Giuliani v. Hillary-- prognosticators, gurus,

[Pure]

pols, armchair experts, objectivists, relativists.

It looks like this is one of the more likely matchups.

What say you about this matchup for Pres, and its outcome.

---
If you wish to astonish us with your abilities, you might comment on the problem of electoral vote v. popular vote, and who's strong in which respect.

 

[Huckleman2000]

Giuliani is the one candidate with a muddier house than Hillary, and he's only got one issue to run on.

 

[Guest]

And he was just given an endorsement by Pat Robertson.

He's toast.

 

[Carnevil9]

Nobody will bring out more opposition voters than Hitlery Clinton. She has more negatives than Adolf, Benito, and Stalin combined. If she gets the Democrat nomination, the Republican will win, even if it is Maynard G. Krebbs.

 

[Pure]

hi carnevil,
please vote in my poll!

 

[Carnevil9]

hi carnevil,
please vote in my poll!

Done. Please, please, please, nominate Hitlery.

 

[keeblercrumb]

Done. Please, please, please, nominate Hitlery.

I fully acknolwedge that some 30% of the voting public probably "hate" Hillary... that these feelings are wholly irrational is almost beside the point. The hated Bill too. But like Bill...... she can certainly win. The 30% only get to vote once,

....Forutnately.....



-KC

 

[Pure]

it's worth noting that maybe 50% say they won't vote for Mitt, because of his religion.

as for Giuliani, his previous 'pro choice' stand must surely alienate say 25% of voters.

there are a couple conservative columnists taking hillary pretty seriously, i.e., saying she might be able to win.

---
note to keebler: i think the "hatred" "outrage" etc are largely manufactured. republicans greatly fear any dem with southern strength, who might win in "their" territory, as clinton did. all the emoting, mudslinging etc may have this simple cause.

 

[Carnevil9]

there are a couple conservative columnists taking hillary pretty seriously, i.e., saying she might be able to win.

PLEASE nominate Hitlery! Nothing could be better for Conservatives than that! She will galvanize the conservative base like no one has since St. Ronaldus Magnus de Reagan.

 

[Liar]

PLEASE nominate Hitlery! Nothing could be better for Conservatives than that! She will galvanize the conservative base like no one has since St. Ronaldus Magnus de Reagan.

Possibly, Hate of Hilary might even be a bigger incentive for the conservative bible belt base to rush to the voting booths than the Fear of Fags were in the last election.

But Hilary is pretty shrewd, and I'll bet she's learned enough from the last 8 years to rally up some fear and hate on her side of the fence too.

 

[rgraham666]

Don't worry, evil. If Hillary gets the Democratic nod she won't live to see the inside of the Oval Office.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Hillary wont get male votes. She wont get conservative votes. Another bad sign is female pundits are harpooning Hillary. Hillary may not be the ONE who leads the gals out of the political wilderness.

I thought she had a lock on the nomination but her performance in & after the last debate may be fatal to her nomination. She hid behind Bill and played the sex card.

My mom was a politician. In the 60s she would not have used her sex as an excuse. She might have shot an opponent or hired detectives to discover his vices, but she would never play 'the little wife.'

My local paper, which loved Bill, hates Hillary. They beat her up every week in editorials. the paper is outraged about the sex card thing.

Guliani doesnt give conservatives a boner.

I think its a toss-up if Hillary gets the nomination. If she is the nominee I plan to vote for her just because I think she's perfect to push America off the cliff into the abyss.

 

[thebullet]

My wife is convinced that Giuliani is the chosen candidate of the neocons. She is sure that if he wins (and if he is nominated, it's already been shown that the neocons know how to 'manufacture' a win), the US is going to complete the conversion to a fascist dictatorship with only a figurehead democratic congress.

I don't endorse this view, mostly because Giuliani has so many negatives going for him that if the Dems ever actually do decide to get down and dirty during the final stages of the campaign, they can really do a number on him, such that the crooked voting machines and altered electoral college rules won't be able to save his ass.

To me the biggest question is: are we going to have an election? Or will we invade Iran, some forged '9/11' style terrorist attack will be created, and the current administration will be 'forced' to declare marshal law. Is Pakistan a beta-test site for that scenario?

Geez, isn't it great to live in interesting times/

 

[john-the-author]

Nobody will bring out more opposition voters than Hitlery Clinton. She has more negatives than Adolf, Benito, and Stalin combined. If she gets the Democrat nomination, the Republican will win, even if it is Maynard G. Krebbs.

Say, Carnevil, I would truly appreciate it if you could answer a question for me I've been trying to get answered for ages. What is the basis for this visceral hatred of Hillary Clinton that I keep hearing expressed? I have asked many people who've expressed it, but never gotten anything clear, save once, when someone felt that it was her and not Bill running the White House--patently absurd on the face of it and hardly the first First Lady to have done so even if it were true: consider the documented evidence of Nancy Reagan management of the White House during Reagan's first term; he spent most of his time watching his old movies and his marketing team got him elected because of this. (It was grand coup in marketing terms, but completely lacking any moral compass.)

Could you explain this, please? I really would like to know. Thanks!

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

It's a great matchup and represents a genuine choice for voters, because other than the personal muck, there's not much (like abortion and bible thumpery) to divert attention from the important matters. Namely the size and scope of the welfare state, and national security issues.

