for me though was still the flatness of the prose and the improbability of the encounter.

I also want to say that, just as Ginger's alarms go off when she sees the word "very", my hackles go up whenever I see an exclamation point in a narrative. It tells me that the author maybe doesn't have the skill to make an important statement without flagging it with a bang mark. At it's worst it can dengenerate into the horrible mnultiple exclamation marks, at which point I immediately backclick out of there. I don't want a narrator hanging on my arm and shouting in my face. Say it with language, not punctuation.

 

[impressive]

We have to believe that the narrator really experienced what he’s telling us about. We want to share that experience, see what he saw and feel what he felt. From this story it looks like you can write okay, you just have to focus more on what’s going on and find a way to describe it in a way that puts us in there with you. Give us the juice and the concrete sensual details, and you’ll be okay.

---dr.M.

Yup - agree totally (which is why I want to re-work it). It's been an embarrassment to me since all subsequent publications, and I've been on the verge of pulling it several times. Yet, I don't want to just abandon it (kinda like a stray puppy). I think it has just (barely) enough redeeming qualities to merit the time it will take to edit.

Also agree on my verb tense teeter-totter. I struggle with that.

Thanks for taking the time to critique it. I appreciate it.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Yup - agree totally (which is why I want to re-work it). It's been an embarrassment to me since all subsequent publications, and I've been on the verge of pulling it several times. Yet, I don't want to just abandon it (kinda like a stray puppy). I think it has just (barely) enough redeeming qualities to merit the time it will take to edit.

Also agree on my verb tense teeter-totter. I struggle with that.

Thanks for taking the time to critique it. I appreciate it.

Well I’d really like to see you edit this story. As others have pointed out, you’ve got all sorts of hot and funny situations in there, and it seems like such a shame to waste them.

Look at these lines again, for instance:

To anyone passing by, we looked totally ordinary. No one could see what was going on behind the trash cans. But I was having considerable trouble carrying on a coherent conversation.

Now, I can just see this guy with his pants down around his ankles, his back ramrod straight, his knuckles white as he grabs onto the rim of the garbage can, trying to look natural while Karen goes down on him.

His eyes would be wide, flicking down to look at Karen’s lips on him, then up to look for customers, then down again. And what if Liza’s hand goes down to fondle his balls as she asks him, “So, what? Are you from around here? What do you study in school?”

Personally, I do a lot of my best writing during revisions. I guess it’s easier for me to see what’s wrong in a first draft than it is for me to get it right the first time. It’s good practice. I think this one deserves it.

---dr.M.

 

[Guest]

Keep in mind I am writing this without having read any of what the others have written. Also, this, like any other opinion I give is just that, my opinion of what I’d like to see done differently.

(1)Watch your tenses. You’re shifting between present and past. Generally you want to keep the story in the same tense. Obviously dialogue doesn’t apply to this.

(2)“was fondly remembering” is wordy… fondly remembered means the same thing (I’m guilty of doing this myself.)

(3)Even though you tell us you’re in a mall food court, you don’t do anything to make us feel as though we are there. Some descriptions about how it looks, how it smells, etc would help.

(4)I could tell they were turned on by the conversation. How? Were they breathing hard, face flushed, etc?

(5)“was aching”… ached works the same (this is something I struggle with fixing in my own writing) Since I’ve already mentioned this twice, I won’t again, but keep an eye on it. There are other areas where you do this when regular past tense works just fine. It’s probably more of a personal style preference, but I think it makes a story look more polished.

(4)I can’t see one woman just idly chatting while her friend gives a blow job in a public place. You have to give me a reason to suspend belief and there isn’t one. Also, if the garbage cans are lined and not circled around, or there isn’t something else blocking the view, there’s no way they’d be hidden from everyone walking by. Watch your details; visualize the scene in your mind.

(5)The whole blow job scene had the “slot A into tab B” feel. There was alot of telling but not alot of showing.

(6)I didn’t really get a feel for the main character outside the fact he was a horny young man.

This has the potential to be an extremely hot story, but it needs more detail and “showing” during the encounter.

