Filling in the blanks between the good bits

[davet_1_1]

Hello, sort-of forum newbie despite having lurked for some time.

My question is around how to keep yourself on track, filling in the connective tissue of a story between the beats you're excited about. I've submitted two longform chapter works on Lit, one starting in 2005 (eep!) and one last year. To be honest they both make me cringe now, and I think part of that is I get bored trying to get from plot point A to plot point B and end up throwing in something demented, let's say plot point Z. Thus where the story ends is a million miles from where it started, which nobody likes (trust me, there are comments), including me.

The thing I'm currently a couple of chapters into is, if I'm any judge, better than either of the previous submissions. BUT I want to avoid getting sidetracked from the plot I have sketched out with the parts that are important, but not the next fun thing I want to get to.

Any advice gratefully received.

NB fair warning, most of my stuff is in the NC/Reluctance/Mind Control categories, if that means you'd prefer not to engage.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I usually have one major "work in progress" and if for whatever reason needs to cook longer at a certain point I often have one active side project which will be shorter, quicker to get out, running in parallel.

That said, I'm currently on my fourth side project with my "main" WIP on the backburner. Not stalled, mind you, just not been written. That's an important difference.

 

[davion2308]

Options

Honestly, and I'm being super honest here, the dull parts between Scene A and Scene B are what take you from your ho-hum, no-so-good 4.12 to the "H." Those parts, the boring parts, are where you build credible characters, you show motivation, you create a richly detailed world that readers can identify and that makes the story believable.

Now you're getting better votes, you're getting a few followers, you're getting some actual comments that aren't shredding you like a julienne salad.

Those parts are as critical as the actual 'fun' because any story that just gets into a sex scene without support documentation is going to get passed up and won't do so hot.

I don't know your process and it'll be different from mine. I try to start from the beginning and move forward, one step at a time, so I don't get lost and I don't forget the bigger picture of moving A to B to C and so on.

 

[LexxRuthless]

I rip out whole sections of stories when I feel like something "doesn't fit" within the story I am writing. Those get tossed into a file marked "Extracts." That file is now up to 70 Word pages -- almost exactly 10 Literotica pages -- that I have pulled out of stories. Only a tiny bit has found its way into something else, but I've only been at this 2 years. My hope is that all those strange bits that didn't fit will eventually find their way into stories where they do fit.

 

[davet_1_1]

electricblue66, good tip, the thing I'm currently writing started as a side story, because the 'big' project (an erotic horror which is now mostly horror and barely erotic tbh) ended up in the weeds.

davion2308, that's useful advice. My current scribbling took a turn in the last chapter that doesn't change the overall plot, but it does make the emphasis of the whole story different. What that means from a writing perspective is even some of the hot-and-heavy parts are going to be important structurally but less exciting to write. But I don't want to short change them because this is Lit, and "then they fucked or whatever" won't cut it

What I've been trying to do is if I think of something compelling on what's now the A-arc, I'm sketching it out in the place I think it'll ultimately end up, which is kind of forcing me to stay on track to support the next good bit.

LexxRuthless, good call. I need to get better at editing.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Hello, sort-of forum newbie despite having lurked for some time.

My question is around how to keep yourself on track, filling in the connective tissue of a story between the beats you're excited about. I've submitted two longform chapter works on Lit, one starting in 2005 (eep!) and one last year. To be honest they both make me cringe now, and I think part of that is I get bored trying to get from plot point A to plot point B and end up throwing in something demented, let's say plot point Z. Thus where the story ends is a million miles from where it started, which nobody likes (trust me, there are comments), including me.

The thing I'm currently a couple of chapters into is, if I'm any judge, better than either of the previous submissions. BUT I want to avoid getting sidetracked from the plot I have sketched out with the parts that are important, but not the next fun thing I want to get to.

Any advice gratefully received.

NB fair warning, most of my stuff is in the NC/Reluctance/Mind Control categories, if that means you'd prefer not to engage.

Ideally, the whole thing is "good bits," if that is feasible. However, if you read short stories and novels from professionals, you'll notice that there are "rises and falls" in the plot. It can't all be a climax. (I don't know how that guy did Infinite Jest. What is that, a thousand pages I think?)

That said, one has to figure out these things through experience. We've all have to deal with it. I had a similar problem with a series chapter a couple of weeks ago.

