'Friends' of blacks'

Ishmael

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Thomas Sowell

September 4, 2002

'Friends' of blacks'

Who was it who said, "if the Negro cannot stand on his own legs, let him fall"?

Ronald Reagan? Newt Gingrich? Charles Murray?

Not even close. It was Frederick Douglass!

This was part of a speech in which Douglass also said: "Everybody has asked the question . 'What shall we do with the Negro?' I have had but one answer from the beginning. Do nothing with us! Your doing with us has already played the mischief with us. Do nothing with us!"

Frederick Douglass had achieved a deeper understanding in the 19th century than any of the black "leaders" of today. Those whites who feel a need to do something with blacks and for blacks have been some of the most dangerous "friends" of blacks.

Academia is the home of many such "friends," which is why there are not only double standards of admissions to colleges but also in some places double standards in grading. The late David Riesman called it "affirmative grading."

A professor at one of California's state universities where black students are allowed to graduate on the basis of easier standards put it bluntly: "We are just lying to these black students when we give them degrees." That lie is particularly deadly when the degree is a medical degree, authorizing someone to treat sick people or perform surgery on children.

For years, Dr. Patrick Chavis was held up as a shining example of the success of affirmative action, for he was admitted to medical school as a result of minority preferences and went back to the black community to practice medicine. In fact, he was publicly praised by the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights -- just two weeks before his license was suspended, after his patients died under conditions that brought the matter to the attention of the Medical Board of California.

An administrative law judge referred to Chavis' "inability to perform some of the most basic duties required of a physician." A year later, after a fuller investigation, his license was revoked.

Those who had for years been using Chavis as a shining example of the success of affirmative action suddenly changed tactics and claimed that an isolated example of failure proved nothing. Sadly, Chavis was not an isolated example.

When a professor at the Harvard Medical School declared publicly, back in the 1970s, that black students were being allowed to graduate from that institution without meeting the same standards as others, he was denounced as a "racist" for saying that it was cruel to "allow trusting patients to pay for our irresponsibility" -- trusting black patients, in many cases.

Why do supposedly responsible people create such dangerous double standards? Some imagine that they are being friends to blacks by lowering the standards for them. Some don't think that blacks have what it takes to meet real standards, and that colleges and universities will lose their "diversity" -- and perhaps federal money
with it -- if they don't lower the standards, in order to get an acceptable racial body count.

My own experience as a teacher was that black students would meet higher standards if you refused to lower the standards for them. This was not the royal road to popularity, either with the students themselves or with the "friends" of blacks on the faculty and in the administration. But, when the dust finally settled, the students
met the standards.

We have gotten so used to abysmal performances from black students, beginning in failing ghetto schools, that it is hard for some to believe that black students once did a lot better than they do today, at least in places and times with good schools. As far back as the First World War, black soldiers from New York, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and Ohio scored higher on mental tests than white soldiers from Georgia, Arkansas, Kentucky, and Mississippi.

During the 1940s, black students in Harlem schools had test scores very similar to those of white working class students on the lower east side of New York. Sometimes the Harlem scores were a little higher or a little lower, but they were never miles behind, the way they are today in many ghetto schools.

If blacks could do better back when their opportunities were worse, why can't today's ghetto students do better? Perhaps blacks have too many "friends" today.

--------------------------------------------------

Food for thought.

Ishmael
 
Again I must ask... are you baiting me?

I'll nibble a bit....The author of this article I feel neglected to point out the caliber of teachers and condition that inner city schools are in. A vast contrast to what they were back in the day.

Yeah, I was raised in a "bougoie" suburban area, but don't you think I'd turn out a lot different if I were brought up in the inner city and attended public schools instead of the private institutions I did.

And it just isn't Black students who are the victims of this....prime example the LAUSD (wanna know why kids in LA are stupid? yes even those in Brentwood) ....how can a city with the 5th largest economy in the world have such a poor educational standards for their youth? Nah, Black people aren't dumb...politicians and teachers don't give a damn anymore.
 
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badasschick said:
Again I must ask... are you baiting me?

LOL, no.

I just happen to feel that patronization is the worst insult of all. How about you?

Ishmael
 
I've always loved Douglas. He's such an awesome thinker.


Oh the things he could accomplish in this day and age....
 
Ishmael said:

Food for thought.

Ishmael

Now I understand your viewpoint on the other 'diversity' thread you posted. Diversity can be a good thing, and here you are making a point of how it can be used incorrectly.

Moon
 
badasschick said:
Yeah, I was raised in a "bougoie" suburban area, but don't you think I'd turn out a lot different if I were brought up in the inner city and attended public schools instead of the private institutions I did.

And it just isn't Black students who are the victims of this....prime example the LAUSD (wanna know why kids in LA are stupid? yes even those in Brentwood) ....how can a city with the 5th largest economy in the world have such a poor educational standards for their youth? Nah, Black people aren't dumb...politicians and teachers don't give a damn anymore.

Amen.
 
Ishmael said:


LOL, no.

I just happen to feel that patronization is the worst insult of all. How about you?

Ishmael

I wouldn't say patronization makes these students lazy...rather school administration (I'm talking, Elementary and High Schools)phoning in a performance.
 
badasschick said:

And it just isn't Black students who are the victims of this....prime example the LAUSD (wanna know why kids in LA are stupid? yes even those in Brentwood) ....how can a city with the 5th largest economy in the world have such a poor educational standards for their youth? Nah, Black people aren't dumb...politicians and teachers don't give a damn anymore.

Agreed.

Ishmael
 
badasschick said:


I wouldn't say patronization makes these students lazy...rather school administration (I'm talking, Elementary and High Schools)phoning in a performance.