 

[impressive]

This has the potential to be an extremely hot story, but it needs more detail and “showing” during the encounter.

Your take has been very similar to the others' -- and, again, I agree.

I'm actually starting to look forward to the rewrite!

Thanks, Lady and all.

 

[MLyons]

Hi there, Impressive.

I've only skimmed some of the other critiques. I am a bit perplexed, I suppose, as to why you would offer up what you feel to be your worst story for discussion. That's your perogative of course, but if you've improved since then, I would think it would be more useful and less frustrating (albeit perhaps more humbling) to hear opinions on what you feel is your best story, so that you can be sure that the comments recieved aren't going to be outdated, and covering topics that you feel you've vastly improved on since you wrote the story.

Anyway, whether you like it or not, I suppose, I didn't feel right about just reading "Two Down" and commenting solely on what I saw in that story. So I read several more of your stories to see if I could discern a pattern of tendencies or topics in your writing as a whole that I thought might warrant a critical eye. I also read the following: "30 Seconds", "Connecting", "Connecting Ch. 02", "Hog Wild Ride", and "It's all about Customer Service".

On the positive side, your language flows well. Your mechanics are just dandy, and it's clear that you know how to form thoughts on paper, and that when you decide to break the rules of grammar you're doing it on purpose. Aside from some things I'll mention below there is nothing there that arrests my eye and catches my attention in a bad way when I read your prose.

I respect the fact that you've consistently tried to stretch your legs with some unusual form and storytelling techniques that go beyond your average straightforward stroke story. I, myself, have tendencies that echo yours in the sense of intoducing a theme and then revisiting it, whether it's something as small as your revisitation of the "30 seconds" motif, or something more complex like the strange way you skirt the line of fantasy and reality in your "Connecting" stories. I'm not sure that what you attempt to do is successful all the time, or as impactful as you might hope it is, but I certainly love that you're mind is working that way. I do that as well, albeit in different ways, and I'm afraid I'm only marginally successful at it.

I think this kind of thing really does skirt a fine line when it comes to erotic stories. Judging from what I've read, I think of all the things that you've most improved on in your writing, this concentration on a larger motif, and more cohesive form is the aspect you've made the most progress with. "Two Down" is, in many ways, a very basic stroke story. It's simply an event that is written from beginning to end--a slice of life as it were. On the other extreme, "30 Seconds" and "Connecting" are a fair amount more complex in their presentation, and in several ways are more dynamic and interesting because of the way you've presented the stories, even if ultimately the events themselves aren't really any more meaningful than those in "Two Down".

One of the unfortunate things about your writing, I think (and what do I know--really?), is that your development as a writer of bringing out something really dynamic in terms of interaction between the characters, and REALLY bringing the reader into the action with a palpable tension that we can't ignore has not kept up with your development on presentation. At least, I think that's true.

Of course, now that I've said that I'm not sure how much help I'll be. Your stories, I'm afraid, are not really to my taste, and the primary reason for that is that there isn't enough character for me to grab a hold of. There isn't enough sense of "being there" for me to really feel the action, and this is not just true of "Two Down" it's true of all the stories that I read. In my humble opinion, and I could be wrong, the reason for this lies almost exclusively in your handling of exposition.

Here's a quote from "Two Down":

Staying in shape is very important to me. Not that I'm vain or anything. I just want to remain healthy and feeling good. Plus, sex can be a vigorous activity – especially certain positions. I don't want to be petering out (yeah, pun intended) in the middle of some serious fucking.

Being the new hire, I was given the least desirable duties – sweeping the floors, emptying the trash cans, and wiping down the tables. Mindless work that allowed my thoughts to wander.

As I worked, I was fondly remembering my last sexual encounter – which took place just before I left my home town. I am accustomed to having sex several times a week. It had been almost a month, and I was really feeling the strain. There's only so much relief one's own hands can provide. I needed human contact.

So, there I was – doing my job with a raging hard on that would not subside. My uniform was tight to begin with, so my arousal was very obvious. It was early, though, and there weren't many patrons. Just a couple of older women having coffee. They appeared to be about 20 years older than me, maybe a little less. One tall and dark, the other petite and fair. Both with the type of curves that really get me going. I can't stand stick thin women. No ass. No tits.