 

[SimonDoom]

It's an interesting question. You seem to have the opposite problem from mine, because I find that what one might call the "connective tissue" between the beats -- if by beats you mean the "sex scenes -- is what most interests me. It's the sex scenes themselves that I often wait to fill in.

My advice is to look at the connective tissue sections in a fresh way. Why do they seem like merely connective tissue to you? Perhaps you need to rethink them. Every part of a story should be essential to the whole. The scenes without sex should be essential to making the sex sexy, or at least carrying the story forward in an interesting way.

I often write stories in a non-linear way. If I hit a roadblock, I go around it and write a later scene and then come back to the earlier scene. But I'm always trying to make sure that every scene is essential, not just connective.

 

[Brutal_One]

I can maybe sympathise if I understand the OP correctly. I have a story Arc that essentially contains three main threads. One is a BDSM relationship between 2 of the central characters. The second is best described as an MC device although I am choosing the NC Category rather than MC, finally I have a story plot device that gives a reason as to why these 3 elements fit together.

The good news from my perspective is this is based on ideas and written story series from many years ago but never thought about trying to publish (certainly no thoughts of there being any commercial value in it).

Because I have been essentially rewriting it and maturing the character and their interactions and to an extent some of the core of the thread that joins them I have taken to writing in general very short chapters nearly all just one Lit page long. This suits the time I have to create these short chapters and as you say knit things together. Because of the BDSM element some chapters are only character development and thoughts, some erotic basis but barely for some chapters. Others are much more sex focused.

But in writing and in particular how I am choosing to write there are a few only chapters that give a payout for the reader so I very much rely on readers that are patient enough to stick with it.

There has been a moderate response if honest but as the writer I need to be happy I am writing it in the way I want and that suits the time I have available to write it.

I am probably maybe unique possibly in my approach but the main goal initially was to find a site that I could publish the series with some small audience of readers that might enjoy the ideas. Brutal One

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

Hello, sort-of forum newbie despite having lurked for some time.

My question is around how to keep yourself on track, filling in the connective tissue of a story between the beats you're excited about. I've submitted two longform chapter works on Lit, one starting in 2005 (eep!) and one last year. To be honest they both make me cringe now, and I think part of that is I get bored trying to get from plot point A to plot point B and end up throwing in something demented, let's say plot point Z. Thus where the story ends is a million miles from where it started, which nobody likes (trust me, there are comments), including me.

The thing I'm currently a couple of chapters into is, if I'm any judge, better than either of the previous submissions. BUT I want to avoid getting sidetracked from the plot I have sketched out with the parts that are important, but not the next fun thing I want to get to.

Any advice gratefully received.

NB fair warning, most of my stuff is in the NC/Reluctance/Mind Control categories, if that means you'd prefer not to engage.

Nice to meet you. I'm glad you came out of the lurker closet! What may we call you for short? Davet? Dave?

I think I could offer a better response if I knew what parts you consider exciting. Are the action, sex scenes, dialogues, etc?

It would also help if you could elaborate on the type of trouble you're having with the connective bits. Is it that you have an idea for them and can't make them work, that you just don't have anything particular envisioned for how you get from Point A to Point B, or is that you lose track of your objective? I thought I caught hints of each of those in your post, and I'm not sure which is predominant.

Knowing a little more about your process might help, too. Do you work from an outline? Do you have a firm idea in your mind? Do you have a couple of points firmly in mind and make the rest up as you go? I'm not advocating or dismissing any of those methods or any others - just trying to get an idea what could be helpful to you.

Finally, when you get diverted by something, what is type of shiny object do you find yourself chasing? What are the things that draw you away from where you're trying to go?

I said "finally," but I lied. One more suggestion: In your profile, you might want to add a link to your stories in the signature block. That way, people can just click to get there. 'Cause let's face it - we're lazy!

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

A metric fuckton of coke and LSD, by all accounts. Mental health issues + drugs + incredible writing talent is a hell of a recipe.

So it's really good? I've never read it or read about it in any detail. How did the end notes work? Were they annoying? Did it work to read them when you got to the end of a chapter, or did you need to keep flipping back and forth?

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

It's really good, but the experience of reading it is basically a mix of awe at the writing and frustration at the plot until 90% of the way through, when all of the threads of plot that made no sense are expertly wound together. The end is enormously satisfying but it took me months to get there. Honestly, I doubt I ever would have finished it without having 2 hours of train commuting every day at the time.

I would flip back and forth immediately to keep the context for the notes, I didn't think I'd remember what they were referencing if I waited until the end.