Of course as a libertarian I can't stand either one of them - they both represent highly authoritarian strains of the competing political/ideological tendencies that dominate our era. In that sense there may seem to be little to distinguish them, but the specific forms of authoritarianism are different. Rudy's is the traditional "law und ordnung" sort, Hillary's is the smothering nanny-state variety (made more toxic by Democratic Party's captivity to the economic vandals and looters of the trial lawyer class).

I have no idea who will win and by how much - neither does anyone else.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

My wife is convinced that Giuliani is the chosen candidate of the neocons. She is sure that if he wins (and if he is nominated, it's already been shown that the neocons know how to 'manufacture' a win), the US is going to complete the conversion to a fascist dictatorship with only a figurehead democratic congress.

I don't endorse this view, mostly because Giuliani has so many negatives going for him that if the Dems ever actually do decide to get down and dirty during the final stages of the campaign, they can really do a number on him, such that the crooked voting machines and altered electoral college rules won't be able to save his ass.

To me the biggest question is: are we going to have an election? Or will we invade Iran, some forged '9/11' style terrorist attack will be created, and the current administration will be 'forced' to declare marshal law. Is Pakistan a beta-test site for that scenario?

Geez, isn't it great to live in interesting times/

I'd like to know what you think is so bad about rudy. The only bad thing I ever heard about his terms as Mayor of New York was that he closed a bunch of strip clubs that were too close to schools or other residential areas. Aside from that, I heard nothing but praise about him.

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

My wife is convinced that Giuliani is the chosen candidate of the neocons. She is sure that if he wins (and if he is nominated, it's already been shown that the neocons know how to 'manufacture' a win), the US is going to complete the conversion to a fascist dictatorship with only a figurehead democratic congress.

I don't endorse this view, mostly because Giuliani has so many negatives going for him that if the Dems ever actually do decide to get down and dirty during the final stages of the campaign, they can really do a number on him, such that the crooked voting machines and altered electoral college rules won't be able to save his ass.

To me the biggest question is: are we going to have an election? Or will we invade Iran, some forged '9/11' style terrorist attack will be created, and the current administration will be 'forced' to declare marshal law. Is Pakistan a beta-test site for that scenario?

Geez, isn't it great to live in interesting times/

Take a deep breath, bullet, put an ice pack on your forehead, and come on out of the fever swamps . . .

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

Nobody will bring out more opposition voters than Hitlery Clinton. She has more negatives than Adolf, Benito, and Stalin combined. If she gets the Democrat nomination, the Republican will win, even if it is Maynard G. Krebbs.

What's wrong with Maynard G. Krebbs? He would make an outstanding president.

"WORK?!"

 

[BareFootPagan]

Agreed, Maynard makes Porgie ,the Monkey Boy, seem eloquent

Altho, I must confess, it is hard for me to fathom anyone who has been at the eye of the White House storm for 8 years wanting to go back .

I do have My fears that Hillary will get the cracker Moonbats all hoppin' up and down (in strict unison, of course. hmm ,In Lockhop ?). But, She is consistently turning in the best debate performances of the entire pack on both sides .

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

Look, there are 37 people in the United States who still believe that the Republican Administration has done a good job. Those will obviously vote for Giuliani. Then there are millions of people who are afraid to have a woman president who will vote for Giuliani. And there are 9 people working for Homeland Security who still believe Giuliani was the saviour of 911.

Taken all together, if the election were held today, Hillery would win by 2 to 5 points.

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

Look, there are 37 people in the United States who still believe that the Republican Administration has done a good job. Those will obviously vote for Giuliani. Then there are millions of people who are afraid to have a woman president who will vote for Giuliani. And there are 9 people working for Homeland Security who still believe Giuliani was the saviour of 911.

Taken all together, if the election were held today, Hillery would win by 2 to 5 points.

I think the Republican administration has done a great job on tax cuts. Does that make me one of the 37?

(Those who think the problems in our economy would be improved by signifigantly slower rates of growth will strongly support letting those tax cuts expire.)

 

[john-the-author]

What's wrong with Maynard G. Krebbs? He would make an outstanding president.

"WORK?!"

Jesus, I thought we'd HAD Maynard G. Krebs for the last 7 years.

 

[Pure]

I think the Republican administration has done a great job on tax cuts. Does that make me one of the 37?


tax cuts. the universal remedy. a bush success? (may i ask, impudently, for any evidence of the good effects of these Bush tax cuts?)

--
OK, giving you the tax cuts as achievements, can you supply a couple more items for the list?

 

[neonlyte]

I think the Republican administration has done a great job on tax cuts. Does that make me one of the 37?


tax cuts. the universal remedy. a bush success? (may i ask, impudently for any evidence of the good effects of these Bush tax cuts?)

You're a glutton for punishment.

Hilly for me, but I'm with Rob, I doubt she'll see out the term, which makes the VP choice crucial.

ETA: The 'wind by a small margin'... is Hilly vegetarian?

 

[Huckleman2000]

I think the Republican administration has done a great job on tax cuts. Does that make me one of the 37?

Even as they've expanded government spending by huge amounts and increased the national debt by more than all of the previous administrations combined?