Compare that to a quote from "30 Seconds":

We're seated across from one another in the semicircular corner booth. Currently, there are four at our table, including the two of us, although that number has fluctuated throughout the evening, further frazzling the waiter. Oh, well. It's his job. We'll make sure he gets a handsome tip.

The talk turns to movie favorites, but I'm not really listening. I'm watching you. I'm watching your mouth, your hands, and your eyes. I'm thoroughly enjoying thoughts of just what you could do to me with each – and, conversely, what I'd like to do to you.

You have intrigued me since the moment we met, years ago. I feel this overwhelming desire to just be with you, in any context – in person or online, in dull committee meetings or lively social settings, in your thoughts or in my dreams. It's an ache that I am powerless to resist. You excite me, incite me, invite me, delight me. I can't get enough.

Both are part of the first 4 or 5 paragraphs of their respective stories, and both are so quick and dirty while trying to set up a great amount of need or tension right off the bat that the reader isn't given enough visceral information to really understand why there SHOULD be tension or excitement. We're told that the narrator in "Two Down" is horny, he's accostumed to getting lots of sex, and he has a hard on, but because we are TOLD this, rather than given some tell-tale details and indications and interactions that really help us to relate to why he has a hard on, or why he's so excited to jack off to these two women, the reader merely becomes an impartial observer. The same phenomenon happened to me in "30 seconds". I was dropped into the action so quickly that I barely had a chance to register why the narrator is so attracted and needful of this man. I simply have to take her word for it. Here's one more excerpt from the beginning of "Connecting Ch. 02":

By the time we arrived, the snow was nearly 3" deep and coming down steadily. Our place was the last one along the path, furthest from the lodge. We quickly went inside, stripping off our snow-covered outer wear and rubbing our hands together. The cabin had all the amenities, including a large hot tub and full kitchen. The fireplace had a huge stone hearth – with the requisite (faux) bear rug, even! You added another big log to the fire while I made some hot chocolate.

The anticipation in the air was so thick that you could’ve cut it with a knife. Sitting as close to the fire as we could get without singeing our eyebrows, we chatted amiably about inconsequential things while sipping the hot chocolate.

Again, as the reader, even though I've read all the fantasy that goes on in chapter one (which is from what I remember almost exclusively from the perspective of only one of the characters), I don't feel any of the "anticipation in the air". I'm simply told that it's there. I have no idea WHY it's there. I haven't really been shown.

Once we move beyond that point, the sex is interesting and fine, and it could be fantastic if I related at all to these characters, but I don't. If it's going to be pure stroke, in order to work for me, the sex has to be sizzlingly outstanding. What I mean, is that it has to include those tiny moments of reality, those visceral moments between two people who are engaging in this act that I can respond to as a fellow human, that "force my hand" as it were. The sex in your stories, of it's own doesn't have enough of that for me in order to stand on it's own.

On the other hand the sex in your stories is still quite good, but because I don't know the characters well enough, I can't relate at all to them when they DO have sex. I guess I would prefer it if your stories were.... mmmmm, not so much longer, but perhaps more developed. You seem to want to tell us real tales, with real people in somewhat extraordinary circumstances, and I'm ALL for it, but in order to really do that well, I think you need to really allow us to get into the characters' heads. Don't just tell us that they are sexual beings and attracted to each other, you must SHOW us that. And I'm certainly not saying that in order for "Two Down" to work it needs to be 3 Lit pages. I don't mean that in the slightest... it's just that you don't seem to be latching onto those tiny, econimical moments that reveal a character with so much more depth and clarity than simply telling us about them would.