If you're interested in addiction, I highly recommend it. If that's a trigger for you, maybe read The Broom of the System instead.

Thanks. I'll put it on my ever-growing reading list. (Better than having nothing to read.)

 

[JuanSeiszFitzHall]

Thanks. I'll put it on my ever-growing reading list. (Better than having nothing to read.)

Let's slip in the author's name: David Foster Wallace. He committed suicide. I had to take "Infinite Jest" out of the library four times to finish it (and that was while he was still alive). Lordy, the footnotes. But worth reading.

 

[davet_1_1]

Nice to meet you. I'm glad you came out of the lurker closet! What may we call you for short? Davet? Dave?

I think I could offer a better response if I knew what parts you consider exciting. Are the action, sex scenes, dialogues, etc?

Thank you everyone for the interesting perspectives. Dave is fine

What I'm working on right now probably has the most detailed outline of anything I've written, which seems to be helping. What I'm struggling with is there's a relationship that has kind of come alive in the writing, so now I want to hit all of the parts of that which are bubbling away, and everything else feels like more of a drag - sex, plot, the works.

I'm trying to make myself come at the 'boring' stuff in the context of the relationship, because the whole story now has an effect on that. I don't want to just write the parts I'm most excited about up-front, because then I don't think I'll go back and finish it.

Link to the initial part in the sig. My previous submissions, I'm slightly in denial about.

 

[yowser]

So it's really good? I've never read it or read about it in any detail. How did the end notes work? Were they annoying? Did it work to read them when you got to the end of a chapter, or did you need to keep flipping back and forth?

The footnotes are annoying (and flipping is necessary, but rewarding) and many felt this device a sign of colossal pomposity, which it probably was. Nonetheless, a work of immense impact, disturbing as it is.

As a writer, if you want examples of how to do character, connective tissue and descriptions well, it is a worthy read.

 

[Voboy]

To me, the filler bits are the fun parts. I indulge myself there. But then I write in FP, mostly, which might be why it's so fun.

It's me, talking to the reader.

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

Thank you everyone for the interesting perspectives. Dave is fine

What I'm working on right now probably has the most detailed outline of anything I've written, which seems to be helping. What I'm struggling with is there's a relationship that has kind of come alive in the writing, so now I want to hit all of the parts of that which are bubbling away, and everything else feels like more of a drag - sex, plot, the works.

I'm trying to make myself come at the 'boring' stuff in the context of the relationship, because the whole story now has an effect on that. I don't want to just write the parts I'm most excited about up-front, because then I don't think I'll go back and finish it.

Link to the initial part in the sig. My previous submissions, I'm slightly in denial about.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you've got an outline and know the different points you want to hit. You are not very interested in the mechanics of driving the plot forward right now. I read the story you linked. Would the part you're not getting excited about be the part where she's officially getting the job, getting trained, or assignments, etc? And I gather you intend in this chapter to introduce Katie with a K to someone she's going to develop a relationship with, and what you want to get to is the part where the relationship chemistry is happening?

If I understood all that correctly, I think you already have your answer. "I'm trying to make myself come at the 'boring' stuff in the context of the relationship, because the whole story now has an effect on that." If the relationship is what is central for you, try to see every detail as building to it. I can't offer anything more specific because I just don't know what's going on in the next chapter or how soon Katie is introduced to whomever her love/sex interest is. Instead of treating the the plot you have to go through to get there as something to be waded past to get where you want to go, try to see it as part of the story of the relationship.

Again, I don't know specifics, but you can spice up the "between" parts by trying to build mood. If plot allows it, you could think about foreshadowing. Sensory details help up the erotic ante. If you look at the "between" parts as a tool instead of as a vehicle, it might allow you to focus on them better.

I do have some more specific thoughts on what might be making the sex scenes a drag for you. I think all sex scenes need emotional content. There will be scenes in a story like yours where the only emotion will be lust. That means you really have to play up the lust. If you can think of any emotion you can mix in with the lust, that will be even better.

You set yourself up with a very tricky task with the sex scene in chapter 1. Where's the emotion supposed to be coming from? Katie, right? But where's all the action happening? On screen with Khloe, Lynch and Pat. There's really no emotional content in the video. However, even though your main emotion should be coming from Katie, Katie needs to be watching something arousing, too. I was not buying Khloe's excitement. Bringing out Khloe's excitement could have been a really good way to build Katie's excitement, with a lot more of Katie's internal dialog about getting turned on watching Khloe get turned on. Emotions can be contagious after all.