I hear you. But I was addressing the 'friends' that always seem to know what's best for a people. To my mind it's like having been freed but never quite having gotten rid of the 'overseer'.

Ishmael
 
Re: Re: 'Friends' of blacks'

MoonWolf said:


Now I understand your viewpoint on the other 'diversity' thread you posted. Diversity can be a good thing, and here you are making a point of how it can be used incorrectly.

Moon

There ya go moon. ;)

Ishmael
 
During my four years at a ghetto public high school, I found that the majority of the teachers didn't even want to be there. These were also the same teachers who couldn't control their classes, and would "pass" a kid just so they wouldn't have to have them as a student in their class again. I imagine it can be tough for those who've been schooled like that to meet the standards of the kids who've had attentive, strict teachers.
 
Guess I'm lucky. I never had any "friends" while in school (public school too, by the way).

I recieved an excellent education. Unfortunately, in the years since, I have seen my old high school degenerate into the type of place you're talking about today. :(
 
Ishmael said:


LOL, no.

I just happen to feel that patronization is the worst insult of all. How about you?

Ishmael
Yes, agreed. What are you going to do about it?
 
Private Vasquez said:
During my four years at a ghetto public high school, I found that the majority of the teachers didn't even want to be there. These were also the same teachers who couldn't control their classes, and would "pass" a kid just so they wouldn't have to have them as a student in their class again. I imagine it can be tough for those who've been schooled like that to meet the standards of the kids who've had attentive, strict teachers.

I couldn't agree with you more. But now we're down to the 'chicken or the egg' issue. Was it the teachers, the kids, or the school board?

I don't have an answer PV, really I don't.

I just know that somewhere, somehow, someone's got to get their shit together and those that believe that making 'adjustments' based on race, or any other factor do not have the answer either.

The 'liberal' mantra of lowering the standards to 'norm' the equation is not doing anyone any good. As a matter of fact it's as if they are the ones that are saying that the black race is incapable of competing without being given some sort of handicap. I know differently and I suspect that you do too.

I don't know about you, but if it were me being treated in such a manner I'd be highly insulted.

Ishmael
 
Ishmael said:

The 'liberal' mantra of lowering the standards to 'norm' the equation is not doing anyone any good. As a matter of fact it's as if they are the ones that are saying that the black race is incapable of competing without being given some sort of handicap. I know differently and I suspect that you do too.
Ishmael

That is not the mantra of all liberals, just as the mantra of all conservatives isn't that blacks are naturally inferior drug users who are best put in prisons. I don't want to see lowering of academic standards any more than you do. Patronization is a form of rascism, although definitely a more subtle one, so I will agree with you there.
 
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badasschick said:

? Nah, Black people aren't dumb...politicians and teachers don't give a damn anymore.


Who votes for these politicians that cater to the teacher's unions whose primary function is covering their ass?

Or should I say, who doesn't vote against them?

That dog don't hunt. If you want to blame someone, blame the fucking parents, black and white, who have shit for brains and never assume any responsibility for their kids'education.
 
Sillyman said:


That is not the mantra of all liberals,

Perhaps, but that is the political position that they support. 70% of the black community is in favor of vouchers. What is the liberal position on this?

Sillyman said:
just as the mantra of all conservatives are that blacks are naturally inferior drug users who are best put in prisons.

Those aren't conservatives, they're bigots. You can not show me one mainstream conservative or libertarian that supports that view. Either publically in a political platform or privately.

Ishmael
 
miles said:



Who votes for these politicians that cater to the teacher's unions whose primary function is covering their ass?

Or should I say, who doesn't vote against them?

That dog don't hunt. If you want to blame someone, blame the fucking parents, black and white, who have shit for brains and never assume any responsibility for their kids'education.

'kay.
 
Ishmael said:

Those aren't conservatives, they're bigots. You can not show me one mainstream conservative or libertarian that supports that view. Either publically in a political platform or privately.

Ishmael


I made that statement as a typo. My point was NOT that that is the conservative viewpoint, AT ALL. I was merely saying that some people who consider themselves to be conservative hold that view point, but they should not be considered the whole of the right, just like while some liberal individuals may believe in such discrimintory tactics, it does not mean we all do.

My apologies again.
 
I couldn't stay away. :) Can't believe I didn't see it sooner.

Nice post Ish. There's nothing like a "well-meaning friend" eh.
I agree with you on this. Making concessions for any group for whatever reason only turns out to be a detriment. In this case, these people are not giving black persons the benefit of the doubt that they can function normally in the world without their "help", which is totally insulting. They're taking away the right to lead one's own life in a way. I mean getting good grades that were not earned is great, but in the end, what is it worth?

Reading this made me think of the ebonics situtation that America is facing. Are black people that dumb that they can't learn to speak proper English? (That was rhetorical, by the way). This kind of leeway is never good. The easy way out never is.
 
Ishmael said:


Accepted. Not a problem.

Now, what about the other half of the post. The vouchers?

Ishmael

So sorry. I'm a tad bit confused exactly what you were getting at there.
 
Mona said:
I couldn't stay away. :) Can't believe I didn't see it sooner.

Nice post Ish. There's nothing like a "well-meaning friend" eh.
I agree with you on this. Making concessions for any group for whatever reason only turns out to be a detriment. In this case, these people are not giving black persons the benefit of the doubt that they can function normally in the world without their "help", which is totally insulting. They're taking away the right to lead one's own life in a way. I mean getting good grades that were not earned is great, but in the end, what is it worth?

Reading this made me think of the ebonics situtation that America is facing. Are black people that dumb that they can't learn to speak proper English? (That was rhetorical, by the way). This kind of leeway is never good. The easy way out never is.

Stop talking like that. I get a hard on. ;)

Ishmael
 
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