For example, what is it that the narrator sees in the fair haired woman that turns him on? Is it the tendons in her forearms? The way her hair tickles across the back of her ear? What is he really seeing that he's responding to? What are they talking about, specifically? When was the last time he had sex, and how does he remember it? Was it good? Did HE get a blowjob? Was it disappointing? How is he integrating all these thoughts into the mundane work he's doing? Is he seeing his mop run along the floor, while he tries to hide the fact that he's getting glimpses of the brunette's legs under their table? Perhaps he's so frustrated with the hard ache in his pants that he has to stop mopping and try to compose himself--take deep breaths and get himself under control. I don't know. It's these things that are not only going to show off the details of these two women, but will also reveal volumes about the narrator's character at the same time--by concentrating not only on what he sees, but also on the reaction he has to what he sees and how it effects his responsibilities and the memories, or fantasies it might stir in his brain.

It's all there in your work. It's all just hidden under the surface of it. I just want to see the details--the microcosm of dymanics that you seem to be glossing over in order to move as fast as possible to the sex scenes. Really though, and I say this all the time, I could simply not be your audience. There are people who like short stories that depict a quick moment, without all the burdens of pages and pages of deeply developed character and such. And although I do have a tendency to enjoy more deeply developed stories than yours, I'll say again--because I think it's important--that I don't mean to suggest that your stories need to be super long. They don't even necessarily need to be longer at all--the focus just seems off to me, is all. They tell too much and don't show enough. Take a leap of faith in the reader that they will interpret those moments the way you intend. The story, no matter how simple or complex, should be told as much by what is left unsaid as what is said, I think--and in truth, it's much more effective that way.

Anyway, I hope this is helpful, and that you don't find it to be harsh. I don't intend it to be that way at all. You write very well, and you have a great sense of realism that I fear I will never have with my own work--and for that I am jealous. As always, ignore everything I say as you see fit, and take to heart only what you find useful and valid. I could be WAY off base with respect to your intentions... It certainly wouldn't be the first time.

I'm off to read what others had to say.

 

[impressive]

Thanks, M.

I am a bit perplexed, I suppose, as to why you would offer up what you feel to be your worst story for discussion.

Mostly because it's the most in need of resuscitation. The others are doing decently in the ratings -- with some very, very enthusiatic feedback. Add to that more than a bit of fear to have one that's very near & dear to me shredded. I really FEEL some of them -- unlike this one -- and they would HURT. I am so new at this that I have NOT developed a very thick skin.

Anyway, whether you like it or not, I suppose, I didn't feel right about just reading "Two Down" and commenting solely on what I saw in that story. So I read several more of your stories to see if I could discern a pattern of tendencies or topics in your writing as a whole that I thought might warrant a critical eye. I also read the following: "30 Seconds", "Connecting", "Connecting Ch. 02", "Hog Wild Ride", and "It's all about Customer Service".

Geez! Talk about getting one's bang for the buck. I appreciate your desire & willingness to compare/contrast.

I think this kind of thing really does skirt a fine line when it comes to erotic stories.

Undoubtedly. I am -- and probably always will be -- a niche writer. Those with whom my work resonates just slobber all over me in the feedback. The rest are lukewarm. That's fine with me.

"Two Down" is, in many ways, a very basic stroke story. It's simply an event that is written from beginning to end--a slice of life as it were.

Agreed.

On the other extreme, "30 Seconds" and "Connecting" are a fair amount more complex in their presentation, and in several ways are more dynamic and interesting because of the way you've presented the stories, even if ultimately the events themselves aren't really any more meaningful than those in "Two Down".

Disagree here. I feel very strongly that the events are much more meaningful. Where I've apparently missed is in effectively conveying that to you. I assure you that I intended it to be there. I felt it -- and quite a few readers have felt it -- but I'm obviously not "Connecting" (Ha!) with everyone.

One of the unfortunate things about your writing, I think (and what do I know--really?), is that your development as a writer of bringing out something really dynamic in terms of interaction between the characters, and REALLY bringing the reader into the action with a palpable tension that we can't ignore has not kept up with your development on presentation. At least, I think that's true.

Hmmmm. Possibly. I kinda think both have evolved considerably, but perhaps presentation moreso than character development.

Of course, now that I've said that I'm not sure how much help I'll be. Your stories, I'm afraid, are not really to my taste, and the primary reason for that is that there isn't enough character for me to grab a hold of. There isn't enough sense of "being there" for me to really feel the action, and this is not just true of "Two Down" it's true of all the stories that I read.

