Getting Published :: I'm Ready!

[Unsung Muse]

I have a million questions. I'm sure I'm not alone.

I've been reading every "how to" and "market guide" I can get my hands on...
sifting through reams of online resources, subscribing to exines and newsletters...
I would love to hear the thoughts & experiences of any willing AHers:

Is there a viable market for short erotic fiction?
What's the best way to find Open Calls for Submissions (Collections, Anthologies)?
Are longer works (novels) more desirable (of more interest to publishers)?
Is 'self-publishing' worth the investment (does it even count as "previously published")?

 

[Selena_Kitt]

I have a million questions. I'm sure I'm not alone.

I've been reading every "how to" and "market guide" I can get my hands on...
sifting through reams of online resources, subscribing to exines and newsletters...
I would love to hear the thoughts & experiences of any willing AHers:

Is there a viable market for short erotic fiction?
What's the best way to find Open Calls for Submissions (Collections, Anthologies)?
Are longer works (novels) more desirable (of more interest to publishers)?
Is 'self-publishing' worth the investment (does it even count as "previously published")?

I can't answer any of these... I just wanted to say:

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!


(It's about time! )

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

I can't either, but want to add: YOU ROCK!

I hope you go all the way, baby!

x 12

 

[neonlyte]

I have a million questions. I'm sure I'm not alone.

Is there a viable market for short erotic fiction?
If by 'viable' you mean 'profitable' you are likely to be disappointed. The reward for short erotic fiction is small, you couldn't regard it as generating more than 'beer money' unless you are exceptionally lucky.

If by 'viable' you mean 'outlets' - there are loads, and each has more submissions than they can ever possibly read or publish. Research your market (publishers) and pitch what they sell. [B]www.firstwriter.com[/B] provides comprehensive listing of Agents and Publishers by more genres than you can cock a hat at. But, it is a subscription service, you have to decide whether it is worth the fee to find the information you require in a single place.

What's the best way to find Open Calls for Submissions (Collections, Anthologies)?
Search and search again. firstwriter puts out calls. [B]www.absolutewrite.com[/B] contains masses of useful links and is free. Unfortunately much is buried in the threads and requires some time to tease out. I posted a call link here a little while ago for a short erotic submission.

Are longer works (novels) more desirable (of more interest to publishers)?
What is desirable is what an Agent/Publisher thinks will sell. If you want a taste of what you might be up against in trying to tempt an Agent/Publisher take a look at Evil Editor's blog.

Is 'self-publishing' worth the investment (does it even count as "previously published")?
Opinions vary according to the number of people asked the question - the concensus in NO, but there have been some noteworthy exceptions - the names of which others will no doubt recall.


Authors Write has a nice little thing called 'The Pledge' an undertaking to submit your material to Agents and Publishers. It's 'set yourself a target' deal, you might commit to one submission per month and you sig shows how you're doing. Just another motivation tool.

ETA: You didn't ask about e-publishing

 

[impressive]

http://www.erotica-readers.com/ERA/G/G-Main.htm

 

[Unsung Muse]

Thank you for all the kind words & tips!

Has anyone had any experience with Tit-Elation?

 

[FallingToFly]

Try www.alteapress.com

Or Google Altea Press if that doesn't work.

They publish anthologies of erotica by the same author, I know that. I believe their standard is 40% ebook/ 15%paperback royalties. I could be wrong. However, I have dealt with them through queries and discussed options with them- they seem like a very reasonable and down to earth company to deal with for a first author, IMHO.

 

[Unsung Muse]

Try www.alteapress.com
Or Google Altea Press if that doesn't work.

Thank you. I located a temporary site for them at:
http://alteapress.blogspot.com/


PS ::
If the AH is the wrong place to have this discussion, I do
hope someone will tell me! I did rummage around first!

 

[dr_mabeuse]

The bottom line is, there's so much free erotica on the web that there are very few sites willing to pay for short fiction, and those that do can pick and choose from the best writers out there. They usually go with name authors.

For the same reason, most legitimate publishers aren't that interested in anthologies of short stories by unknowns. If you have a name and a following earned through sales of novels, then they might consider it. Your other chance for publishing short stuff for money is to find some weird niche market looking for material "Cigar-Smoking_Rubber_Transvestites.com might be looking for fiction, for example, and be willing to pay for it, though it won't be much. $20-30, probably.

It costs almost nothing to set yourself up as a publisher of e-books and so lots of people do. All you need is a web site and some storage space for the text files (which is dirt cheap), and since you only pay the author a piece of what you get when someone buys his/her book, it's all gravy to them. The only upfront costs are for any editing they do, and maybe a few bucks for some stock-art cover, and many of them don't even bother with that. Because of all this, they'll "publish" pretty much anything you send them, and there are hundreds of outfits like this. So actually, it's pretty easy to get yourself "published". Whether anyone will ever buy your book--or ever even see it--is another question altogether. They probably won't.