For Katie, where I think the real emotional content is supposed to be, you have her going through the right moves, but she just doesn't sound all that excited. Maybe focus on her breathing, her white-knuckled grip on the bottle, Maybe do something with her breasts or unbuttoning her blouse. (She could pull it closed when she hears the kid coming in.) I have a hard time getting in the mindset of a woman who is acting like she barely knows what sex is. It doesn't feel real to me, BUT, I think there's a good sized audience for that, and your scores reflect it. People like what you're writing. I assume you like what you're writing. It doesn't matter if it's my cup of tea. I'm just letting you know where my blind spots are so you know how much weight to give my suggestions.

I don't know whether her thoughts about, "oh, gosh, that never happened before," just aren't doing it for me, or if they might not be doing it for you, either. If they're not working for you, I'd drop that in chapter 2. To me, those bits feel flat and to artificial to carry a feeling. There's going to be plenty of opportunity to show her hesitation when she starts doing things like getting undressed, etc. Again, this could be just me, but I wouldn't keep repeating the bits about "this never happened before." Instead, I would describe her actions in a way that reflect the the hesitation and uncertainty I think you're wanting to portray. (Her hand trembled, her mouth was dry, she stood unsteadily, etc.)

I'm hoping that since you're keyed in on the chemistry of the relationship you want to get to (which is also an emotional construct), adding emotion to the parts in between may help you be more interested in it and to write is engagingly. If this doesn't help, I hope you'll find something else that will

Good luck!

 

[ElectricBlue]

What I've been trying to do is if I think of something compelling on what's now the A-arc, I'm sketching it out in the place I think it'll ultimately end up, which is kind of forcing me to stay on track to support the next good bit.

My writing approach is what we call "pantser", not "plotster", in that I start writing with very often only a tiny nub of an idea, often a single scene. I then write until I stop. No plot, no character sheets, rarely an end-game in mind. Everything falls into place along the way. Characters will arrive in the course of a paragraph, and in two recent cases, a secondary character might take over for a significant chunk of a story.

Very often (almost constantly, thinking about it) my characters circle around their sex scenes until they're good and ready - and that's where they get filled out as characters - their motivation, their passion and interests, their desire. And most importantly, my interest in them as a writer. As a consequence, my style is slow burn; character, mood and action, in that order. I've received many comments along the lines of, "slow, meandering like a river, leisurely, like whiskey before a log fire, but worth the wait..."

It's stream of consciousness, really, with some (not much) edit. I edit words, phrases, occasionally a sentence, rarely a whole paragraph. Most of what you read is first draft, which I prefer to keep raw because that's where the heat is. It's not a common approach - cue plots and rewrites, which I never do - but it works for me.

 

[Voboy]

It's stream of consciousness, really, with some (not much) edit. I edit words, phrases, occasionally a sentence, rarely a whole paragraph. Most of what you read is first draft, which I prefer to keep raw because that's where the heat is. It's not a common approach - cue plots and rewrites, which I never do - but it works for me.

This. 1,000% this.

I encourage all the plotters, outliners, rewriters, and revisers to try it this way, once or twice. It's fun.

 

[gunhilltrain]

A metric fuckton of coke and LSD, by all accounts. Mental health issues + drugs + incredible writing talent is a hell of a recipe.

I'm not sure how he wrote while on drugs; I know I can't. But then I've never used LSD or coke, so maybe I don't know the truth.

One of Wallace's problems may have been his ex-girlfriend, Mary Karr. She wrote some interesting stuff of her own, including a memoir about growing up near Port Arthur, Texas and another one about being a young woman in California in the 1970s.

He apparently was really taken with her; he even tattooed her name on himself. (Never do that, ever!) Apparently they had a stormy relationship that included abuse and stalking (by him). Then later he married a different woman, also a writer, and that seemed to go better.

 

[SimonDoom]

This. 1,000% this.

I encourage all the plotters, outliners, rewriters, and revisers to try it this way, once or twice. It's fun.

I want to try doing it this way. Really. But the plotter/outliner in me keeps getting in the way. And MS Word makes outlining so easy!

 

[Omenainen]

My writing approach is what we call "pantser", not "plotster", in that I start writing with very often only a tiny nub of an idea, often a single scene. I then write until I stop. No plot, no character sheets, rarely an end-game in mind. Everything falls into place along the way.