Part of that is intentional, but I readily admit room for improvement. I have left out many details (referring not so much to "Two Down" but to the other, more ethereal, stories) to challenge the reader to insert fantasy of choice. Maybe I've asked too much from the reader.

... and both are so quick and dirty while trying to set up a great amount of need or tension right off the bat that the reader isn't given enough visceral information to really understand why there SHOULD be tension or excitement.

Ditto the above. I have made a huge assumption, I suppose, that most folks come here with some serious levels of their own personal tension. Rather that beat them over the head with it, I opted to treat it as a given. It's certainly something I'll keep in mind in the future!

And I'm certainly not saying that in order for "Two Down" to work it needs to be 3 Lit pages. I don't mean that in the slightest... it's just that you don't seem to be latching onto those tiny, econimical moments that reveal a character with so much more depth and clarity than simply telling us about them would.

Most definitely true of "Two Down."

It's all there in your work. It's all just hidden under the surface of it. I just want to see the details--the microcosm of dymanics that you seem to be glossing over in order to move as fast as possible to the sex scenes.

Again, dancing that fine line (for me) of just how much to lead the reader. How much is TOO much? How little is TOO little? "Two Down" has undoubtedly too little. I'm comfortable with the others. They're not perfect, by a long shot, and I may someday revisit them -- but they're definitely not an embarrassment to me.

Anyway, I hope this is helpful, and that you don't find it to be harsh.

Very helpful and not harsh at all. THANK YOU!

 

[BlackShanglan]

Trotting blind ...

I am starting out replying without reading other replies. Personally, I found it helpful when others did this with my story - it helped me to see what issues bothered more than one reader. I'll post notes here first, then try to catch up on what others have said.

The first paragraph is interesting. I like the voice - straightforward, appealingly simple and unpretentious. It's probably just my personal thing that I'm not a big fan of sex as "just sex" or as a leisure activity; for me, the emotional and psychological ramifications are more interesting. For that reason, I'm aware from the start that the speaker and I would not agree on some things, and I am a little put off. However, I think this largely a visceral reaction; I can't see that it makes it bad writing, just not my personal preference. I think it's fine, too, for letting the reader know up front who the speaker is and what the reader should expect from the story.

However, the trend that develops from here continues to divorce my interest from the speaker. This paragraph, for example, gave me some difficulties:

As I worked, I was fondly remembering my last sexual encounter – which took place just before I left my home town. I am accustomed to having sex several times a week. It had been almost a month, and I was really feeling the strain. There's only so much relief one's own hands can provide. I needed human contact.

Again, I don't wish to confuse what I like in a story with what constitutes good literature, and I urge you to go with what you are trying to achieve. If, however, you wish to achieve depth and resonance with the character, this paragraph poses some obstacles. The speaker's approach to sex appears largely mechanical. It should occur within a specified frequency, ideally within parameters that include another warm body. It's a rather distant, clinical description of his sex life, which makes it difficult to establish empathy with the character. It's not just that there is no sense of intellectual or emotional connection; I don't actually feel a sense of physical pleasure either. I'd like to hear more about what the reader likes about sex or the sensations he associates with it; as it is, it doesn't come across that differently to saying "I like to have the car lubed and serviced every six months, preferably at EZLube."

They appeared to be about 20 years older than me, maybe a little less. One tall and dark, the other petite and fair. Both with the type of curves that really get me going. I can't stand stick thin women. No ass. No tits.

There were some points here where minor grammatical or stylistic choices niggled a bit, but this is a great use of broken diction. I like the swift, appraising glance that this sentence structure nicely encapsulates. I don't get a great sense of emotion out of the character, but I do get a great sense of how he encounters these women - a quick, measuring look that touches on the details important to him.

"I just took a mouthful of crushed ice and a mouthful of Kevin," she said. "Now he's typically quiet, but he let out a moan that nearly woke the kids!"

