Fidelity Redux-The Pew Survey

[SimpleGifts]

I really wish that I had been around to take part in Vermillion's thread on fidelity and monogamy, etc., before it devolved into a rather irrelevant debate on the questionable link between religion and integrity. Since I fear any post I add there would just ring hollow in the Mexican standoff over there, I thought I'd start anew.

I'm curious that no one has brought up the recent Pew Center study on attitudes towards marriage and divorce:

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/526/marriage-parenthood

Most of the press about this survey focused on the fact that among factors cited as "very important" to a "successful" marriage, "children" ranked 8 out of 9 factors listed, compared to 3rd in a comparable 1990 survey. HOWEVER, the survey result that continues to intrigue me is the fact that 93 percent of respondents agreed that "faithfulness" is "very important" to a "successful" marriage, while 70 percent agreed that a "happy sexual relationship" is similarly important in a marriage. Presumably, this means that as many as 23 percent of respondents believe that "faithfulness" is very important in a successful marriage but that a happy sexual relationship is NOT "very important."

(Note that 27 percent of respondents did say that a happy sexual relationship is "rather important" to a successful marriage, and only 2 percent called it "not very important.)

I'm intrigued because the implication is that for a significant segment of the population, fidelity is more important to the success of a marriage than sexual satisfaction with your spouse. I could infer further that for that segment, you can have a successful marriage without sexual satisfaction as long as you remain faithful to your spouse. The survey notes that on this question, men and women gave roughly the same answers in comparable proportions.

The thoughts that this item raised within me were:

- If faithfulness is "very important" to a successful marriage, is a marriage automatically "unsuccessful" if one or both spouses are unfaithful to each other?

- If a spouse is not happy with their sex life, can the marriage still be "successful?"

- Is a marriage that ends in divorce by definition "unsuccessful?"

- Can a marriage still be "successful" if one spouse gains sexual satisfaction by being unfaithful to the other?

Like most surveys, this one gets very slippery because terms like "very important" and "successful marriage" are open to wide interpretation by respondents. For example, I think that marriages can be successful even if there is infidelity, and I know of some marriages that are stronger today after one spouse was unfaithful. I know of some people who claim that if one spouse refuses to engage in sex, the other is "justified" in being unfaithful. (As an aside, I also note that women are more likely than men to feel that divorce is preferable to an unhappy marriage, and much more likely than men to believe that the children in an unhappy marriage will be better off if the parents divorce.) The range of views about the roles of sex and fidelity in marriage is quite broad.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

SG

 

[BlackShanglan]

Isn't this the same survey that discovered that in African-American populations, respondents were more likely to state that sex and childbirth outside of marriage were wrong, but also more likely to have children out of wedlock? There were figures on Latinos and Caucasians as well - can't remember the numbers at all. But I did think that that point on the role of children was intriguing; pretty much what the Catholic church has been railing about for years. (It baffles me that they continue to insist that producing humans is more important than making them happy.)

Your point is very interesting as well. I often find myself irritated with Dan Savage (of the "Savage Love" advice column) for his insistence that people who can't get the sex they want from their marriages have an absolute right to cheat. It's rather reassuring to me, really, to see that so many people seem to take the view that if it's a choice between fidelity and sex, the fidelity ought properly to win. Of course, I think that what will actually work in reality varies from person to person according to individual priorities, but it was nice to know that I did have some company.

Shanglan

 

[Vermilion]

Isn't this the same survey that discovered that in African-American populations, respondents were more likely to state that sex and childbirth outside of marriage were wrong, but also more likely to have children out of wedlock? There were figures on Latinos and Caucasians as well - can't remember the numbers at all. But I did think that that point on the role of children was intriguing; pretty much what the Catholic church has been railing about for years. (It baffles me that they continue to insist that producing humans is more important than making them happy.)

Only way they can mainatain the congregation numbers? </bitch>

It's sad you didn;t feel you could contribute directly to the thread I started, guess I should have tried to put the fires out earlier, but it's hard to stop someone on a roll.

Perhaps the people in the survey didn;t have a satisfying sexual relationship at the time they took the survey, but because they were still married and fairly happy, they decided it couldn't be all that important...
Did that make sense? My brain feels like porridge this morning.

x
V

 

[monique1971]

Since we're all here on an erotica site, by definition we're interested in sex. But I've known people, both male and female, who honestly didn't care about sex that much. Some of them downright disliked it. Others had a sort of "Meh, it's okay, but I can live without it" attitude. I think this kind of antipathy/apathy about sex is more widespread than we realize.

I suppose that for some people, sex is just bodies rubbing around -- why would that matter in a marriage? Whereas fidelity is about trust and honesty, and most people agree that these matter in a marriage.

