Garderobes

[oggbashan]

It is about time Garderobes had their own thread since they are polluting other threads.

I searched for "garderobe" and found 250,000 hits. Searching the UK for garderobe+castle produced a more manageable 168. Here is one:

http://www.eng-h.gov.uk/reports/old_wardour/

Archaelogists seem to like excavating the discharge points of garderobes for unconsidered trifles that might have fallen in.

A few hints:
1. Garderobes were shit-holes that discharged outside the castle walls. They were high class shit-holes. The common soldiery had to go out into the castle yard.
2. Garderobe means "wardrobe" in some European languages. In England and Wales it has the privy meaning.
3. The Garderobe was the most private place in a castle in the rest of which communal living was the norm. So it was often the last place of defence AND the place where the valuables (which included clothing) belonging to the castle's owner were kept. The garderobe's toilet would be at the end of a longish passage to keep the smell away from the valuables but the smell might not be too great because constant fresh air ventilation was provided.

Best wishes to all garderobe lovers.

Og

 

[oggbashan]

Extract from search

Warwick Castle: Press: Press Release - ... the wall side and human waste would drop straight down a latrine shaft into the castle ditch or cess pit. Guests can see an original garderobe (complete with ...
www.warwick-castle.co.uk/press/2003/castles.asp


I wonder why it was terminated with ... ?

Og

 

[Svenskaflicka]

You people shit in the wardrobes???

Yanks...

 

[oggbashan]

You people shit in the wardrobes???

Yanks...

Garderobes were BIG. Like Magdalena's walk-in wardrobe you had to walk-in but with a garderobe you kept walking round a bend or two before getting to the bottom of things. The clothes were kept before the first bend so smelt no more than the rest of the castle.

Og

PS. In my youth I visited a famous Spanish tourist attraction. The toilets were on a projecting ledge over a 75 metre drop. There was a metre high wall separating Hombres from Mulieres. The "toilet" was a hole cut in the ledge with white painted feet to show where to squat. There was no toilet paper, just a neat pyramid of round pebbles. Used pebbles were dropped through the hole. There was an interesting streak starting about 20 metres down and continuing to the bottom of the ravine. There was no smell perhaps because there was a strong wind blowing at the time. I'm sure you wanted to know that.

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Yes. I believe my life will be much richer now that I know this.

 

[Madame Manga]

I believe one reason they kept the clothes in the passage leading to the privy was the belief that moths didn't like the smell. ;-) When your entire wardrobe is made of wool, silk and fur, that's a necessary precaution.

MM

 

[MathGirl]

Garderobes forever!!

Dear Og,
I think it's wonderful that you introduced a thread dedicated to the discussion of garderobes. I'm sure one reason only the upper classes in castles used them was that they were the only ones upstairs.

"Ahh, yes, Dear. There's a pleasant breeze wafting from the garderobe this evening, dontcha think?"

MG

Ps. Pebbles? Sounds like something those gre..... Spaniards would use.

Pps. Yanks? WE don't have garderobes, Swede.

 

[oggbashan]

Re: Garderobes forever!!

Pps. Yanks? WE don't have garderobes, Swede.

I thought I would leave it to a US citizen to respond to that comment. In the US they had one or two holers down back of the yard. But today we in the UK do NOT use garderobes, and most of the US does not use the little wooden shed.

Thomas Crapper invented the modern WC and we haven't looked back since.

Og

 

[MathGirl]

T. Crapper, plumber

Thomas Crapper invented the modern WC and we haven't looked back since.

Dear Og,
People like Edison, Bell, Watt, etc. are famous for their inventions, but where would we be without Thomas Crapper? Using privies and garderobes, I expect.

I have an old book about T. Crapper. It's entitled, "Flushed with Pride."
MG

Ps. Something has been bothering me. How did those spi... Spanish people use those pebbles to ..........?

 

[Gabriel_Lee]

Garderobe ode

When you're modern medieval, you've got a garderobe
When your bowels are in upheaval, it's the best place to unload
Before the innovation, we crapped inside a wooden stall
But now, people in high station can shit out through the wall.

 

[MathGirl]

Garderobe poetry

Dear GL,
Please save that. There will soon be an announcement soliciting verse for a garderobe epic saga by the Durt Gurl Group. As an active contributing member, you will, of course, add to the steaming, fetid heap.
MG

Ps. Oh, okay. Foetid
Pps. It would seem that the idea of the garderobe was to separate the owner of the castle as far as possible from his excrement.

 

[Gabriel_Lee]

saved.

BTW, I believe fetid is an acceptable spelling (as if you would really care).

Hmmm ... didn't Bertrand Russell say something about civilization being the distance man put between himself and his excretia? (I assume it referred to women too)

 

[MathGirl]

acceptable spelling (as if you would really care).

Dear GL,
I'll have you know that I DO CARE. It's DurtGurl who takes a ballistic approach to spelling.
MG
Ps. I live in a two story townhouse. At the next Homeowner's Association meeting, I'm going to ask if building a garderobe would be within the rules and regulations. I have a sneaking suspicion that it wouldn't. You never know until you ask, though.

I think a garderobe would be a really cool thing to have. Emptying onto the street side, of course. Great conversation piece. Probably to wonders for the lawn.

 

[Gabriel_Lee]

Originally posted by MathGirl
I think a garderobe would be a really cool thing to have. Emptying onto the street side, of course. Great conversation piece. Probably to wonders for the lawn.

Very true. Of course, whilst being a cool topic for conversation, it may have the side effect of reducing the number of visitors - though this may also be advantageous.