On the nit-picky diction level, for some reason "typically" didn't work for me here. It sounds a little too formal for a discussion of blowjobs in a mall food court. It's a small detail, but one that stood out to me.

Liza starts chatting with me about life in general while her pal is giving me the best head I've ever received. What a mouth!

You changed verb tense here, which was a little distracting. More to the point, however, is the fact that this moves very quickly and raises a number of objections, at least to my mind. Two women suddenly decide to blow a total stranger in mall food court based solely on the fact that he has an erection. It is unusual, in my experience, that the sight of a man's erection exercises this sort of instantaneous power. Liza's chatting also seems odd, although I think it might work if you made some mention of tone. She's talking to the total stranger her friend is blowing; surely she's at least a little shaky, possibly glancing about apprehensively, or at least somewhat at a loss for words? I had the same issues later. I do recognize that part of the fun here is the nonchalance juxtaposed with the very hot sexual action, but I think it needs a bit of tinkering to work.

I think the main thing that I would like to see more of is some sense of motive in the female characters, and more reaction from the male lead. I am told that the women are expert, but I would get a better sense of this by being shown what they do that is expert. The woman-woman action could use a bit more development as well; at the moment, the characters feel a bit like the participants in a porn flick, who have sex in various combinations not because it's natural or interesting to them, but because a director is telling them to. Showing the reader more of their reactions, motivations, and desires would help to make this more powerful and evocative.

This is, of course, all in the opinion of someone who writes and reads very different stories as a general course of things. However, I have tried to look at the goals that I think you have set for yourself. I'm not saying that this needs to turn into "War and Peace" or a Mills and Boone romance. I don't think that it needs any emotional attachment between the characters to work; in fact I see its purpose as being to describe a short, self-contained sexual encounter that derives its thrill from its semi-anonymous, spur-of-the-moment nature. I don't propose that you change that; clearly, that's the sort of story you want to write. I do, however, think that that sort of story would have more sizzle if there was more attention to reaction and motivation. Are the characters thrilled at how naughty they are being? Turned on by the semi-public location? Titillated by the difference in ages? What sort of technique do these charming ladies use on our hero? What little touches make their minstrations especially delightful? Details of this sort will help to move this past a matter-of-fact description of general actions and toward something that will fire up the audience - regardless of its normal reading habits.

Shanglan

 

[BlackShanglan]

Comments on comments ...

And some observations on the comments of others:

LyingEyes suggested that "more of the coversatation the women were having should of been written in. It would of helped build up the sexual tension the character and many readers would build up before the actual sex scene." I quite agree with this. It would help to get the reader simmering in the same way that it gets the speaker excited. There and throughout, LyingEyes picked up on a tendency to report summaries of dialogue rather than give us the actual words. The words could, as LyingEyes points out, be a very effective tool for establishing tension. They could also help to flesh out the women and the man a bit and, together with some small gestures or physical details, help us to understand the motivations that lead to them joining in on this three-way. Some sense of building action and anticipation would, indeed, make the payoff sweeter.

From Varian: "The best head of his whole life, and really we only got two sentences about it." That about sums it up for me. I want to know what about it is so brilliant. I think she's got good points on voice as well.

There's very little I can add to Ginger's advice, which I think was brilliant and very dedicated and thorough. It had not occurred to me to view the speaker as intentionally meant to jar me and develop a dissonance with the reader, and that is an interesting point. However, I think we both tend to the same point, and to some extent what Varian was saying as well - even a self-absorbed person should be giving more detail about what he is absorbed in, how it feels, how he reacts, etc.

I wanted him to be confident (and not necessarily unjustly so) yet surprised and kinda humbled by two lusty older women

You know, the surprise was not coming through all that strongly. He seemed quite calm and rather matter-o-fact. I would have enjoyed a stronger sense of surprise.

Most of the rest tends to the same issues - shan't pester you with re-hashing them! But it looks like you've gotten a lot of good advice, and like you're taking it with a sensible, thoughtful, and intelligent approach. Best of luck with this -

Shanglan

 

[cloudy]

The first thing I noticed, Impressive, is that the sentences seem to all be about the same, short length, lending it a sort of monotone reading, if that's at all possible. It wasn't so noticeable further into the story, but in the first couple of paragraphs, it really jumped out at me.