 

[SimpleGifts]

Your point is very interesting as well. I often find myself irritated with Dan Savage (of the "Savage Love" advice column) for his insistence that people who can't get the sex they want from their marriages have an absolute right to cheat. It's rather reassuring to me, really, to see that so many people seem to take the view that if it's a choice between fidelity and sex, the fidelity ought properly to win. Of course, I think that what will actually work in reality varies from person to person according to individual priorities, but it was nice to know that I did have some company.

Hey, thanks for your very fair comment. I'm also bothered by those who use their partner's/spouse's actions to claim that their own infidelity is not "cheating." I agree that infidelity is a choice...I know it is. I really don't have anything against people who "cheat"--as you say, it depends on circumstances--but if you're gonna do it, at least be honest with yourself and realize that you're choosing to violate your own vows. If you're unfaithful, you're unfaithful, and it doesn't matter how many times your spouse turned you down.

I've never tried to justify my past infidelities based on some twisted argument of moral superiority, and I'm not going to start now.

SG

 

[SimpleGifts]

Since we're all here on an erotica site, by definition we're interested in sex. But I've known people, both male and female, who honestly didn't care about sex that much. Some of them downright disliked it. Others had a sort of "Meh, it's okay, but I can live without it" attitude. I think this kind of antipathy/apathy about sex is more widespread than we realize.

I suppose that for some people, sex is just bodies rubbing around -- why would that matter in a marriage? Whereas fidelity is about trust and honesty, and most people agree that these matter in a marriage.

That does seem to be a bit of a contradiction tho, doesn't it? I mean, I feel that only a very few people are ever COMPLETELY honest about EVERYTHING with their spouse. You choose what you tell each other...you decide that some things aren't important enough to risk the pain of always telling the truth. I think that's a common human tendency, right or wrong.

But if that's what people do...then, if your spouse thinks that sex is just two bodies rubbing together and not very important or significant, then why be honest with your spouse about your sex life? If it's really not that important, then your spouse shouldn't really have any concerns about whether or not you sleep with someone else...right?

(Just playing Devil's advocate here.)

SG

 

[SimpleGifts]

Only way they can mainatain the congregation numbers? </bitch>

It's sad you didn;t feel you could contribute directly to the thread I started, guess I should have tried to put the fires out earlier, but it's hard to stop someone on a roll.

Perhaps the people in the survey didn;t have a satisfying sexual relationship at the time they took the survey, but because they were still married and fairly happy, they decided it couldn't be all that important...
Did that make sense? My brain feels like porridge this morning.

x
V

Just to clarify--the respondents were people who were married and those who were unmarried--they didn't separate the sample that way. So it's possible that those who have never been married think that they could be happily married and sexually unsatisfied, 'cuz they've never tried it.

And no need to apologize just because others misbehaved on your thread--their behavior is their responsibility.

SG

 

[BlackShanglan]

But if that's what people do...then, if your spouse thinks that sex is just two bodies rubbing together and not very important or significant, then why be honest with your spouse about your sex life? If it's really not that important, then your spouse shouldn't really have any concerns about whether or not you sleep with someone else...right?

But if you're certain that your spouse would have no concerns, why wouldn't you tell him/her? It would certainly make scheduling easier.

Like you, I don't have a great deal of patience for people who use their spouses' or SOs' actions to justify infidelity. That's not to say that I don't think sex is important, and even important enough to destroy a committed relationship if the issue isn't addressed. It's not the need for sex that I disdain, but the dishonesty. Yes, it's wretched to have to tell a spouse or partner that your inability to resolve your sexual problems means that you are going to have to insist either on having an "open" relationship or on dissolving the relationship altogether, but that's what mature and honorable adults do. They take a stand on the things that are important to them and they accept the consequences. It's possible that this will be the kick in the tail that the other partner needs to really work on resolving the problem; it's possible that it can't be resolved, and the other partner will need to make a very difficult decision. But simply cheating and hiding the fact is both cowardly and a quick-and-easy fix; it's simpler than doing the work to resolve very substantial difficulties, and I mistrust anything that asks the least effort possible from the person doing it.

I've never tried to justify my past infidelities based on some twisted argument of moral superiority, and I'm not going to start now.

Agreed. I say all of the above knowing that I have erred in the past and that it was wrong. None of us like to be told that we are wrong, and no doubt some will say that anyone who has done wrong in the past and argues now that it is wrong for others to do it is a hypocrite. I think otherwise. I think it wrong regardless of who does it, including me. I was wrong to do it. Hypocrisy, to me, would be suddenly declaring that it's not wrong after all now that I've done it and don't care to be chastized for it, or declaring that mine was a rare and unusual special case in which it wasn't wrong. Down that road lies the popular ethical standard of "I get what I want," and I don't wish to go there.

Shanglan