Oh? I haven’t heard those terms before. But I guess I’m a “pantser” then as well. I start somewhere, and then I literally write it out to see what will happen. Which is to say I don’t know what will happen, going in. And then the story ends when it’s told.

If the finished story isn’t good enough I can rewrite, but that makes me end up somewhere different than the original draft. What sometimes happens is that I end up with lengthy nothing-happens-scenes when I’m waiting for something to develop, and I might take those out of they’re irrelevant enough.

I just think I’m so undisciplined that if I knew the task ahead, if I had a plot to get through, I’d get bored and dump it in the middle. My approach doesn’t lead to very complicated plots, though, so if one would like to write some sort of a sci-fi saga for example it probably wouldn’t do. I just can’t do it any other way.

 

[Voboy]

Oh? I haven’t heard those terms before. But I guess I’m a “pantser” then as well. I start somewhere, and then I literally write it out to see what will happen. Which is to say I don’t know what will happen, going in. And then the story ends when it’s told.

If the finished story isn’t good enough I can rewrite, but that makes me end up somewhere different than the original draft. What sometimes happens is that I end up with lengthy nothing-happens-scenes when I’m waiting for something to develop, and I might take those out of they’re irrelevant enough.

I just think I’m so undisciplined that if I knew the task ahead, if I had a plot to get through, I’d get bored and dump it in the middle. My approach doesn’t lead to very complicated plots, though, so if one would like to write some sort of a sci-fi saga for example it probably wouldn’t do. I just can’t do it any other way.

The story tells you what it wants.

There are times that I go hybrid: I knock out 6k words or so and then go to the gym, where I think about the story and where it might go. Then inspiration strikes (it really does happen at the gym most often, or while on a stroll, or commuting to work) and then I jot it down on my phone as a sequence. Very bare-bones.

Then I just sit back down and connect the dots.

 

[Omenainen]

I’m also not quite sure what the OP means by good bits and filling in. I only write the parts I’m interested in. So I jump from one good bit to the next.

 

[Wilson Spalding]

...Those parts, the boring parts, are where you build credible characters, you show motivation, you create a richly detailed world that readers can identify and that makes the story believable.

^^^ This. Right here.

Example: the "good" parts -- the juicy, high-action parts -- happen between characters you already know. They're in your head, to varying levels, so by the time you bring them together, there's context that gives the interaction some sort of emotional weight. That's what makes it exciting.

Now, the corollary: Your reader doesn't know your characters.

Until you've introduced Joe and Jane Reader to Ms Protagonist and Mr Antagonist (or maybe just Mr Neighbor), nobody cares. You can describe the good bits in all the slow-mo, dripping-wet detail you want and it's not going to do much for the reader because there's no emotional investment.

Take the connective tissue: the build-up and the "between-scenes" to flesh out the characters so the reader knows them like you do. Then the good bits will be good for the reader, too.

 

[davet_1_1]

Thanks everyone for the great suggestions and EoN for that fantastic feedback. A lot of what you mention is things I'm trying to articulate to myself, I think.

When I started the story, I think a few of the hot and heavy scenes appealed to my twisted little mind, but since I wanted to try to come to a satisfying ending, there needed to be more than 'Katie has to do porn > Katie finds her first scene humiliating but arousing > hooray, Katie loves porn now!'

So the structure was to get to what seemed like a plausible, if maybe not 100% realistic, timescale, the sort of scenes she might be required to do etc. (and everything I've either described so far or got lined up is based on something I've seen in actual porn). But, much like porn itself, just writing one scene after another is dull for both me and the reader.

However thinking on what everyone has suggested, the relationship that starts presenting in ch. 2 (and I don't want to keep building it up like it's a HUGE TWIST ) does feel like it can play into Katie's Journey Into Porn* in an interesting way. The chapter I'm writing now, the structure hasn't changed but the emotional emphasis is completely different to when I started the story, and I think it's really helping the scene along. So I hope I can carry that forward.

EoN, Great points on Katie's slightly ludicrous naiveté. I'm trying to balance the shift from 'unintentionally inexperienced and prudish' without it feeling too much like 'and after one porn scene, Katie loved dick!' but I need to trust the audience that they get it. There's maybe a touch of it in chapter 2 but I think it'll be dead after that.

*that sounds so pretentious for an amateur submission with a plot daft enough to be from an actual porno.