As I worked my way around the Food Court, I came within earshot. They were talking about giving head! That is not what I needed to hear if I wanted to calm down! Still, I couldn't stop myself from inching closer to eavesdrop.

I lined up four of those huge trash cans nearby in order to replace the liner bags, and I was taking my good old time. From where I stood, I could clearly hear their naughty conversation, but they could only see me from the waist up.

The seemed oblivious to anything going on around them. I could tell they were turned on by the conversation, and were both thinking ahead to surprising their mates that evening. The fair haired one – whose named turned out to be Liza – was providing a blow by blow (yeah, pun intended) description of an iced job she'd recently given.

"I just took a mouthful of crushed ice and a mouthful of Kevin," she said. "Now he's typically quiet, but he let out a moan that nearly woke the kids!"

I would've liked to have been able to "hear" this conversation, instead of just the one sentence at the end. What's turning him on about it? Are they really going into detail? What is the first thing he hears that makes him realize what they're talking about?

I turn my attention back to my work. The next thing I know, they are standing on either side of me.

"My name's Karen," said the brunette. "We couldn't help noticing your – um, dilemma. Can we help?"

Liza didn't wait for me to respond, placing her hand on my half-zipped fly and reporting, "What a nice sized cock! I've got to taste it."

"Me first!" Karen exclaimed and went immediately to her knees.

Liza starts chatting with me about life in general while her pal is giving me the best head I've ever received. What a mouth!

I wasn't really sure why these women would just suddenly go "help" this guy. In the same situation, it might earn a sly grin from me to know that he'd over heard my conversation, but I don't see many women just running over there. This is fantasy, true, but I want to know why

And I would use dialogue to detail what Liza was actually chatting about? And why would she do that (talk to him about mundane things)? Is it a teasing thing?

Karen guided my hands between her legs, and I concentrated on playing with her cunt. Having something to hold on to helped steady me. A moan escaped her lips. She was so hot and so wet. I brought my hands quickly up to my mouth to taste her. I longed to suck her clit.

As my hands returned to Karen's pussy, then encountered Liza's hands. While Liza finger fucked her, I played with Karen's engorged clit. I thought she was going to scream, but instead, she put her hands on my shoulders and planted a hot kiss on my mouth. She tasted of Liza's cunt, and the combination was just too much for me.

As I felt the wave of Karen's orgasm pulsing against my fingers, my load shot into Liza's throat.

This is a hot scene! Draw it out longer, what is each doing to the other? You could really do a lot with this.

This story really has a lot of potential! Use dialogue instead of telling us what the conversation was about, maybe play up the teasing aspect - maybe the women knew he was listening from the very beginning, and started to make their conversation raunchier, knowing it was getting to him.

Don't throw it out, I can see, that with a little reworking, it can be a really good story.

 

[impressive]

This story really has a lot of potential! Use dialogue instead of telling us what the conversation was about ....

Don't throw it out, I can see, that with a little reworking, it can be a really good story.

Thanks, cloudy.

Dialog, at the time I wrote this, was kind of intimidating to me. I've gotten over that fear (and have really enjoyed writing an almost exclusively dialog sex scene in my upcoming story).

Since getting the wonderfully thorough feedback in this thread, I have been itching to get started on the rewrite -- but I've gotta finish the Rainy Day story first.

Thanks for taking the time to read and remark.

All the best,

 

[impressive]

Re: Comments on comments ...

But it looks like you've gotten a lot of good advice, and like you're taking it with a sensible, thoughtful, and intelligent approach. Best of luck with this -

Shanglan

I have been very impressed (no pun intended) with the feedback received, and I quite agree with yours as well. (Similarly, I've impressed myself with how I've taken it. Surprised myself, quite frankly. Live & learn, eh?) You're all so "right on" with your comments. Having a piece dissected that (I realize now) I didn't ever expect to ever be so scrutizined is a humbling experience -- and it gives me a greater respect for the writing process as well as for the reader.