I'm not saying these people are crooked. They're not. They just don't have the resources to do much with your book except let it lie there and take 60% of whatever sales you can drum up on your own.

Selling books is largely a matter of advertising and publicity. What separates legimate publishers from your average ebook outfit is that the legitimate publishers make a financial commitment to your book. They edit it and provide cover art. More importantly, they advertise and promote it. They put their seal of approval on it. Because they invest money in their products, their standards are higher and they're more discriminating. The consumer is more likely to buy from a legit publisher too, not only because of the advertising, but because they know that someone thought this book was good enough to invest some money in, and so there's going to be at least some modicum of quality.

I heard recently that 40% of the fiction market is now Romance, which is pretty fucking incredible if true. In the romance field, "Romantica"--graphically erotic romance--in the fastest growing segment. That's not quite the same as porn, but readers are more liberated now and want to see what happens once the bodice is ripped off. if you can write a decent erotic story, you have a good chance of seliing it to a legitimate publisher.

The other good news is that more and more legitimate publishers are just throwing in the towel and going with straight porn or erotica. That doesn't mean they'll publish any old fuck story though. They still expect quality writing and plot and characterization.

Those have been my experiences at any rate.

 

[AngelofDarkLust]

http://www.erotica-readers.com/ERA/G/G-Main.htm

If it's there, it's decent and most likely paid, even if it's token payment.

 

[FallingToFly]

Dr. M-

Under normal circumstances, I would agree with you on this, even whole-heartedly help support the claims.

My limited experience with Altea has been completely different, however. I asked for, and recieved, a copy of their submission guidelines. Below is the copy/paste of those. They are a very small genre publisher, accepting only Mystery, Horror, Romance and Erotica. I hope this helps anyone looking for a press to ask questions of- they have been very helpful and very prompt with replies to all of my queries and questions.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
SUBMISSION GUIDELINES
Altea is open to all unsolicited manuscripts. We accept multiple and simultaneous submissions. Currently, we are accepting novellas and novels, categorized in the following lengths:

Novellas: 15,000 - 35,000 words
Novels: 35,000 - 65,000 words

Anthologies are welcome if all stories are on the same genre.
We accept mystery, horror, romance, and erotica ONLY.

We only accept electronic submissions. You must send all required information to be considered for publication.* Partial submissions will be rejected without review.

Cover Letter

On the Subject Line, write: Submission--title-of-novel
In the body of the email, include the following information:
Your full name.
Your e-mail address.
The title of your book.
Approximate number of words.
One short paragraph synopsis describing what the novel is about.
A short bio noting other published works, awards, etc.
Your website link, if you have one.

Manuscript

Attach the complete manuscript as a Microsoft Word® or RTF-format file. File name must be title-of-your-novel.rtf (or .doc). On the first page of your manuscript, at the top, include your full name, e-mail address, and number of words. Please number the pages.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I also asked questions about short story anthologies, and recieved this response:

For anthologies, I prefer a minimum of 20,000 words and at least 6 stories. There's really no upper limit. I also prefer manuscripts where all stories center around one main theme or the stories have some kind of connection. Keep in mind that explicit erotic stories sell better, but do whatever's best for your stories.



Thank you again for your interest. I look forward to reading your work.

Best regards,



Diana Bocco

 

[Unsung Muse]

RE: http://www.erotica-readers.com/ERA/G/G-Main.htm

If it's there, it's decent and most likely paid, even if it's token payment.

Yes, that's where I found the 'first bite' (Tit-Elation, under websites that pay). It is definitely "token" payment and – since the "chosen for publication" response/offer came less than 24-hours after my first/initial contact – I'm not sure I should pop a champagne cork

Then again... IF it counts as "previously published", I can leverage that...
I'm going to think positively & consider it a little benchmark

 

[Unsung Muse]

I heard recently that 40% of the fiction market is now Romance, which is pretty fucking incredible if true. In the romance field, "Romantica"--graphically erotic romance--in the fastest growing segment. That's not quite the same as porn, but readers are more liberated now and want to see what happens once the bodice is ripped off. if you can write a decent erotic story, you have a good chance of seliing it to a legitimate publisher.

I read some statistics along these lines quite recently too. They were highlighted in some marketing materials for a "Romance Novel Writing Course", so I took with a chunk of salt. Your source may have been less 'self-serving'... maybe there's something to it? After all, what could it hurt to take a shot at that 'formula' (as I've been told, it always is) and see what falls out? An interesting exercise... I might pursue.

The other good news is that more and more legitimate publishers are just throwing in the towel and going with straight porn or erotica. That doesn't mean they'll publish any old fuck story though. They still expect quality writing and plot and characterization.