Some things speak louder than words and I think a pile of shit at the bottom of the wall may be one of them. Shit actually descending down the wall is probably even more vocal, and will, no doubt, be of great interest to passers by.

Might I suggest an informative plaque on the wall. Partly to educate the masses, and partly to see if you can trick someone to come a little closer. Use small letters.

GL

P.S. I did not intend to imply that you take a ballistic approach to speling; rather that you have an independant and original style of your own and the cumbersome trappings of convention are seen by you as exactly what they are. Of course, I think the Homeowners Association will feel more comfortable with the cumbersome trappings of convention.

 

[oggbashan]

Re: T. Crapper, plumber

Ps. Something has been bothering me. How did those spi... Spanish people use those pebbles to ..........?

They used their left hand only, held the pebble neatly between forefinger and thumb, and wiped. How else?

Og

 

[Svenskaflicka]

That explains the sea shells in Demolition Man. Thanks, og! That detail has been driving me nuts for years.

 

[Octavian]

hence the saying.

Originally posted by oggbashan

Garderobe means "wardrobe" in some European languages. In England and Wales it has the privy meaning.

Hence the famous saying:

'Up sh*t garderobe without a coathanger!'

Octavian

 

[AgentAika]

>snip<


2. Garderobe means "wardrobe" in some European languages. In England and Wales it has the privy meaning.

Og

Actually Og, you would have done better to phrase that as "Garderobe is the word from whence our modern-day Wardrobe derives" for it does not actually mean wardrobe.
Garderobe is an abbreviation of the words, "Regardez la robe" basically meaning, "Look out for your robe" [when shitting and pissing!] Obviously, sitting on the loo is far less likely to mess up your clothing than squatting over a hole.

For those who care, the word loo comes from the expression, "Regardez l'eau" (watch out for the water)......corrupted to "Gardyloo" thence to "Loo". This saying originated during the middle ages when people would chuck their night water (and goodness knows what else) out into the street from their windows. As a goodly amount of dwellings at that time had the living quarters on the first floor (the ground floor being the undercroft), one can imagine how easy it would have been to get a head full of someone's waste!
Ewwww!

Interesting thread Og!

 

[Sir Tarquin Thripp]

Re: Re: Garderobes

Actually Og, you would have done better to phrase that as "Garderobe is the word from whence our modern-day Wardrobe derives" for it does not actually mean wardrobe.
Garderobe is an abbreviation of the words, "Regardez la robe" basically meaning, "Look out for your robe" [when shitting and pissing!] Obviously, sitting on the loo is far less likely to mess up your clothing than squatting over a hole.

For those who care, the word loo comes from the expression, "Regardez l'eau" (watch out for the water)......corrupted to "Gardyloo" thence to "Loo". This saying originated during the middle ages when people would chuck their night water (and goodness knows what else) out into the street from their windows. As a goodly amount of dwellings at that time had the living quarters on the first floor (the ground floor being the undercroft), one can imagine how easy it would have been to get a head full of someone's waste!
Ewwww!

Interesting thread Og!

Ha!! damn me young lady, they still do that in our village, the surfs that is, we nobility of course use the Garderobe.

Sir T

 

[MathGirl]

Of course, I think the Homeowners Association will feel more comfortable with the cumbersome trappings of convention.

Dear GL,
You're probably quite correct. I've always felt, though, that rules and regulations are things that happen to someone else.
MG

 

[MathGirl]

Re: Re: T. Crapper, plumber

They used their left hand only, held the pebble neatly between forefinger and thumb, and wiped. How else?

Dear Og,
In other words, they wiped their gre.... arses with finger and thumb, holding the pebble to pretend they weren't. Sounds like something the Sons of Castille would do.
MG
Ps. AArrrrgggghhhhhhhh
Pps. Couldn't they at least have tried a leaf or the Sears Roebuck catalogue? Almanack? Sunday Times? Library copy of Don Quixote?
Ppps. I've always thought the etymoloty of "gardyloo" was quaint. Sort of like "Gringo."

 

[oggbashan]

Re: Re: Garderobes

Actually Og, you would have done better to phrase that as "Garderobe is the word from whence our modern-day Wardrobe derives" for it does not actually mean wardrobe.
Garderobe is an abbreviation of the words, "Regardez la robe" basically meaning, "Look out for your robe" [when shitting and pissing!] Obviously, sitting on the loo is far less likely to mess up your clothing than squatting over a hole.

Nice idea - but wrong.

According to the Oxford English Dictionary "garderobe" means wardrobe and is from the same source. The use as "privy" is incidental. I can be boring and quote all the etymological references from the OED (full version) but I'm boring enough without making things worse.

Also "gardeloo" for "loo" assumes that English city dwellers communicated in French. A more usual warning would be "heads" or "watch out" but much more likely is no warning at all. Tough.

Og

 

[MathGirl]

Re: Re: Re: Garderobes

I can be boring and quote all the etymological references from the OED (full version) but I'm boring enough without making things worse.

Can one be overzealous in quoting garderobe lore? I think not.
MG

 

[Guest]

Venetian peasantry

Ha!! damn me young lady, they still do that in our village, the surfs that is, we nobility of course use the Garderobe.
Sir T

Thripp: As a virgin you must take care about revealing personal information, i.e., judging by your quaint spelling I would guess you live in Venice*, CA. I had no idea surfers used medieval crappers, but then Californians are such an inclusive and tolerable people (except the majority Republicans).

*Venice, Italy does not allow surfing on the Lido.

Regards, Perdita of the North

 

[DurtGurl]

Re: Re: Re: Garderobes

Also "gardeloo" for "loo" assumes that English city dwellers communicated in French.

Dear Og,
Would that be before or after Norman conquered the place?
DG