Thank you so much for the thoughtful feedback!

 

[Pure]

Hi Imp,

Without studying earlier responses, and taking one key passage:

Liza was struggling to get my cock entirely into her small mouth, and I was struggling to keeping my balance. I wanted to pump into her. The pressure was building.

##Karen guided my hands between her legs, and I concentrated on playing with her cunt. Having something to hold on to helped steady me. A moan escaped her lips. She was so hot and so wet. I brought my hands quickly up to my mouth to taste her. I longed to suck her clit.

As my hands returned to Karen's pussy, then encountered Liza's hands. While Liza finger fucked her, I played with Karen's engorged clit. I thought she was going to scream, but instead, she put her hands on my shoulders and planted a hot kiss on my mouth. She tasted of Liza's cunt, and the combination was just too much for me.

As I felt the wave of Karen's orgasm pulsing against my fingers, my load shot into Liza's throat.

While it has potential, the writing seems not to 'take off.'
Many sentences start with "I" or "Karen" "Liza" or "she". Too many. Many of the sentences are short.

Looking at verbs, starting at point ##:

guided, concentrated, steady, escaped, was, brought, longed, returned, encountered, fucked, played, thought, put... etc.

mostly mental or cerebral or non-sexual terms, somewhat ordinary.

this reader's arousal was fitful and not great.

OK, a premise of straight porn, is everyone woman's instant readiness to fuck whoever is handy and asks, this pursuit strains credibility, in that he's approached, also.

So it's a straight male fantasy "Hot babes come after me, blow me, and suck each other for my entertainment."

You would have to put more effort into: character; descriptions of events; plot, sentence variety. It has the feel of being 'knocked off' in an hour or two.

You have the brains and writing ability to do bettter; I see you have several 'hot' stories.

J.

PS.(after reading some critiques). Ginger did well. She said,

So, there I was – doing my job with a raging hard on that would not subside.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ginger: //Ah ha! "I'm" male. I'd honest to God guessed wrong up to this point. I just got criticised for this myself on my last story…I now get how big a speed bump it can be. If I'm the only one, maybe you should blow it off. I personally HATE self revelatory introductions. I've gone back through the beginning, and can't at the moment see where it could have been made more obvious. Quite possibly it's a non-issue.//

I agree, the narrator comes across as somehow a female, at first.
Probably because of vagueness of detail (hadn't got much sex, etc.).

There is an early clue, regarding 'petered out', which is a typical male attempt at witticism.

 

[impressive]

Hi Imp,

<snip>

You have the brains and writing ability to do bettter; I see you have several 'hot' stories.

Thanks for the review, Pure. And thanks for the comment above. I can do (and have done) better -- and hopefully will bring this one up to speed before too much longer.

(P.S. Love the Imp)

 

[ShyAzn]

Hi!

I liked your story, but agree with the above on the thought that there could have been 'more'. It felt more like a play by play retelling of what happened, with little about how it made the narrator felt. Perhaps it's just me, but it felt like an empty, random encounter with two women. I mean, why would two women randomly decide to help out a janitor cleaning the floor? In real life, they'd probably run away and call security or something. Not that it couldn't happen, but I prefer to have a little more motivation for characters.

There were too many sentences that began with "I" or "Karen" or "Liza", which was something that bothered me as well.

Liza was struggling to get my cock entirely into her small mouth, and I was struggling to keeping my balance. I wanted to pump into her. The pressure was building.

As an example, I thought the last two sentences of this paragraph could have been combined in some way: The pressure was building, and it was all I could do not to grab her head and start pumping myself into her mouth, or something as such.

The ending was most problematic for me. I figure that the supervisor must have had his view blocked in some way, but it seemed unplausible and rushed.

The story is certainly not terrible, it just needs some reworking and editing if you so choose.

I hope this was helpful, if perhaps redundant with above comments.

 

[impressive]

I hope this was helpful, if perhaps redundant with above comments.

Thanks, ShyAzn.

The redundancy is good. The consistency of the feedback just reinforces the problems with the story -- rather than making it "just" one person's opinion.

Warm regards,