This is starting to show... and it's exciting. I'm not sure I would equate it with 'throwing in the towel' though. There are some very creative (and publicity hungry) "name authors" out there who really seem to be doing their part to expand the market in new ways / on their own. They're stirring things up. I think things are going to get very interesting...

Those have been my experiences at any rate.

Your experiences are why I'm here, sir

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Your experiences are why I'm here, sir

I certainly didn't mean to put Altea or any other publisher down. As I said, these people aren't crooks, and they're not going to rip you off. It's just that it's very unlikely you''re going to sell many books with them.

I'm published with Ellora's Cave (3 books), and also with Renaissance E-books and Extasy Books (1 book each). EC is what I consider a "legitimate" publisher. They advertise and promote and market, and I do pretty well with them, getting a monthly royalty checks. They send copies of my books to reviewers and arrange signings and do stuff like that. Once you sell so many e-books (500, I think), they put you out in hard-copy and get you into bookstores, and I'm shamefully thrilled to say that the first printing of my first EC book has sold out and they're doing another print run.

Renaissance, on the other hand, is a typical e-book publisher. They sent me a contract for my "Bound Angel" bondage detetctive parody and had it available for sale at Fictionwise and other e-book outlets within 3 months, which is pretty fast. They don't advertise or promote, though, and so after maybe 9 months I think they've sold like 12 copies or so. I got a royalty check for them for $38. $38 for 9 months worth of sales. No one can find the book, and the only advertising it gets is pretty much confined to the link in my sig line here at Lit.

I imagine if you go with Altea, your experience will be similar to my experience with Renaissance. You'll be published, but--and I don't mean to be discouraging--so what?

Even worse was (is) my experience with Extasy, who might not be crooks but who seem to be hopelessly incompetent. They sent me a contract for my erotic vampire novel "The Croft" back in April of 2005. They didn't answer my letters for months, and when I finally got through to them and asked if they were still in business, they told me not to get snippy and that they were terribly backlogged. They sent me the very poorly edited and proofed manuscript in January 2006 (I had to redo the entire thing. They must have paid someone like $50 to "edit" it and they got what they paid for.) and I sent it back a week or two later. Now, 7 months after that, it still hasn't been released and after 19 months there's no word on when and if they'll release it.

There's a clause in the contract that says they have to release it within 12 months of "the agreed upon date", and I was foolish enough to think that meant within 12 months of the date I signed the contract. Not so, according to them. The "agreed upon date" is when they say they'll pubnlish it, and so far they haven't said a word. The contract gives them the rights to the book for 7 years, and meanwhile erotic vampire novels are hotter than hell and I'm losing money every day they sit on it. I wrote them again and offered to buy the rights back from them so I could send it to EC, and again they were kind of nasty. I've just about given up on them. I'd call in a lawyer if I could afford one.

So, like I said, getting published isn't hard. Selling books is. That's where you separate the A-list publishers from the rest. Maybe Altea has a loyal and dedicated following and a decent market share or will actually work hard to promote your book and get it out in the public eye, but barring that, it costs them nothing to "publish" your book, so why shouldn't they?

I hate to be a wet blanket about this, and I know what a thrill it is just to know you've been published, but the reality is, getting published is the easy part. Selling them is what's hard.

 

[Unsung Muse]

Your candor is appreciated!

I may be a bit luckier than most, when it comes to promotions/sales 'after-the-fact'. My 'day job' = online marketing. I also host a pseudo-literary show with a very loyal and growing listenership -- I'm hopeful the majority will buy anything I manage to have published and plan to put the show to shameless good use

Yes, this is (mostly) me trying to boost my own confidence & 'think positive'... as the rejection letters begin to infiltrate my mailbox <LOL>

 

[Tanuki]

I certainly didn't mean to put Altea or any other publisher down. As I said, these people aren't crooks, and they're not going to rip you off. It's just that it's very unlikely you''re going to sell many books with them.

I'm published with Ellora's Cave (3 books), and also with Renaissance E-books and Extasy Books (1 book each). EC is what I consider a "legitimate" publisher. They advertise and promote and market, and I do pretty well with them, getting a monthly royalty checks. They send copies of my books to reviewers and arrange signings and do stuff like that. Once you sell so many e-books (500, I think), they put you out in hard-copy and get you into bookstores, and I'm shamefully thrilled to say that the first printing of my first EC book has sold out and they're doing another print run.

I just discovered Ellora's Cave, from another Lit thread - wow, I didn't realize that's where the great Doctor was published. There's some great stories on there, I've been reading excerpts! Sometimes I read an excerpt and think my own writing is better, but then even if one of my stories sold well, I definitely wouldn't want the publicity.

Now excuse me, I have to go order my first e-book. I'll make sure I buy one of yours Doc, your writing is the bomb.